GO TITANS!

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by Gata

If I want to root for another team; I'd rather just change my alliance to this franchise.

Though the likelihood of us advancing as a WC is dim and us even moving passed the first round is dim, I still have to side with my Team.

By the time you were old enough to understand football right to this very day, the New York Jets have been an elite AFC team. You were 15 years old, what, 6 years ago?

With a healthy quarterback, since 1997 we have averaged 10 wins per season, have always been in the thick of things, have always been around the playoffs every December.

So, to you, the Jets are merely in a rut right now and you think better days are right around the corner. You think that because since 1997 that's been the case. Make a QB change, BOOM, playoffs. Make a HC change, BOOM, playoffs.

You don't realize what some of the older fans clearly know- that pretty damn good 15 year run that's been going on since you were in elementary school is now over, lousy drafting and excessive free agency has assured us of that. We have to work for it now, have to do it the old fashioned way and the football men that report to Woody Johnson aren't capable of that.

Root against the Jets because it's the best thing for the Jets. You'll realize that soon enough.

SAR I

[PMarsico9]

Not top-tier, obviously, but far from the bottom as well.

In the words of Yoda:

Do or do not, there is no try.

This team is waaaaaaaaayyyyyyy overdue to win a Super Bowl.

If you haven't noticed, since 2002, there hasn't been a Super Bowl winner without a guaranteed or borderline Hall of Fame quarterback.

Of the QB's who have won the Super Bowl in that time frame, only Tom Brady was drafted lower than the 2nd round.

Bottom line:

A GM who is great at evaluating QB talent is a huge must today.

I would sign Polian, have him draft us a QB after tanking a year or two (which is how Polian works to guarantee the #1 pick) then fire Polian since he only is good at doing just what I said (unless you consider continually losing conference Championship games "good enough," in which case please go root for the Bills or Pats,) then bring a Giants GM and go win titles.

[Joe W. Namath]

My 11 year old son doesn't want me to let the San Diego tickets go, thinks that if the Jets win tonight we should go next week.
I'm trying to talk sense to him, get him to root for the Titans tonight, but he won't hear of it. Says we're alive and we love the Jets and need to root for them no matter what. He put on his Coples jersey, got his homework done early.
I feel so bad that I did this to him. I'm an awful father.
SAR I

My kid is 7. Hes really not into the Jets though. and i am not pushing it at all. You have to let your kid go through this SAR. I had faith up until last year. Now im done. Until I see the right guy is place as GM, HC and qb, I wil have no faith. And right now, we are 0 for 3 in that department.

But at 11, you cant understand that so the kid is ok.

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by Salz

SAR: Give Rex credit for coaching this team to be around .500 with one of the worst rosters in the league. I think Rex can coach but he's been screwed by Tanenbaum's awful personnel decisions. Remember, Rex isn't the GM. He's just a coach who gets some input into the moves Tanny makes.

Al Groh.
Herman Edwards.
Eric Mangini.
Rex Ryan.

They all were able to beat the scrubs on their schedules and lose to the elites on their schedules. All of them. They all averaged 9 or 10 wins with a healthy quarterback. They're all the same. All Rookie bums who think defense defense defense and could never get over the hump in the big games that meant the most. Ryan did it for two seasons on the back of someone else's roster. They're all the same. No credit for Ryan.

He's the black Herman Edwards.

SAR I

[Borgoguy]

Originally Posted by SAR I

Al Groh.
Herman Edwards.
Eric Mangini.
Rex Ryan.

They all were able to beat the scrubs on their schedules and lose to the elites on their schedules. All of them. They all averaged 9 or 10 wins with a healthy quarterback. They're all the same. All Rookie bums who think defense defense defense and could never get over the hump in the big games that meant the most. Ryan did it for two seasons on the back of someone else's roster. They're all the same. No credit for Ryan.

He's the black Herman Edwards.

SAR I

Hearted?

[chirorob]

Originally Posted by SAR I

I hear ya, and I know that's what we all said, but this is different.

Rex Ryan has to go. Anything that stands in the way of that is counter productive to our team, puts us in a bad position on that glorious day when Bill and Tom retire and the AFC might actually be winnable.

SAR I

They aren't going anywhere for 4 years.

Thing is, there is no reasons to tank the season. Rex isn't getting fired. The players continue to play hard for him, to not quit. His defensive schemes are good, although his defensive talent is not elite.

His offensive talent is awful. What do you think Jon Gruden would do with this "talent"? Sparano should go, Tebow should go. The Jets should draft either a pass rusher (need that no matter what) or offensive playmakers in the first round. May a guard who knows how to play in the second round, and more speed guys from round 3-7.

[PMarsico9]

Originally Posted by SAR I

Al Groh.
Herman Edwards.
Eric Mangini.
Rex Ryan.

They all were able to beat the scrubs on their schedules and lose to the elites on their schedules. All of them. They all averaged 9 or 10 wins with a healthy quarterback. They're all the same. All Rookie bums who think defense defense defense and could never get over the hump in the big games that meant the most. Ryan did it for two seasons on the back of someone else's roster. They're all the same. No credit for Ryan.

He's the black Herman Edwards.

SAR I

To be fair, I'm pretty sure Rex is an actual defensive coach. Herm was a very good motivator. But I doubt he ever made an actual play call.

[Joe W. Namath]

The best thing for the Jets would be to bring in a new gm and head coach. Go 2-14 next year and get top picks. Then show a little improvement and go 5-11 and get some more top picks. Then go 9-7 and be on the brink of the playoffs and go from there.

The Jets need a few years of back to back high picks.

[Joe W. Namath]

To be fair, I'm pretty sure Rex is an actual defensive coach. Herm was a very good motivator. But I doubt he ever made an actual play call.

Herm changed our entire defense from a 3-4 to a tampa 2. he had a huge impact on the D.

[Warfish]

SAR, remind me who you want, and Woody WILL, hire to replace Rex for 2013 should we lose out and finish 6-10?

After all, without knowing that, how can we judge the alternatives?

Thanks in advance.

[chirorob]

Originally Posted by PMarsico9

In the words of Yoda:

Do or do not, there is no try.

This team is waaaaaaaaayyyyyyy overdue to win a Super Bowl.

If you haven't noticed, since 2002, there hasn't been a Super Bowl winner without a guaranteed or borderline Hall of Fame quarterback.

Of the QB's who have won the Super Bowl in that time frame, only Tom Brady was drafted lower than the 2nd round.

Bottom line:

A GM who is great at evaluating QB talent is a huge must today.

I would sign Polian, have him draft us a QB after tanking a year or two (which is how Polian works to guarantee the #1 pick) then fire Polian since he only is good at doing just what I said (unless you consider continually losing conference Championship games "good enough," in which case please go root for the Bills or Pats,) then bring a Giants GM and go win titles.

Thing about tanking it, is sometimes there is no QB worth tanking it for. Or what if you tank, and the QB isn't that good? That happens a lot too. You can find good QB's outside of the top 5. Big Ben, Rogers, Brees, all mid first rounders to early seconds.

[PMarsico9]

Originally Posted by chirorob

Thing about tanking it, is sometimes there is no QB worth tanking it for. Or what if you tank, and the QB isn't that good? That happens a lot too. You can find good QB's outside of the top 5. Big Ben, Rogers, Brees, all mid first rounders to early seconds.

Like this year?

Let's say this year the Jets end up with a mid-teens pick. Instead of BAP, or forcing the issue, what if you hedge your bets and trade out of the first round for an additional possible pick next year?

What does that accomplish?

It enables a good and creative front office to package those picks together to make your best attempt (barring you didn't have a high enough pick to begin with) to attain truly elite talent.

Let me see if I can create a mock scenario. Keep in mind, that picks are even traded within a division.

Let's say Miami really wants to upgrade WR or TE this year. Or falls in love with a certain guy they work out who was projected a 1st-2nd rounder to begin with.

Well the Jets are up on the board and Miami calls. The Jets ask for Miami's first rounder next year, Miami's 3rd rounder this year, and a 3rd rounder the year after.

Miami accepts.

The following draft Johnny Manziel (not to say Manziel is guaranteed to be amazing) declares, but the Jets have the 8th pick. Let's say the Chiefs have the first pick, but just obtained Alex Smith or some other highly desirable (lol) QB. The Miami pick is 28 or something.

The Jets can package 8 and 28 and potentially move up to get their guy.

But just to be clear, if Mark Sanchez is "your guy," you are a failure at talent evaluation.

[Ma Teng Fei]

"+1 We aint beating any of the playoff teams. Doubt we could even keep it close. Rex Ryan is not going anywhere. I will root for the Jets to win no matter what. The Jets suck and ,it looks like they will for a few more years. What is new."... Gibby

+1

I'm a fan (a long suffering one, to boot), not a strategic planning mgr! F'n ridiculous concept not to back the team (players), no matter how slim the chances are....

[PMarsico9]

Originally Posted by Joe W. Namath

Herm changed our entire defense from a 3-4 to a tampa 2. he had a huge impact on the D.

Which is why he hasn't gotten a coaching job since KC.

[Warfish]

Originally Posted by PMarsico9

Let's say Miami really wants to upgrade WR or TE this year. Or falls in love with a certain guy they work out who was projected a 1st-2nd rounder to begin with.

Well the Jets are up on the board and Miami calls. The Jets ask for Miami's first rounder next year, Miami's 3rd rounder this year, and a 3rd rounder the year after.

Miami accepts.

This hypothetical deal sounds like fantasy to me. I can't see the Dolphins ever giving up that much to move up to where the Jets will be in the next draft, regardless of where we finish now.

And what world is it where a Revis or a Mangold (both obtained mid-to-late in the fist round) are not legitimate elite talents? elite talent can be found throughout the draft. You simply need better talent evaluators and stop picking for desperation (Ghost, D-Rob and Vlad come immediately to mind as examples).

I'm not a fan of passing on a 1st round pick to get future year depth choices when we have pressing needs at LB, RB and elsewhere. Such a decision speaks of an inabillity to evaluate current-tyear talent, or an inabillity to move down in the current year for current year picks.

[PMarsico9]

Originally Posted by Warfish

This hypothetical deal sounds like fantasy to me. I can't see the Dolphins ever giving up that much to move up to where the Jets will be in the next draft, regardless of where we finish now.

And what world is it where a Revis or a Mangold (both obtained mid-to-late in the fist round) are not legitimate elite talents? elite talent can be found throughout the draft. You simply need better talent evaluators and stop picking for desperation (Ghost, D-Rob and Vlad come immediately to mind as examples).

I'm not a fan of passing on a 1st round pick to get future year depth choices when we have pressing needs at LB, RB and elsewhere. Such a decision speaks of an inabillity to evaluate current-tyear talent, or an inabillity to move down in the current year for current year picks.

QB's are an entirely different animal, War.

You can't say "I need one," then draft one that year, when that year's 1st round talent absolutely pales compared to the following draft's.

It could even be a 3 or 4 year window that you have to grit out.

That's my point. It's a shame, but really it needs to be mentioned, you have to be that in touch with the prospects available and coming up as a GM.

There's too much money at stake.

I'd almost venture to say to stick with Tebow or McElroy after next season if there's not a top flight QB on the horizon. You sure as hell know that you aren't getting Brees, Rodgers, either Manning, or Brady via free agency.

That's for sure.

[fidelioion]

Originally Posted by chirorob

They aren't going anywhere for 4 years.

Thing is, there is no reasons to tank the season. Rex isn't getting fired. The players continue to play hard for him, to not quit. His defensive schemes are good, although his defensive talent is not elite.

His offensive talent is awful. What do you think Jon Gruden would do with this "talent"? Sparano should go, Tebow should go. The Jets should draft either a pass rusher (need that no matter what) or offensive playmakers in the first round. May a guard who knows how to play in the second round, and more speed guys from round 3-7.

How do you blame Sparano for the offense but Rex gets a pass due to lack of talent on offense?

Fact is they don't have a QB. If Sparano had a quality QB this team would be quite good. It's not the coaching or talent (other than the QB play)

[fidelioion]

Originally Posted by PMarsico9

QB's are an entirely different animal, War.

You can't say "I need one," then draft one that year, when that year's 1st round talent absolutely pales compared to the following draft's.

It could even be a 3 or 4 year window that you have to grit out.

That's my point. It's a shame, but really it needs to be mentioned, you have to be that in touch with the prospects available and coming up as a GM.

There's too much money at stake.

I'd almost venture to say to stick with Tebow or McElroy after next season if there's not a top flight QB on the horizon. You sure as hell know that you aren't getting Brees, Rodgers, either Manning, or Brady via free agency.

That's for sure.

you do have a shot at Rivers though.

He's done in SD...Maybe you could pull off a Wayne Hunter Change of Scenery deal. My big money trash for your big money trash...

[sg3]

based on recent performance, Rivers is no different and maybe worse than Sanchez

the last two times they met (including last season) Sanchez outplayed the Sidearm throwing choke artist and the Jets won the game

[JetsFanatic]

Originally Posted by Warfish

If you don't know why, I feel for you.

Maybe being a Sports Fan isn't for you. Maybe the Stock Market, where loyalty and being a fan isn't involved, might be a better choice of things to follow.

Why?

Because I am a Jets Fan, I enjoy seeing my team win football games, and I really enjoy seeing my team play (and hopefully win) playoff games. I enjoy being a successful team, even when we're hurt badly (best player on O, best player on D) and have one of the worst starting QB's in the NFL. I enjoy having a shot, even if it's a small low-odds shot, at a Championship. I enjoy being a winning team, not a losing team, every year.

Why root agains them? For the 18th pick instead of the 19th? So Rex is maybe on a shorter leash in 2013 than he might otherwsie be? So that Tanny has a 0.00052 higher chance of being fired/demoted? So that a Coach Who Cannot Be Named Fantasy can exist for a short while, till we inevitable hire an actual person, and teh board erupts in mass dissapoint and mass hysteria of overhyped "he's the answer" threads? So we can hope we're one o fthe only teams in NFL history to fire a Head Coach who never had a losing season? So we can draft 10 new WR, RB's and O-Linemen and make Sanchez what we so dream he could be if only...if only......

A playoff game and a winning record is something real, tangible. An accomplishment to be proud of, even if not THE accomplishment we all want.

Rooting for losing, and firings, and who knows who next up at Coach and whatever......what is that, other than a fantasy, and a short lived fantasy at that?

Why is the fantastic hopes of the "fire them all" crowd somehow superior to the fantasy and hopes of the "lets win and get in" crowd?

At the end of the day, why root against your own team?

What a great post!!! Written very eloquently and to many great points. Great JOB!!