COPLES haters - put yer name on it

[King Koopa]

[QUOTE=iahawkeyejet;4449115]Fair enough. I enjoy your posts and usually agree on most subjects, but I disagree on some of your points there.

It's easy to say that if Coples busts and Ingram is a stud that the Jets will get everything they deserve, but what if Coples is a stud and Ingram busts. Ingram is no where close to a sure fire NFL stud. You are right about scouts loving long arms and prototype bodies, things Coples possesses as well.

You say that Ingram is the better pure football player and simply wants it more. He may simply want it more, but if that's the case, he's certainly not the better pure football player. If he's the better pure football player, and he gives considerably more effort, he should produce more than Coples, and he simply didn't.

Everyone has their opinions, and I'm by no means saying I'm positive is the next great pass rusher in the NFL, but to say Ingram consistently dominated and was always disruptive. He dominated against Auburn, and played a damn good game in the Bowl game. He also was far from dominant in a few games this year, just like Coples.

I guess what it boils down to me is that I don't like the argument that Ingram is the better pick because he works harder. They produced similar numbers(slight edge to Coples), so he worked hard enough to be a better college player than Ingram. That's not me saying that, that's pretty much every talent evaluator saying it for the past 4 months, with the exception of a few recently. We as fans also have no idea what was the cause of the perceived lack of effort with Coples. The NC football program was a dumpster fire for his last 2 years there. He was a 20/21 year old college kid. Who knows what all went into it.

A lot of people(not necessarily you) are making him out to be some dog on and off the field, like he's the laziest player to ever step on a football field. That's just a bunch of crap. Is it true that he may not went full throttle on every single snap of every game? Seems to be the case, but that doesn't mean he just rolled over and died all the time too.

After reading all that, I just want to add this, I don't want this to come off as directed completely off you, just an overall venting on the back and forths throughout the board.[/QUOTE]

Good Post buy we just have differing opinions.....Ingram kinda came outta nowhere midway through 2010 and for the most part was great till the end of his collegiate career

Not saying Coples will bust or anything, but if anyone were to be the Vernon Gholston of 2012, Coples would have to be the odds on favorite, no? I just find it strange we chose this kind of route, but I do understand the potential

I hope Coples is the best DE to ever play the game for obvious reasons and I also hope my boy Ingram succeeds in San Diego and I'll leave it at that

[Paradis]

[QUOTE=King Koopa;4449116]Because scouts fall in love with prototypical body types and potential instead of great football players

If Coples is some all world DE.....How did he drop to us in the first place? Prototype DE's like Coples don't usually make it out of the top 10, so what happened here?

You can take guys like Poe and Coples.....I'll take Fletcher Cox, Brockers, and Ingram[/QUOTE]

Coples slid for reasons NC's sh*t program largely played a part in.

Ingram played his best ball and still couldn't beat out Coples.

You're getting me all wrong if you think I don't like Ingram. He was the guy who i was very OK with taking once Floyd was off our radar... but hands down, if Coples is on the board, forget it. Ingrams come and go. Coples is a specimen

[LB54]

[url]

[King Koopa]

[QUOTE=Paradis;4449120]Coples slid for reasons NC's sh*t program largely played a part in.

Ingram played his best ball and still couldn't beat out Coples.

You're getting me all wrong if you think I don't like Ingram. He was the guy who i was very OK with taking once Floyd was off our radar... but hands down, if Coples is on the board, forget it. Ingrams come and go. Coples is a specimen[/QUOTE]

Fair enough....But the term "beating out" really annoys me

For example, Dontari Poe "beat out" Fletcher Cox, but you can't even tell me Dontari Poe was as close to as good of a collegiate player, at Memphis no less, than Fletcher Cox

Some scouts/teams fall in love with potential and body types, some teams prefer the more sure fire football players

I think that's what happened here with Ingram/Coples......to a lesser extent

[Paradis]

Can't wait to get a jersey

[Paradis]

[QUOTE=King Koopa;4449125]Fair enough....But the term "beating out" really annoys me

For example, Dontari Poe "beat out" Fletcher Cox, but you can't even tell me Dontari Poe was as close to as good of a collegiate player, at Memphis no less, than Fletcher Cox

Some scouts/teams fall in love with potential and body types, some teams prefer the more sure fire football players

I think that's what happened here with Ingram/Coples......to a lesser extent[/QUOTE]

Maybe so... but there's denying that IF things worked out for Coples and the Jets... we're talking glory baby. Pretty much exactly what we've been looking for and complaining about. That guy with the IT factor to create pressure

[King Koopa]

[QUOTE=Paradis;4449128]Maybe so... but there's denying that IF things worked out for Coples and the Jets... we're talking glory baby. Pretty much exactly what we've been looking for and complaining about. That guy with the IT factor to create pressure[/QUOTE]

I agree with this.....

With Ingram I felt like we would have got a guy that would have been a solid passrusher/player at worst, an overall solid football player....with the potential to be great

Coples has an even higher potential but also could be a complete flop IMO and and it wouldnt be a huge surprise to alot of people if thats the case

I hope the Jets really did their homework with this guy and are convinced he loves football and loves working hard at every part of what makes a good football player

[Woody56]

[QUOTE=King Koopa;4449119]Good Post buy we just have differing opinions.....Ingram kinda came outta nowhere midway through 2010 and for the most part was great till the end of his collegiate career

Not saying Coples will bust or anything, but if anyone were to be the Vernon Gholston of 2012, Coples would have to be the odds on favorite, no? I just find it strange we chose this kind of route, but I do understand the potential

I hope Coples is the best DE to ever play the game for obvious reasons and I also hope my boy Ingram succeeds in San Diego and I'll leave it at that[/QUOTE]

Nick Perry is the Gholston of this draft. Pretty much the same exact guy.

[southparkcpa]

[QUOTE=Austin;4448144]Hate the pick. Physical freak who doesn't love football? Where have I heard that before..?

Hope I'm wrong.[/QUOTE]

I watched him at UNC....over rated.

[augustiniak]

random thoughts:

- coples isn't just a pass rusher. he blows up his share of runs too. something to remember which is getting overlooked.

- i know it was just one interview, but he seems like a humble kid who wound up in a messed up program.

- he's nothing like gholston. he's a pure football player and can shed blocks.

- there's a prevailing belief on this board that in a 3-4 defense the entire pass rush has to come from lbs. well that's really been the problem since rex arrived. now they can actually get pressure from coples and wilkerson, and from the inside, too. and don't underestimate having tall DLs. maybe they can bat down some passes too.

- truth, if the patriots took him we'd all be kinda pissed. all the analysts would be saying how belichick will max this kid's potential and the afc east qbs better watch out. but really, with rex as the hc and wilk as his former hs teammate, he's in an ideal environment. he could flourish here.

- don't get too down on the kid for not pushing it his senior year. the unc hc got canned, the program was in complete disarray and he wanted to protect his draft stock by not getting hurt. if you're him, you just may have done the same thing.

- as for ingram, he would have been a fine jet, but if you look how the best teams draft pass rushers, arm length and body type does matter. all you need to do is look how the giants draft. the would never take a guy like ingram in the first round. the guys they take all look similar - tuck, osi, jpp. coples has the same build. while there are exceptions, that's generally been the case. if coples played with a bit more fire last season he'd have been a top 10 pick no doubt.

[Winstonbiggs]

Love the pick! Nothing wrong with being lazy and inconsistent if you actually have the talent and can pick your spots.

[paulyjet]

Mike Mayock's deer in the headlights look after the pick told me all i need to know.
Jets fail... again.

[jetswin]

I wanted Jones...now I have to compare these two forever. Hope I was wrong.

[Scoop24]

[QUOTE=paulyjet;4449166]Mike Mayock's deer in the headlights look after the pick told me all i need to know.
Jets fail... again.[/QUOTE]

the same Mayock who loved Gholston?

but not even that Draft Experts Never been wrong before?

[lamont_jordan_rules]

[QUOTE=LB54;4449123][url]

[sg3]

the only thing that worries me is that he is from UNC

has UNC ever produced a single decent pass rusher in the NFL??


:):):):)

[Winstonbiggs]

[QUOTE=Scoop24;4449176]the same Mayock who loved Gholston?

but not even that Draft Experts Never been wrong before?[/QUOTE]

Exactly a dart board would get you the same results at a much lower cost.

[sg3]

I kind of feel sorry for Mayock on that set... I mean with Irvin and Faulk yukking it up and talking amongst themselves 90 percent of the time and Eisen making little or no attempt to shut them up, poor Mayock who is the only one of the four who actually has a clue as to who these players are is stuck on off on the side saying nothing

[CanadaSteve]

[QUOTE=Paradis;4449128]Maybe so... but there's denying that IF things worked out for Coples and the Jets... we're talking glory baby. Pretty much exactly what we've been looking for and complaining about. That guy with the IT factor to create pressure[/QUOTE]

I signed your thread Paradis, but now that I have a day to think about it, it might work out.

Now, imagine if Courtney Upshaw was to happen to fall to us?

[CanadaSteve]

[QUOTE=Winstonbiggs;4449183]Exactly a dart board would get you the same results at a much lower cost.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, that's incorrect. Mayock is THE best in the business.