They are who we thought they were....

[LockeJET]

Originally Posted by Savage69

The topic was RB's was it not.. How bad Greene was with his 8 tds and 3.9 ypc?? Just admit Martin is held to a different level of criticism where 3.5 ypc is a good year and 3.9 for Greene means he sucks.. If me voicing my opinion on comparing rb's offends you there's the ignore feature.. BTW I have always said Martin would make the HOF based on his durability and longevity and he was a great guy and role model.. If he acted like Gastineau who was a 3 time All Pro do you think he gets in?? Even YJF admitted in his visit the other week that Martin was never great just good for a long time.. The HOF committee is very political otherwise Klecko and Winston Hill would have been in a long time ago..

Curtis Martin made defenders miss. He had moves and vision. You can't compare RB's today to RB's 8-10 years ago. It's a different league right now. Defenses are set up to stop the pass. Anyone with legs can run the ball. When Curtis played, defenses were more set up to stop running teams. Defenses played the run consistantly. Not today. Curtis in todays pass happy league would not have had a 3.5 YPC.

[Untouchable]

Originally Posted by Savage69

The topic was RB's was it not.. How bad Greene was with his 8 tds and 3.9 ypc?? Just admit Martin is held to a different level of criticism where 3.5 ypc is a good year and 3.9 for Greene means he sucks.. If me voicing my opinion on comparing rb's offends you there's the ignore feature.. BTW I have always said Martin would make the HOF based on his durability and longevity and he was a great guy and role model.. If he acted like Gastineau who was a 3 time All Pro do you think he gets in?? Even YJF admitted in his visit the other week that Martin was never great just good for a long time.. The HOF committee is very political otherwise Klecko and Winston Hill would have been in a long time ago..

Again, no one is saying that Martin was ever on the level of the Earl Campbell's, Walter Payton's, or Jim Brown's.

Hell, if Franco Harris isn't a part of 4 championship teams, you think he's a HOFer?

There's something to be said about Martin's durability, longevity and consistency. To be only the 2nd player in NFL history with 10 consecutive 1,000 yard rushing seasons is pretty damn impressive if you ask me. And it's not like Curtis was running behind arguably the greatest OL of all-time and playing with a HOF QB and WR like Emmitt Smith, who was the ULTIMATE compiler.

Hey, Hines Ward will probably be in the HOF one day. Was he ever a dominant receiver? Hell no, but he was damn good for a long period of time, was tough as nails, and did all of the dirty work with a smile on his face. Just like Curtis Martin.

[Savage69]

Originally Posted by LockeJET

Curtis Martin made defenders miss. He had moves and vision. You can't compare RB's today to RB's 8-10 years ago. It's a different league right now. Defenses are set up to stop the pass. Anyone with legs can run the ball. When Curtis played, defenses were more set up to stop running teams. Defenses played the run consistantly. Not today. Curtis in todays pass happy league would not have had a 3.5 YPC.

3.4?? Ok in 98 the fan boys said to me the reason Martin had 14 yds is the Bronco's feared him and his 3.5 with 8 td's the most.. Not Vinny or KJ and Wayne.. Meanwhile Terrrell Davis didn't bother BB or the Tuna who had 20+ TD's and over 2,000 yds rushing and 5.1 ypc.. That's the type of crap that makes it hard to have a reasonable football discussion.. So it was harder to run when Martin played?? So props to Adrian Murrell who out rushed Martin on less carries in 96 on a 1-15 Jet team..

[Traitor Jay & the Woodies]

Originally Posted by Beerfish

A few tidbits from Andrew Perloffs article about the Jets coming off season from CNNSI.

65.6. Mark Sanchez's completion percentage not counting drops, throwaways, spikes and batted passes as attempts -- lowest in the NFL -- according to Pro Football Focus.

According to to Pro Football Focus, free-agent Shonn Greene averaged one forced missed tackle every 5.42 carries -- the worst mark in the NFL.

Blech....

In today's NFL, batted passes are not bad luck. It's part of defensive strategy. Sanchez's staggering number of passes blocked is only another indictment of the kid not progressing.

[LockeJET]

Originally Posted by Savage69

3.4?? Ok in 98 the fan boys said to me the reason Martin had 14 yds is the Bronco's feared him and his 3.5 with 8 td's the most.. Not Vinny or KJ and Wayne.. Meanwhile Terrrell Davis didn't bother BB or the Tuna who had 20+ TD's and over 2,000 yds rushing and 5.1 ypc.. That's the type of crap that makes it hard to have a reasonable football discussion.. So it was harder to run when Martin played?? So props to Adrian Murrell who out rushed Martin on less carries in 96 on a 1-15 Jet team..

Sure! Props to Murrell. He had a solid year. Many backs have solid years or 2. Every situation is different. Comparing one situation or team to the next means nothing. Facts are, Martin is in the HOF for a reason. And a good reason at that. It's not a mistake Savage. He's there and deserved it. Teams keyed on Martin. He always got played with a 8 in the box.. With Elway you couldnt do that, you had to play him honest. Teams weren't worried about Vinny, Wayne or Key as much, hence the reason Vinny had success with us and not with others.

[EM31]

Savage is right about Martin but some folks are very unlikely to admit to hypocrisy on this issue and so I am not sure that I really see the point in bringing it up.

[Savage69]

Originally Posted by EM31

Savage is right about Martin but some folks are very unlikely to admit to hypocrisy on this issue and so I am not sure that I really see the point in bringing it up.

Your right 31 but it's Feb nothing is going on and it's always fun to tweak the Martinette's on their hypocrisy..

[Savage69]

Originally Posted by LockeJET

Sure! Props to Murrell. He had a solid year. Many backs have solid years or 2. Every situation is different. Comparing one situation or team to the next means nothing. Facts are, Martin is in the HOF for a reason. And a good reason at that. It's not a mistake Savage. He's there and deserved it. Teams keyed on Martin. He always got played with a 8 in the box.. With Elway you couldnt do that, you had to play him honest. Teams weren't worried about Vinny, Wayne or Key as much, hence the reason Vinny had success with us and not with others.

Teams weren't worried about Sanchez yet TJ and Greene had great success.. Oh wait it was a passing league in 09 some no one paid attention to the backs.. BTW Vinny had a fine year with the Ravens in 96 with 33 tds..

[LockeJET]

Savage is always on here telling everyone that many Jets fans always find something to complain about. Meanwhile, he is constantly complaning about a 2nd ballot HOFer. And one of the very few Jets in the HOF.

And i'm not a Martinette. You and I have never battled about CMart. I've already admitted hes not on certain levels and never was the best of the best. But we are talking about a HOFer and one that deserves what he got. So if there was a right or wrong here, I'm pretty sure most know whos what.

[Kentucky Jet]

Agreed


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Go Jets!

[Savage69]

Originally Posted by LockeJET

Savage is always on here telling everyone that many Jets fans always find something to complain about. Meanwhile, he is constantly complaning about a 2nd ballot HOFer. And one of the very few Jets in the HOF.

And i'm not a Martinette. You and I have never battled about CMart. I've already admitted hes not on certain levels and never was the best of the best. But we are talking about a HOFer and one that deserves what he got. So if there was a right or wrong here, I'm pretty sure most know whos what.

You miss the whole point like many do.. I always said he would make the HOF my problem is the passes he gets that other jet players don't.. I think he was a fine workhorse back with amazing durability.. He was also one of the luckiest players of all time in several ways.. He was drafted to a team that needed a RB. He bonded with a HC that became a father figure to him and as a rookie got ALL the carries 369 to be exact..
Had he got the 237 that Terrell Davis got or the 233 that Cory Dillon no 1,000 yd season.. Then his Tuna Daddy left to become the Jets HC and thanks to a huge contract and a 1st and 3rd pick he comes to the Jets.. The Tuna leaves and who does he get a lame brain HC named Hermie who lets him play when he wants even too hurt to practice.. And his OC?? None other then his old college coach who loved him like the Tuna.. Who has luck like that??

[LockeJET]

Originally Posted by Savage69

You miss the whole point like many do.. I always said he would make the HOF my problem is the passes he gets that other jet players don't.. I think he was a fine workhorse back with amazing durability.. He was also one of the luckiest players of all time in several ways.. He was drafted to a team that needed a RB. He bonded with a HC that became a father figure to him and as a rookie got ALL the carries 369 to be exact..
Had he got the 237 that Terrell Davis got or the 233 that Cory Dillon no 1,000 yd season.. Then his Tuna Daddy left to become the Jets HC and thanks to a huge contract and a 1st and 3rd pick he comes to the Jets.. The Tuna leaves and who does he get a lame brain HC named Hermie who lets him play when he wants even too hurt to practice.. And his OC?? None other then his old college coach who loved him like the Tuna.. Who has luck like that??

I get it! So by luck he made the HOF. Make great sense!!!

[Savage69]

Originally Posted by LockeJET

I get it! So by luck he made the HOF. Make great sense!!!

That's not what I said and you know it.. Would you agree on this?? 3.5 ypc is not a good avg for a RB?? BTW in 04 when he got the rushing title by 1 yd?? What luck that in 04 we had 2 overtime games..

[LockeJET]

Originally Posted by Savage69

That's not what I said and you know it.. Would you agree on this?? 3.5 ypc is not a good avg for a RB?? BTW in 04 when he got the rushing title by 1 yd?? What luck that in 04 we had 2 overtime games..

Here is what I know. Based on what we know about CMart, his drive and his passion to be the best at what he does, he would have still found his way into the HOF. His 04 season had he lost the title, he would've still made the HOF so that means nothing.

We are not talking about a RB that got voted in 10-20 years later. We're talking about a 2nd ballot guy. In other words, there is no debate by the football people, he's legit.

[Savage69]

Originally Posted by LockeJET

Here is what I know. Based on what we know about CMart, his drive and his passion to be the best at what he does, he would have still found his way into the HOF. His 04 season had he lost the title, he would've still made the HOF so that means nothing.

We are not talking about a RB that got voted in 10-20 years later. We're talking about a 2nd ballot guy. In other words, there is no debate by the football people, he's legit.

You can have all the drive and passion in the world but if you go to the wrong team like Archie Manning did it can wreck your carreer in a hurry.. Cumar was a altar boy and a great guy that besides stats that plays well with the committee.. If Cory Dillon or Alexander would have gone to the Pats in the same time frame as Martin they would be in the HOF today..That's what I mean by being lucky.. Right team,right place,right time..

[jetsman51]

Originally Posted by Savage69

That's not what I said and you know it.. Would you agree on this?? 3.5 ypc is not a good avg for a RB?? BTW in 04 when he got the rushing title by 1 yd?? What luck that in 04 we had 2 overtime games..

Being the oldest player to win a rushing title (by one yards) is a testament to the kind of back Martin was.

Maybe not great, but very good.