Originally Posted by Warfish
And you base this on what, more "the people I know" facts?
Again, it's painful to have to keep repeating myself, but Teachers are not a special class of citizen. It's a job, they work it, and they face all (or should face all) the same challenges as the rest of us in teh working world. So save the complaining for the unemployed, since most of us worker bees already face these challenges every day ourselves, for less pay, less benefits and far less Union protection.
A paycheck, the benefits, and 2-4 months a year off.
I'm not saying teachers are a special class of citizen, I'm saying it's plain and simple that with no job security, far less people, especially good people, would go into teaching. You're going to get a master's degree to work a job that you'll lose to a starting teacher before you get to half of your max salary?
Whats the "incentive" to work in any career? We all could face a 10 year career too if we're not good enough or if circumstances, technology and/or business trends change.
So why go into a career that you'd be almost certain to be let go even if you are better than good enough? Boggles my mind how you don't see that when you take away the ultimate measuring stick (what you add to the bottom line), and add continual budget crunches, there's very little chance that public education, especially in a city, could maintain any kind of reasonable quality at all without 'special' circumstances. I'm sure there are places where the power of the union is accused, and maybe even places where teachers are more highly paid than other available occupations, but I haven't seen it. My wife (a counselor, not a teacher, but same scale I believe) makes half of what I do, with a master's and 10+ years experience. Sure, she's off July and August, but when she's working, she never, ever has a 'close my door and be a slacker today' day. And several times a year she is dealing with life and death situations - sometimes with a teacher along side her.
Yeah, that's just 'case I know', I could just BS and say "78% of teachers in NYC..." but the truth is, it all files logic and reason as well. It would greatly surprise me if you can't see the difference between someone working in a for profit (or for gain) situation is different, and how good teachers would get cut on salary alone without protection, and how that would ultimately play out. That's why I question the value you place on public education.
If you're talking about changing how discipline etc.Is handled, I'm all for it. But I'm positive that eliminating any form of tenure would destroy the quality of NYC public education, even further than budget cuts already have.