A Little Perspective on the Current FO

[Jet Nut]

[QUOTE=DDNYjets;4479514]'98 > '09,'10.

Hell, I think the 2008 roster was better than the 2009 and 2010 ones.[/QUOTE]

The offense was better, the defense wasn't anywhere close to what Rex built.

[Toooon]

[QUOTE=Warfish;4479488]What Parcells did his first two years, two, was admirable and vital to the franchise. No question about it.

With that said, it was one average year, and one truly great (for us) year.

It was followed by a horrible year that was equally Parcells mismanagement as it was Vinny's fluke injury. Parcells drafted poorly. Parcells handed a Hall of Fame Head Coach to one of our most bitter rivals by his personal mismanagement. And he left the franchise almost in as bad a shape with Groh, massive too-old-veterans contracts and a lack of talent as it was when he got there. Parcells mistakes at least equal his successes in New York Green and White.

Frankly, Parcells last season, and Groh's only year, were not much better than much of the late 80's early 90's period before Parcells, average to below average. But because Parcells followed the worst Coach in franchise history, he get more points than his on-field results and off-field bungling and disloyalty warrant.

Rex, thus far, has had unquestionably more on-field success, more playoff years, more AFCCG's, drafting success, with vastly better picks than under Parcells, and overall success than Parcells had. He also stuck around (Parcells would have quit after last season and leaft the Jets in a lurch) when things got difficult. Adn he didn't give the Dolphins the next Multi-Super Bowl Winning Coach by being totally inept as a front office person.[/QUOTE]



I agree with most of your points about Parcells. His inability to find a legit backup QB, and waiting too long to play Lucas, cost us '99. I fault him 90% for Bellichick leaving (the other 10% is BB simply realizing Woody was not going to be a good owner). Handing the reins to Terry Bradway was a disaster. Parcells did a lot of bad as well as good.

That said, he was not inept as a front office guy. His 2000 draft largely laid the foundation for the franchise to contend for years to come. Pennington, Abe and Ellis were huge parts of the success of 2001-2006.

[Jet Nut]

[QUOTE=Toooon;4479624]I agree with most of your points about Parcells. His inability to find a legit backup QB, and waiting too long to play Lucas, cost us '99. I fault him 90% for Bellichick leaving ([B]the other 10% is BB simply realizing Woody was not going to be a good owner[/B]). Handing the reins to Terry Bradway was a disaster. Parcells did a lot of bad as well as good.

That said, he was not inept as a front office guy. His 2000 draft largely laid the foundation for the franchise to contend for years to come. Pennington, Abe and Ellis were huge parts of the success of 2001-2006.[/QUOTE]

Sure. It was more money, more power in NE over what he would get here that was the deal breaker.

Parcells over his shoulder contributed to the equation. That he knew anything about Woody is ridiculous. That anyone thinks he's a problem as an owner is even more ridiculous. :rolleyes:

[Toooon]

[QUOTE=Jet Nut;4479528]
Parcells, amazingly enough, can't match up with Rex. BPs one great season happened in both of Rex 1st two seasons, with a rookie QB.[/QUOTE]


Come on, you can't compare 2009 and 2010 to 1998. Sure, the end result was the same, but we won the division in '98 with a 12-4 record. We had a bye and a home playoff game. We dominated down the stretch of that season. In '09 we miss the playoffs entirely if Cincy and Indy hadn't already clinched when we played them. In '10 we were barely scraping by against a weak schedule and were all but dead until we found a way (huge credit to Rex) to save the season in Pittsburgh. Those teams overachieved big time.

[jpoppy7]

[QUOTE=Toooon;4479624]I agree with most of your points about Parcells. [B]His inability to find a legit backup QB, and waiting too long to play Lucas, cost us '99[/B]. I fault him 90% for Bellichick leaving (the other 10% is BB simply realizing Woody was not going to be a good owner). Handing the reins to Terry Bradway was a disaster. Parcells did a lot of bad as well as good.

That said, he was not inept as a front office guy. His 2000 draft largely laid the foundation for the franchise to contend for years to come. Pennington, Abe and Ellis were huge parts of the success of 2001-2006.[/QUOTE]

That definitely made '99 suck more than it had to, but let's face it, Vinny's injury cost us '99 no matter who the backup was. We went from Super Bowl contender to just another team, no backup would've kept us a Super Bowl contender (except Kurt Warner I guess).

[Jet Nut]

[QUOTE=Toooon;4479635]Come on, you can't compare 2009 and 2010 to 1998. Sure, the end result was the same, but we won the division in '98 with a 12-4 record. We had a bye and a home playoff game. We dominated down the stretch of that season. In '09 we miss the playoffs entirely if Cincy and Indy hadn't already clinched when we played them. In '10 we were barely scraping by against a weak schedule and were all but dead until we found a way (huge credit to Rex) to save the season in Pittsburgh. Those teams overachieved big time.[/QUOTE]

What was so much better in 98? A division title is great, for sure. But it's one more win than Rex managed in year two. And with a buy he didn't get the Jets one game deeper in the playoffs. You have to credit Rex with his 2 road wins in each season, it's much more impressive than 1 home win in 3 seasons.

The rest of Parcells resume here was a year of disappointment where he sh1t the bed coaching the Jets into a loss and out of the playoffs in 97 @ Detroit. As bad a coaching job as the jets have seen and that's saying a lot. And then unfortunately like Rex had identical 8-8 seasons in year three.

The Indy argument I get. The Cincy one is a Francessa pipe dream. They rested one player of worth to start the game who was hurting? Then after they fell behind 27-0 they sat their team. Not like they were ever going to win that game, no matter who played in that 2nd half. And to drive it home, the Jets beat them up a week later.

Why do Jet fans take great pride in sh1tting on their team? Why would you downplay their accomplishments?

[Toooon]

[QUOTE=Jet Nut;4479649]
Why do Jet fans take great pride in sh1tting on their team? Why would you downplay their accomplishments?[/QUOTE]

Say what? I was simply making a point in the Rex-Parcells debate. I'm not downplaying what they accomplished, but it is fair to look at what happened realistically. If you want to improve, you have to be honest with yourself about your weaknesses, and despite the end results those two teams had a lot of weaknesses. Had the front office been as objective, we might be in better shape right now.

[Toooon]

[QUOTE=jpoppy7;4479647]That definitely made '99 suck more than it had to, but let's face it, Vinny's injury cost us '99 no matter who the backup was. We went from Super Bowl contender to just another team, no backup would've kept us a Super Bowl contender (except Kurt Warner I guess).[/QUOTE]


Sure, I agree with that. But I do think we would have made the playoffs if we went to Lucas earlier. Remember, that team started 2-6 and finished 8-8.

[Jet Nut]

[QUOTE=Toooon;4479676]Say what? I was simply making a point in the Rex-Parcells debate. I'm not downplaying what they accomplished, but it is fair to look at what happened realistically. If you want to improve, you have to be honest with yourself about your weaknesses, and despite the end results those two teams had a lot of weaknesses. Had the front office been as objective, we might be in better shape right now.[/QUOTE]

No, the line about the Cincy game, if they were playing for something we miss the playoffs?

Based on what? Tell me thats not a SOJF comment. We beat their brains in, forcing them to sit starters in the 2n half. And with that we beat their brains in a week later in the playoffs.

Weren't they playing for something in the playoffs?

Who's being honest?

[Jet Nut]

[QUOTE=Toooon;4479678]Sure, I agree with that. But I do think we would have made the playoffs if we went to Lucas earlier. Remember, that team started 2-6 and finished 8-8.[/QUOTE]

We all thought it.

Unfortunately Parcells wouldn't pull the plug on Mirer until it was too late.

Thats a big mark on his NY Jets resume.

[Toooon]

[QUOTE=Jet Nut;4479683]No, the line about the Cincy game, if they were playing for something we miss the playoffs?

Based on what? Tell me thats not a SOJF comment. We beat their brains in, forcing them to sit starters in the 2n half. And with that we beat their brains in a week later in the playoffs.

Weren't they playing for something in the playoffs?

Who's being honest?[/QUOTE]


I can go either way on the Cincy game. It was less of a factor than Indy. If Peyton plays the second half, there is no discussion about the 2009 season.

[Jet Nut]

[QUOTE=Toooon;4479723]I can go either way on the Cincy game. It was less of a factor than Indy. [B]If Peyton plays the second half, there is no discussion about the 2009 season.[/B][/QUOTE]

Really?

I said I'll give you the Indy game, who knows how that would have panned out, but why Cincy?

They played the first half, starters were in and were shut out, losing 27-0 at the half.

Like I said, if there was something they could do differently that they were holding back, why did they then go out and get smacked around a week later, at home?

[Toooon]

[QUOTE=Jet Nut;4479728]Really?

I said I'll give you the Indy game, who knows how that would have panned out, but why Cincy?

They played the first half, starters were in and were shut out, losing 27-0 at the half.

Like I said, if there was something they could do differently that they were holding back, why did they then go out and get smacked around a week later, at home?[/QUOTE]


I don't think we smacked them around. It was a fairly close game. Whatever. I would argue Cincy didn't go all out in the regular season game when they already clinched a playoff spot, but we certainly could have (would have) beaten them anyway. But let's not get crazy with this. We agree that the Indy game is the one that really propelled us thanks to Peyton taking a seat.

[ASG0531]

[QUOTE=Toooon;4479768]I don't think we smacked them around. It was a fairly close game. Whatever. I would argue Cincy didn't go all out in the regular season game when they already clinched a playoff spot, but we certainly could have (would have) beaten them anyway. [B]But let's not get crazy with this. We agree that the Indy game is the one that really propelled us thanks to Peyton taking a seat.[/B][/QUOTE]

Oooh boy. That's a hush-hush piece of info around here.

[DDNYjets]

2009 Jet MVP = Bill Polian. That run does not happen without his ego. Anyone who disagrees is in denial.

I give the players credit for taking advantage of the opportunity in the postseason. Tanny also gets some credit for building that team via the draft and FA, even though I think it was more Mangini. From 2006 - 2009 the Jets did very well in the draft and free agency even when you factor in the Gholston pick.

My knocks on Tanny are for bringing in Brett Favre and undermining Mangini and allowing Favre's streak to take the season hostage. And then you can sprinkle in the 2010 draft and whatever happened to the team last year. Allowing key veterans to walk, not having depth on the OL.

[GreenWave]

[QUOTE=Jet Nut;4479649]What was so much better in 98?
[/QUOTE]

A gun-slinging QB at the top of his game.
Big-time playmakers on offense.
A team that won 10 of its last 11, including 3 huge wins against the AFC East (all playoff contenders at that point) to close out the year.
A defense that put on the clamps on for most of the games down the stretch.

If this isn't your favorite season as a fan, then I think you've forgotten the 4th-quarter comeback against Seattle (plus the Vinny T bad call), the Chad Cascadden fumble return for a TD to beat Marino and the Dolphins, and the bomb to Dedric Ward to win the division the following week.

As great as that three-game stretch was in '10 with the two OT wins and the Texans miracle, those three games in '98 were much better (IMO) b/c they were against playoff-caliber teams.

[QUOTE=Jet Nut;4479649]Why do Jet fans take great pride in sh1tting on their team? Why would you downplay their accomplishments? [/QUOTE]

I don't think anyone here is ****ting on the team. '09 & '10 were great runs that could have easily ended in SB appearances had a couple of plays gone differently.

But if you're a Jets fan like me who missed Namath but watched the misery of the '80s & '90s, I can't see how the '98 season isn't still the best memory you have of this team.

[OCCH]

I'm sorry, but it's ridiculous what losers Jets fans are.

I'd love to meet the Giants fan that says "yeah we won the SB, but let's be honest, we were just a 9-7 team and almost didn't make the playoffs"

Or the NE fan who says "yeah we had a good run, but we needed a favorable "tuck rule" call, a kicker who couldn't keep the ball in bounds, and a winded McNabb to get it done"

What if we don't make the playoffs in '09? Then the last three years would be two 8-8 records that just missed the playoffs, and one 11-5 record that went to the AFCCG.

All in the first three years for the QB and HC.

With a lockout shortening their most recent off-season.

With an OC that MIGHT not have been the best match for the personnel.

But I know, that makes me a homer. The fact that we've still had a better run than most teams in the NFL pales in comparison to Manning missing 1/2 a game . . .:rolleyes:

[AlwaysGreenAlwaysWhite]

[QUOTE=OCCH;4479842]I'm sorry, but it's ridiculous what losers Jets fans are.

I'd love to meet the Giants fan that says "yeah we won the SB, but let's be honest, we were just a 9-7 team and almost didn't make the playoffs"

Or the NE fan who says "yeah we had a good run, but we needed a favorable "tuck rule" call, a kicker who couldn't keep the ball in bounds, and a winded McNabb to get it done"

What if we don't make the playoffs in '09? Then the last three years would be two 8-8 records that just missed the playoffs, and one 11-5 record that went to the AFCCG.

All in the first three years for the QB and HC.

With a lockout shortening their most recent off-season.

With an OC that MIGHT not have been the best match for the personnel.

But I know, that makes me a homer. The fact that we've still had a better run than most teams in the NFL pales in comparison to Manning missing 1/2 a game . . .:rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

Preach on, bro...

[Joe W. Namath]

Parcells 1998 team would have beaten the falcons in the super bowl if they had gotten there. Rex's 09 team would have lost to the saints and the 2010 team would have lost to the packers.

So really, only parcells constructed a super bowl caliber team.

[Savage69]

[QUOTE=OCCH;4479842]I'm sorry, but it's ridiculous what losers Jets fans are.

I'd love to meet the Giants fan that says "yeah we won the SB, but let's be honest, we were just a 9-7 team and almost didn't make the playoffs"

Or the NE fan who says "yeah we had a good run, but we needed a favorable "tuck rule" call, a kicker who couldn't keep the ball in bounds, and a winded McNabb to get it done"

What if we don't make the playoffs in '09? Then the last three years would be two 8-8 records that just missed the playoffs, and one 11-5 record that went to the AFCCG.

All in the first three years for the QB and HC.

With a lockout shortening their most recent off-season.

With an OC that MIGHT not have been the best match for the personnel.

[B]But I know, that makes me a homer[/B]. The fact that we've still had a better run than most teams in the NFL pales in comparison to Manning missing 1/2 a game . . .:rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

No it don't it makes you what SOJF's proclaim to be a realistic fan..:yes: