2012-13 NY Knicks Thread

[SMC]

Originally Posted by brady's a catcher

This Knicks team is so deep that they can be very, very cautious with Shump and work Stat in as they see fit, hopefully off the bench. Will be hard for stat to ***** about how he's being used when the team is rolling and everyone is playing team ball.

So excited to have the Knicks back. I more orless pretended they didn't exist for years because I loved them so much in the 80s and 90s and I couldn't deal with what Dolan did them on the 00s.

A lot of Knicks fans did that, LOL.

[detjetsfan]

Originally Posted by SMC

Superstars matter.

Deron Williams is an excellent PG and I wish Knicks had a PG like that, but he is not a superstar.

Thankfully Dolan and Grunwald told D'Antoni to pound sand when he asked them to trade Melo for Deron last year so he could have a veteran PG run "his system."

Deron Williams is a superstar. Maybe the best PG in the NBA. The Nets don't have another superstar after him. Humph, Lopez, Wallace etc are big athletic players but none are even close to superstar level. Joe Johnson gets the superstar paycheck but isn't even all-star caliber. David Stern screwed the Nets over by blocking the Howard trade so he could go to LA. The 3,000 Nets fans are still bitter over Carmelo picking the Garden over Barclays Center.


How about Mike D'antoni? Idiot is trying to play run n' gun with half-court players like Dwight and Kobe. He'll be s-canned by the trade deadline.

[detjetsfan]

Originally Posted by gqxluvx

Yes a December 3 point loss is devastating.

Can Melo the fugazy New Yorker shut the eff up already with his "the Nets didnt beat us we beat ourselves garbage"

Nets dominated the 1st quarter and really had no excuse to lose the game. They can say Lopez is out but Amare, Shumpert and Camby are all out for the Knicks. Devestating? Not quite but definitely a disappointment for Prokhorov who is trying to turn the Nets into the NBA's marquis franchise.

[greenwichjetfan]

Originally Posted by SMC

Superstars matter.

Deron Williams is an excellent PG and I wish Knicks had a PG like that, but he is not a superstar.

I'm supremely happy with our team as well, and love Melo...

But saying Deron isn't a superstar is equally ignorant as the other dude saying Melo isn't.

DWill might be the best all-around PG in the league. He's without a doubt the best shoot first PG, and other than the arguments for CP3, Rondo, and even at this age: Nash...can you name a better pass-first PG?

[SMC]

Originally Posted by greenwichjetfan

I'm supremely happy with our team as well, and love Melo...

But saying Deron isn't a superstar is equally ignorant as the other dude saying Melo isn't.

DWill might be the best all-around PG in the league. He's without a doubt the best shoot first PG, and other than the arguments for CP3, Rondo, and even at this age: Nash...can you name a better pass-first PG?

I think you guys are making too much of this. A superstar is the top tier player, then there are star players after that, then there good players, JAGs, etc. in descending order.

DWill is not the best all-around PG. Paul is. But that doesn't make DWill a bum. I'm just saying he isn't an upper echelon player like LeBron, Wade (healthy), Dirk (healthy), Melo, Paul, Kobe, and Durant.

DWill is not on those 7 player's level, that's why he's a notch below.

Would you guys prefer that I call DWill a superstar and those 7 I mentioned super-duper-stars?

[greenwichjetfan]

Originally Posted by SMC

I think you guys are making too much of this. A superstar is the top tier player, then there are star players after that, then there good players, JAGs, etc. in descending order.

DWill is not the best all-around PG. Paul is. But that doesn't make DWill a bum. I'm just saying he isn't an upper echelon player like LeBron, Wade (healthy), Dirk (healthy), Melo, Paul, Kobe, and Durant.

DWill is not on those 7 player's level, that's why he's a notch below.

Would you guys prefer that I call DWill a superstar and those 7 I mentioned super-duper-stars?

You're welcome to call them whatever your heart desires. I don't care much. I was just pointing out the ignorance in your statement.

Just curious though, why 7 for superstar players? Seems a bit arbitrary. Why not the best starting 5? Or top 2 at each position? Or just top 3 overall players? 7 random players just seems arbitrary... Used to fit an argument.

Sure CP3 is the better passer and defender, but DWill is the better shooter by miles and is a very solid defender in his own right. Plus he can post and drop for rebounds, two things Paul can't do.

I'm not gonna knock you for taking CP3 over DWill, but to not put the two in the same sentence is...well, biased, or downright ignorant.

Edit: I'd rather take DWill than Dwade right now on Miami. Dwade is still superstar level, but DWill is higher.

[simijet]

Originally Posted by greenwichjetfan

You're welcome to call them whatever your heart desires. I don't care much. I was just pointing out the ignorance in your statement.

Just curious though, why 7 for superstar players? Seems a bit arbitrary. Why not the best starting 5? Or top 2 at each position? Or just top 3 overall players? 7 random players just seems arbitrary... Used to fit an argument.

Sure CP3 is the better passer and defender, but DWill is the better shooter by miles and is a very solid defender in his own right. Plus he can post and drop for rebounds, two things Paul can't do.

I'm not gonna knock you for taking CP3 over DWill, but to not put the two in the same sentence is...well, biased, or downright ignorant.

Edit: I'd rather take DWill than Dwade right now on Miami. Dwade is still superstar level, but DWill is higher.

I agree with you completely

DWill and CP3 are clearly the best point guards in basketball. I would even go as far as to say DWill is very underrated, and therefore not viewed as a superstar by many.

[SMC]

Originally Posted by greenwichjetfan

You're welcome to call them whatever your heart desires. I don't care much. I was just pointing out the ignorance in your statement.

Just curious though, why 7 for superstar players? Seems a bit arbitrary. Why not the best starting 5? Or top 2 at each position? Or just top 3 overall players? 7 random players just seems arbitrary... Used to fit an argument.

Sure CP3 is the better passer and defender, but DWill is the better shooter by miles and is a very solid defender in his own right. Plus he can post and drop for rebounds, two things Paul can't do.

I'm not gonna knock you for taking CP3 over DWill, but to not put the two in the same sentence is...well, biased, or downright ignorant.

Edit: I'd rather take DWill than Dwade right now on Miami. Dwade is still superstar level, but DWill is higher.

You can view my statement as ignorant, but it's not as if the opinion is divergent compared to those covering the game. The list of upper tier players can expand or contract, but those are primarily the names included.

With respect to your suggestions, the best starting 5 doesn't work because it would include a position which would not necessarily have a top player, such as at C, to the exclusion of another. Top 2 at position? Maybe, but again, the top players in the NBA are those regardless of position.

As to CP3 vs. DWill, CP3 shoots for a better percentage than DWill across the board and utterly dominates DWill in career PER (25.4 vs. 19.1) and career WS/48 (.240 vs. .136). So for you to criticize me for not putting the two in the same sentence shows your own ignorance.

[Bonhomme Richard]

This is pretty awesome

!

[greenwichjetfan]

Originally Posted by SMC

You can view my statement as ignorant, but it's not as if the opinion is divergent compared to those covering the game. The list of upper tier players can expand or contract, but those are primarily the names included.

With respect to your suggestions, the best starting 5 doesn't work because it would include a position which would not necessarily have a top player, such as at C, to the exclusion of another. Top 2 at position? Maybe, but again, the top players in the NBA are those regardless of position.

As to CP3 vs. DWill, CP3 shoots for a better percentage than DWill across the board and utterly dominates DWill in career PER (25.4 vs. 19.1) and career WS/48 (.240 vs. .136). So for you to criticize me for not putting the two in the same sentence shows your own ignorance.

Respect for your post.

One thing to consider though- Chad Pennington led the NFL many many times in completion percentage. I'd still have taken at least 6 or 7 QBs over him.

Percentages are the most unbiased equators of apples to apples. However, they need to be viewed in context, my friend.

I agree with the weak centers argument...which is why I hedged and included top 3 overall. Again, I don't see why the number was limited to 7. I stick by my original statement...Deron is a superstar in the NBA.

Now back to important things like the Knicks being the team to beat in the east!!!

[AlwaysGreenAlwaysWhite]

To SMC's point, DWill has star #s... Not superstar #s...

[MCBNY]

Williams has regressed a bit it seems. His shooting is flat out horrible right now: 38% from the field, 27% from 3. His career numbers are 45% from the field and 34% from 3. His assists are slightly down. If it's not regression, hopefully it's the nagging injuries and he'll eventually get back on track. I think he said something a few weeks back about his confidence being down which ain't good at all. Even as a Nets fan I wouldn't call him a superstar right now.

Although it really doesn't matter what we label any of these dudes. Just makes for some fun, useless banter.

[SMC]

Originally Posted by AlwaysGreenAlwaysWhite

To SMC's point, DWill has star #s... Not superstar #s...

Yeah, that's point. I'm not killing the guy. I'm not calling DWill a bum, JAG, etc. I'd love for a PG like him to be on the Knicks.

The word "superstar" is thrown around loosely in the media IMO, when it should only be used for a select few.

But regardless, the Knicks and Nets have set their own paths. The Knicks have a big game tonight and need to bury a Lakers team in shambles.

Although Magic was my favorite non-Knick player, I've always hated the Lakers and seeing them further implode on the Garden floor would be awesome.

[SMC]

Originally Posted by MCBNY

Williams has regressed a bit it seems. His shooting is flat out horrible right now: 38% from the field, 27% from 3. His career numbers are 45% from the field and 34% from 3. His assists are slightly down. If it's not regression, hopefully it's the nagging injuries and he'll eventually get back on track. I think he said something a few weeks back about his confidence being down which ain't good at all. Even as a Nets fan I wouldn't call him a superstar right now.

Although it really doesn't matter what we label any of these dudes. Just makes for some fun, useless banter.

Exactly.

And the comments you mentioned DWill made were surprising to me. Very honest of him, but surprising. He admitted that he's let his poor shooting affect how he plays the game.

Hopefully for his and Net fans sake he gets healthy.

[gqxluvx]

Originally Posted by AlwaysGreenAlwaysWhite

To SMC's point, DWill has star #s... Not superstar #s...

And what is the difference between star #'s and superstar #'s? He listed 7 "superstars" and included CP3, dwill and cp3 have basically identical numbers for the entire career. Dwill is also 13-4 head to head vs CP3.

If you tell me kobe, dirk, lebron, and wade are superstars because they have won a title, ok I see the distinction. Durant carried a team to a finals, ok see another distinction. But CP3, Melo, Dwill have not played in a finals yet, and of the 3 Melo has the worst record/history in the playoffs. Its just typical over the top homerism by Knick fans because Melo is finally (albeit through 20 games) playing at a unreal superstar level. Prior to the start of this season he has/had done nothing to be labeled a "superstar." Great scorer who has superstar ability but never lived up to it. I am not arguing one is better than the other or that Dwill is even a superstar, but Melo is not a superstar by my standards. He is off to the start that finally displays the ability and talent he has, but he never lived up to.

[SMC]

Originally Posted by gqxluvx

And what is the difference between star #'s and superstar #'s? He listed 7 "superstars" and included CP3, dwill and cp3 have basically identical numbers for the entire career. Dwill is also 13-4 head to head vs CP3.

If you tell me kobe, dirk, lebron, and wade are superstars because they have won a title, ok I see the distinction. Durant carried a team to a finals, ok see another distinction. But CP3, Melo, Dwill have not played in a finals yet, and of the 3 Melo has the worst record/history in the playoffs. Its just typical over the top homerism by Knick fans because Melo is finally (albeit through 20 games) playing at a unreal superstar level. Prior to the start of this season he has/had done nothing to be labeled a "superstar." Great scorer who has superstar ability but never lived up to it. I am not arguing one is better than the other or that Dwill is even a superstar, but Melo is not a superstar by my standards. He is off to the start that finally displays the ability and talent he has, but he never lived up to.

Best record in the East. Two 20 point victories over the defending champs and a come from behind victory against the best team in the West on the road. Superstar playing at an MVP level and a HC who has the best record in franchise history after 45 games.

I'm proud to Ray-Ray the crap out of the Knicks right now.

[MCBNY]

Originally Posted by SMC

I'm proud to Ray-Ray the crap out of the Knicks right now.

hahahahaha

Watch it now.

[SMC]

Dan D'Antoni, Mike's brother and assistant coach in LA, believes things could have ultimately worked out for MDA, Melo and the Knicks. He says it would've been only a matter of time before the Knicks started winning.

"That's what we think. We think it would have [worked]," Dan D'Antoni said.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/stor...ew-york-knicks

[greenwichjetfan]

Who is that cute girl who's been sitting next to Ewing all game? She's an actress...I think Ben stiller is on the other side of her.

[SMC]

Originally Posted by greenwichjetfan

Who is that cute girl who's been sitting next to Ewing all game? She's an actress...I think Ben stiller is on the other side of her.

Thats Stiller's wife, Christine Stewart, I belive her name is. If you ever saw the movie the Wedding Singer she played Drew Barrymore's sister.