What has happened to the Jets' Special Teams? - Jets Insider.com Forums

RoadFan · 11-20-2012, 04:06 PM

This has been the worst season of special teams for the Jets in I don't know how long... the Kotite era? Westhoff has been the best in the biz for two decades, but his units this season have been unrecognizable.

Even during Sunday's win; The Jets had a FG blocked, a fake punt that should have been abandoned, they surrendered a kick return for a TD that was negated by a holding penalty that was not what you would call an egregious violation....

The Jets can't cover kicks, can't cover punts, can't field a punt, can't hold the line on field goal attempts, and can't protect the punter.

The only positives have been Folk, Malone, and the kick returning (not punt returning.) Malone is the best punter the Jets have had in forever, so we can be certain the Jets will stay true to form and let him walk at the end of the year.

The Jets have almost always had the edge over their opponent on special teams. Not anymore.

McGinley · 11-20-2012, 04:08 PM

Part of it is on Westy, but you can't blame the coach for the player not executing.

RoadFan · 11-20-2012, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McGinley

Part of it is on Westy, but you can't blame the coach for the player not executing.

The Schitty defense, nice.

DDNYjets · 11-20-2012, 04:10 PM

Goes hand in hand with our overall roster. It stinks.

Westy used to be able to polish a few turds and put together some decent units but we have less talent on this team than we have had in a long time.

I can't kill Westy b.c a Pro Bowl LT doesn't do his assignment or b.c he is forced to have a backup QB as PP, one that can't read a defense and misses blocks. Can't kill him when Kerley fumbles punts. He used to be able to put Leonhard back there when we needed to sure things up.

McGinley · 11-20-2012, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoadFan

The Schitty defense, nice.

Did I not just say that Westy is partially to blame? Sorry, I didn't know that Westhoff was out on the field missing tackles/arm tackling.

It's common sense that when a player ****s up, that's on him. A coach can only do so much, you know?

Nike · 11-20-2012, 04:13 PM

i too blame the overall roster. westhoff is using what he has to do what he can.

Apache 51 · 11-20-2012, 04:16 PM

Roster is stretched, next year it will be better.

Beerfish · 11-20-2012, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McGinley

Part of it is on Westy, but you can't blame the coach for the player not executing.

Eh? Of course you can that is what the frigging coaches are there for, to make sure players execute. It's not rocket science to block on a FG or a punt.

If Westy is not blamed for the awful specials this year then I guess we can not give him any credit for all the good years of specials right?

RoadFan · 11-20-2012, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McGinley

Did I not just say that Westy is partially to blame? Sorry, I didn't know that Westhoff was out on the field missing tackles/arm tackling.

It's common sense that when a player ****s up, that's on him. A coach can only do so much, you know?

Easy boss. I'm not blaming Westhoff specifically. He has earned the benefit of the doubt for one bad year. It is just an observation that the special teams have collectively sucked this year, something we are not used to seeing. I just thought it was funny that your response was the battle cry for Schitty defenders.

Demosthenes9 · 11-20-2012, 04:20 PM

There was no reason to call off the fake punt. It's failure was a result of 1 completely missed block on the MLB. Play design was great, and was a good call against the defensive alignment that St. Louis had.

McGinley · 11-20-2012, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beerfish

Eh? Of course you can that is what the frigging coaches are there for, to make sure players execute. It's not rocket science to block on a FG or a punt.

If Westy is not blamed for the awful specials this year then I guess we can not give him any credit for all the good years of specials right?

LEARN. TO. ****ING. READ. I already said that he is partially to blame. But, he is not the LONE reason why our ST is ass.

If I'm on ST and I mess up my assignment and end up missing a block that gets the punt blocked or whatever scenario we're in, you couldn't just go "WOW! **** YOU, WESTHOFF! STUPID ****ING COACH! WHY DID YOU MAKE MCGINLEY MISS HIS ASSIGNMENT!? STUPID ASS! MCDAWG, YOU DA BESS! I'M SORRY YOUR COACH IS AN IDIOT AND MADE YOU SCREW UP!". You see how that works?

Is Westhoff partially to blame? Yes. Is it ALL his fault? No.

3rd_Times_A_Charm · 11-20-2012, 04:24 PM

It's a result of the confidence of the team as a whole.

DDNYjets · 11-20-2012, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Demosthenes9

There was no reason to call off the fake punt. It's failure was a result of 1 completely missed block on the MLB. Play design was great, and was a good call against the defensive alignment that St. Louis had.

Not sure how you can arrive at this result other than affection for Tebow.

They were in their base defense. And the MLB you reference is one of the smartest and instinctive MLBs in the NFL. He was not going to get fooled there. We have run multiple fakes this year. STL was not going to get caught off guard.

There was no missed block b.c that play is not designed to run against a base defense.

RoadFan · 11-20-2012, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Demosthenes9

There was no reason to call off the fake punt. It's failure was a result of 1 completely missed block on the MLB. Play design was great, and was a good call against the defensive alignment that St. Louis had.

It absolutely should have been abandoned. A fake punt is based on the element of surprise. The 'missed block' you are referring to is totally irrelevant. If the Rams are expecting it, you don't try it. If you really want to pick up the 1st down, then put the offense back on the field.

Demosthenes9 · 11-20-2012, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McGinley

LEARN. TO. ****ING. READ. I already said that he is partially to blame. But, he is not the LONE reason why our ST is ass.

If I'm on ST and I mess up my assignment and end up missing a block that gets the punt blocked or whatever scenario we're in, you couldn't just go "WOW! **** YOU, WESTHOFF! STUPID ****ING COACH! WHY DID YOU MAKE MCGINLEY MISS HIS ASSIGNMENT!? STUPID ASS! MCDAWG, YOU DA BESS! I'M SORRY YOUR COACH IS AN IDIOT AND MADE YOU SCREW UP!". You see how that works?

Yep yep. Hard to say whether it's coaching or not when blocks get missed. Did the coach teach the players the right thing in that situation ? Did the players execute what they were taught by the coaches?

Demosthenes9 · 11-20-2012, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoadFan

It absolutely should have been abandoned. A fake punt is based on the element of surprise. The 'missed block' you are referring to is totally irrelevant. If the Rams are expecting it, you don't try it. If you really want to pick up the 1st down, then put the offense back on the field.

Ummm, no, you are incorrect.

DDNYjets · 11-20-2012, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McGinley

LEARN. TO. ****ING. READ. I already said that he is partially to blame. But, he is not the LONE reason why our ST is ass.

If I'm on ST and I mess up my assignment and end up missing a block that gets the punt blocked or whatever scenario we're in, you couldn't just go "WOW! **** YOU, WESTHOFF! STUPID ****ING COACH! WHY DID YOU MAKE MCGINLEY MISS HIS ASSIGNMENT!? STUPID ASS! MCDAWG, YOU DA BESS! I'M SORRY YOUR COACH IS AN IDIOT AND MADE YOU SCREW UP!". You see how that works?

Is Westhoff partially to blame? Yes. Is it ALL his fault? No.

Safe to say the jimmies are rustled.

BTW I agree with you. I am sure Westy is teaching them the correct assignments and techniques. We just have multiple players phucking up and there is nobody to replace them with.

The way I judge Westy is on his schemes and play designs and those have always been top notch. He has made some mistakes throughout his tenure but this year I am not sure what he can do to make things better.

RoadFan · 11-20-2012, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Demosthenes9

Ummm, no, you are incorrect.

Then please enlighten me. I could use a good laugh. How exactly is a fake punt not based on the element of surprise? By your logic, it would be a reasonable strategy to send the field goal team out there to pick up a 3rd and 6 against the base defense.... Maybe Nick Folk can throw a pass to the holder.... SMH

McGinley · 11-20-2012, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDNYjets

Safe to say the jimmies are rustled.

BTW I agree with you. I am sure Westy is teaching them the correct assignments and techniques. We just have multiple players phucking up and there is nobody to replace them with.

The way I judge Westy is on his schemes and play designs and those have always been top notch. He has made some mistakes throughout his tenure but this year I am not sure what he can do to make things better.

Yes, I'm easily rustled right now. My room is damn near sweltering and I'm cranky, lol.

Westhoff isn't perfect by any means. He's human, therefore flawed by nature. I think of it this way: If a QB makes a good read, makes the right decision, throws a good pass and his receiver drops it, how can you blame the QB for that?

SlickBri481 · 11-20-2012, 04:35 PM

Westhoff is a good coach. Probably the overall lack of talent on the roster has worked its way into special teams as well. Malone and Folk are having very good seasons though, and despite all the mishaps that alone is reason for some confidence if we need a big play from this unit.

11-20-2012, 04:06 PM	#1
RoadFan is tired of the Jets missing on their 2nd round picks. Veteran Join Date: May 2007 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 1,855	What has happened to the Jets' Special Teams? This has been the worst season of special teams for the Jets in I don't know how long... the Kotite era? Westhoff has been the best in the biz for two decades, but his units this season have been unrecognizable. Even during Sunday's win; The Jets had a FG blocked, a fake punt that should have been abandoned, they surrendered a kick return for a TD that was negated by a holding penalty that was not what you would call an egregious violation.... The Jets can't cover kicks, can't cover punts, can't field a punt, can't hold the line on field goal attempts, and can't protect the punter. The only positives have been Folk, Malone, and the kick returning (not punt returning.) Malone is the best punter the Jets have had in forever, so we can be certain the Jets will stay true to form and let him walk at the end of the year. The Jets have almost always had the edge over their opponent on special teams. Not anymore. Last edited by RoadFan; 11-20-2012 at 04:11 PM.

11-20-2012, 04:10 PM	#4
DDNYjets Bye week buh bye Rex Hall Of Fame Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: New York Posts: 12,199	Goes hand in hand with our overall roster. It stinks. Westy used to be able to polish a few turds and put together some decent units but we have less talent on this team than we have had in a long time. I can't kill Westy b.c a Pro Bowl LT doesn't do his assignment or b.c he is forced to have a backup QB as PP, one that can't read a defense and misses blocks. Can't kill him when Kerley fumbles punts. He used to be able to put Leonhard back there when we needed to sure things up. Last edited by DDNYjets; 11-20-2012 at 04:12 PM.

11-20-2012, 04:08 PM	#2
McGinley We Know Geno All Pro Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 7,400	Part of it is on Westy, but you can't blame the coach for the player not executing.

11-20-2012, 04:13 PM	#6
Nike Fix it or sell it Woody! Banned Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 3,386	i too blame the overall roster. westhoff is using what he has to do what he can.

11-20-2012, 04:16 PM	#7
Apache 51 Let's Kill them all......... Hall Of Fame Join Date: May 2009 Location: In Morris Co.,N.J.,at the right end of a Browning 12 gauge Posts: 12,607	Roster is stretched, next year it will be better.

11-20-2012, 04:20 PM	#10
Demosthenes9 PimpAssedAvatar Thanks McGinley :) Veteran Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 2,283	There was no reason to call off the fake punt. It's failure was a result of 1 completely missed block on the MLB. Play design was great, and was a good call against the defensive alignment that St. Louis had.

11-20-2012, 04:24 PM	#12
3rd_Times_A_Charm Practice Squad Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 397	It's a result of the confidence of the team as a whole.

11-20-2012, 04:35 PM	#20
SlickBri481 Heal up Darrelle... All Pro Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 6,350	Westhoff is a good coach. Probably the overall lack of talent on the roster has worked its way into special teams as well. Malone and Folk are having very good seasons though, and despite all the mishaps that alone is reason for some confidence if we need a big play from this unit.