Obama plays the race card, already?! - Page 5 - Jets Insider.com Forums

Phoenixx · 01-13-2012, 11:36 AM

[QUOTE=cr726;4328194] GOP used to nominate elder experienced statesmen and the Dems would find the young hot name.[/QUOTE]

Used to ??

You just defined the 2008 candidates exactly.

cr726 · 01-13-2012, 12:23 PM

[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328203]Used to ??

You just defined the 2008 candidates exactly.[/QUOTE]

Sure if you want to ignore the VP they chose, you would of had a point.

Phoenixx · 01-13-2012, 12:33 PM

[QUOTE=cr726;4328301]Sure if you want to ignore the VP they chose, you would of had a point.[/QUOTE]

So the choice of Sara Palin negates the statesmanship of John McCain ...

but the choice of Joe Biden reinforces the hotness of Barack Obama ?? :rolleyes:

What is your point again ?? :confused:

cr726 · 01-13-2012, 12:43 PM

[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328319]So the choice of Sara Palin negates the statesmanship of John McCain ...

but the choice of Joe Biden reinforces the hotness of Barack Obama ?? :rolleyes:

What is your point again ?? :confused:[/QUOTE]

Why do you constantly try to put words in my mouth? Dems have always been guilty of looking for the hot name, but back to my point, Palin absolutely blows the statesmanship out of McCain. McCain was passed over by Rove and the boys when he mattered and then McCain being the desperate man to become Pres (last shot) he listened to the Rove types and brought Palin (embarrassment).

Phoenixx · 01-13-2012, 01:05 PM

[QUOTE=cr726;4328336]Why do you constantly try to put words in my mouth? Dems have always been guilty of looking for the hot name, but back to my point, Palin absolutely blows the statesmanship out of McCain. McCain was passed over by Rove and the boys when he mattered and then McCain being the desperate man to become Pres (last shot) he listened to the Rove types and brought Palin (embarrassment).[/QUOTE]

I didn't put words in your mouth..
I used YOUR WORDS (note the bolded quote below).

You said: [B]"GOP used to nominate elder experienced statesmen"[/B]...

and when your point is proven wrong in just the very last time your point was tested...

You divert your argument by dusting off the Sara Palin boogeyman to suddenly include VPs in hopes of making your point...

but just as suddenly you ignore Joe Biden because he directly refutes your point.

I bet you never lose an argument with yourself.

cr726 · 01-13-2012, 01:14 PM

[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328386]I didn't put words in your mouth..
I used YOUR WORDS (note the bolded quote below).

You said: [B]"GOP used to nominate elder experienced statesmen"[/B]...

and when your point is proven wrong in just the very last time your point was tested...

You divert your argument by dusting off the Sara Palin boogeyman to suddenly include VPs in hopes of making your point...

but just as suddenly you ignore Joe Biden because he directly refutes your point.

I bet you never lose an argument with yourself.[/QUOTE]

McCain was passed over for who again? Remember when he mattered and it wasn't 2008, he listened to Rove and the players, what statemen would do that again? I am not arguing what the Dems do, I don't agree with them either, but hanging your hat on McCain in 2008 isn't going to win any arguments.

Phoenixx · 01-13-2012, 01:25 PM

[QUOTE=cr726;4328402][B]McCain was passed over for who again? [/B]

Remember when he mattered and it wasn't 2008, he listened to Rove and the players, what statemen would do that again? I am not arguing what the Dems do, I don't agree with them either, but hanging your hat on McCain in 2008 isn't going to win any arguments.[/QUOTE]

So McCain was an elder statesman in 2000 when he was passed over for Bush 43..

But 8 years later..when McCain was 8 years more elderly with 8 years more experience.... he suddenly was no longer elderly statesman.

Is that your argument ??

cr726 · 01-13-2012, 01:30 PM

[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328420]So McCain was an elder statesman in 2000 when he was passed over for Bush 43..

But 8 years later..when McCain was 8 years more elderly with 8 years more experience.... he suddenly was no longer elderly statesman.

Is that your argument ??[/QUOTE]

You want to argue he was the same candidate 8 years later, feel free.

Phoenixx · 01-13-2012, 01:58 PM

[QUOTE=cr726;4328431]You want to argue he was the same candidate 8 years later, feel free.[/QUOTE]

Of course candidates change over time...
But make no mistake..John McCain, the 2000 maverick..ran on his experience in Government and in Foreign Affairs against Bush Jr. in 2000.
Didn't win..doesn't mean he didn't try.

But your premise of "elderly statesman vs. hot candidate" is flawed anyway.

From 1960 on..
For non-incumbent Democrats..
JFK, McGovern, Carter, Clinton and Obama all ran as the fresh, new, hot outside candidate

Humphrey, Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry all ran on their experience.

For the GOP..
Goldwater, Reagan and Bush Jr all ran as outsiders while Nixon, Dole, Bush Sr, and McCain all ran as experienced candidates.

Please try to respond without a mention/inference to Karl Rove and Sarah Palin..
Thanks in advance ;)

southparkcpa · 01-13-2012, 02:02 PM

[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328497]Of course candidates change over time...
But make no mistake..John McCain, the 2000 maverick..ran on his experience in Government and in Foreign Affairs against Bush Jr. in 2000.
Didn't win..doesn't mean he didn't try.

But your premise of "elderly statesman vs. hot candidate" is flawed anyway.

From 1960 on..
For non-incumbent Democrats..
JFK, McGovern, Carter, Clinton and Obama all ran as the fresh, new, hot outside candidate

Humphrey, Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry all ran on their experience.

For the GOP..
Goldwater, Reagan and Bush Jr all ran as outsiders while Nixon, Dole, Bush Sr, and McCain all ran as experienced candidates.

Please try to respond without a mention/inference to Karl Rove and Sarah Palin..
Thanks in advance ;)[/QUOTE]

Like trying to get a fish to fly.....

cr726 · 01-13-2012, 02:32 PM

[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328497]Of course candidates change over time...
But make no mistake..John McCain, the 2000 maverick..ran on his experience in Government and in Foreign Affairs against Bush Jr. in 2000.
Didn't win..doesn't mean he didn't try.

But your premise of "elderly statesman vs. hot candidate" is flawed anyway.

From 1960 on..
For non-incumbent Democrats..
JFK, McGovern, Carter, Clinton and Obama all ran as the fresh, new, hot outside candidate

Humphrey, Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry all ran on their experience.

For the GOP..
Goldwater, Reagan and Bush Jr all ran as outsiders while Nixon, Dole, Bush Sr, and McCain all ran as experienced candidates.

Please try to respond without a mention/inference to Karl Rove and Sarah Palin..
Thanks in advance ;)[/QUOTE]

Goldwater was an outsider? Bush Jr. was the son of a past President and you want to consider him an outsider too? Goldwater was def the party's elder stateman. Bush Jr. has set your party back and now you are dealing with it.

cr726 · 01-13-2012, 02:36 PM

[QUOTE=southparkcpa;4328512]Like trying to get a fish to fly.....[/QUOTE]

Great post! Comedy from a CPA.......:rolleyes:

Phoenixx · 01-13-2012, 03:01 PM

Ok...since you didn't bother to reply to the rebuttal of your Democratic Party stereotype..I'll assume you've given up on that.

As for the GOP argument you are making...

[QUOTE=cr726;4328596]Goldwater was an outsider? [/quote]

Clearly...ask Nelson Rockefeller or Henry Cabot Lodge, Jr.

[QUOTE=cr726;4328596]Bush Jr. was the son of a past President and you want to consider him an outsider too? [/quote]

I am trying to follow YOUR words...
Apparently you think 54 year old W was a Republican Party Elder Statesman.
I, and the rest of America, disagree with you.

[QUOTE=cr726;4328596]Goldwater was def the party's elder stateman. [/quote]

You are embarrassingly misinformed on GOP history.

cr726 · 01-13-2012, 05:54 PM

:zzz: You can turn this around anyway you want, GW was the hot name and they threw Mcain (statesman at the time)aside for him.

[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328658]Ok...since you didn't bother to reply to the rebuttal of your Democratic Party stereotype..I'll assume you've given up on that.

As for the GOP argument you are making...

Clearly...ask Nelson Rockefeller or Henry Cabot Lodge, Jr.

I am trying to follow YOUR words...
Apparently you think 54 year old W was a Republican Party Elder Statesman.
I, and the rest of America, disagree with you.

You are embarrassingly misinformed on GOP history.[/QUOTE]

Phoenixx · 01-13-2012, 06:33 PM

[QUOTE=cr726;4328976]:zzz: You can turn this around anyway you want, GW was the hot name and they threw Mcain (statesman at the time)aside for him.[/QUOTE]

We started with you saying this:

[QUOTE]"GOP used to nominate elder experienced statesmen and the Dems would find the young hot name."[/QUOTE]

So after I took you thru the last 13 Presidential elections and showed you were wrong about Democratic nominees and the background of Barry Goldwater among others...

We are back where we began...the elder statesman who was denied the nomination in 2000 was the more elder statesman who won the nomination in 2008.

Like I said...what was your point ??

Here..I'll save you a reply...
Have a good weekend. :yes:

Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin

cr726 · 01-13-2012, 06:59 PM

[QUOTE=cr726;4328074]Bush 1 was the last groomed and distinguished GOP candidate, Rove ended that and now we have what we do now.[/QUOTE]

This was my first post.

shakin318 · 01-13-2012, 07:45 PM

Phoenix, we have a rule about picking on the less able. Please play nice.

cr726 · 01-13-2012, 10:30 PM

[QUOTE=shakin318;4329060]Phoenix, we have a rule about picking on the less able. Please play nice.[/QUOTE]

Wow, another great post. :zzz:

01-13-2012, 11:36 AM	#81
Phoenixx Hall Of Fame Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Fairfield County, CT Posts: 6,870	[QUOTE=cr726;4328194] GOP used to nominate elder experienced statesmen and the Dems would find the young hot name.[/QUOTE] Used to ?? You just defined the 2008 candidates exactly.

01-13-2012, 12:23 PM	#82
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,534	[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328203]Used to ?? You just defined the 2008 candidates exactly.[/QUOTE] Sure if you want to ignore the VP they chose, you would of had a point.

01-13-2012, 12:33 PM	#83
Phoenixx Hall Of Fame Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Fairfield County, CT Posts: 6,870	[QUOTE=cr726;4328301]Sure if you want to ignore the VP they chose, you would of had a point.[/QUOTE] So the choice of Sara Palin negates the statesmanship of John McCain ... but the choice of Joe Biden reinforces the hotness of Barack Obama ?? :rolleyes: What is your point again ?? :confused:

01-13-2012, 12:43 PM	#84
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,534	[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328319]So the choice of Sara Palin negates the statesmanship of John McCain ... but the choice of Joe Biden reinforces the hotness of Barack Obama ?? :rolleyes: What is your point again ?? :confused:[/QUOTE] Why do you constantly try to put words in my mouth? Dems have always been guilty of looking for the hot name, but back to my point, Palin absolutely blows the statesmanship out of McCain. McCain was passed over by Rove and the boys when he mattered and then McCain being the desperate man to become Pres (last shot) he listened to the Rove types and brought Palin (embarrassment).

01-13-2012, 01:05 PM	#85
Phoenixx Hall Of Fame Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Fairfield County, CT Posts: 6,870	[QUOTE=cr726;4328336]Why do you constantly try to put words in my mouth? Dems have always been guilty of looking for the hot name, but back to my point, Palin absolutely blows the statesmanship out of McCain. McCain was passed over by Rove and the boys when he mattered and then McCain being the desperate man to become Pres (last shot) he listened to the Rove types and brought Palin (embarrassment).[/QUOTE] I didn't put words in your mouth.. I used YOUR WORDS (note the bolded quote below). You said: [B]"GOP used to nominate elder experienced statesmen"[/B]... and when your point is proven wrong in just the very last time your point was tested... You divert your argument by dusting off the Sara Palin boogeyman to suddenly include VPs in hopes of making your point... but just as suddenly you ignore Joe Biden because he directly refutes your point. I bet you never lose an argument with yourself.

01-13-2012, 01:14 PM	#86
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,534	[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328386]I didn't put words in your mouth.. I used YOUR WORDS (note the bolded quote below). You said: [B]"GOP used to nominate elder experienced statesmen"[/B]... and when your point is proven wrong in just the very last time your point was tested... You divert your argument by dusting off the Sara Palin boogeyman to suddenly include VPs in hopes of making your point... but just as suddenly you ignore Joe Biden because he directly refutes your point. I bet you never lose an argument with yourself.[/QUOTE] McCain was passed over for who again? Remember when he mattered and it wasn't 2008, he listened to Rove and the players, what statemen would do that again? I am not arguing what the Dems do, I don't agree with them either, but hanging your hat on McCain in 2008 isn't going to win any arguments.

01-13-2012, 01:25 PM	#87
Phoenixx Hall Of Fame Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Fairfield County, CT Posts: 6,870	[QUOTE=cr726;4328402][B]McCain was passed over for who again? [/B] Remember when he mattered and it wasn't 2008, he listened to Rove and the players, what statemen would do that again? I am not arguing what the Dems do, I don't agree with them either, but hanging your hat on McCain in 2008 isn't going to win any arguments.[/QUOTE] So McCain was an elder statesman in 2000 when he was passed over for Bush 43.. But 8 years later..when McCain was 8 years more elderly with 8 years more experience.... he suddenly was no longer elderly statesman. Is that your argument ??

01-13-2012, 01:30 PM	#88
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,534	[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328420]So McCain was an elder statesman in 2000 when he was passed over for Bush 43.. But 8 years later..when McCain was 8 years more elderly with 8 years more experience.... he suddenly was no longer elderly statesman. Is that your argument ??[/QUOTE] You want to argue he was the same candidate 8 years later, feel free.

01-13-2012, 01:58 PM	#89
Phoenixx Hall Of Fame Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Fairfield County, CT Posts: 6,870	[QUOTE=cr726;4328431]You want to argue he was the same candidate 8 years later, feel free.[/QUOTE] Of course candidates change over time... But make no mistake..John McCain, the 2000 maverick..ran on his experience in Government and in Foreign Affairs against Bush Jr. in 2000. Didn't win..doesn't mean he didn't try. But your premise of "elderly statesman vs. hot candidate" is flawed anyway. From 1960 on.. For non-incumbent Democrats.. JFK, McGovern, Carter, Clinton and Obama all ran as the fresh, new, hot outside candidate Humphrey, Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry all ran on their experience. For the GOP.. Goldwater, Reagan and Bush Jr all ran as outsiders while Nixon, Dole, Bush Sr, and McCain all ran as experienced candidates. Please try to respond without a mention/inference to Karl Rove and Sarah Palin.. Thanks in advance ;)

01-13-2012, 02:02 PM	#90
southparkcpa I see the 88 to 97 period all over again. Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: NC Posts: 15,923	[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328497]Of course candidates change over time... But make no mistake..John McCain, the 2000 maverick..ran on his experience in Government and in Foreign Affairs against Bush Jr. in 2000. Didn't win..doesn't mean he didn't try. But your premise of "elderly statesman vs. hot candidate" is flawed anyway. From 1960 on.. For non-incumbent Democrats.. JFK, McGovern, Carter, Clinton and Obama all ran as the fresh, new, hot outside candidate Humphrey, Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry all ran on their experience. For the GOP.. Goldwater, Reagan and Bush Jr all ran as outsiders while Nixon, Dole, Bush Sr, and McCain all ran as experienced candidates. Please try to respond without a mention/inference to Karl Rove and Sarah Palin.. Thanks in advance ;)[/QUOTE] Like trying to get a fish to fly.....

01-13-2012, 02:32 PM	#91
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,534	[QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328497]Of course candidates change over time... But make no mistake..John McCain, the 2000 maverick..ran on his experience in Government and in Foreign Affairs against Bush Jr. in 2000. Didn't win..doesn't mean he didn't try. But your premise of "elderly statesman vs. hot candidate" is flawed anyway. From 1960 on.. For non-incumbent Democrats.. JFK, McGovern, Carter, Clinton and Obama all ran as the fresh, new, hot outside candidate Humphrey, Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry all ran on their experience. For the GOP.. Goldwater, Reagan and Bush Jr all ran as outsiders while Nixon, Dole, Bush Sr, and McCain all ran as experienced candidates. Please try to respond without a mention/inference to Karl Rove and Sarah Palin.. Thanks in advance ;)[/QUOTE] Goldwater was an outsider? Bush Jr. was the son of a past President and you want to consider him an outsider too? Goldwater was def the party's elder stateman. Bush Jr. has set your party back and now you are dealing with it.

01-13-2012, 02:36 PM	#92
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,534	[QUOTE=southparkcpa;4328512]Like trying to get a fish to fly.....[/QUOTE] Great post! Comedy from a CPA.......:rolleyes:

01-13-2012, 03:01 PM	#93
Phoenixx Hall Of Fame Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Fairfield County, CT Posts: 6,870	Ok...since you didn't bother to reply to the rebuttal of your Democratic Party stereotype..I'll assume you've given up on that. As for the GOP argument you are making... [QUOTE=cr726;4328596]Goldwater was an outsider? [/quote] Clearly...ask Nelson Rockefeller or Henry Cabot Lodge, Jr. [QUOTE=cr726;4328596]Bush Jr. was the son of a past President and you want to consider him an outsider too? [/quote] I am trying to follow YOUR words... Apparently you think 54 year old W was a Republican Party Elder Statesman. I, and the rest of America, disagree with you. [QUOTE=cr726;4328596]Goldwater was def the party's elder stateman. [/quote] You are embarrassingly misinformed on GOP history.

01-13-2012, 05:54 PM	#94
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,534	:zzz: You can turn this around anyway you want, GW was the hot name and they threw Mcain (statesman at the time)aside for him. [QUOTE=Phoenixx;4328658]Ok...since you didn't bother to reply to the rebuttal of your Democratic Party stereotype..I'll assume you've given up on that. As for the GOP argument you are making... Clearly...ask Nelson Rockefeller or Henry Cabot Lodge, Jr. I am trying to follow YOUR words... Apparently you think 54 year old W was a Republican Party Elder Statesman. I, and the rest of America, disagree with you. You are embarrassingly misinformed on GOP history.[/QUOTE]

01-13-2012, 06:33 PM	#95
Phoenixx Hall Of Fame Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Fairfield County, CT Posts: 6,870	[QUOTE=cr726;4328976]:zzz: You can turn this around anyway you want, GW was the hot name and they threw Mcain (statesman at the time)aside for him.[/QUOTE] We started with you saying this: [QUOTE]"GOP used to nominate elder experienced statesmen and the Dems would find the young hot name."[/QUOTE] So after I took you thru the last 13 Presidential elections and showed you were wrong about Democratic nominees and the background of Barry Goldwater among others... We are back where we began...the elder statesman who was denied the nomination in 2000 was the more elder statesman who won the nomination in 2008. Like I said...what was your point ?? Here..I'll save you a reply... Have a good weekend. :yes: Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin...Karl Rove...Sarah Palin

01-13-2012, 06:59 PM	#96
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,534	[QUOTE=cr726;4328074]Bush 1 was the last groomed and distinguished GOP candidate, Rove ended that and now we have what we do now.[/QUOTE] This was my first post.

01-13-2012, 07:45 PM	#97
shakin318 all your post counts are belong to us Board Moderator Jets Insider VIP Charter JI Member Join Date: May 1999 Location: Funkytown Posts: 7,255	Phoenix, we have a rule about picking on the less able. Please play nice.

01-13-2012, 10:30 PM	#98
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,534	[QUOTE=shakin318;4329060]Phoenix, we have a rule about picking on the less able. Please play nice.[/QUOTE] Wow, another great post. :zzz: