I Caution the Republican Party leaders

Green Jets & Ham · 06-22-2011, 11:39 PM

Don't make the mistake of criticizing Obama's decision to pull the troops out of Afghanistan.

Don't misread the country on this one.

The American people have mission fatigue and they want the troops home too.

Even conservatives don't want our kids spilling any more blood in that hell-hole, and who can blame them, we've now been in that rat-nest even longer than Vietnam!

If the Republican Party leaders are smart, they'll say we agree with the President, its time to vamoose.

Having said that, I think John Boehner's response missed the mark.

Thats not what the American people wanted to hear.

They wanted to hear the Republicans agree that its time to go.

JMO

Green Jets & Ham · 06-22-2011, 11:44 PM

As I type this, I'm watching the replay of O'Reilly and Pawlenty is the first dummy to misread the tea leaves. He took the bait, criticizing Obama and talking about finishing the mission.

That position is a loser, even amongst Republicans.

This guy is tone-deaf and IMO he just doomed what little chance he had.

piney · 06-22-2011, 11:47 PM

[QUOTE=Green Jets & Ham;4051773]Don't make the mistake of criticizing Obama's decision to pull the troops out of Afghanistan.

Don't misread the country on this this one.

The American people have mission fatigue and they want the troops home too.

Even conservatives don't want our kids spilling any more blood in that hell-hole, and who can blame them, we've now been in that rat-nest even longer than Vietnam!

If the Republican Party leaders are smart, they'll say we agree with the President, its time to vamoose.

Having said that, I think John Boehner's response missed the mark.

Thats not what the American people wanted to hear.

They wanted to hear the Republicans agree that its time to go.

JMO[/QUOTE]

I have been saying for a year or so that this was going to be a big political move for Obama, bringing troops home.

Maybe I am cynical, but it just reeks of political theater (albeit, one I am happy with even if I don't agree with the motive) but it is just one more thing he can run on.

Shrewd move, IMO.

Green Jets & Ham · 06-23-2011, 12:11 AM

[QUOTE=piney;4051776]

I have been saying for a year or so that this was going to be a big political move for Obama, bringing troops home.

Maybe I am cynical, but it just reeks of political theater (albeit, one I am happy with even if I don't agree with the motive) but it is just one more thing he can run on.

Shrewd move, IMO.[/QUOTE]Absolutely, and the Republicans will severely damage the parties 2012 prospects if they foolishly turn this into a partisan issue with the Republicans on the wrong side.

IMO if they were smart they would say we agree with the President, its time to bring our troops home.

Green Jets & Ham · 06-23-2011, 12:18 AM

Of course Hannity can't resist the urge to criticize the President, so he's another sucker who took the bait.

I hope Michele Bachmann is smart enough to separate herself from the kneejerk reaction on this one, because if she does I believe she will really start to position herself as a front-runner for the nomination.

Its gonna be hard because the natural inclination of conservatives is to oppose Obama, but if she's smart she'll realize this is one of those rare exceptions, the smart move politically is to agree with Obama on this one.

I'll say it again, republicans and conservatives want our troops home as much as dems and libs.

Jet_Engine1 · 06-23-2011, 01:01 AM

WIn or go home. Period. No middle ground on this one. Stop frakkin' around with this "Nation Building" bull****, destroy the bad guys and their infrastructure, burn the poppy fields down and let Spec Ops teams wipe out the processing sites, and if that corrupt band of clowns in the Karzei government have a problem with it, too bad.

When we send our guys to war (and yes, I've been one of those guys), then they DESERVE to have the Government send them over with a clear objective, the flexibility to do the job, and the ability to wage war with all of the power and fury the U.S. Military can bring to bear in order to secure the objectives and win the war with as few U.S. casualties as possible.

And if thats not what the Civilian Command structure has in mind, then bring the guys, ALL of them, home NOW.

Enough ****ing around with these goat****ing dirtbags.

Trades · 06-23-2011, 08:57 AM

[QUOTE=Jet_Engine1;4051811]WIn or go home. Period. No middle ground on this one. Stop frakkin' around with this "Nation Building" bull****, destroy the bad guys and their infrastructure, burn the poppy fields down and let Spec Ops teams wipe out the processing sites, and if that corrupt band of clowns in the Karzei government have a problem with it, too bad.

When we send our guys to war (and yes, I've been one of those guys), then they DESERVE to have the Government send them over with a clear objective, the flexibility to do the job, and the ability to wage war with all of the power and fury the U.S. Military can bring to bear in order to secure the objectives and win the war with as few U.S. casualties as possible.

And if thats not what the Civilian Command structure has in mind, then bring the guys, ALL of them, home NOW.

Enough ****ing around with these goat****ing dirtbags.[/QUOTE]

We did all that in the first couple of years. The problem is that new groups keep cropping up or old ones come back. It is historically a lawless area and I don't think we are ever going to change that.

When we first invaded we felt little resistance, bombed the crap out of the bad areas and then tried to set up a government. The 2nd part is imposible. Then we invaded Iraq (should have been Syria) because the Taliban/Al-Queda left Afghanistan to avoid us and regroup. Many were drawn to Iraq and we beat them there. Now they are in Pakistan, Syria and other countries in the area. That is the issue with fighting this kind of opponenet. There is no leader to topple, no government to depose. We have accomplished what we could in Afghanistan. It is time to pull out and let China deal with the remains.

isired · 06-23-2011, 09:46 AM

[QUOTE=Jet_Engine1;4051811][B]WIn or go home.[/B] Period. No middle ground on this one. Stop frakkin' around with this "Nation Building" bull****, destroy the bad guys and their infrastructure, burn the poppy fields down and let Spec Ops teams wipe out the processing sites, and if that corrupt band of clowns in the Karzei government have a problem with it, too bad.[/quote]What is a "win" here? We can accomplish all of what you list in the rest of the paragraph, but there are always new bad guys, new generations, the poppy will grow again, and with it the money to build new infrastructure.

[QUOTE=Jet_Engine1;4051811]When we send our guys to war (and yes, I've been one of those guys), then they DESERVE to have the Government send them over [B]with a clear objective[/B], the flexibility to do the job, and the ability to wage war with all of the power and fury the U.S. Military can bring to bear in order to secure the objectives and win the war with as few U.S. casualties as possible.[/QUOTE]That's been the problem since day 1, hasn't it? It's been another 'body count' war, with no clear objective. We would go on sifting through the country, picking off our enemies for generations, likely without any real, long-lasting change. It's time. It's past time.

JetPotato · 06-23-2011, 11:40 AM

Absolutely correct Ham.

The Republican talking heads and the establishment are completely out of touch with the people. It's why they will have the floor mopped with whatever candidate they choose again this time. To this absolute mess of a "President" no less.

McCain's comments were the worst of all. Time to hang it up, old man. You had your chance to lead this party and this country and it was an absolute train wreck. You've supported one disaster President, and got shellacked by another. We appreciate that you have served your country well with your military service, but you have done nothing but disservice to your political party.

palmetto defender · 06-23-2011, 12:24 PM

Disagree with you, Ham. But on this point: "10,000 troops? BFD.
We still have 3 times the number as when you came into office. YOU put them there. This draw down is neither high enough in reduction nor quick enough. You're just trying to make news not end the confliict".

Except for the BFD. That's what some Rep leader should say - verbatim.

PlumberKhan · 06-23-2011, 12:58 PM

[QUOTE=palmetto defender;4052044]That's what some Rep leader should say - verbatim.[/QUOTE]

They should. That way Dems can replay that over and over again in campaign commercials.

MnJetFan · 06-23-2011, 01:08 PM

Time to say goodbye! We leave the Taliban is back in power weather now or 5 years from now!

palmetto defender · 06-23-2011, 01:14 PM

[QUOTE=PlumberKhan;4052071]They should. That way Dems can replay that over and over again in campaign commercials.[/QUOTE]

Right. So the president who promised to end our involvement immediately (that was 2 1/2 years ago) builds up the troop concentration and then pulls out 10,000. WOW. He's going to stand on that? Make a commercial on that? Sure he is. He's doing nothing.

Winstonbiggs · 06-23-2011, 01:16 PM

Any candidate for President regardless of party that can't articulate a policy and strategy for Afghanistan has no business being a candidate.

Simply put regardless of who wins the White House Afghanistan is a huge monetary and defense issue that must be dealt with. Not criticizing or shutting up is simply not an option for a serious candidate.

We may have bad enough economic conditions where ideologues in the Republican party think they can win on running against health care and stripping out the social safety net but it's hard for me to take that kind of candidate seriously when we have troops on the ground all over the world and a huge economic commitment tied to it.

JetsFan2012 · 06-23-2011, 01:22 PM

I agree 100% with you Ham. :yes:

PlumberKhan · 06-23-2011, 01:26 PM

[QUOTE=palmetto defender;4052082]Right. So the president who promised to end our involvement immediately (that was 2 1/2 years ago) builds up the troop concentration and then pulls out 10,000. WOW. He's going to stand on that? Make a commercial on that? Sure he is. He's doing nothing.[/QUOTE]

No.

But they can take the quote out of context and play it over and over again.

[QUOTE]Voiceover: Republicans like to say that they value the safety of the troops. But how do they [B][I]really[/I][/B] feel?

Republican Leader: "Bring home {edit out number} troops? Big f*cking deal...big f*cking deal"....[/QUOTE]

Viola!

palmetto defender · 06-23-2011, 01:38 PM

[QUOTE=PlumberKhan;4052093]No.

But they can take the quote out of context and play it over and over again.

Viola![/QUOTE]

In other words, your Dem buddies would LIE? Obama would tolerate LYING? Not the open President? Lying. Sort of what got the Weiner in trouble. You advocate that?
BTW, I did indicate not to include BFD. You saw that, right?

bitonti · 06-23-2011, 01:41 PM

[QUOTE=palmetto defender;4052082]Right. So the president who promised to end our involvement immediately (that was 2 1/2 years ago) [/QUOTE]

Obama never promised this. He campaigned that Iraq was the wrong war and Afghanistan was the right war. by surging, he fulfilled a campaign promise not broke a campaign promise.

palmetto defender · 06-23-2011, 01:49 PM

[QUOTE=bitonti;4052112]Obama never promised this. He campaigned that Iraq was the wrong war and Afghanistan was the right war. by surging, he fulfilled a campaign promise not broke a campaign promise.[/QUOTE]

He did say he would end Afghanistan as well as Iraq.
Plus close Gitmo.
He escalated Afghanistan. Why, an LBJ of our time.

Winstonbiggs · 06-23-2011, 02:00 PM

[QUOTE=palmetto defender;4052120]He did say he would end Afghanistan as well as Iraq.
Plus close Gitmo.
He escalated Afghanistan. Why, an LBJ of our time.[/QUOTE]

He absolutely campaigned on expanding the war in Afganistan. He said it over and over in his debates with Hillary.

06-22-2011, 11:39 PM	#1
Green Jets & Ham Banned Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 41,588	I Caution the Republican Party leaders Don't make the mistake of criticizing Obama's decision to pull the troops out of Afghanistan. Don't misread the country on this one. The American people have mission fatigue and they want the troops home too. Even conservatives don't want our kids spilling any more blood in that hell-hole, and who can blame them, we've now been in that rat-nest even longer than Vietnam! If the Republican Party leaders are smart, they'll say we agree with the President, its time to vamoose. Having said that, I think John Boehner's response missed the mark. Thats not what the American people wanted to hear. They wanted to hear the Republicans agree that its time to go. JMO Last edited by Green Jets & Ham; 06-23-2011 at 12:07 AM.

06-22-2011, 11:44 PM	#2
Green Jets & Ham Banned Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 41,588	As I type this, I'm watching the replay of O'Reilly and Pawlenty is the first dummy to misread the tea leaves. He took the bait, criticizing Obama and talking about finishing the mission. That position is a loser, even amongst Republicans. This guy is tone-deaf and IMO he just doomed what little chance he had. Last edited by Green Jets & Ham; 06-23-2011 at 12:08 AM.

06-23-2011, 12:18 AM	#5
Green Jets & Ham Banned Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 41,588	Of course Hannity can't resist the urge to criticize the President, so he's another sucker who took the bait. I hope Michele Bachmann is smart enough to separate herself from the kneejerk reaction on this one, because if she does I believe she will really start to position herself as a front-runner for the nomination. Its gonna be hard because the natural inclination of conservatives is to oppose Obama, but if she's smart she'll realize this is one of those rare exceptions, the smart move politically is to agree with Obama on this one. I'll say it again, republicans and conservatives want our troops home as much as dems and libs. Last edited by Green Jets & Ham; 06-23-2011 at 12:21 AM.

06-22-2011, 11:47 PM	#3
piney hip deep in dirty diapers All League Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 3,618	[QUOTE=Green Jets & Ham;4051773]Don't make the mistake of criticizing Obama's decision to pull the troops out of Afghanistan. Don't misread the country on this this one. The American people have mission fatigue and they want the troops home too. Even conservatives don't want our kids spilling any more blood in that hell-hole, and who can blame them, we've now been in that rat-nest even longer than Vietnam! If the Republican Party leaders are smart, they'll say we agree with the President, its time to vamoose. Having said that, I think John Boehner's response missed the mark. Thats not what the American people wanted to hear. They wanted to hear the Republicans agree that its time to go. JMO[/QUOTE] I have been saying for a year or so that this was going to be a big political move for Obama, bringing troops home. Maybe I am cynical, but it just reeks of political theater (albeit, one I am happy with even if I don't agree with the motive) but it is just one more thing he can run on. Shrewd move, IMO.

06-23-2011, 12:11 AM	#4
Green Jets & Ham Banned Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 41,588	[QUOTE=piney;4051776] I have been saying for a year or so that this was going to be a big political move for Obama, bringing troops home. Maybe I am cynical, but it just reeks of political theater (albeit, one I am happy with even if I don't agree with the motive) but it is just one more thing he can run on. Shrewd move, IMO.[/QUOTE]Absolutely, and the Republicans will severely damage the parties 2012 prospects if they foolishly turn this into a partisan issue with the Republicans on the wrong side. IMO if they were smart they would say we agree with the President, its time to bring our troops home.

06-23-2011, 01:01 AM	#6
Jet_Engine1 Stictly an observer. All League Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: West Palm Beach, FL Posts: 3,855	WIn or go home. Period. No middle ground on this one. Stop frakkin' around with this "Nation Building" bull**, destroy the bad guys and their infrastructure, burn the poppy fields down and let Spec Ops teams wipe out the processing sites, and if that corrupt band of clowns in the Karzei government have a problem with it, too bad. When we send our guys to war (and yes, I've been one of those guys), then they DESERVE to have the Government send them over with a clear objective, the flexibility to do the job, and the ability to wage war with all of the power and fury the U.S. Military can bring to bear in order to secure the objectives and win the war with as few U.S. casualties as possible. And if thats not what the Civilian Command structure has in mind, then bring the guys, ALL of them, home NOW. Enough ing around with these goat**ing dirtbags.

06-23-2011, 08:57 AM	#7
Trades Jets Insider VIP Join Date: May 2004 Location: New Jersey Posts: 5,556	[QUOTE=Jet_Engine1;4051811]WIn or go home. Period. No middle ground on this one. Stop frakkin' around with this "Nation Building" bull**, destroy the bad guys and their infrastructure, burn the poppy fields down and let Spec Ops teams wipe out the processing sites, and if that corrupt band of clowns in the Karzei government have a problem with it, too bad. When we send our guys to war (and yes, I've been one of those guys), then they DESERVE to have the Government send them over with a clear objective, the flexibility to do the job, and the ability to wage war with all of the power and fury the U.S. Military can bring to bear in order to secure the objectives and win the war with as few U.S. casualties as possible. And if thats not what the Civilian Command structure has in mind, then bring the guys, ALL of them, home NOW. Enough ing around with these goat**ing dirtbags.[/QUOTE] We did all that in the first couple of years. The problem is that new groups keep cropping up or old ones come back. It is historically a lawless area and I don't think we are ever going to change that. When we first invaded we felt little resistance, bombed the crap out of the bad areas and then tried to set up a government. The 2nd part is imposible. Then we invaded Iraq (should have been Syria) because the Taliban/Al-Queda left Afghanistan to avoid us and regroup. Many were drawn to Iraq and we beat them there. Now they are in Pakistan, Syria and other countries in the area. That is the issue with fighting this kind of opponenet. There is no leader to topple, no government to depose. We have accomplished what we could in Afghanistan. It is time to pull out and let China deal with the remains.

06-23-2011, 09:46 AM	#8
isired Board Moderator Jets Insider VIP Charter JI Member Join Date: May 1999 Location: nyc Posts: 11,155	[QUOTE=Jet_Engine1;4051811][B]WIn or go home.[/B] Period. No middle ground on this one. Stop frakkin' around with this "Nation Building" bull****, destroy the bad guys and their infrastructure, burn the poppy fields down and let Spec Ops teams wipe out the processing sites, and if that corrupt band of clowns in the Karzei government have a problem with it, too bad.[/quote]What is a "win" here? We can accomplish all of what you list in the rest of the paragraph, but there are always new bad guys, new generations, the poppy will grow again, and with it the money to build new infrastructure. [QUOTE=Jet_Engine1;4051811]When we send our guys to war (and yes, I've been one of those guys), then they DESERVE to have the Government send them over [B]with a clear objective[/B], the flexibility to do the job, and the ability to wage war with all of the power and fury the U.S. Military can bring to bear in order to secure the objectives and win the war with as few U.S. casualties as possible.[/QUOTE]That's been the problem since day 1, hasn't it? It's been another 'body count' war, with no clear objective. We would go on sifting through the country, picking off our enemies for generations, likely without any real, long-lasting change. It's time. It's past time.

06-23-2011, 11:40 AM	#9
JetPotato fermenting Hall Of Fame Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: New York, NY Posts: 12,134	Absolutely correct Ham. The Republican talking heads and the establishment are completely out of touch with the people. It's why they will have the floor mopped with whatever candidate they choose again this time. To this absolute mess of a "President" no less. McCain's comments were the worst of all. Time to hang it up, old man. You had your chance to lead this party and this country and it was an absolute train wreck. You've supported one disaster President, and got shellacked by another. We appreciate that you have served your country well with your military service, but you have done nothing but disservice to your political party.

06-23-2011, 12:24 PM	#10
palmetto defender All League Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 4,649	Disagree with you, Ham. But on this point: "10,000 troops? BFD. We still have 3 times the number as when you came into office. YOU put them there. This draw down is neither high enough in reduction nor quick enough. You're just trying to make news not end the confliict". Except for the BFD. That's what some Rep leader should say - verbatim.

06-23-2011, 12:58 PM	#11
PlumberKhan BRACE YOURSELVES FOR 12... Hall Of Fame Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Van down by the river Posts: 21,013	[QUOTE=palmetto defender;4052044]That's what some Rep leader should say - verbatim.[/QUOTE] They should. That way Dems can replay that over and over again in campaign commercials.

06-23-2011, 01:08 PM	#12
MnJetFan All League Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 4,302	Time to say goodbye! We leave the Taliban is back in power weather now or 5 years from now!

06-23-2011, 01:14 PM	#13
palmetto defender All League Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 4,649	[QUOTE=PlumberKhan;4052071]They should. That way Dems can replay that over and over again in campaign commercials.[/QUOTE] Right. So the president who promised to end our involvement immediately (that was 2 1/2 years ago) builds up the troop concentration and then pulls out 10,000. WOW. He's going to stand on that? Make a commercial on that? Sure he is. He's doing nothing.

06-23-2011, 01:16 PM	#14
Winstonbiggs Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 12,928	Any candidate for President regardless of party that can't articulate a policy and strategy for Afghanistan has no business being a candidate. Simply put regardless of who wins the White House Afghanistan is a huge monetary and defense issue that must be dealt with. Not criticizing or shutting up is simply not an option for a serious candidate. We may have bad enough economic conditions where ideologues in the Republican party think they can win on running against health care and stripping out the social safety net but it's hard for me to take that kind of candidate seriously when we have troops on the ground all over the world and a huge economic commitment tied to it.

06-23-2011, 01:22 PM	#15
JetsFan2012 Waterboy Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 0	I agree 100% with you Ham. :yes:

06-23-2011, 01:26 PM	#16
PlumberKhan BRACE YOURSELVES FOR 12... Hall Of Fame Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Van down by the river Posts: 21,013	[QUOTE=palmetto defender;4052082]Right. So the president who promised to end our involvement immediately (that was 2 1/2 years ago) builds up the troop concentration and then pulls out 10,000. WOW. He's going to stand on that? Make a commercial on that? Sure he is. He's doing nothing.[/QUOTE] No. But they can take the quote out of context and play it over and over again. [QUOTE]Voiceover: Republicans like to say that they value the safety of the troops. But how do they [B][I]really[/I][/B] feel? Republican Leader: "Bring home {edit out number} troops? Big fcking deal...big fcking deal"....[/QUOTE] Viola!

06-23-2011, 01:38 PM	#17
palmetto defender All League Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 4,649	[QUOTE=PlumberKhan;4052093]No. But they can take the quote out of context and play it over and over again. Viola![/QUOTE] In other words, your Dem buddies would LIE? Obama would tolerate LYING? Not the open President? Lying. Sort of what got the Weiner in trouble. You advocate that? BTW, I did indicate not to include BFD. You saw that, right?

06-23-2011, 01:41 PM	#18
bitonti searching Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philly Posts: 38,786	[QUOTE=palmetto defender;4052082]Right. So the president who promised to end our involvement immediately (that was 2 1/2 years ago) [/QUOTE] Obama never promised this. He campaigned that Iraq was the wrong war and Afghanistan was the right war. by surging, he fulfilled a campaign promise not broke a campaign promise.

06-23-2011, 01:49 PM	#19
palmetto defender All League Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 4,649	[QUOTE=bitonti;4052112]Obama never promised this. He campaigned that Iraq was the wrong war and Afghanistan was the right war. by surging, he fulfilled a campaign promise not broke a campaign promise.[/QUOTE] He did say he would end Afghanistan as well as Iraq. Plus close Gitmo. He escalated Afghanistan. Why, an LBJ of our time.

06-23-2011, 02:00 PM	#20
Winstonbiggs Jets Insider VIP Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 12,928	[QUOTE=palmetto defender;4052120]He did say he would end Afghanistan as well as Iraq. Plus close Gitmo. He escalated Afghanistan. Why, an LBJ of our time.[/QUOTE] He absolutely campaigned on expanding the war in Afganistan. He said it over and over in his debates with Hillary.