A fraud has been perpetuated on the Jets’ fan base

[Dunnie]

Originally Posted by freestater

oh, ok.

thanks.

Pretty funny

[TechJet]

Originally Posted by rmeyer52

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/09/...nse-for-years/

A fraud has been perpetuated on the Jets’ fan base and the public at large.

For three years and two games apologists have brainwashed many into believing the Jets’ defense is elite, as if finishing in the top 5 in total yards allowed a bunch of times truly defines that which is fearsome.

It doesn’t.

There are several things to take from Sunday’s 27-10 loss in Pittsburgh, none of them good. I’m choosing this particular time and space to focus on the defense, but believe me when I tell you I’m cognizant of the disaster that was the offense, including the serious regression it showed. I just want to address this team in parts, so as not to force feed you in one big helping that which you already know.

A lot of what I’m about to say will sound familiar, but it bears repeating for the millionth time because for some odd reason the Jets still don’t get it, or are just ill-equipped to demonstrate they understand on anything resembling a weekly basis.

Despite its many successes in previous years, the Jets’ defense is a bend-but-don’t-break unit. It’s not elite. To be elite it would have to be as intimidating and productive as, say, what the Steelers showed on Sunday, or the Ravens generally have shown for more than a decade, or what the 49ers have displayed over the last year-plus or what the Giants have traditionally unveiled when they’ve needed it.

No, the Jets for sure get high marks for giving off an aura of invincibility, but when it’s time to actually produce and make the big plays at opportune moments they disappear, give up 10-minute drives, tackle like a Pop Warner team or treat opposing quarterbacks as if they wear red jerseys.

And please don’t talk to me about Darrelle Revis. Yes, his absence hurt Sunday, but you didn’t see the Steelers looking inept without their two best defensive players, Troy Polamalu and James Harrison. Pittsburgh found ways to ratchet up the intensity, to remain as intimidating as it always has been and to make a big impact when the moments called for it.

The Jets, on the other hand, continued to show they lead the NFL in best intentions.


More than anything else a top-notch defense is supposed to do, its pass rush must determine the tone and tenor of a particular game. The Jets recorded three sacks on Sunday. Sione Pouha got a gift when Ben Roethlisberger fell down in the second quarter and Gang Green got two more in the fourth quarter when the score was totally out of reach.

What exacerbated the situation further was the fact that coming in the Steelers’ offensive line was a mess, and to be honest it didn’t play all that great Sunday. The Jets, for whatever the reasons — and if you figure them out you’re smarter than me, Rex Ryan and a host of others, did not finish plays. They spent plenty of time in the pocket and got their hands on Roethlisberger at least a dozen times, but as for interrupting his rhythm or, dare I say it, bringing him to the ground with the ball, they failed miserably.

And we’ve seen this time and time again, regardless of the opponent, over the last three-plus years.

The question is why?

Do the Jets just simply not have the talent up front to get to the quarterback, even though they have made a concerted effort to draft linemen and get quicker and more athletic? Or are the schemes they employ not effective enough? I ask because regardless if they are running a 3-4 and bringing a host of linebackers or a 4-3 and relying on individual talent and pass-rushing ability, they have not gotten the job done.

Now you could say it was only the second game of the season and things can only improve, but I’d counter that by saying we’ve seen this type of failure repeatedly since Ryan arrived prior to the 2009 season. Don’t you think a true pass rush might have gotten the Jets over the hump in both 2009 and ’10 and put them in a better position to perhaps host playoff games and not have to take the hard road toward February? A case can be made that not doing a better job in the regular season was the soul reason why the Jets fell just short of the Super Bowl. I say this because playing and winning on the road in the NFL, regardless of the time of the season, is an art, not a given.

What magnifies the defense’s failure most is the fact that this offense, despite what it pulled off in Week 1, is probably, at the end of the day, below average to average at best. Without better running backs and better run-blocking, the Jets have to rely on Mark Sanchez, who, though improved, looked like his previous self after the first quarter against the Steelers.

And that’s because the Steelers have an elite defense. They sensed the enormity of the situation and went into lockdown mode on the Jets’ receivers. Jeremy Kerley had one catch after the 45-yard reception in the first quarter. Stephen Hill, he of the we better pick this guy up Hills of the World Fantasy Football Assoc., did not record a catch. Santonio Holmes was AWOL after his quick start and finished with three grabs for 28 yards.

And while all this was happening, the Jets and their fans watched in horror as Mike Wallace abused Antonio Cromartie, LaRon Landry, the heat-seeking missile that he is, repeatedly missed his marks (and got penalties) and the Jets’ defense as a whole decided two-hand touch was a far better way to stop the Pittsburgh offense than actually wrapping people up.

The Jets can get away with bending but not breaking and coming in the vicinity of quarterbacks against less experienced signal callers, which is what they will see more often than not during the rest of the regular season. However, when it comes time to deal with the Roethlisbergers, Tom Bradys and Matt Schaubs of the world they better pray they have done enough to beat teams with the likes of Ryan Tannehill, Andrew Luck, Russell Wilson, Blaine Gabbert and Jake Locker, among others, under center or this will, indeed, be a very long season.

I have no doubt the Jets will be fine against the run, but in this pass-happy league you don’t need a stellar running game to win. Not anymore. Quarterbacks are maturing at lightning speed as opposed to previous generations, and every team has enough depth at wide receiver and tight end to handle teams that can’t get to the quarterback.

Like the Jets.

Ryan and all of his defensive lieutenants better take what happened in Pittsburgh and learn from it because it’s hard to imagine the Jets’ offense consistently giving this defense a cushion. The Jets simply can’t look at what happened against Buffalo as the rule rather than the exception.

Either the Jets start sacking the QB, forcing turnovers or making sure the opposition’s punter plays more than their place-kicker or we’re all in for a very stressful final 14 games.

And if that happens, someone should pay. Who that could be remains to be seen. The Jets, for their part, should do everything in their power to see to it that no decisions like that ever need to be made.

The bottom line is this notion that the Jets have an elite defense is just a theory and a desire. It’s nowhere near a reality.

OOOKAY! Do you know Lisa Salters!? you need a dose of her!

[JonEJet]

Originally Posted by PatsFanTX

Not going crazy at all.

Pats lost that game because of the offense, not the defense.

Two games in a row, the defense played great.

Time will tell.

Pats defense played great?

Thought I read the score to be 20-18 Cupcake Cards

That means the Pats defense let up more points than the Cards let up.

Are you and your pathetic Pats fans looking for moral victories now?

[kennyo7]

Not passing judgement after 2 weeks. BUT...as I said all offseason, our Defense is not that good. Why? #1 our LBs are old and slow and cannot tackle.

[BleedGreen314]

Article is spot on. If I said it once I said it a hundred times, our linebackers are the problem, they ****ing suck. It is not a safety's job to cover tight ends and running backs it is a linebacker's. It literally ****s the roles up on ye whole defense. Big Ben destroyed the middle all game. You could have flown the MetLife blimp through the separation Heath Miller got on David Harris, it is ****ing disgraceful. At minimum, Bart Scott should be sitting in favor of Demario Davis, experience be damned, useless Bryan Thomas should be sitting and McIntyre should get the majority of reps. I would suggest trading Harris for picks but we need so much help on the other side of the ball that we can't pick a high linebacker next year so we can work with it if Davis is playing.

[SAR I]

Ryan was asked if he is concerned about his defense allowing 55 points in the first two games.

"Bet against us," Ryan said. "We'll see where it ends up. I know where it's going to end up. I tell you every year. It's the same thing. We've had some issues. We couldn't get off the field on third down. In the first game you get four takeaways in a half. I think that was pretty good. Up 41-7 on a team, we'll take that regardless of how any yards you give up."

SAR I

[Gibby]

Originally Posted by PatsFanTX

A young, athletic, fast defense with 3 rookie starters, versus an old, slow defense that can't make a play in crunch time with the game on the line?

Yea, I'm sure all the GM's and HC's would prefer the Jets defense.

Keep telling yourself the Jets defense is elite.

Where in my post did I ever say our D was elite. No its still very good though and far better than the pats. You have always been a fly in the oniment however I thought you knew a little about football. Now Iam not so sure. Whats that word you like to use. OH YEAH DELUSIONAL.

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by kennyo7

Not passing judgement after 2 weeks. BUT...as I said all offseason, our Defense is not that good. Why? #1 our LBs are old and slow and cannot tackle.

Wheelchairs, not wheels.

SAR I

[Apache 51]

A defense is fighting with one eye, when the offense doesn't do it's part the defense is fighting with one eye, and an arm tied behind it's back.

[Apache 51]

Defense gave them ample time all game to rack up points.

[NY's stepchild]

Originally Posted by GuidoYaztremski

Have you even seen this years Pats defense yet? Not elite, but a far cry from 'in shambles'. You pull that outta your ass?

I have friends in Glendale and they say you suck.

[CleatMarks]

Originally Posted by JonEJet

Pats defense played great?

Thought I read the score to be 20-18 Cupcake Cards

That means the Pats defense let up more points than the Cards let up.

Are you and your pathetic Pats fans looking for moral victories now?

The offense turned the ball over on a short field twice. Anyone who saw the game can tell you that the defense played well. It's not an opinion, it's a fact.

[Ray Ray19]

Originally Posted by SAR I

Wheelchairs, not wheels.

SAR I

The Jets have one of the younger rosters in the league, Landry and Cromartie aren't old, they are 27 years old and in their primes. Devito is 28.

The Jets have players in Maybin, McIntyre that are playing more at OLB, and have younger players in Davis and Mauga rotating in at ILB. The starters are veteran players, but teams throughout the league have veteran players starting, LB is a position that will all the more likely be overhauled next season when Thomas and Pace will probably both not be back, and Scott could be a casualty as well.

Teams don't have all youth across the board at every position group.

[Dunnie]

Originally Posted by SAR I

Wheelchairs, not wheels.

SAR I

I don't get circling Landry and Harris .... If you do that you must circle Revis.

[CleatMarks]

The Jets starting linebackers are older than that Pats when this board used to call the Pats linebackers old and slow.

[NY's stepchild]

Ridiculous. I'm not really sure why our corners were giving such a big cushion, but the Steelers are pretty good. We're not the first team to look foolish trying to bring down Big Ben. We got there he just made great plays to buy time. Only so long you can cover receivers that good, and only so much time a defense can be out there before they start to tire. Pace seemed the one to get tired the most. Not sure why Coples didn't see more time since he made a few plays when he was out there. LBs covered pretty well. The biggest culprit was Harris, and he's not too old. We were playing zone the entire game which was a big mistake imo. Rex completely changed the way he called the game without Revis. Cro really screwed up that one jump ball, or what should have been a jump ball. The muffed punt really hurt too. The defense stopped them deep, and then again, and we end up with the ball at the 10.

The offense needed to move the ball a little to give the D a break, but I'm waiting to see the all 22 to decide whether the receivers were getting open or not. They really did seem to be getting mugged. However they were moving the ball pretty well until Mark, and Green got their bells rung.

You can't go crazy over just one week. Well you can, but it makes you seem foolish. Week 2 of the new offense. We'll now see if Sporano can make the adjustments that we've been longing for all these years.

[sec.101row23]

Originally Posted by Ray Ray19

The Jets have one of the younger rosters in the league, Landry and Cromartie aren't old, they are 27 years old and in their primes. Devito is 28.

The Jets have players in Maybin, McIntyre that are playing more at OLB, and have younger players in Davis and Mauga rotating in at ILB. The starters are veteran players, but teams throughout the league have veteran players starting, LB is a position that will all the more likely be overhauled next season when Thomas and Pace will probably both not be back, and Scott could be a casualty as well.

Teams don't have all youth across the board at every position group.

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post...ngest-starters

Actually Ray that isnt true. If you look at the article where they take the average age of the starters on each unit, you will see the Jets have 2nd oldest average age in the league on defense and the offense is ranked 11th oldest.

The average age of the entire Jets roster is 26.21 years, which is pretty much the league average and ranks them at 17 in the league. The youngest is the Rams at 25.32 and the oldest is the Chargers at 27.15.

[32green]

Originally Posted by rmeyer52

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/09/...nse-for-years/

A fraud has been perpetuated on the Jets’ fan base and the public at large.

For three years and two games apologists have brainwashed many into believing the Jets’ defense is elite, as if finishing in the top 5 in total yards allowed a bunch of times truly defines that which is fearsome.

It doesn’t.

There are several things to take from Sunday’s 27-10 loss in Pittsburgh, none of them good. I’m choosing this particular time and space to focus on the defense, but believe me when I tell you I’m cognizant of the disaster that was the offense, including the serious regression it showed. I just want to address this team in parts, so as not to force feed you in one big helping that which you already know.

A lot of what I’m about to say will sound familiar, but it bears repeating for the millionth time because for some odd reason the Jets still don’t get it, or are just ill-equipped to demonstrate they understand on anything resembling a weekly basis.

Despite its many successes in previous years, the Jets’ defense is a bend-but-don’t-break unit. It’s not elite. To be elite it would have to be as intimidating and productive as, say, what the Steelers showed on Sunday, or the Ravens generally have shown for more than a decade, or what the 49ers have displayed over the last year-plus or what the Giants have traditionally unveiled when they’ve needed it.

No, the Jets for sure get high marks for giving off an aura of invincibility, but when it’s time to actually produce and make the big plays at opportune moments they disappear, give up 10-minute drives, tackle like a Pop Warner team or treat opposing quarterbacks as if they wear red jerseys.

And please don’t talk to me about Darrelle Revis. Yes, his absence hurt Sunday, but you didn’t see the Steelers looking inept without their two best defensive players, Troy Polamalu and James Harrison. Pittsburgh found ways to ratchet up the intensity, to remain as intimidating as it always has been and to make a big impact when the moments called for it.

The Jets, on the other hand, continued to show they lead the NFL in best intentions.


More than anything else a top-notch defense is supposed to do, its pass rush must determine the tone and tenor of a particular game. The Jets recorded three sacks on Sunday. Sione Pouha got a gift when Ben Roethlisberger fell down in the second quarter and Gang Green got two more in the fourth quarter when the score was totally out of reach.

What exacerbated the situation further was the fact that coming in the Steelers’ offensive line was a mess, and to be honest it didn’t play all that great Sunday. The Jets, for whatever the reasons — and if you figure them out you’re smarter than me, Rex Ryan and a host of others, did not finish plays. They spent plenty of time in the pocket and got their hands on Roethlisberger at least a dozen times, but as for interrupting his rhythm or, dare I say it, bringing him to the ground with the ball, they failed miserably.

And we’ve seen this time and time again, regardless of the opponent, over the last three-plus years.

The question is why?

Do the Jets just simply not have the talent up front to get to the quarterback, even though they have made a concerted effort to draft linemen and get quicker and more athletic? Or are the schemes they employ not effective enough? I ask because regardless if they are running a 3-4 and bringing a host of linebackers or a 4-3 and relying on individual talent and pass-rushing ability, they have not gotten the job done.

Now you could say it was only the second game of the season and things can only improve, but I’d counter that by saying we’ve seen this type of failure repeatedly since Ryan arrived prior to the 2009 season. Don’t you think a true pass rush might have gotten the Jets over the hump in both 2009 and ’10 and put them in a better position to perhaps host playoff games and not have to take the hard road toward February? A case can be made that not doing a better job in the regular season was the soul reason why the Jets fell just short of the Super Bowl. I say this because playing and winning on the road in the NFL, regardless of the time of the season, is an art, not a given.

What magnifies the defense’s failure most is the fact that this offense, despite what it pulled off in Week 1, is probably, at the end of the day, below average to average at best. Without better running backs and better run-blocking, the Jets have to rely on Mark Sanchez, who, though improved, looked like his previous self after the first quarter against the Steelers.

And that’s because the Steelers have an elite defense. They sensed the enormity of the situation and went into lockdown mode on the Jets’ receivers. Jeremy Kerley had one catch after the 45-yard reception in the first quarter. Stephen Hill, he of the we better pick this guy up Hills of the World Fantasy Football Assoc., did not record a catch. Santonio Holmes was AWOL after his quick start and finished with three grabs for 28 yards.

And while all this was happening, the Jets and their fans watched in horror as Mike Wallace abused Antonio Cromartie, LaRon Landry, the heat-seeking missile that he is, repeatedly missed his marks (and got penalties) and the Jets’ defense as a whole decided two-hand touch was a far better way to stop the Pittsburgh offense than actually wrapping people up.

The Jets can get away with bending but not breaking and coming in the vicinity of quarterbacks against less experienced signal callers, which is what they will see more often than not during the rest of the regular season. However, when it comes time to deal with the Roethlisbergers, Tom Bradys and Matt Schaubs of the world they better pray they have done enough to beat teams with the likes of Ryan Tannehill, Andrew Luck, Russell Wilson, Blaine Gabbert and Jake Locker, among others, under center or this will, indeed, be a very long season.

I have no doubt the Jets will be fine against the run, but in this pass-happy league you don’t need a stellar running game to win. Not anymore. Quarterbacks are maturing at lightning speed as opposed to previous generations, and every team has enough depth at wide receiver and tight end to handle teams that can’t get to the quarterback.

Like the Jets.

Ryan and all of his defensive lieutenants better take what happened in Pittsburgh and learn from it because it’s hard to imagine the Jets’ offense consistently giving this defense a cushion. The Jets simply can’t look at what happened against Buffalo as the rule rather than the exception.

Either the Jets start sacking the QB, forcing turnovers or making sure the opposition’s punter plays more than their place-kicker or we’re all in for a very stressful final 14 games.

And if that happens, someone should pay. Who that could be remains to be seen. The Jets, for their part, should do everything in their power to see to it that no decisions like that ever need to be made.

The bottom line is this notion that the Jets have an elite defense is just a theory and a desire. It’s nowhere near a reality.

+1

Granted, the O stalled, sputtered and pulled over to the side against Pitt....but this is nowhere near an Elite D.

Its silly to even deny it.

[NY's stepchild]

Originally Posted by Ray Ray19

The Jets have one of the younger rosters in the league, Landry and Cromartie aren't old, they are 27 years old and in their primes. Devito is 28.

The Jets have players in Maybin, McIntyre that are playing more at OLB, and have younger players in Davis and Mauga rotating in at ILB. The starters are veteran players, but teams throughout the league have veteran players starting, LB is a position that will all the more likely be overhauled next season when Thomas and Pace will probably both not be back, and Scott could be a casualty as well.

Teams don't have all youth across the board at every position group.

Pace and Scott have been two of our best players out there the first two games. Bart really does seem rejuvenated. The worst thing for him is actually he's been over aggressive at times, but he's actually been covering well. I still hope the young guys can work their way in. We'll see how much money they want, but they'll both be playing somewhere next year. McIntyre has been a revelation so far. Hopefully he keeps it up. The problem was the dbs in this game. Not the LBs at all. Harris did not have a great game.

[NY's stepchild]

Originally Posted by sec.101row23

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post...ngest-starters

Actually Ray that isnt true. If you look at the article where they take the average age of the starters on each unit, you will see the Jets have 2nd oldest average age in the league on defense and the offense is ranked 11th oldest.

The average age of the entire Jets roster is 26.21 years, which is pretty much the league average and ranks them at 17 in the league. The youngest is the Rams at 25.32 and the oldest is the Chargers at 27.15.

Well that seems a little ridiculous as well. Less than one year older on average than the youngest team. Seems like a huge concern. If Ellis, Coples, and McIntyre start then we're the youngest.