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-   -   The relative value of a CB (http://www.jetsinsider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=253595)

johnnysd 01-26-2013 08:57 AM

The relative value of a CB
 
On the PFT show Peter King cam out strongly against trading Revis, saying that the four most important positions in foootball are QB, LT, rush lineman, CB. He said if you have the best one in the game you pay him the $16M a year (about 13% of our entire cap)

I mostly agree with that, but for the sake of the thread say its true.

What got me thinking after he said this was I think that those positions are not equal.

In broad terms I would say they line up like this:

QB>>>>>LT>>>Rusher>>CB

A QB is WAY WAY more valuable than any CB, and is the least important of the 4 positions. Even in Rex's scheme you only get some much value from a CB, and it was proven this year that a very good CB in Cromartie could completely cover the loss of Revis.

Thought of another way, if you replaced the other three positions with players 80% of the level of the player being replaced, you would see a huge impact from QB and LT, probably so high you might lose the game. A reasonably high but schemable replacemtn for a rusher, and a much lesser impact at CB. He is one of 4 or 5 after all with safeties and LBers helping too.

So when I think of it that way, I have to say it does not make sense to me to pay a CB 13% of your cab and the CB group probably 15 or 16% of the cap. And the thing people are missing here is Revis wont sign for less, so unless we want to do that we will lose him.

So trade him now and see if you can get an elite player at one of the other important positions

Dunnie 01-26-2013 08:59 AM

I agree ... CB is not even in the same stratosphere as QB. King is a Pats fan ... So ....

JetsfanfromtheBURGH 01-26-2013 09:52 AM

Did he say they were equal or did he just say they were the top 4? The reason I ask, is because "stink" on ESPN said the exact same thing. He said they were in that order.

Snell41 01-26-2013 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnysd (Post 4796026)
QB>>>>>LT>>>Rusher>>CB



I'd say it's more like this

QB>>>>LT>>Rusher #1>>>>>>>>>>Rusher #2>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>CB.

John_0515 01-26-2013 09:58 AM

If the Jets had the worst secondary in football, keep Revis, but people seem to forget the Jets were #2 versus the pass WITHOUT Revis.

Is that jump to #1 really worth paying him all that money? We have good CBs. Let's get good elsewhere.

sec.101row23 01-26-2013 10:29 AM

The real question should be, how important is it to have a 16 million dollar a year CB on a team without a QB, Pass Rusher and a ton of other needs?

Flushing Roots 01-26-2013 10:38 AM

+1 on all the above.
The stupidity with how the Jets have handled this whole Revis thing as it pertains to business savvy is mind boggling. As soon as Rex announced to the whole world that Revis was the best CB in the history of the planet, all our bargaining power to keep him went out the window. And then they did it again this week with the leaks that we might trade Revis. Now the whole NFL world knows that and have some automatic, instant leverage to chisel down the price for him. Freakin' Economics 101 and the Jets get an "F"!

johnnysd 01-26-2013 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JetsfanfromtheBURGH (Post 4796085)
Did he say they were equal or did he just say they were the top 4? The reason I ask, is because "stink" on ESPN said the exact same thing. He said they were in that order.

He just listed them as if they were somewhat equally important.

JamesR 01-26-2013 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnysd (Post 4796026)
Thought of another way, if you replaced the other three positions with players 80% of the level of the player being replaced, you would see a huge impact from QB and LT, probably so high you might lose the game. A reasonably high but schemable replacemtn for a rusher, and a much lesser impact at CB. He is one of 4 or 5 after all with safeties and LBers helping too.

Surely though a LT is the same as a CB ... there are 5 linemen who all need to protect the QB, plus sometimes a TE and / or RB / FB too.

MagroCrag 01-26-2013 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dunnie (Post 4796029)
I agree ... CB is not even in the same stratosphere as QB. King is a Pats fan ... So ....

lol might be my pessimism, but I feel like we are more likely to trade Revis so the media is just setting themselves up to get ready to blast us.

It's just not worth paying mega money like that when they are so many holes on the team (cb not being one of them).

Dunnie 01-26-2013 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagroCrag (Post 4796256)
lol might be my pessimism, but I feel like we are more likely to trade Revis so the media is just setting themselves up to get ready to blast us.

It's just not worth paying mega money like that when they are so many holes on the team (cb not being one of them).

+1 million ... Cro's emergence s what allows us to get value for Revis.

ryan10 01-26-2013 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John_0515 (Post 4796097)
If the Jets had the worst secondary in football, keep Revis, but people seem to forget the Jets were #2 versus the pass WITHOUT Revis.

Is that jump to #1 really worth paying him all that money? We have good CBs. Let's get good elsewhere.

no its not but we might not have our 2 starting safeties back..so that is a key in the equation..but if u told me they were back and we drafted depth at cb..i say trade him!!!

detectivekimble 01-26-2013 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sec.101row23 (Post 4796138)
The real question should be, how important is it to have a 16 million dollar a year CB on a team without a QB, Pass Rusher and a ton of other needs?

Revis wouldn't prohibit the Jets from filling other positions. Stupid contracts like David Harris, Calvin Pace, Mark Sanchez, etc. and the trading of picks are. It's amazing that people don't care about overpaying for mediocrity, but care about paying for greatness. Darrelle Revis is greatness.

ryan10 01-26-2013 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detectivekimble (Post 4796400)
Revis wouldn't prohibit the Jets from filling other positions. Stupid contracts like David Harris, Calvin Pace, Mark Sanchez, etc. and the trading of picks are. It's amazing that people don't care about overpaying for mediocrity, but care about paying for greatness. Darrelle Revis is greatness.

great point!! I'm sure if thats still an option it will be explored..its two fold..affordability and rebuilding..they might decide to cut ties with the dead wood and w revise blow it all up and start from scratch..

Flaming Mo 01-26-2013 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John_0515 (Post 4796097)
If the Jets had the worst secondary in football, keep Revis, but people seem to forget the Jets were #2 versus the pass WITHOUT Revis.

Is that jump to #1 really worth paying him all that money? We have good CBs. Let's get good elsewhere.

Yet we were horrible against the run because we had to play much more people in coverage to make up for the loss of Revis.

sec.101row23 01-26-2013 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detectivekimble (Post 4796400)
Revis wouldn't prohibit the Jets from filling other positions. Stupid contracts like David Harris, Calvin Pace, Mark Sanchez, etc. and the trading of picks are. It's amazing that people don't care about overpaying for mediocrity, but care about paying for greatness. Darrelle Revis is greatness.

Who said people are happy with those contracts? The Jets could sign Revis and make his contract fit, its a matter of whether it is worth it or not. Do the Jets want to worry about Revis every two years? I dont think they want to revisit his contract every couple years because Revis feels he is under-paid.

detectivekimble 01-26-2013 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sec.101row23 (Post 4796415)
Who said people are happy with those contracts? The Jets could sign Revis and make his contract fit, its a matter of whether it is worth it or not. Do the Jets want to worry about Revis every two years? I dont think they want to revisit his contract every couple years because Revis feels he is under-paid.

Pay him and get rid of the trash. Paying JAGs for production you can get out of third and fourth round picks is stupid. The terrible use of resources by Tannenbaum is the problem here, not Darrelle Revis.

Everyone just needs to ask themselves this simple question: how many players on the roster are (or were) worth their contracts? It's not many.

Savage69 01-26-2013 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sec.101row23 (Post 4796415)
Who said people are happy with those contracts? The Jets could sign Revis and make his contract fit, its a matter of whether it is worth it or not. Do the Jets want to worry about Revis every two years? I dont think they want to revisit his contract every couple years because Revis feels he is under-paid.

Revis doesn't like the down years in a contract..DeMarcus Ware made 825,000 in base salary 2012 but with his bonus money made 7 million..

JamesR 01-26-2013 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detectivekimble (Post 4796425)
Everyone just needs to ask themselves this simple question: how many players on the roster are (or were) worth their contracts? It's not many.

Agreed 100%.

And hopefully, this is what our new GM is already looking at. :)

Darth Vader 01-26-2013 02:31 PM

the value of QB is relative to the defensive system...

the position is more subject to relativity than say the QB position, LT, pass rusher, DL in general, etc. those positions are more universally important, hands down.


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