The relative value of a CB - Jets Insider.com Forums

johnnysd · 01-26-2013, 08:57 AM

On the PFT show Peter King cam out strongly against trading Revis, saying that the four most important positions in foootball are QB, LT, rush lineman, CB. He said if you have the best one in the game you pay him the $16M a year (about 13% of our entire cap)

I mostly agree with that, but for the sake of the thread say its true.

What got me thinking after he said this was I think that those positions are not equal.

In broad terms I would say they line up like this:

QB>>>>>LT>>>Rusher>>CB

A QB is WAY WAY more valuable than any CB, and is the least important of the 4 positions. Even in Rex's scheme you only get some much value from a CB, and it was proven this year that a very good CB in Cromartie could completely cover the loss of Revis.

Thought of another way, if you replaced the other three positions with players 80% of the level of the player being replaced, you would see a huge impact from QB and LT, probably so high you might lose the game. A reasonably high but schemable replacemtn for a rusher, and a much lesser impact at CB. He is one of 4 or 5 after all with safeties and LBers helping too.

So when I think of it that way, I have to say it does not make sense to me to pay a CB 13% of your cab and the CB group probably 15 or 16% of the cap. And the thing people are missing here is Revis wont sign for less, so unless we want to do that we will lose him.

So trade him now and see if you can get an elite player at one of the other important positions

Dunnie · 01-26-2013, 08:59 AM

I agree ... CB is not even in the same stratosphere as QB. King is a Pats fan ... So ....

JetsfanfromtheBURGH · 01-26-2013, 09:52 AM

Did he say they were equal or did he just say they were the top 4? The reason I ask, is because "stink" on ESPN said the exact same thing. He said they were in that order.

Snell41 · 01-26-2013, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnysd

QB>>>>>LT>>>Rusher>>CB

I'd say it's more like this

QB>>>>LT>>Rusher #1>>>>>>>>>>Rusher #2>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>CB.

John_0515 · 01-26-2013, 09:58 AM

If the Jets had the worst secondary in football, keep Revis, but people seem to forget the Jets were #2 versus the pass WITHOUT Revis.

Is that jump to #1 really worth paying him all that money? We have good CBs. Let's get good elsewhere.

sec.101row23 · 01-26-2013, 10:29 AM

The real question should be, how important is it to have a 16 million dollar a year CB on a team without a QB, Pass Rusher and a ton of other needs?

Flushing Roots · 01-26-2013, 10:38 AM

+1 on all the above.
The stupidity with how the Jets have handled this whole Revis thing as it pertains to business savvy is mind boggling. As soon as Rex announced to the whole world that Revis was the best CB in the history of the planet, all our bargaining power to keep him went out the window. And then they did it again this week with the leaks that we might trade Revis. Now the whole NFL world knows that and have some automatic, instant leverage to chisel down the price for him. Freakin' Economics 101 and the Jets get an "F"!

johnnysd · 01-26-2013, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JetsfanfromtheBURGH

Did he say they were equal or did he just say they were the top 4? The reason I ask, is because "stink" on ESPN said the exact same thing. He said they were in that order.

He just listed them as if they were somewhat equally important.

JamesR · 01-26-2013, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnysd

Thought of another way, if you replaced the other three positions with players 80% of the level of the player being replaced, you would see a huge impact from QB and LT, probably so high you might lose the game. A reasonably high but schemable replacemtn for a rusher, and a much lesser impact at CB. He is one of 4 or 5 after all with safeties and LBers helping too.

Surely though a LT is the same as a CB ... there are 5 linemen who all need to protect the QB, plus sometimes a TE and / or RB / FB too.

MagroCrag · 01-26-2013, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dunnie

I agree ... CB is not even in the same stratosphere as QB. King is a Pats fan ... So ....

lol might be my pessimism, but I feel like we are more likely to trade Revis so the media is just setting themselves up to get ready to blast us.

It's just not worth paying mega money like that when they are so many holes on the team (cb not being one of them).

Dunnie · 01-26-2013, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagroCrag

lol might be my pessimism, but I feel like we are more likely to trade Revis so the media is just setting themselves up to get ready to blast us.

It's just not worth paying mega money like that when they are so many holes on the team (cb not being one of them).

+1 million ... Cro's emergence s what allows us to get value for Revis.

ryan10 · 01-26-2013, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John_0515

If the Jets had the worst secondary in football, keep Revis, but people seem to forget the Jets were #2 versus the pass WITHOUT Revis.

Is that jump to #1 really worth paying him all that money? We have good CBs. Let's get good elsewhere.

no its not but we might not have our 2 starting safeties back..so that is a key in the equation..but if u told me they were back and we drafted depth at cb..i say trade him!!!

detectivekimble · 01-26-2013, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sec.101row23

The real question should be, how important is it to have a 16 million dollar a year CB on a team without a QB, Pass Rusher and a ton of other needs?

Revis wouldn't prohibit the Jets from filling other positions. Stupid contracts like David Harris, Calvin Pace, Mark Sanchez, etc. and the trading of picks are. It's amazing that people don't care about overpaying for mediocrity, but care about paying for greatness. Darrelle Revis is greatness.

ryan10 · 01-26-2013, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detectivekimble

Revis wouldn't prohibit the Jets from filling other positions. Stupid contracts like David Harris, Calvin Pace, Mark Sanchez, etc. and the trading of picks are. It's amazing that people don't care about overpaying for mediocrity, but care about paying for greatness. Darrelle Revis is greatness.

great point!! I'm sure if thats still an option it will be explored..its two fold..affordability and rebuilding..they might decide to cut ties with the dead wood and w revise blow it all up and start from scratch..

Flaming Mo · 01-26-2013, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John_0515

If the Jets had the worst secondary in football, keep Revis, but people seem to forget the Jets were #2 versus the pass WITHOUT Revis.

Is that jump to #1 really worth paying him all that money? We have good CBs. Let's get good elsewhere.

Yet we were horrible against the run because we had to play much more people in coverage to make up for the loss of Revis.

sec.101row23 · 01-26-2013, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detectivekimble

Revis wouldn't prohibit the Jets from filling other positions. Stupid contracts like David Harris, Calvin Pace, Mark Sanchez, etc. and the trading of picks are. It's amazing that people don't care about overpaying for mediocrity, but care about paying for greatness. Darrelle Revis is greatness.

Who said people are happy with those contracts? The Jets could sign Revis and make his contract fit, its a matter of whether it is worth it or not. Do the Jets want to worry about Revis every two years? I dont think they want to revisit his contract every couple years because Revis feels he is under-paid.

detectivekimble · 01-26-2013, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sec.101row23

Who said people are happy with those contracts? The Jets could sign Revis and make his contract fit, its a matter of whether it is worth it or not. Do the Jets want to worry about Revis every two years? I dont think they want to revisit his contract every couple years because Revis feels he is under-paid.

Pay him and get rid of the trash. Paying JAGs for production you can get out of third and fourth round picks is stupid. The terrible use of resources by Tannenbaum is the problem here, not Darrelle Revis.

Everyone just needs to ask themselves this simple question: how many players on the roster are (or were) worth their contracts? It's not many.

Savage69 · 01-26-2013, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sec.101row23

Who said people are happy with those contracts? The Jets could sign Revis and make his contract fit, its a matter of whether it is worth it or not. Do the Jets want to worry about Revis every two years? I dont think they want to revisit his contract every couple years because Revis feels he is under-paid.

Revis doesn't like the down years in a contract..DeMarcus Ware made 825,000 in base salary 2012 but with his bonus money made 7 million..

JamesR · 01-26-2013, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detectivekimble

Everyone just needs to ask themselves this simple question: how many players on the roster are (or were) worth their contracts? It's not many.

Agreed 100%.

And hopefully, this is what our new GM is already looking at.

Darth Vader · 01-26-2013, 02:31 PM

the value of QB is relative to the defensive system...

the position is more subject to relativity than say the QB position, LT, pass rusher, DL in general, etc. those positions are more universally important, hands down.

01-26-2013, 08:57 AM	#1
johnnysd Founding Member of the Geno Bandwagon Veteran Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 2,166	The relative value of a CB On the PFT show Peter King cam out strongly against trading Revis, saying that the four most important positions in foootball are QB, LT, rush lineman, CB. He said if you have the best one in the game you pay him the $16M a year (about 13% of our entire cap) I mostly agree with that, but for the sake of the thread say its true. What got me thinking after he said this was I think that those positions are not equal. In broad terms I would say they line up like this: QB>>>>>LT>>>Rusher>>CB A QB is WAY WAY more valuable than any CB, and is the least important of the 4 positions. Even in Rex's scheme you only get some much value from a CB, and it was proven this year that a very good CB in Cromartie could completely cover the loss of Revis. Thought of another way, if you replaced the other three positions with players 80% of the level of the player being replaced, you would see a huge impact from QB and LT, probably so high you might lose the game. A reasonably high but schemable replacemtn for a rusher, and a much lesser impact at CB. He is one of 4 or 5 after all with safeties and LBers helping too. So when I think of it that way, I have to say it does not make sense to me to pay a CB 13% of your cab and the CB group probably 15 or 16% of the cap. And the thing people are missing here is Revis wont sign for less, so unless we want to do that we will lose him. So trade him now and see if you can get an elite player at one of the other important positions

01-26-2013, 08:59 AM	#2
Dunnie still waiting ... All League Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 4,219	I agree ... CB is not even in the same stratosphere as QB. King is a Pats fan ... So ....

01-26-2013, 09:52 AM	#3
JetsfanfromtheBURGH Pirates win 88 games this year. Mark it! Veteran Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 2,188	Did he say they were equal or did he just say they were the top 4? The reason I ask, is because "stink" on ESPN said the exact same thing. He said they were in that order.

01-26-2013, 09:58 AM	#5
John_0515 Hall Of Fame Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 21,215	If the Jets had the worst secondary in football, keep Revis, but people seem to forget the Jets were #2 versus the pass WITHOUT Revis. Is that jump to #1 really worth paying him all that money? We have good CBs. Let's get good elsewhere.

01-26-2013, 10:29 AM	#6
sec.101row23 All Pro Join Date: May 2005 Location: Mendham, NJ Posts: 7,877	The real question should be, how important is it to have a 16 million dollar a year CB on a team without a QB, Pass Rusher and a ton of other needs?

01-26-2013, 10:38 AM	#7
Flushing Roots Fuhgeddaboudit! Undrafted Free Agent Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 186	+1 on all the above. The stupidity with how the Jets have handled this whole Revis thing as it pertains to business savvy is mind boggling. As soon as Rex announced to the whole world that Revis was the best CB in the history of the planet, all our bargaining power to keep him went out the window. And then they did it again this week with the leaks that we might trade Revis. Now the whole NFL world knows that and have some automatic, instant leverage to chisel down the price for him. Freakin' Economics 101 and the Jets get an "F"!

01-26-2013, 02:31 PM	#20
Darth Vader Hall Of Fame Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 11,877	the value of QB is relative to the defensive system... the position is more subject to relativity than say the QB position, LT, pass rusher, DL in general, etc. those positions are more universally important, hands down.