Just cancelled my Rockland Journal Subscription

[chiefst2000]

What a rush! I imagine the joy felt similar to voting in a swing state. I wouldn't know as I have never voted for a Presidential Candidate that won my state but in this case the feeling was great. As a bonus the cancellation department asked why I was cancelling so I got to let them know that their article comparing law abiding permit holders to pedophiles and sex offenders forced me to cancel.

[gunnails]

Good for you Chief.

[southparkcpa]

Originally Posted by chiefst2000

What a rush! I imagine the joy felt similar to voting in a swing state. I wouldn't know as I have never voted for a Presidential Candidate that won my state but in this case the feeling was great. As a bonus the cancellation department asked why I was cancelling so I got to let them know that their article comparing law abiding permit holders to pedophiles and sex offenders forced me to cancel.

I cancelled my subscription to the Charlotte Observer many years ago.

They called and asked and I said.."Next time you endorse a conservative" Ill buy the paper. Until then, fukk off.

[32green]

Some old-timer whose name was on the list just had his house broken into and they tried to take his gunsafe. I'll try to find the link.

Also, a few of the Corrections guys whose names were in there have had prisoners taunting them by yelling out their addresses.

-

[gunnails]

Originally Posted by 32green

Some old-timer whose name was on the list just had his house broken into and they tried to take his gunsafe. I'll try to find the link.

Also, a few of the Corrections guys whose names were in there have had prisoners taunting them by yelling out their addresses.

-

===========================================

Was bound to happen, here's a link. http://newsbusters.org/blogs/tom-blu...-newspapers-in

I've also read there's legislation in the works to keep these permit holders names private. Also it should be noted that several Sheriffs in NJ have refused to allow the Journal access to there records in similar requests.

I' am beginning to believe there is a concerted effort by some of the media to demonize gun owners.

[Jungle Shift Jet]

This is the link, if you are so inclined, you can capture everyones name and address and make a list

http://www.lohud.com/interactive/art...r-neighborhood-

The guy who was robbed lives not far away, the street is a residential one but near the WP hospital w/ some medical offices and halfway house residences.

[Warfish]

Originally Posted by 32green

Also, a few of the Corrections guys whose names were in there have had prisoners taunting them by yelling out their addresses.

-

So ****ed up.

[long island leprechaun]

Originally Posted by gunnails

===========================================

Was bound to happen, here's a link. http://newsbusters.org/blogs/tom-blu...-newspapers-in

I've also read there's legislation in the works to keep these permit holders names private. Also it should be noted that several Sheriffs in NJ have refused to allow the Journal access to there records in similar requests.

I' am beginning to believe there is a concerted effort by some of the media to demonize gun owners.

I don't think there's much doubt that some media are using their pulpits to assert a political position on this issue. The step to publish the names of gun owners was knee jerk and rash. I doubt very strongly that the publishers gave serious thought to the consequences of their actions for law abiding gun owners.

On the other hand, suppose that a public list reveals to you as a private citizen that your neighbor, who behaves irratically and you know has a psychiatric problem, is stockpiling assault weapons. Is there anything that should be done in this instance? Or should it simply be ignored because of his right to keep arms?

[32green]

Originally Posted by long island leprechaun

On the other hand, suppose that a public list reveals to you as a private citizen that your neighbor, who behaves irratically and you know has a psychiatric problem, is stockpiling assault weapons. Is there anything that should be done in this instance? Or should it simply be ignored because of his right to keep arms?

This would reveal a problem in the supply system that has to be addressed, no doubt, but throwing the baby out with the bathwater (giving perps the addresses of law enforcement/corrections they have dealt with..they know the cops names from court paperwork etc.) is ridiculous.

You dont think there are any bitter prisoners that would love to settle a score with LE? Alot of cops on that list put away monsters....who have nothing better to do than read the paper and use the prison library. Whoa...there's my arresting officers address. Niiiiiice.


The bad guys out there will not abide by any new laws and the weapons are already out there, so we will merely be impacting good guys.

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[Axil]

Originally Posted by long island leprechaun

On the other hand, suppose that a public list reveals to you as a private citizen that your neighbor, who behaves irratically and you know has a psychiatric problem, is stockpiling assault weapons. Is there anything that should be done in this instance? Or should it simply be ignored because of his right to keep arms?

What exactly are you suggesting should be done by a private citizen, who now knows the neighbor he thinks is crazy has an assault weapon? Seriously.

[long island leprechaun]

Originally Posted by Axil

What exactly are you suggesting should be done by a private citizen, who now knows the neighbor he thinks is crazy has an assault weapon? Seriously.

Given that we call authorities to report our neighbor making too much noise, or beating his dog, I would guess that this too is reportable. Police may have knowledge of the stockpiling issue (probably not) but may not put that together with your knowledge of erratic/unstable behavior. I'd like to know the neighbor is at least on someone's radar. They could also initiate a MH Crisis team visit, which is pretty common. Again, I would want the neighbor at least assessed and noted by those that might be able to avert a catastrophe.

[chiefst2000]

Originally Posted by long island leprechaun

I don't think there's much doubt that some media are using their pulpits to assert a political position on this issue. The step to publish the names of gun owners was knee jerk and rash. I doubt very strongly that the publishers gave serious thought to the consequences of their actions for law abiding gun owners.

On the other hand, suppose that a public list reveals to you as a private citizen that your neighbor, who behaves irratically and you know has a psychiatric problem, is stockpiling assault weapons. Is there anything that should be done in this instance? Or should it simply be ignored because of his right to keep arms?

Assault rifles dont require a permit. Their list only included names of people that have a permit to own a handgun. For a newspaper to print their names and a map of their addresses, treating them like sex offenders or felons is beyond extreme and the publishers most certainly knew what they were doing.

[Warfish]

Originally Posted by long island leprechaun

I don't think there's much doubt that some media are using their pulpits to assert a political position on this issue. The step to publish the names of gun owners was knee jerk and rash. I doubt very strongly that the publishers gave serious thought to the consequences of their actions for law abiding gun owners.

On the other hand, suppose that a public list reveals to you as a private citizen that your neighbor, who behaves irratically and you know has a psychiatric problem, is stockpiling assault weapons. Is there anything that should be done in this instance? Or should it simply be ignored because of his right to keep arms?

TLDR: Abusing one right (speech/media) to try and ban another (gun rights), whilse abusing a third (privacy), is not a good thing.

If you want to know why mandatory state-based registration has an much opposition as it does (apart from confiscation fears down the road), this is your example. No one wants their private information forcibly "shared" by the State to anyone, much less an abusive media trying to screw people.

[chiefst2000]

Originally Posted by long island leprechaun

Given that we call authorities to report our neighbor making too much noise, or beating his dog, I would guess that this too is reportable. Police may have knowledge of the stockpiling issue (probably not) but may not put that together with your knowledge of erratic/unstable behavior. I'd like to know the neighbor is at least on someone's radar. They could also initiate a MH Crisis team visit, which is pretty common. Again, I would want the neighbor at least assessed and noted by those that might be able to avert a catastrophe.

Since its perfectly legal to stockpile weapons and the police would not be able to do anything in your scenario (which again has nothing to do with the topic of this thread) I ask the following. When your crazy gun owning neighbor finds out that you reported him to the police do you simply live in fear/accept your fate or do you get yourself armed so that if necessary you are able to protect your family?

[Bonhomme Richard]

Originally Posted by long island leprechaun

On the other hand, suppose that a public list reveals to you as a private citizen that your neighbor, who behaves irratically and you know has a psychiatric problem, is stockpiling assault weapons. Is there anything that should be done in this instance? Or should it simply be ignored because of his right to keep arms?

That's a stupid hypothetical. What kind of public list would be available to let everyone know that someone is "stockpiling assault weapons"? And what good would that do for the public to know? If its public information then I'm sure it was known by the police or authorities long before that.

That reminds me of a story from about 3 years ago. It's 8am and I'm leaving for work, driving through my neighborhood and there's a big commotion by the house on the corner -- 8-10 beige government cars with dashboard lights flashing, and people milling around the driveway in bulletproof vests with "ATF" emblazoned on them. The house belonged to a guy my dad plays golf with at a local country club. Apparently, in this pleasant, leafy NJ neighborhood, this old guy's 30 year old son was running guns from Arizona and distributing them across the tri-state.

The Feds got him, as they should have, and he's doing serious time right now. I'd rather let the authorities do their job than make that information public, and invite vigilantes or other criminals to exact their own brand of "justice."

[32green]

Originally Posted by Bonhomme Richard

this old guy's 30 year old son was running guns from Arizona and distributing them across the tri-state.

Is gun control legislation in NJ and NY going to change this?

As long as there are states with much less restrictive laws, its too lucrative a business for bad guys not to get into; Instead of addressing that on the Federal level, you have Cuomo telling me the gun I carried for 20 years in defense of the People of the City of New York...is now illegal because the magazines carry too many rounds! Thousands of law-abiding, highly-trained retired LEO's now in violation of a law that doesnt affect bad guys or those who would flout the law.

The bad guys win in this scenario, big time.

A kid with severe psychiatric problems living in a house with unsecured firearms because his mother was half a loon too.....

And now we have cops getting their addresses printed and their legally possessed weapons outlawed! Makes perfect sense to me.


Ignore the mental health issue, ignore the fact that the gun laws we have ARE NOT ENFORCED on the judicial level...and go after law abiding citizens.

Bravo.

[Axil]

Originally Posted by long island leprechaun

Given that we call authorities to report our neighbor making too much noise, or beating his dog, I would guess that this too is reportable. Police may have knowledge of the stockpiling issue (probably not) but may not put that together with your knowledge of erratic/unstable behavior. I'd like to know the neighbor is at least on someone's radar. They could also initiate a MH Crisis team visit, which is pretty common. Again, I would want the neighbor at least assessed and noted by those that might be able to avert a catastrophe.

Yeah, and stuff like this is exactly why I'm against any sort of "mental health background check" to own guns.

You want a mental health crisis team to be deployed because someone reported their neighbor might be crazy, after finding out he owns a gun. They didn't think he was crazy enough to require mental health intervention before they knew he had a gun. But now that they know he is in legal procession of a firearm, his crazy level has jumped to critical levels.

By the way disturbing the peace, and animal abuse is against the law. That's why the police are involved in those situations.

[MnJetFan]

It is politics and nothing else. 99.9 percent of gun owners are law abiding citizens but the 1/10 percent screw it up for everyone.

[long island leprechaun]

Originally Posted by Axil

Yeah, and stuff like this is exactly why I'm against any sort of "mental health background check" to own guns.

You want a mental health crisis team to be deployed because someone reported their neighbor might be crazy, after finding out he owns a gun. They didn't think he was crazy enough to require mental health intervention before they knew he had a gun. But now that they know he is in legal procession of a firearm, his crazy level has jumped to critical levels.

By the way disturbing the peace, and animal abuse is against the law. That's why the police are involved in those situations.

The responses here are very interesting. I'm not arguing for or against public registries, but I would think if there is one it should include a list of people who own all forms of firearms. Would it be so difficult to exclude law enforcement personnel - active/retired? Would it be a problem for that list to require a request through an agency rather than a newspaper publication?

Re the example, the key issue was "stockpiling" of weapons coupled with observed erratic behavior. It seems in your world there are only two options: wildy insane or normal. In my world, the accumulation of risk factors would suggest someone take notice. Police would not be required or expected to declare who filed the complaint so I don't get the concern about being retaliated against. MH Crisis Teams are called every day in NYC due to observed MH problems in a family member, neighbor, or stranger. This is not a new service, but one that has been in existence for many years. Just the simple presence of the police to investigate might serve as adequate deterrent to said neighbor acting out some mass attack. Same with an MH evaluation. The neighbor might even get some help. God forbid that we should engage professional intervention to at least check things out... or are we arguing here that the police should not have the right to investigate a complaint because it infringes someone's liberty?

[long island leprechaun]

Originally Posted by Axil

Yeah, and stuff like this is exactly why I'm against any sort of "mental health background check" to own guns.

You want a mental health crisis team to be deployed because someone reported their neighbor might be crazy, after finding out he owns a gun. They didn't think he was crazy enough to require mental health intervention before they knew he had a gun. But now that they know he is in legal procession of a firearm, his crazy level has jumped to critical levels.

By the way disturbing the peace, and animal abuse is against the law. That's why the police are involved in those situations.

Just to be clear, crazy guy with lots of firearms is definitely much more of a concern than crazy guy without them. Yeah, I would worry if my crazy nieghbor suddenly started purchasing assault weapons. But hey, who am I to question his personal liberty...