Number 10 NFL D - Page 2 - Jets Insider.com Forums

PatsFanTX · 12-03-2012, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sg3

A pat chowd turd arguing about defense

Oh the ironing

Pats defense is easily better than the Jets defense this year.

Not even close.

Enjoy those great defenses from 2 and 3 years ago.

kennyo7 · 12-03-2012, 01:23 PM

When was the last time the Jet Defense under Ryan stopped a potential game winning/tying drive by an opposing team late in the 4th? How many times did they blow a late lead?

How many times has the D dominated an opposing team in the Ryan era?

Not enough to be considered a top 10 Defense by any real standards.

Even when we finished #1, how did we compare to other #1 type defenses in past years ie the 1985 Bears, 1986 Giants, 2000 Ravens etc

Carlton · 12-03-2012, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kennyo7

When was the last time the Jet Defense under Ryan stopped a potential game winning/tying drive by an opposing team late in the 4th? How many times did they blow a late lead?

How many times has the D dominated an opposing team in the Ryan era?

Not enough to be considered a top 10 Defense by any real standards.

Even when we finished #1, how did we compare to other #1 type defenses in past years ie the 1985 Bears, 1986 Giants, 2000 Ravens etc

The 2009 defense was fantastic. They broke a few records. You will not see defenses like those you listed again because the rules have changed such a ridiculous amount towards the offense. The day they "re-focused" on illegal contact was the beginning of the end for truly elite Ds. Every rule since then has supported the offense. This is exactly why you need an elite QB to win the superbowl these days. I think of the last 15 there are like 13 trophies won by future HOF QBs.

Edit: I find this very sad as I love watching great defenses.

southside · 12-03-2012, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carlton

The 2009 defense was fantastic. They broke a few records. You will not see defenses like those you listed again because the rules have changed such a ridiculous amount towards the offense. The day they "re-focused" on illegal contact was the beginning of the end for truly elite Ds. Every rule since then has supported the offense. This is exactly why you need an elite QB to win the superbowl these days. I think of the last 15 there are like 13 trophies won by future HOF QBs.

Edit: I find this very sad as I love watching great defenses.

You can thank Ty Law and the cheating Patriots for that.

Your sadness made me laugh. Sorry. It's funny because it's true. We've sucked on offense for far too long now. We haven't had an elite offensive playmaker since... sh!t I can't even think of one. Now I'm sad.

ASH_1962 · 12-03-2012, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buzzsaw

The defense has been a huge disappointment. I think someone posted that Aldon Smith has more sacks than our entire team? Yeah, some "top-10" defense we've got here.

I agree Buzz-this is a 5-7 train wreck that has lost home games 34-0, 30-9, 49-19 and we have to sit here and read that we have a top 10 defense.

And you guys wonder why we have trolls like Patsfantx wandering around here. They are here to bring us back to reality I guess.

This team is not a top 10 anything except draft pick order in April.

PatsFanTX · 12-03-2012, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASH_1962

I agree Buzz-this is a 5-7 train wreck that has lost home games 34-0, 30-9, 49-19 and we have to sit here and read that we have a top 10 defense.

And you guys wonder why we have trolls like Patsfantx wandering around here. They are here to bring us back to reality I guess.

This team is not a top 10 anything except draft pick order in April.

I am not a troll.

Just a valuable, objective contributor to a football message board.

Dreamers · 12-03-2012, 03:15 PM

The D given it has no real play makers without Revis has done a great job this year. We have a very young DL that is playing very well and some good DB depth. If we had a QB that could drive the ball and not give up 3-4 bad turnovers a game we'd still be a top 5 D. If we pass the Bears and Zona I dont see that as being a sham stat either. Sacks are sexy but you don't need then to have an effective D. All the talk of not getting pressure and the passing D still has top 5 #s. Our rushing D has just been horrid because none of our LBs can catch a RB anymore.

Add an OLB or 2 and this could very well be an elite D the way they are playing. LB talent in general is the biggest weakness right now. Add one guy that can add outside pressure and stuff the run and we are elite again. The backbone is there we just need that trigger man to put it together. It is not like the whole D needs to be blown up. Dump the old guys and improve. The O looks much harder to fix.

wepnx · 12-03-2012, 03:16 PM

Let's just give them credit for yesterday. Yea they played the worst QB BUT their run defense was great. They didn't give up a million plus yards on the ground.

Greensleeves · 12-03-2012, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatsFanTX

Total yardage means crap.

Jets defense is ranked #22 in points allowed.

Hardly a top 10 NFL defense.

Totally wrong about this. The offense and special teams have given up a ton of points this year. Jet's realistically should be top 10 if it was actually points the defense has allowed. How many points went towards this total in the Pats game? You mean to tell me the fumble score, return fumble score, interceptions are on the D? The only real way to judge a D is by the yards they give up.

PatsFanTX · 12-03-2012, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greensleeves

The only real way to judge a D is by the yards they give up.

When was the last time total yards mattered on the scoreboard or in the standings?

ASH_1962 · 12-03-2012, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatsFanTX

I am not a troll.

Just a valuable, objective contributor to a football message board.

LOL

You are KING Troll

the Troll of all Trolls LOL

chirorob · 12-03-2012, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SONNY WERBLIN

Agreed. The proper yardstick for measuring a D is scoring. I believe the NFL is the only sport where D is evaluated on something other than the amount of points the other team puts on the board. I'll take the #1 scoring D every day of the week. In fact, I think the best D should be ranked based on Points Allowed by the D Minus Points Scored by the D.

BTW, if the Jets #22 ranking includes special team and scores by the opposing D, it's an invalid ranking, IMO.

I look at sacks and turnovers. The ability to pressure and dictate to the other team. 3rd down conversion percentage also very big.

The Jets don't get sacks, don't get a lot of turnovers, and before yesterday, weren't very tight on 3rd downs.

chirorob · 12-03-2012, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greensleeves

Totally wrong about this. The offense and special teams have given up a ton of points this year. Jet's realistically should be top 10 if it was actually points the defense has allowed. How many points went towards this total in the Pats game? You mean to tell me the fumble score, return fumble score, interceptions are on the D? The only real way to judge a D is by the yards they give up.

Not true.

If a team is up by 30, and gives up a ton a garbage passing yards, their D is bad?

PatsFanTX · 12-03-2012, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chirorob

Not true.

If a team is up by 30, and gives up a ton a garbage passing yards, their D is bad?

Exactly, and everything you mentioned in your previous post is also more imortant than yardage.

patman · 12-03-2012, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sg3

A pat chowd turd arguing about defense

Oh the ironing

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

and why is that?

SONNY WERBLIN · 12-03-2012, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chirorob

I look at sacks and turnovers. The ability to pressure and dictate to the other team. 3rd down conversion percentage also very big.

The Jets don't get sacks, don't get a lot of turnovers, and before yesterday, weren't very tight on 3rd downs.

I think I may have come up with a good formula to evaluate D's:

points allowed - extra points - points scored by defense - Interceptions - fumbles recovered - sacks - (QB hits/2)

The team with the lowest number would have to be the best defense in the league.

IHATEDOLPHINS · 12-03-2012, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JetsCrazey

means very little. this defense can beat up on lesser opponents all they want but they are not elite and nowhere near the defenses of SF, Houston, Pittsburgh, etc

This

12-03-2012, 01:23 PM	#22
kennyo7 All Pro Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 7,404	When was the last time the Jet Defense under Ryan stopped a potential game winning/tying drive by an opposing team late in the 4th? How many times did they blow a late lead? How many times has the D dominated an opposing team in the Ryan era? Not enough to be considered a top 10 Defense by any real standards. Even when we finished #1, how did we compare to other #1 type defenses in past years ie the 1985 Bears, 1986 Giants, 2000 Ravens etc

12-03-2012, 03:15 PM	#27
Dreamers The angry poster All League Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 4,396	The D given it has no real play makers without Revis has done a great job this year. We have a very young DL that is playing very well and some good DB depth. If we had a QB that could drive the ball and not give up 3-4 bad turnovers a game we'd still be a top 5 D. If we pass the Bears and Zona I dont see that as being a sham stat either. Sacks are sexy but you don't need then to have an effective D. All the talk of not getting pressure and the passing D still has top 5 #s. Our rushing D has just been horrid because none of our LBs can catch a RB anymore. Add an OLB or 2 and this could very well be an elite D the way they are playing. LB talent in general is the biggest weakness right now. Add one guy that can add outside pressure and stuff the run and we are elite again. The backbone is there we just need that trigger man to put it together. It is not like the whole D needs to be blown up. Dump the old guys and improve. The O looks much harder to fix.

12-03-2012, 03:16 PM	#28
wepnx Practice Squad Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Midlothian, VA Posts: 429	Let's just give them credit for yesterday. Yea they played the worst QB BUT their run defense was great. They didn't give up a million plus yards on the ground.