Maybe Saints are Innocent!!!!

[Charlie Brown]

If what is being reported in the article below is even remotely true then NFL Commissioner GoodFraud should be dismissed IMMEDIATELY!!!!

Read and see what you think!!!!

[url]http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/2012/05/anthony_hargroves_declaration.html[/url]

[B]Anthony Hargrove's declaration looks bad for the New Orleans Saints and the NFL 05/07/12 5:44PM[/B]

Mike Triplett, The Times-Picayune

The release of Anthony Hargrove's declaration to the NFL on Tuesday looked bad for the New Orleans Saints. And it looked bad for the league.

Michael DeMocker/The Times-PicayuneFormer New Orleans Saints defensive lineman Anthony Hargrove issued a statement that could be bad for Saints and NFL.

First, the bad news for the Saints: Hargrove's detailed account of how he was instructed by coaches Gregg Williams and Joe Vitt to "play dumb" and deny the existence of bounties and a bounty program depicts the Saints as a team that knew it was breaking the rules and was willing to lie to cover it up.

NOTE: Vitt later denied Hargrove's allegations.

Hargrove's testimony hurt the Saints. Although it may strengthen the claim that players were just following orders, it doesn't help the organization or the coaching staff as a whole.

[B]However, here's the bad news for the NFL: The league was also twisting the truth about what Hargrove said.[/B]

According to the NFL's statement when it announced player punishments last Wednesday, Hargrove's declaration, "established not only the existence of the program at the Saints, but also that he knew about and participated in it."

[B]At no time in Hargrove's declaration did he specifically admit to those things.[/B]That may be semantics. Hargrove implied that he knew what the coaches were talking about when they told him to deny the existence of a bounty program. Still, the NFL's statement misrepresented what Hargrove actually said.

[B]And according to a source close to Williams, the NFL has also misrepresented what Williams said in interviews with the league. According to the source, Williams never admitted a "bounty program" was in place and that the league "rephrased his statements to satisfy its needs." The source also said Williams never identified any players for their involvement in a pay-for-performance or bounty program.[/B]

That doesn't mean the NFL's case is fabricated, or that the Saints are innocent. But so far, the details of both Hargrove's and Williams' testimonies have stood out as the NFL's most compelling evidence that has been shared with the public. And when bits and pieces of the league's evidence can be picked apart, it creates a greater atmosphere of skepticism when it comes to simply accepting the NFL's word that it has indisputable and overwhelming evidence of the Saints' guilt.

[B]In recent days, the demand for the league to share its evidence has grown from accused players, their attorneys, the NFL Players Assocation and more and more media outlets, not to mention Saints supporters.[/B]
The NFL is not required to share such evidence, either publicly or with the accused players. And it is perfectly understandable that the NFL would want to protect its sources. Much of the league's evidence is testimony from eyewitness accounts, and the league does not want to out its sources the way Hargrove was outed on Monday when the details of his statement were obtained by Yahoo! Sports.

However, since the NFL has punished the Saints so aggressively and so publicly, the league should leave no room for doubt and skepticism.

_________________________________________________________________

If the NFL has lied and mislead the public about this scandal then top head should roll it would be a farce and a disgrace to let them continue.....

GOOD GRIEF!!!!!:eek:

[PatsFanTX]

Charlie, I don't know if you just got done banging Pepermint Patty or what, but how did you create the thread title based on that article?

[NPTJET53]

[QUOTE=PatsFanTX;4462814]Charlie, I don't know if you just got done banging Pepermint Patty or what, but how did you create the thread title based on that article?[/QUOTE]

Saints *Players* ?

[Savage69]

[QUOTE=PatsFanTX;4462814]Charlie, I don't know if you just got done banging Pepermint Patty or what, but how did you create the thread title based on that article?[/QUOTE]

He prefers Juicy Lucy.. ;)

[greenwichjetfan]

[QUOTE=PatsFanTX;4462814]Charlie, I don't know if you just got done banging Pepermint Patty or what, but how did you create the thread title based on that article?[/QUOTE]

He's saying that if Goodell hadn't destroyed the evidence, the Pats would have been innocent.

Goodell hates the Pats.

[lageman4ever]

They've got Gregg Williams on audio tape encouraging players to injure opponents. You've got statements from previous Saints sworn in a courtroom saying Williams had the bounty program. Former Redskins also stated that Williams had a bounty program there when he was the DC.

I think the charges against the Saints are pretty well established.

[JetPotato]

[QUOTE=NPTJET53;4462820]Saints *Players* ?[/QUOTE]

Who ordered the Code Red?

[Ray Ray19]

[QUOTE=Charlie Brown;4462803]If what is being reported in the article below is even remotely true then NFL Commissioner GoodFraud should be dismissed IMMEDIATELY!!!!

Read and see what you think!!!!

[URL]http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/2012/05/anthony_hargroves_declaration.html[/URL]

[B]Anthony Hargrove's declaration looks bad for the New Orleans Saints and the NFL 05/07/12 5:44PM[/B]

Mike Triplett, The Times-Picayune

The release of Anthony Hargrove's declaration to the NFL on Tuesday looked bad for the New Orleans Saints. And it looked bad for the league.

Michael DeMocker/The Times-PicayuneFormer New Orleans Saints defensive lineman Anthony Hargrove issued a statement that could be bad for Saints and NFL.

First, the bad news for the Saints: Hargrove's detailed account of how he was instructed by coaches Gregg Williams and Joe Vitt to "play dumb" and deny the existence of bounties and a bounty program depicts the Saints as a team that knew it was breaking the rules and was willing to lie to cover it up.

NOTE: Vitt later denied Hargrove's allegations.

Hargrove's testimony hurt the Saints. Although it may strengthen the claim that players were just following orders, it doesn't help the organization or the coaching staff as a whole.

[B]However, here's the bad news for the NFL: The league was also twisting the truth about what Hargrove said.[/B]

According to the NFL's statement when it announced player punishments last Wednesday, Hargrove's declaration, "established not only the existence of the program at the Saints, but also that he knew about and participated in it."

[B]At no time in Hargrove's declaration did he specifically admit to those things.[/B]That may be semantics. Hargrove implied that he knew what the coaches were talking about when they told him to deny the existence of a bounty program. Still, the NFL's statement misrepresented what Hargrove actually said.

[B]And according to a source close to Williams, the NFL has also misrepresented what Williams said in interviews with the league. According to the source, Williams never admitted a "bounty program" was in place and that the league "rephrased his statements to satisfy its needs." The source also said Williams never identified any players for their involvement in a pay-for-performance or bounty program.[/B]

That doesn't mean the NFL's case is fabricated, or that the Saints are innocent. But so far, the details of both Hargrove's and Williams' testimonies have stood out as the NFL's most compelling evidence that has been shared with the public. And when bits and pieces of the league's evidence can be picked apart, it creates a greater atmosphere of skepticism when it comes to simply accepting the NFL's word that it has indisputable and overwhelming evidence of the Saints' guilt.

[B]In recent days, the demand for the league to share its evidence has grown from accused players, their attorneys, the NFL Players Assocation and more and more media outlets, not to mention Saints supporters.[/B]
The NFL is not required to share such evidence, either publicly or with the accused players. And it is perfectly understandable that the NFL would want to protect its sources. Much of the league's evidence is testimony from eyewitness accounts, and the league does not want to out its sources the way Hargrove was outed on Monday when the details of his statement were obtained by Yahoo! Sports.

However, since the NFL has punished the Saints so aggressively and so publicly, the league should leave no room for doubt and skepticism.

_________________________________________________________________

If the NFL has lied and mislead the public about this scandal then top head should roll it would be a farce and a disgrace to let them continue.....

GOOD GRIEF!!!!!:eek:[/QUOTE]

No wonder Goodell deleted the evidence the first time this happened with the Patriots. Why didn't the league excercise the same tactic this time around?

This latest update only proves there was much more going on in Pastrycheatville than we all realize. :eek:

[doggin94it]

This is absurd. Anyone who heard the Gregg Williams speech knows everything they need to know. And the fact that Hargrove was "told to deny it" is even more damning.

And from that you took "Maybe the Saints are Innocent!!!!"?

To quote an icon: Good Grief!

[bullitt929]

What a surprise that Spygate found its way into this thread.

Good grief!

[SMC]

[QUOTE=doggin94it;4462846]This is absurd. Anyone who heard the Gregg Williams speech knows everything they need to know. And the fact that Hargrove was "told to deny it" is even more damning.

And from that you took "Maybe the Saints are Innocent!!!!"?

To quote an icon: Good Grief![/QUOTE]

This.

[bullitt929]

I don't see much misrepresentation from the NFL here. Nor should there be any doubt that the bounty system was in place.

But I guess there are those who believe that Jerry Sandusky was teaching personal hygiene in the shower.

[jetsfan1983]

K... The thread title and OP are extremely misleading... To be honest, I have no idea how any human being good come to that conclusion after reading the article.

[Bonhomme Richard]

[QUOTE=jetsfan1983;4462909]K... The thread title and OP are extremely misleading... To be honest, I have no idea how any human being good come to that conclusion after reading the article.[/QUOTE]

And the over-use of exclamation marks is, frankly, unecessary.

[Warfish]

[QUOTE]That may be semantics.[/QUOTE]

Yes, yes it is.

[doggin94it]

[QUOTE=Bonhomme Richard;4462977]And the over-use of exclamation marks is, frankly, unecessary.[/QUOTE]

"Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind."
- Terry Pratchett

[McGinley]

So, who is this source? Why is he/she unnamed?

[Limolady]

[QUOTE=JetPotato;4462832]Who ordered the Code Red?[/QUOTE]

Your Gawddamn right I did!

(-:

I can see where Charlie Brown is going with this in terms of gang mentality and clubhouse norm. Somewhere along the line this became the Saints "way of doing things" if you wanted to play along and "don't ask, don't tell" if you didn't want to play along.

Either way sucks for the families of the players & coaches involved and put another *team on the cheat sheet.

[THE_SOOTHSAYER]

[QUOTE=JetPotato;4462832]Who ordered the Code Red?[/QUOTE]

[B]Sean Payton to the Commissioner: [/B]

Commish, we live in a league that has walls, and those walls have to be rushed by men in pads. Who's gonna do it? You, Mr Aiello? You, Commsiosner Goodell?

I have a greater responsibility than you could possibly fathom. You weep for the torn Achilles' and ACL's, and you curse the Saints. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. That these injuries, while tragic, increased ratings. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, increases ratings and sells tickets.

You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me ordering bounties, you need ordering bounties. We use words like injure, maim and take out. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very ratings and ticket sales that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you suit up and hit someone.

Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to. :yes:

[32green]

[QUOTE=THE_SOOTHSAYER;4463486][B]Sean Payton to the Commissioner: [/B]

Commish, we live in a league that has walls, and those walls have to be rushed by men in pads. Who's gonna do it? You, Mr Aiello? You, Commsiosner Goodell?

I have a greater responsibility than you could possibly fathom. You weep for the torn Achilles' and ACL's, and you curse the Saints. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. That these injuries, while tragic, increased ratings. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, increases ratings and sells tickets.

You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me ordering bounties, you need ordering bounties. We use words like injure, maim and take out. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very ratings and ticket sales that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you suit up and hit someone.

Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to. :yes:[/QUOTE]

Lmao

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