[NY2FLDWC85]

[QUOTE=Demosthenes9;4499780]Hmmm, production over the years, huh ?? You mean like averaging 56 catches a year and 872.5 yards per year?

Yeah, certainly top 10 material there.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, right, as if Holmes didn't put up 79 receptions for 1,248 receiving yards the year before coming to the Jets ala the first time he had a chance to really show his worth. And put up a very strong season for Pittsburgh.

You can look at his 56 catches and 872.5 yards per season as a way of judging his ability all you like, because at the end of the night? I not only know, but also understand that only simple minded casual fans would post up numbers of Holmes, without taking into consideration the types of systems he's been forced to play under; as if he's not a true #1 WR option/threat.

In 2006, the Pittsburgh Steelers were only ranked 16th in pass attempts during his rookie season. He still managed to put up 49 receptions for 824 yards despite playing opposite of a future HOF WR in Hines Ward who put up 74 receptions for 975 yards. Lets not act as if, back in 2006, his quarterback didn't have a career low in completion percentage, QB rating (75.4) and a career high with 23 INT's. Only threw 18 TD's as well. Heck, even Sanchez threw 26 TD's last season. Talk about a struggling quarterback, talk about a developing Roethlisberger during the 2006 season.

Lets not act like, in 2007, the Pittsburgh Steelers never ranked 31st in pass attempts and 3rd in rushing attempts. Holmes STILL put up 52 receptions, 942 yards and 8 TD's inside of a rushing attack, run first committed offense. But yeah, lets not let the facts get in the way of his 52 receptions, 942 yards and 8 TD type of season, as if those numbers wouldn't have been through the roof within an offense that ranked the opposite ala 31st in rushing attempts and 3rd in passing attempts.

In 2008, the Pittsburgh Steelers only ranked 20th in pass attempts and top 10 in rushing attempts. Holmes still put up 55 receptions, 821 yards and 5 TD's, despite the fact that he was receiving for a smash-mouth Pittsburgh offensive attack ala run first. Put Holmes with Roethlisberger on an offense in which ranked 7th, instead of 20th in pass attempts? And he easily puts up 80+ receptions for 1200+ yards back in 2008.

2009 was the first and ONLY season where Holmes was able to show his full ability/talent and potential that he's always had (and still does have). In 2009 the Steelers actually ranked 18th in rushing attempts and 18th in passing attempts. More of a balanced approach in regards to the offensive end of the field. Holmes put up 79 receptions for 1,248 yards. Not bad for a wide receiver who was under an offense in which only ranked 18th in pass attempts.

In 2010 Holmes went back to a run first offense ala a Jets offense with a struggling/developing QB in Sanchez (only a 2nd year player) while the Jets offense ranked 2nd in rushing attempts. Holmes still put up 52 receptions, 746 yards and 6 TD's, despite being forced to miss 4 games. If he would have played all 16 games? He was on pace for a 69 reception, 994 yard, 8 TD type of season, on an offense that A.) Had a raw 2nd year Sanchez (who many consider a "bust" and B.) an offense that ranked 2nd in rushing attempts.

So yeah, let's keep up with the simple minded football judgement, while also using his "average numbers over the past 6 years" as a way of judging his WR talents, ability and potential. while disregarding the types of offensive situations that he's played in over the years ala run first teams, followed by two years of playing alongside a struggling/developing/raw Mark Sanchez.

Yes, he's only averaged 56 receptions for 872.5 yards per season throughout the course of his career, but let's not let facts get in the way of his overall talents/production on the football field. Lets not act as if a WR such as Reggie Wayne wasn't blessed with not only an all-time great at the Quarterback position in Peyton Manning, but also played inside of an offensive scheme that's ranked 1st, 2nd, 5th, 6th, 15th and 21st in pass attempts dating back to 2006. Yeah, right, I'm pretty sure it's fair to judge Wayne's numbers to Holmes numbers who's played on O's that's ranked 16th, 18th, 18th, 20th, 21st and 31st in pass attempts since being drafted into the league. Yeah, right, Reggie Wayne is some type of true number one wide out, while Holmes isn't; just based off of "numbers and production".

They don't call me "stats" for nothing. I don't just post stats as a simple number, I look into the different types of situation when discussing stats. I don't just throw ****ty numbers at a wall and hope it sticks (such as Demosthenes9 just did). I actually look at the situations that a player was under while putting up his stats/production on a football field when judging a #1 WR. Holmes is without question, no doubt about it, a top 15-20 WR talent.