Dick Cheney: I'm not part of Bush Administration

nuu faaola · 06-22-2007, 09:22 AM

This guy is the most shameless, bald-faced liar in the history of American politics. He makes Nixon lok like Honest Abe. God knows what he's hiding, but there's no question he's hiding something...

[url]http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-cheneyjun22,1,4089964.story?coll=chi-newsnationworld-hed[/url]
___________

Cheney sought to get oversight office shut
He balked on classified data reporting

From Tribune news services
Published June 22, 2007

WASHINGTON -- [B]Vice President Dick Cheney's office has refused to comply with an executive order governing the handling of classified information for the past four years and recently tried to abolish the office that sought to enforce those rules, according to documents released Thursday.[/B]

Under the order, executive branch offices are to give the Information Security Oversight Office data on how much material they have classified and declassified.

[B]The vice president's office provided the information in 2001 and 2002, then stopped. When the oversight office objected, Cheney's office suggested the oversight office be shut down,[/B] according to documents released by Rep. Henry Waxman (D-Calif.). The oversight office, a unit of the National Archives, appealed the issue to the Justice Department, which has not yet ruled.

Waxman said [B]Cheney's office claims it need not comply with the executive order because it is not an "entity within the executive branch."[/B]

"Your decision to except your office from the president's order is problematic because it could place national security secrets at risk," Waxman wrote in a letter to Cheney on Thursday.

"I know the vice president wants to operate with unprecedented secrecy," Waxman said in an interview. "But this is absurd. This order is designed to keep classified information safe."

The Tribune reported in April 2006 that Cheney exempts his office from a demand that executive agencies report each year on the volume of documents they classify or declassify. The vice president maintains he is exempt from that reporting requirement because his office is both executive and legislative, Cheney argues, due to his role as president of the Senate.

Warfish · 06-22-2007, 09:40 AM

I heard some of this on the Radio yesterday. On it's face, the idea behind this defense seems pretty laughable. Yet another poor judgement by this Administration.....they are, literally, their own worst enemies.

JetsFan2012 · 06-22-2007, 10:00 AM

I actually always wondered this. Because Cheney is the President of the Senate, couldn't his office be considered part of the Legislature?

I'm not defending him, I'm just wondering.

intelligentjetsfan · 06-22-2007, 11:01 AM

He is the poster boy for abuse of power. It will take decades before we can/may be able to right the wrongs of the Cheney Administration.

Warfish · 06-22-2007, 11:02 AM

[QUOTE=intelligentjetsfan]He is the poster boy for abuse of power. It will take decades before we can/may be able to right the wrongs of the Cheney Administration.[/QUOTE]

Why will it "take decades"?

Buster · 06-22-2007, 11:22 AM

[QUOTE=Warfish]I heard some of this on the Radio yesterday. On it's face, the idea behind this defense seems pretty laughable. Yet another poor judgement by this Administration.....they are, literally, their own worst enemies.[/QUOTE]

Some would call Mr Cheney's actions hubris.

jets5ever · 06-22-2007, 11:38 AM

This is bad, no doubt. I just find it funny that Cheney is supposed to be this Darth Vadar character when every single administration has abused their power, some to worse degrees than this by far and some of them Democrats as well as GOP. The Clintons, for example, have a long list of abuses.

Cheney is in power now, so we talk about him and should and this is bad, again, no doubt. But spare me these historical comparisons. Current events are always magnified. The GOP did it during Clinton's terms when they exaggerated stuff he did, calling it the worst ever, etc. When one party controls congress and has subpeona power and another controls the executive branch and tried to combat these subpeonas, the party with subpeona power (and their supporters) always, always, always whine about abuses of power, even though 99% of these subpeonas and investigations are politically motivated and 99% of the "abuses" of power are responses to transparently politically motivated investigations.

This is the game and Cheney is playing it, like many other have before and will continue to do so afterwards. Again, this doesn't excuse his actions, but offers context that, perhaps, shrieks of him being the worst ever are,at the very least, a bit of hyperbole. Or, to use the parlance of our time, don't hate the player, hate the game.

Queens Jet Fan · 06-22-2007, 11:45 AM

[QUOTE=jets5ever]This is bad, no doubt. I just find it funny that Cheney is supposed to be this Darth Vadar character when every single administration has abused their power, some to worse degrees than this by far and some of them Democrats as well as GOP. The Clintons, for example, have a long list of abuses.

Cheney is in power now, so we talk about him and should and this is bad, again, no doubt. But spare me these historical comparisons. Current events are always magnified. The GOP did it during Clinton's terms when they exaggerated stuff he did, calling it the worst ever, etc. When one party controls congress and has subpeona power and another controls the executive branch and tried to combat these subpeonas, the party with subpeona power (and their supporters) always, always, always whine about abuses of power, even though 99% of these subpeonas and investigations are politically motivated and 99% of the "abuses" of power are responses to transparently politically motivated investigations.

This is the game and Cheney is playing it, like many other have before and will continue to do so afterwards. Again, this doesn't excuse his actions, but offers context that, perhaps, shrieks of him being the worst ever are,at the very least, a bit of hyperbole. Or, to use the parlance of our time, don't hate the player, hate the game.[/QUOTE]
Where is your moral equivalence here J5E? The Republican Congress under Clinton was trying to subpoena Secret Service records to see who Clinton was getting BJ's from. Here we are talking about records concerning government operations - during wartime no less.

How can you possibly compare this and say that it happens all the time while opposing parties have power? For someone who complains about those wearing tin foil hats you sure are fast to say this is business as usual.

I'm sorry it's not.

Winstonbiggs · 06-22-2007, 12:08 PM

Cheney went from a well thought of Conservative to Spiro Agnew in 7 years.

bman · 06-22-2007, 12:54 PM

Cheney, Rummy and Little Bush have set this country back by about 20 years with their incompetence.

06-22-2007, 01:06 PM

[QUOTE=bman]Cheney, Rummy and Little Bush have set this country back by about 20 years with their incompetence.[/QUOTE]

great, i was hoping i could go back in time before the
clinton years and un-do them

are wearing loafers without socks back in style yet

bman · 06-22-2007, 01:27 PM

[QUOTE=flushingjet]great, i was hoping i could go back in time before the
clinton years and un-do them

are wearing loafers without socks back in style yet[/QUOTE]

That was actually funny. Didn't know you had it in ya.

06-22-2007, 01:45 PM

[QUOTE=bman]That was actually funny. Didn't know you had it in ya.[/QUOTE]

you can learn a lot from a plumber

jets5ever · 06-22-2007, 02:10 PM

[QUOTE=Queens Jet Fan]Where is your moral equivalence here J5E? The Republican Congress under Clinton was trying to subpoena Secret Service records to see who Clinton was getting BJ's from. Here we are talking about records concerning government operations - during wartime no less.

How can you possibly compare this and say that it happens all the time while opposing parties have power? For someone who complains about those wearing tin foil hats you sure are fast to say this is business as usual.

I'm sorry it's not.[/QUOTE]

Dude, that's hardly a complete summary of all the subpeonas Clinton faced and an inaccurate summary of that particular issue, as well. It does happen all the time. The GOP was wrong to engage in stupid politically motivated fishing expeditions and so are the Dems, now. The GOP used pious-sounding rhetoric about abuses of power when they opposed the executive, just like the Dems are doing now that they do. On and on is goes...forgive me if I don't get outraged by something that's gone on consistently since I have bee alive....

MnJetFan · 06-22-2007, 03:14 PM

Bush made a major mistake having Rumsfeld and Cheney anywhere near the White House. Sought of like Beevis and Butthead!

bman · 06-22-2007, 03:45 PM

[QUOTE=jets5ever]Dude, that's hardly a complete summary of all the subpeonas Clinton faced and an inaccurate summary of that particular issue, as well. It does happen all the time. The GOP was wrong to engage in stupid politically motivated fishing expeditions and so are the Dems, now. The GOP used pious-sounding rhetoric about abuses of power when they opposed the executive, just like the Dems are doing now that they do. On and on is goes...forgive me if I don't get outraged by something that's gone on consistently since I have bee alive....[/QUOTE]

That's why I LOVEEEEEE A Bloomberg/Hegal ticket..
Two dudes who actually get crap done..

Queens Jet Fan · 06-22-2007, 04:26 PM

[QUOTE=jets5ever]Dude, that's hardly a complete summary of all the subpeonas Clinton faced and an inaccurate summary of that particular issue, as well. It does happen all the time. The GOP was wrong to engage in stupid politically motivated fishing expeditions and so are the Dems, now. The GOP used pious-sounding rhetoric about abuses of power when they opposed the executive, just like the Dems are doing now that they do. On and on is goes...forgive me if I don't get outraged by something that's gone on consistently since I have bee alive....[/QUOTE]
Ok you want to talk accurate?
[QUOTE]Vice President Dick Cheney's office has refused to comply with an executive order governing the handling of classified information for the past four years and recently tried to abolish the office that sought to enforce those rules, according to documents released Thursday.[/QUOTE]
So who gave this executive order? Wouldn't it be the President? He hasn't complied for 4 years? Oh so it was a Republican Congress who was worried about treatment of classified information.

How exactly is this a fishing expedition?

Again this is not business as usual. This is Cheney thumping his nose at any oversight. Who died and made him King? To talk about this as political chicanery just puts this in the Dem vs Rep battlefied which is something it is clearly not.

I expect better from you.

cr726 · 06-22-2007, 05:01 PM

Don't forget Rove had he ability to delete RNC server emails because they knew he was abusing it.

nuu faaola · 06-25-2007, 09:53 AM

Here's what I think:

Congress should tell Cheney: 'You're right, you aren't in the executive branch," and allow him to withhold this information about what his office di with classified material.

And then, after that occurs, it should begin to treat him as outside the executive branch in two ways: (1) No more executive privilege, which he has claimed repeatedly in matters related to torture policy, warrantless spying and even national energy policy, and (2) no more access to executive-branch funding for his office.

If he's in Congress, he should be funded like a congressman, and subject to the same truth-telling laws as one.

Soberphobia · 06-25-2007, 10:13 AM

This is the same guy who gave the 'co-ordinates' to the 'real weapons of mass destruction in Iraq' to the CIA and ordered them to 'go get them.'

When the CIA ran the co-ordinates through their computers they found the area he had given them was somewhere in Lebanon.

06-22-2007, 09:22 AM	#1
nuu faaola All Pro Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 6,255	Dick Cheney: I'm not part of Bush Administration This guy is the most shameless, bald-faced liar in the history of American politics. He makes Nixon lok like Honest Abe. God knows what he's hiding, but there's no question he's hiding something... [url]http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-cheneyjun22,1,4089964.story?coll=chi-newsnationworld-hed[/url] ___________ Cheney sought to get oversight office shut He balked on classified data reporting From Tribune news services Published June 22, 2007 WASHINGTON -- [B]Vice President Dick Cheney's office has refused to comply with an executive order governing the handling of classified information for the past four years and recently tried to abolish the office that sought to enforce those rules, according to documents released Thursday.[/B] Under the order, executive branch offices are to give the Information Security Oversight Office data on how much material they have classified and declassified. [B]The vice president's office provided the information in 2001 and 2002, then stopped. When the oversight office objected, Cheney's office suggested the oversight office be shut down,[/B] according to documents released by Rep. Henry Waxman (D-Calif.). The oversight office, a unit of the National Archives, appealed the issue to the Justice Department, which has not yet ruled. Waxman said [B]Cheney's office claims it need not comply with the executive order because it is not an "entity within the executive branch."[/B] "Your decision to except your office from the president's order is problematic because it could place national security secrets at risk," Waxman wrote in a letter to Cheney on Thursday. "I know the vice president wants to operate with unprecedented secrecy," Waxman said in an interview. "But this is absurd. This order is designed to keep classified information safe." The Tribune reported in April 2006 that Cheney exempts his office from a demand that executive agencies report each year on the volume of documents they classify or declassify. The vice president maintains he is exempt from that reporting requirement because his office is both executive and legislative, Cheney argues, due to his role as president of the Senate.

06-22-2007, 09:40 AM	#2
Warfish JetsInsider.com Legend Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 35,000	I heard some of this on the Radio yesterday. On it's face, the idea behind this defense seems pretty laughable. Yet another poor judgement by this Administration.....they are, literally, their own worst enemies.

06-22-2007, 10:00 AM	#3
JetsFan2012 Waterboy Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 0	I actually always wondered this. Because Cheney is the President of the Senate, couldn't his office be considered part of the Legislature? I'm not defending him, I'm just wondering.

06-22-2007, 11:01 AM	#4
intelligentjetsfan All Pro Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 5,320	He is the poster boy for abuse of power. It will take decades before we can/may be able to right the wrongs of the Cheney Administration.

06-22-2007, 11:02 AM	#5
Warfish JetsInsider.com Legend Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 35,000	[QUOTE=intelligentjetsfan]He is the poster boy for abuse of power. It will take decades before we can/may be able to right the wrongs of the Cheney Administration.[/QUOTE] Why will it "take decades"?

06-22-2007, 11:22 AM	#6
Buster not a rocket surgeon All League Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: East of the Jordan, West of the Rock of Gibraltar Posts: 4,295	[QUOTE=Warfish]I heard some of this on the Radio yesterday. On it's face, the idea behind this defense seems pretty laughable. Yet another poor judgement by this Administration.....they are, literally, their own worst enemies.[/QUOTE] Some would call Mr Cheney's actions hubris.

06-22-2007, 11:38 AM	#7
jets5ever Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Boston Posts: 11,692	This is bad, no doubt. I just find it funny that Cheney is supposed to be this Darth Vadar character when every single administration has abused their power, some to worse degrees than this by far and some of them Democrats as well as GOP. The Clintons, for example, have a long list of abuses. Cheney is in power now, so we talk about him and should and this is bad, again, no doubt. But spare me these historical comparisons. Current events are always magnified. The GOP did it during Clinton's terms when they exaggerated stuff he did, calling it the worst ever, etc. When one party controls congress and has subpeona power and another controls the executive branch and tried to combat these subpeonas, the party with subpeona power (and their supporters) always, always, always whine about abuses of power, even though 99% of these subpeonas and investigations are politically motivated and 99% of the "abuses" of power are responses to transparently politically motivated investigations. This is the game and Cheney is playing it, like many other have before and will continue to do so afterwards. Again, this doesn't excuse his actions, but offers context that, perhaps, shrieks of him being the worst ever are,at the very least, a bit of hyperbole. Or, to use the parlance of our time, don't hate the player, hate the game.

06-22-2007, 11:45 AM	#8
Queens Jet Fan All Pro Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Roslyn Posts: 6,797	[QUOTE=jets5ever]This is bad, no doubt. I just find it funny that Cheney is supposed to be this Darth Vadar character when every single administration has abused their power, some to worse degrees than this by far and some of them Democrats as well as GOP. The Clintons, for example, have a long list of abuses. Cheney is in power now, so we talk about him and should and this is bad, again, no doubt. But spare me these historical comparisons. Current events are always magnified. The GOP did it during Clinton's terms when they exaggerated stuff he did, calling it the worst ever, etc. When one party controls congress and has subpeona power and another controls the executive branch and tried to combat these subpeonas, the party with subpeona power (and their supporters) always, always, always whine about abuses of power, even though 99% of these subpeonas and investigations are politically motivated and 99% of the "abuses" of power are responses to transparently politically motivated investigations. This is the game and Cheney is playing it, like many other have before and will continue to do so afterwards. Again, this doesn't excuse his actions, but offers context that, perhaps, shrieks of him being the worst ever are,at the very least, a bit of hyperbole. Or, to use the parlance of our time, don't hate the player, hate the game.[/QUOTE] Where is your moral equivalence here J5E? The Republican Congress under Clinton was trying to subpoena Secret Service records to see who Clinton was getting BJ's from. Here we are talking about records concerning government operations - during wartime no less. How can you possibly compare this and say that it happens all the time while opposing parties have power? For someone who complains about those wearing tin foil hats you sure are fast to say this is business as usual. I'm sorry it's not.

06-22-2007, 12:08 PM	#9
Winstonbiggs Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 13,095	Cheney went from a well thought of Conservative to Spiro Agnew in 7 years.

06-22-2007, 12:54 PM	#10
bman All League Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 4,941	Cheney, Rummy and Little Bush have set this country back by about 20 years with their incompetence.

06-22-2007, 01:06 PM	#11
flushingjet Edit Status Guest Posts: n/a	[QUOTE=bman]Cheney, Rummy and Little Bush have set this country back by about 20 years with their incompetence.[/QUOTE] great, i was hoping i could go back in time before the clinton years and un-do them are wearing loafers without socks back in style yet

06-22-2007, 01:27 PM	#12
bman All League Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 4,941	[QUOTE=flushingjet]great, i was hoping i could go back in time before the clinton years and un-do them are wearing loafers without socks back in style yet[/QUOTE] That was actually funny. Didn't know you had it in ya.

06-22-2007, 01:45 PM	#13
flushingjet Edit Status Guest Posts: n/a	[QUOTE=bman]That was actually funny. Didn't know you had it in ya.[/QUOTE] you can learn a lot from a plumber

06-22-2007, 02:10 PM	#14
jets5ever Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Boston Posts: 11,692	[QUOTE=Queens Jet Fan]Where is your moral equivalence here J5E? The Republican Congress under Clinton was trying to subpoena Secret Service records to see who Clinton was getting BJ's from. Here we are talking about records concerning government operations - during wartime no less. How can you possibly compare this and say that it happens all the time while opposing parties have power? For someone who complains about those wearing tin foil hats you sure are fast to say this is business as usual. I'm sorry it's not.[/QUOTE] Dude, that's hardly a complete summary of all the subpeonas Clinton faced and an inaccurate summary of that particular issue, as well. It does happen all the time. The GOP was wrong to engage in stupid politically motivated fishing expeditions and so are the Dems, now. The GOP used pious-sounding rhetoric about abuses of power when they opposed the executive, just like the Dems are doing now that they do. On and on is goes...forgive me if I don't get outraged by something that's gone on consistently since I have bee alive....

06-22-2007, 03:14 PM	#15
MnJetFan All League Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 4,312	Bush made a major mistake having Rumsfeld and Cheney anywhere near the White House. Sought of like Beevis and Butthead!

06-22-2007, 03:45 PM	#16
bman All League Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 4,941	[QUOTE=jets5ever]Dude, that's hardly a complete summary of all the subpeonas Clinton faced and an inaccurate summary of that particular issue, as well. It does happen all the time. The GOP was wrong to engage in stupid politically motivated fishing expeditions and so are the Dems, now. The GOP used pious-sounding rhetoric about abuses of power when they opposed the executive, just like the Dems are doing now that they do. On and on is goes...forgive me if I don't get outraged by something that's gone on consistently since I have bee alive....[/QUOTE] That's why I LOVEEEEEE A Bloomberg/Hegal ticket.. Two dudes who actually get crap done..

06-22-2007, 04:26 PM	#17
Queens Jet Fan All Pro Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Roslyn Posts: 6,797	[QUOTE=jets5ever]Dude, that's hardly a complete summary of all the subpeonas Clinton faced and an inaccurate summary of that particular issue, as well. It does happen all the time. The GOP was wrong to engage in stupid politically motivated fishing expeditions and so are the Dems, now. The GOP used pious-sounding rhetoric about abuses of power when they opposed the executive, just like the Dems are doing now that they do. On and on is goes...forgive me if I don't get outraged by something that's gone on consistently since I have bee alive....[/QUOTE] Ok you want to talk accurate? [QUOTE]Vice President Dick Cheney's office has refused to comply with an executive order governing the handling of classified information for the past four years and recently tried to abolish the office that sought to enforce those rules, according to documents released Thursday.[/QUOTE] So who gave this executive order? Wouldn't it be the President? He hasn't complied for 4 years? Oh so it was a Republican Congress who was worried about treatment of classified information. How exactly is this a fishing expedition? Again this is not business as usual. This is Cheney thumping his nose at any oversight. Who died and made him King? To talk about this as political chicanery just puts this in the Dem vs Rep battlefied which is something it is clearly not. I expect better from you.

06-22-2007, 05:01 PM	#18
cr726 Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 13,532	Don't forget Rove had he ability to delete RNC server emails because they knew he was abusing it.

06-25-2007, 09:53 AM	#19
nuu faaola All Pro Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 6,255	Here's what I think: Congress should tell Cheney: 'You're right, you aren't in the executive branch," and allow him to withhold this information about what his office di with classified material. And then, after that occurs, it should begin to treat him as outside the executive branch in two ways: (1) No more executive privilege, which he has claimed repeatedly in matters related to torture policy, warrantless spying and even national energy policy, and (2) no more access to executive-branch funding for his office. If he's in Congress, he should be funded like a congressman, and subject to the same truth-telling laws as one.

06-25-2007, 10:13 AM	#20
Soberphobia All League Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 3,449	This is the same guy who gave the 'co-ordinates' to the 'real weapons of mass destruction in Iraq' to the CIA and ordered them to 'go get them.' When the CIA ran the co-ordinates through their computers they found the area he had given them was somewhere in Lebanon.