Does the US Health System need to be changed?

[OCCH]

[QUOTE=southparkcpa;4250252]Lets get the average salary of a private school teacher and make that the salary of all public school teachers. Then the difference can be applied to healthcare. Cut their pensions to match those of private school teachers as well. Sound good?;)[/QUOTE]

While I'm strictly a conservative, I'm also a realist. I've taught in both arenas and there's absolutely no way you can compare the two.

From VASTLY different class sizes, to INFINITELY more hoops to jump through, to WAY more "needy" kids . . . I love what I do, but I don't think I could do it in a public setting for a private salary.

You can interpret that any way you want -- all I know is they've made the job way harder than it needs to be, and because of that you need to offer an adequate salary/benefits if you want anyone showing up for work. . .

[exit9JetsFan]

[QUOTE=OCCH;4249591]I won't pretend to understand the intricacies of the insurance system. I guess in my "simple" mind I picture one level of insurance that a private company can offer, and a much lower one offered by the gov't. You are correct in noting Medicaid pretty much already does this, and not very cost-effectively. So I guess I don't know what the answer is -- I just know it shouldn't be in forcing a for-profit business to do something that won't allow them to maximize their profit.

Again, if we "change the rules" as a nation, then yes, insurance companies will have to deal with that. But right now we're just arguing if they should or not, and I most definitely think they should not.

[B]In regards to your son's foot (and other such instances) no one "owes" him physical care.[/B] If your argument is "it will cost more to fix down the road", that is a financial position that holds MUCH more weight than "he deserves the help".

I guess it bothers me that free education, free food, low-cost housing -- nothing ever seems to be enough. Most of our poor are light-years ahead of poor around the world, but all I hear is how much more they are owed. (And I use the word "they" lightly, because if most posters here knew my specifics, they'd probably put me in that category . . .)[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=OCCH;4249747]But if we're counting on a "moral compass", why the regulation that private corporations provide for public needs? Shouldn't the people who say "make it so" be obligated to make sure it comes to pass?

I hope you know I meant no ill will toward your son -- I was just going with your example. But where would it stop? [B] His foot certainly wasn't a life-or-death issue, so we've already moved from the "catastrophic" scenario. How do we define "bettering someone's life"? [/B] Do we offer free liposuction to help the obesity epidemic? Do we argue the surgery could lessen the cost of obesity issues down the road?

If we could find a realistic way to provide everyone health care, I'd be all for it. I just don't think the answer is forcing the "haves" to care for the "have nots". (That's a VERY general statement, and I'm sure there are specific situations where I would argue against my own logic. However, as a general rule I simply cannot agree with the idea that people are "entitled" to a way of life that is already so much greater than most of the world . . .)[/QUOTE]

Wow, just wow.

Jetworks had insurance at the time. He paid for the f-n insurance.

Basically, you're saying "If you did not have extra $500 your son would still be limping in the best country in the world".

Aha ha, No wonder you're poor, dick.

[intelligentjetsfan]

[QUOTE=southparkcpa;4250252]Lets get the average salary of a private school teacher and make that the salary of all public school teachers. Then the difference can be applied to healthcare. Cut their pensions to match those of private school teachers as well. Sound good?;)[/QUOTE]

lol!

an apples to orange comparison. Private and public school teaching is analogous to a police officer and a mall cop.

But your thought process is not dissimilar to what many people (who simply do not realize/understand what goes on in most public schools in 2011) think public school teaching entails. Its not this;

[url]

[southparkcpa]

[QUOTE=intelligentjetsfan;4250502]lol!

an apples to orange comparison. Private and public school teaching is analogous to a police officer and a mall cop.

But your thought process is not dissimilar to what many people (who simply do not realize/understand what goes on in most public schools in 2011) think public school teaching entails. Its not this;



[/QUOTE]

I was busting your balls...... thats why the smiley face.


But if you were totally correct, there would be openings at the public school level. I think we bioth know to get that job requires a bit of "inside the beltline" and there is a HUGE number of qualified apps that LEAVE NY and NJ because they cant get the job yet went to terrific schools. Charlotte is full of young kids from NY and NJ that couldn't get a public school job.

But lets not let real economics get in the way of public union abuse of the taxpayer.

[intelligentjetsfan]

[QUOTE=southparkcpa;4250525]I was busting your balls...... thats why the smiley face.


But if you were totally correct, there would be openings at the public school level. I think we bioth know to get that job requires a bit of "inside the beltline" and there is a HUGE number of qualified apps that LEAVE NY and NJ because they cant get the job yet went to terrific schools. Charlotte is full of young kids from NY and NJ that couldn't get a public school job.

But lets not let real economics get in the way of public union abuse of the taxpayer.[/QUOTE]

I know you were kidding as was I with the breakfast club and Welcome Back Kotter references.

Of course there is nepotism in public schools as there is nepotism in almost every profession in America. One of the main reasons why people cannot get a job as a teacher now is because the economy is bad and cut backs have curtailed new hiring as well as letting long time teachers go.

[Warfish]

[QUOTE=intelligentjetsfan;4250502]lol!

an apples to orange comparison. Private and public school teaching is analogous to a police officer and a mall cop.[/QUOTE]

Says alot about the abject failure of the Public School System and those who manage it.

Hint: If you'd like us to think Govt. Schools are a good solution to education, try not to remind us how much they suck whenever they're brought up.

Hey, at least you get to make a boatload of money being a kiddie cop.

[TerminatorJet]

[QUOTE=palmetto defender;4249984]Actually you do not have to buy insurance for a car you own. Not anywhere in the U.S. What is required in most states is LIABILITY insurance.[/QUOTE]

Uhhh... That is still insurance. And that is still insurance the gov't requires you to buy.

[img]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_653_4FsTEfc/TAj-seVQQeI/AAAAAAAAA_M/v_8JmXwL61E/s400/HolyFacepalm.jpg[/img]

[JetPotato]

[QUOTE=Warfish;4250589]Says alot about the abject failure of the Public School System and those who manage it.

Hint: If you'd like us to think Govt. Schools are a good solution to education, try not to remind us how much they suck whenever they're brought up.

Hey, at least you get to make a boatload of money being a kiddie cop.[/QUOTE]

Fish, we're usually in agreement on public school issues, but it is a little silly to not recognize the difference in the nature of the teaching jobs here.

On one hand you have students whose parents all care enough about their kids' education that they pay extra out of pocket to buy the best classes available.

On the other, you have a mix of students that include those whose parents view school only as free day care.

A lot easier to teach kids who want to learn (enforced by their parents).

[southparkcpa]

[QUOTE=intelligentjetsfan;4250528]I know you were kidding as was I with the breakfast club and Welcome Back Kotter references.

Of course there is nepotism in public schools as there is nepotism in almost every profession in America. One of the main reasons why people cannot get a job as a teacher now is because the economy is bad and cut backs have curtailed new hiring as well as letting long time teachers go.[/QUOTE]

Interestingly, I got a job teaching at a 4 year public university here in Charlotte in 1995. I knew absolutely NO ONE. It was so refreshing to see that it didn't matter where my dad worked or my uncle helping me etc...

I taught accounting fulltime for 4 years then went back to public practice. I am still, in my mind , very indebted to the university for believing in me. I donate more to that university than my own alma mater. I hire an intern EVERY YEAR form that University. I could have stayed ther ebut the job only paid about 50K. Without a Phd, teaching at a FULLY accredited National University is at their discretion.


When I see my childrens teachers, most from NY, PA and NJ, who left NY because they didn't know anyone, it is a SHAM and a SHAME and the results of our educational tests portary the REAL results.

[JetPotato]

[QUOTE=TerminatorJet;4250724]Uhhh... That is still insurance. And that is still insurance the gov't requires you to buy.

[img]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_653_4FsTEfc/TAj-seVQQeI/AAAAAAAAA_M/v_8JmXwL61E/s400/HolyFacepalm.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]

You can't facepalm anyone if you think that states requiring auto insurance when you voluntarily enter commerce is even remotely close to the federal government requiring all to purchase health insurance.

It's simply a stupid comparison used by stupid people.

[cr726]

It's always entertaining when hearing someone telling me or a friend why they think they didn't get a job. People move to where theo jobs are NC had a population boom. Pretty simple.



[QUOTE=southparkcpa;4250858]Interestingly, I got a job teaching at a 4 year public university here in Charlotte in 1995. I knew absolutely NO ONE. It was so refreshing to see that it didn't matter where my dad worked or my uncle helping me etc...

I taught accounting fulltime for 4 years then went back to public practice. I am still, in my mind , very indebted to the university for believing in me. I donate more to that university than my own alma mater. I hire an intern EVERY YEAR form that University. I could have stayed ther ebut the job only paid about 50K. Without a Phd, teaching at a FULLY accredited National University is at their discretion.


When I see my childrens teachers, most from NY, PA and NJ, who left NY because they didn't know anyone, it is a SHAM and a SHAME and the results of our educational tests portary the REAL results.[/QUOTE]

[TerminatorJet]

[QUOTE=JetPotato;4250888]You can't facepalm anyone if you think that states requiring auto insurance when you voluntarily enter commerce is even remotely close to the federal government requiring all to purchase health insurance.

It's simply a stupid comparison used by stupid people.[/QUOTE]

No. It's a completely valid comparison. Call it stupid all you want just because you're a conservative and it doesn't correspond to your world view that we had this great healthcare system where 40 million Americans were uninsured and the rest of us had to pay through the nose for the bare minimum healthcare.

It's so easy to avoid the state's requirement to buy car insurance. All you have to do is not own a car and never drive :rolleyes:

[southparkcpa]

[QUOTE=TerminatorJet;4250908]No. It's a completely valid comparison. Call it stupid all you want just because you're a conservative and it doesn't correspond to your world view that we had this great healthcare system where 40 million Americans were uninsured and the rest of us had to pay through the nose for the bare minimum healthcare.

It's so easy to avoid the state's requirement to buy car insurance. All you have to do is not own a car and never drive :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

OK fine...but is your solution to MAKE employers provide insurance? What happens if you are laid off? What happens to part timers?

A small deli in NY has to provide health insurance?

Make it unlawful for an employer to provide it.......

[bitonti]

[QUOTE=JetPotato;4250888]You can't facepalm anyone if you think that states requiring auto insurance when you voluntarily enter commerce is even remotely close to the federal government requiring all to purchase health insurance.

It's simply a stupid comparison used by stupid people.[/QUOTE]

yes we are dumb you are smart

let's see what the Supreme Court says. Those 9 dumbasses.

[JetPotato]

[QUOTE=bitonti;4251028]yes we are dumb you are smart

let's see what the Supreme Court says. Those 9 dumbasses.[/QUOTE]

The Supreme Court isn't ruling on the comparison. They wouldn't waste their time. And no lawyer defending the federal mandate would even try to make the comparison because they know it would only make them look foolish. They understand that the only similarity between the two scenarios is the word "insurance ".

One is a state law. One is federal. If you can't understand the collosal difference between those two things, there really is no point in even going further into the other differences. And really, it makes you unfit to ever discuss politics at all.

[JetPotato]

[QUOTE=TerminatorJet;4250908]No. It's a completely valid comparison. Call it stupid all you want just because you're a conservative and it doesn't correspond to your world view that we had this great healthcare system where 40 million Americans were uninsured and the rest of us had to pay through the nose for the bare minimum healthcare.

It's so easy to avoid the state's requirement to buy car insurance. All you have to do is not own a car and never drive :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

This was loltastic.

[OCCH]

[QUOTE=exit9JetsFan;4250481]Wow, just wow.

Jetworks had insurance at the time. He paid for the f-n insurance.

Basically, you're saying "If you did not have extra $500 your son would still be limping in the best country in the world".

Aha ha, No wonder you're poor, dick.[/QUOTE]

LOL

The guy already said he realized I meant nothing personal, so it's really cute that you're picking up the cross for him . . .:rolleyes:

And yes, that's basically what I'm saying -- please explain to me why ANYONE is "owed" anything in this country.

I look forward to your response . . .

[MnJetFan]

[QUOTE=bitonti;4251028]yes we are dumb you are smart

let's see what the Supreme Court says. Those 9 dumbasses.[/QUOTE]

Well there is one with a brain. I know that for sure!

[exit9JetsFan]

[QUOTE=OCCH;4251150]LOL

The guy already said he realized I meant nothing personal, so it's really cute that you're picking up the cross for him . . .:rolleyes:

And yes, that's basically what I'm saying -- please explain to me why ANYONE is "owed" anything in this country.

I look forward to your response . . .[/QUOTE]

Limping, f-n limping as a kid. Just because some one does not have $500 dollars, in the best, greatest country in the world.

That's not "catastrophic" scenario?

Sometimes it's best to shut ta **** up, dude.

[doggin94it]

[QUOTE=JetPotato;4251096]The Supreme Court isn't ruling on the comparison. They wouldn't waste their time. And no lawyer defending the federal mandate would even try to make the comparison because they know it would only make them look foolish. They understand that the only similarity between the two scenarios is the word "insurance ".

One is a state law. One is federal. If you can't understand the collosal difference between those two things, there really is no point in even going further into the other differences. And really, it makes you unfit to ever discuss politics at all.[/QUOTE]


Bit knows that - its the reason why he didn't respond to my post