Quinton Coples

[McGinley]

Originally Posted by detectivekimble

It's not necessarily about production when it comes to rookies. You want to see the ability and talent when they do play, though. Focus on Cople's during a game. He has some great natural ability. One thing you'll notice about him, if you watch him, is his natural strength. He has MAN strength. In the 49ers game, he grabbed Frank Gore with one hand, stopped Gore dead in his tracks, and SLAMMED him on the ground. You don't see that often.

Anyone worried about Coples is nuts. He's going to be good.

Unnecessary apostrophe, lol.

[Flaming Mo]

Originally Posted by detectivekimble

It's not necessarily about production when it comes to rookies. You want to see the ability and talent when they do play, though. Focus on Cople's during a game. He has some great natural ability. One thing you'll notice about him, if you watch him, is his natural strength. He has MAN strength. In the 49ers game, he grabbed Frank Gore with one hand, stopped Gore dead in his tracks, and SLAMMED him on the ground. You don't see that often.

Anyone worried about Coples is nuts. He's going to be good.

Very good post. Even in his very limited playing time Coples has shown flashes like the play you mentioned, two sacks and a bunch of tackles for loss. He does not at all look overwhelmed in the strength or speed department. And imagine that he should take a big step forward next year - our new DLine coach Karl Dunbar has said that the offseason after their rookie year is usually the time when a players make the biggest leap. We also saw that with Wilkerson...

[detjetsfan]

Need to switch to 4-3.

[Rexipus Rex]

Originally Posted by patman

I understand Wilkerson playing the nose, the guy is 320 lbs or so. Coples looks like he is 275 and with nothing in his seat.

I seen BB Put Cunningham at 260 on the nose but with 5 guys with their hands on the ground, And I seen Rex stand guys up and move them around before the snap.

Come to think of it, where does Coples play on the FG team?

Coples is listed at 290 lbs.

[Rexipus Rex]

Originally Posted by Flaming Mo

I think the long term plan with Coples is pretty clear as it goes hand in hand with other moves we have made in recent years regarding the defense. The NFL becomes more and more of a passing league and the top teams will always look to attack you with the wrong personnel on the field. It has been extremely apparent when we played NE the last couple of times. Brady will pick our heavy packages apart and when we try to bring our nickel package in they run it a ton. The days where you can just mix and match from down to down are over, you can't play to many one dimensional players. DeVito was and is strictly a run defender and even in that regard he hasn't been great this year.

Now enter Coples who as of now might be a little light and inexperienced and put him at one DE spot and Wilkerson on the other side of the nose tackle. Than you have two big guys who can defend the run AND can rush the passer. If Coples develops according to plan then we have two big time players for the next decade at the end spots and it would give us a big advantage when we match up with different offenses.

+1

Over the summer, I wrote an article outlaying that very point. Wilkerson and Coples are versatile three down defenders.

Remember in 2011 when the Patriots ran out the clock on us? It's because we had smaller guys like Dixon and Westerman stuck in the game.

All this defense needs is an edge rusher who can win one on one battles.

[Nike]

Originally Posted by Rexipus Rex

+1

Over the summer, I wrote an article outlaying that very point. Wilkerson and Coples are versatile three down defenders.

Remember in 2011 when the Patriots ran out the clock on us? It's because we had smaller guys like Dixon and Westerman stuck in the game.

All this defense needs is an edge rusher who can win one on one battles.

westerman should have been resigned the guy was a decent pass rusher and special teams player. instead we have 0 depth and slugs at lb.

[TJ]

Originally Posted by Beerfish

You know how at draft evaluation time the pundits will look at dlineman as being 4-3 or 3-4 players? I think this is a classic case. Coples is a 4-3 player. He's not suited to be a devito, ellis hold the fort and get some push and 5 sacks a year. If the jets play more 4-3 he will be much better and wilkerson will be even better than he is already.

"Can't get enough 4-3"

Woody Johnson

[Flaming Mo]

People who call for the 4-3 have to realize that Rex will always run a hybrid defense. Yes, our base front is a 3-4 but we constantly change fronts during the game and one of Rex's principal defensive philosophies is to keep the offense guessing and give them a lot of different looks.

Coples had his best games for UNC when he was lined up inside and could provide pass rush from the inside. Facing more and more passing happy teams the biggest key is to get a pass rush up the middle, collapse the pocket and get the QB off his spot. With Wilkerson and Coples the Jets look to have a combination of players who can provide that for a decade to come and they are just beginning to realize their potential (Wilkerson more than Coples). The key to that is that we do not have to get these guys out depending on a running or passing down, they project as legit three down defenders.

[detjetsfan]

Originally Posted by Flaming Mo

People who call for the 4-3 have to realize that Rex will always run a hybrid defense.

Right. And our hybrid defense needs to be primarily 4-3 especially in pass situations. Otherwise Coples will spend his entire career being a decent 3-4 DE instead of a good to great pass rushing 4-3 edge rusher. Match him up against Right Tackles one on one instead of having to occupy blockers up the middle..

How many pass rushers in the NFL make their money rushing up the middle? JJ Watt and that's about it. Haynesworth years ago is the second name comes to mind. NFL teams stack the middle with 330 lb Guards, Centers who shift and QB's who spend alot of time rolling out.

[Nails]

Coples biggest problem is Rex - who won't put him on the field.

He gets about thirty percent of the snaps.

When he is given a chance he does well pressuring the QB:

Tenth in the league for inside rushers:

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blo...roductivity/2/

And that was his sack credited to Harris in the NE game.

[detjetsfan]

Originally Posted by Nails

Coples biggest problem is Rex - who won't put him on the field.

He gets about thirty percent of the snaps.

When he is given a chance he does well pressuring the QB:

Tenth in the league for inside rushers:

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blo...roductivity/2/

And that was his sack credited to Harris in the NE game.

Coples will be fine. I think he has a shot to be great but we need to go 4-3 base and get another pass rushing DE. Wilkerson is a borderline pro bowler this year and last yr everyone dismissed him as a bust.

[Flaming Mo]

Originally Posted by detjetsfan

Right. And our hybrid defense needs to be primarily 4-3 especially in pass situations. Otherwise Coples will spend his entire career being a decent 3-4 DE instead of a good to great pass rushing 4-3 edge rusher. Match him up against Right Tackles one on one instead of having to occupy blockers up the middle..

How many pass rushers in the NFL make their money rushing up the middle? JJ Watt and that's about it. Haynesworth years ago is the second name comes to mind. NFL teams stack the middle with 330 lb Guards, Centers who shift and QB's who spend alot of time rolling out.

You can definitely do it but again, not only has he played his best ball rushing from the inside and against pocket passers like Brady or Manning pressure up the middle is the most important thing. And when you defend a team on three downs and when the down isnt an obvious passing down, you need your big guys to push the pocket and provide pressure which Coples and Wilkerson give you. That's what made Richard Seymour special.

There are plenty of players who are disruptive up the middle even though they might not all have the big sack numbers. Geno Atkins is a monster on the inside pass rush, Ngata, even Wilfork, the two Detroit tackles, Antonio Smith... Brady will just step up if the rush only comes from the outside. That's why Pittsburgh for years struggled with him as they had both their edge rushers crush in but didnt get a push up the middle.

In the end there are a lot of ways you can use him but I think his best value is as a pass rusher AND run defender on the inside.

[IRONFAN 40]

Originally Posted by Flaming Mo

You can definitely do it but again, not only has he played his best ball rushing from the inside and against pocket passers like Brady or Manning pressure up the middle is the most important thing. And when you defend a team on three downs and when the down isnt an obvious passing down, you need your big guys to push the pocket and provide pressure which Coples and Wilkerson give you. That's what made Richard Seymour special.

There are plenty of players who are disruptive up the middle even though they might not all have the big sack numbers. Geno Atkins is a monster on the inside pass rush, Ngata, even Wilfork, the two Detroit tackles, Antonio Smith... Brady will just step up if the rush only comes from the outside. That's why Pittsburgh for years struggled with him as they had both their edge rushers crush in but didnt get a push up the middle.

In the end there are a lot of ways you can use him but I think his best value is as a pass rusher AND run defender on the inside.

I think the Giants are the best examples of being successful against Brady and other passing offenses. They don't just rely on pressure up the middle from Tuck but also from the outside from JPP and Osi. It works hand and hand .Pressure from the outside always made Brady step up into the pocket and that's where they killed him. Pressure from the inside made Brady drop back more and that's where they killed him from the outside. You can't just continue to draft inside rushers to have a impact and that is what Rex and Tanny did at the same time ignoring our OLB position. You need a balance attack.

[kennyo7]

Originally Posted by detjetsfan

Need to switch to 4-3.

Why?
We have more players suited for the 3-4.
The 4-3 requires speed edge rushers. We have none. Outside of Davis, none of our linebackers are athletic enough to play in a 4-3.

[Cleansweep2013]

could be a nice pick, in a yr or 2 will find out.. However clearly biggest needs were elsewhere, on O especially.. Would have taken DeCastro easily.. He would be Jets best guard for now and for next 10 years.. I know he got hurt but what would chances be he suffered same injury playing with jets in preseason..

Will take this pcik, ofcourse now this year must pick a guard up in first or 2nd round..

[Flaming Mo]

Originally Posted by IRONFAN 40

I think the Giants are the best examples of being successful against Brady and other passing offenses. They don't just rely on pressure up the middle from Tuck but also from the outside from JPP and Osi. It works hand and hand .Pressure from the outside always made Brady step up into the pocket and that's where they killed him. Pressure from the inside made Brady drop back more and that's where they killed him from the outside. You can't just continue to draft inside rushers to have a impact and that is what Rex and Tanny did at the same time ignoring our OLB position. You need a balance attack.

Good post. I think they thought they had something in Maybin and underestimated father time in regards to Calvin Pace and BT. I hope this upcoming offseason is finally the time they address the edge rusher position in the draft as the class is incredibly deep on pass rushers (Moore, Jones, Mingo, Montgomery, Jordan, Lemonier, Okafor, Q.Smith etc.)...

[TJ]

Originally Posted by IRONFAN 40

I think the Giants are the best examples of being successful against Brady and other passing offenses. They don't just rely on pressure up the middle from Tuck but also from the outside from JPP and Osi. It works hand and hand .Pressure from the outside always made Brady step up into the pocket and that's where they killed him. Pressure from the inside made Brady drop back more and that's where they killed him from the outside. You can't just continue to draft inside rushers to have a impact and that is what Rex and Tanny did at the same time ignoring our OLB position. You need a balance attack.

+1 We need to address this specifically to play against NE>

[patman]

Originally Posted by Rexipus Rex

Coples is listed at 290 lbs.

Yeah, i know, he just does not look like it though. he looks the same size as Pace to me. Pace is 6-4 265 and to me Coples looks 6-6 275

[Flaming Mo]

Originally Posted by patman

Yeah, i know, he just does not look like it though. he looks the same size as Pace to me. Pace is 6-4 265 and to me Coples looks 6-6 275

Pace certainly moves like someone weighing 400 pounds...

[detectivekimble]

Originally Posted by patman

Yeah, i know, he just does not look like it though. he looks the same size as Pace to me. Pace is 6-4 265 and to me Coples looks 6-6 275

That's not a bad thing. He's got a great frame and great strength. It was a good pick.