So the Pats get another A in the draft - Page 27

ASG0531 · 10-03-2012, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revis

Every Pats young player who shows anything is ridiculously hyped up. I remember Chung being called up and down a young Rodney Harrison in year 2.

Yes, fortunately the Jets' coaching staff and its fans take a much more conservative and level-headed approach to evaluating the prospects of its young players.

scottyM · 10-03-2012, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revis

Every Pats young player who shows anything is ridiculously hyped up. I remember Chung being called up and down a young Rodney Harrison in year 2.

And Davis has been called the next Ray Lewis. Hill the next Calvin Johnson. Coples the next Peppers. Heck, there are threads on this board where Ricky freaking Sapp is the next pass rushing terror in the NFL because he has prototypical size. Talk about over hype.

Rob0729 · 10-03-2012, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revis

Every Pats young player who shows anything is ridiculously hyped up. I remember Chung being called up and down a young Rodney Harrison in year 2.

No one ever hyped Chung like that other than maybe a handful of Pats' fans. He was always somewhat of a liability in coverage (sometimes a huge liability) and good against the run. He was never even close to Harrison 2.0.

Anyone who watches Jones though know this guy is showing so far that he is the real deal. He has gotten a sack in every game this season (the one in Baltimore was called back for a BS holding call). He is consistently drawing double teams and winning one on one match ups against good LTs (only Michael Oher has had any success with him and they let a lot of offensive holding go in that game for both teams). If Jones was a Patriot, Jet, or Brown; he would be getting the hype he is getting.

adpz · 10-03-2012, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottyM

And Davis has been called the next Ray Lewis. Hill the next Calvin Johnson. Coples the next Peppers. Heck, there are threads on this board where Ricky freaking Sapp is the next pass rushing terror in the NFL because he has prototypical size. Talk about over hype- at least the Patriots win.

Well - now this is hyperbole about hyperbole. Sorry, no one called any of these guys those guys.

Rob0729 · 10-03-2012, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adpz

And I will remind myself to be impressed when he actually gets those stats. He looked pretty ordinary against the Ravens.

You are judging his season thus far on one game? A game where the refs let Oher hold him on every play (not complaining since they let the Pats' offense get away with the same amount of offensive holding). He did get a sack in that game too which was negated on a BS call on a player who had zero effect on the play.

Rob0729 · 10-03-2012, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adpz

Well - now this is hyperbole about hyperbole. Sorry, no one called any of these guys those guys.

People on this board compared Hill to Calvin Johnson and Coples to JPP consistently this offseason. In fact, you might find people in this thread making those comparisons.

But then again, no one other than a small handful of Pats fans ever compared Chung to Harrison.

First DOWN! · 10-03-2012, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray Ray19

The Jets can be a 12-4 team, they can be that good. They have the potential.

Locking in the Pats at 14 wins is pure comedy and homerism, especially right now, with so much up in the air with the team on offense at WR, with Welker's inevitable holdout, Mankins injury, Brady aging, BGJE's loss, and a defense that was at the bottom of the league last year.

They had a good run last year

Teams will be better prepared this year against the Patriots two TE's.

Give me some stock tips bud.

adpz · 10-03-2012, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob0729

You are judging his season thus far on one game? A game where the refs let Oher hold him on every play (not complaining since they let the Pats' offense get away with the same amount of offensive holding). He did get a sack in that game too which was negated on a BS call on a player who had zero effect on the play.

No - I am just saying that I am not one of those guys who thinks Jones is Lawrence Taylor and Coples is Vernon Ghost.

I think Chandler Jones is a good player. But he did not do much in that Ravens game and he had PLENTY of opportunities to be stout against Ray Rice; I didn't see much of that at all. So - I've seen some good plays from him and some so-so. I'll wait til the end of the season to judge any of these guys.

adpz · 10-03-2012, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob0729

People on this board compared Hill to Calvin Johnson and Coples to JPP consistently this offseason. In fact, you might find people in this thread making those comparisons.

Mmm, I've seen posts about people complaining about hype - but I don't recall anyone actually making any of those comparisons whatsoever - and I've been on these boards a lot from the draft going right through to today.

Rob0729 · 10-03-2012, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adpz

No - I am just saying that I am not one of those guys who thinks Jones is Lawrence Taylor and Coples is Vernon Ghost.

I think Chandler Jones is a good player. But he did not do much in that Ravens game and he had PLENTY of opportunities to be stout against Ray Rice; I didn't much of that at all. So - I've seen some good plays from him and some so-so. I'll wait til the end of the season to judge any of these guys.

Never said he was LT. He is as of right now the best defensive player to come out of the 2012 draft. That can obviously change over time especially since we only have four games to judge. You can't name one rookie defender who has been good every game on most plays. Rookies are inconsistent. Even JJ Watts and Aldon Smith last year had good games and bad games.

Jones had a far better game than you give him credit for against the Ravens. It was his worst game, but he did better than you say.

Here is an impartial write up by Matt Williamson at ESPN (yeah, not the best source):

Quote:

Comparing anyone to the Giants' Jason Pierre-Paul just isn't fair. And Patriots DE Chandler Jones is not quite in that class in terms of physical gifts -- few are.

But Jones is close because of his incredibly long frame and arms, smooth movement skills and the natural strength to anchor or bull rush against bigger men. He has been extremely impressive thus far as a pass-rusher and against the run -- and he has yet to develop a wide array of pass-rush moves.

Also, Jones has to have endeared himself to Patriots coach Bill Belichick because of his versatility. He is best as a traditional 4-3 defensive end, but Jones also can stand up and bump outside in a wider technique or hunker down inside in more of a 3-4 defensive end role.

A big problem for Jones, and for New England, is that Jones is really the team's only threatening pass-rusher. Opposing teams now know he is the one to stop when they decide to pass, which is going to be a lot for any rookie to overcome. The Bills, namely fellow rookie Cordy Glenn, did a nice job against Jones in Week 4. But that is also a bit misleading, as Buffalo surrenders few sacks because its offense dictates getting the ball out very quickly.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/story...triots-defense

And as for Coples, I don't think he has been all that impressive thus far, but I saw in the preseason (which has translated to the regular season) a raw player who struggled against the run and was more of disrupter than a polished pass rusher (he burst through the line, but had poor awareness of the QB). He is raw. So he could become dominant over time, but he needs to develop his game. I think it is way too soon to call him a bust, but I knew he wouldn't come out of the gate like gangbusters.

ASG0531 · 10-03-2012, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adpz

Mmm, I've seen posts about people complaining about hype - but I don't recall anyone actually making any of those comparisons whatsoever - and I've been on these boards a lot from the draft going right through to today.

Hill has absolutely been talked about around here as a potential Megatron/Moss because of his measurables. Coples was the DROY before he ever stepped on the field.

CleatMarks · 10-03-2012, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adpz

Well - now this is hyperbole about hyperbole. Sorry, no one called any of these guys those guys.

Wanna bet?

I found this in 3 seconds

Quote:

During the draft process, he was outstanding and dominated the Senior Bowl practices. He was dam right unblockable and looked 2 steps ahead of everyone on the field. His combine showed what everyone expected. A physical specimen in the likes of Julius Peppers.

http://www.jetsinsider.com/forums/sh...48&postcount=1

adpz · 10-03-2012, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASG0531

Hill has absolutely been talked about around here as a potential Megatron/Moss because of his measurables. Coples was the DROY before he ever stepped on the field.

Honestly it's too small a topic to bother searching through posts to find, but I honestly didn't see ANYONE actually makes those comparisons.

If anyone wants to fess up to having done so, be my guest.

I agree with the other post - yes, Jones has been at the top of the class so far in defensive rookies.

patman · 10-03-2012, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revis

McCourty didn't shut Fitz down, Ken Whisenhunt did. As soon as Arizona got the lead they went into ultra-conservative preserve mode

The game was 13-9 in the 4th quarter, what are you talking about?

ASG0531 · 10-03-2012, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patman

The game was 13-9 in the 4th quarter, what are you talking about?

Clearly conservative mode against the Pats at home in the 4th quarter up by less than a touchdown is an optimal strategy. It's not like they are capable of putting points on the board.

ASG0531 · 10-03-2012, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adpz

Honestly it's too small a topic to bother searching through posts to find, but I honestly didn't see ANYONE actually makes those comparisons.

If anyone wants to fess up to having done so, be my guest.

I agree with the other post - yes, Jones has been at the top of the class so far in defensive rookies.

Don't worry about it, it's not worth looking up, but trust me, those posts existed. It was a long summer.

scottyM · 10-03-2012, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASG0531

Don't worry about it, it's not worth looking up, but trust me, those posts existed. It was a long summer.

It is worth noting that most of these were authored by a certain poster that shall not be mentioned by name... here in 2012.

#1Patriot · 10-03-2012, 06:23 PM

I don't know about A+ grades or C- grades on any draft. Those are subjective.

What I do know is that the only Patriots players on the team left form the 2004 SB team are Brady and Vince. Yet, they win 10+ games a season while getting younger and faster.

That is not subjective- it's a fact. Many of those younger and faster players are drafted, so that speaks for itself without a letter grade.

PatriotReign · 10-03-2012, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sg3

not "virtually" KIDD, totally meaningless

All you had to do is watch the third day of the draft and see that Patriot asskissing shill Lombardi awarding them their AAAAA+++++ GRADE two hours before the frigging draft was even completed

10-03-2012, 06:23 PM	#538
#1Patriot not feeling the love here Rookie Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 916	I don't know about A+ grades or C- grades on any draft. Those are subjective. What I do know is that the only Patriots players on the team left form the 2004 SB team are Brady and Vince. Yet, they win 10+ games a season while getting younger and faster. That is not subjective- it's a fact. Many of those younger and faster players are drafted, so that speaks for itself without a letter grade. Last edited by #1Patriot; 10-03-2012 at 06:25 PM.