Sanchez as the QB

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by fidelioion

It's hard how anyone can look at this situation and not see the QB is a major problem.

Of course QB is a major problem. I don't think there's a poster on JI that thinks otherwise.

What is not discussed enough is:

1. We are supposed to win on D and the Rushing game so their failure is 10x the issue of the quarterback.

2. Our head coach is awful.

3. We knew coming out of Cortland how bad our O was and how good our D was supposed to be. The O met our sorry expectations. The D disappointed fantastically.

Mark Sanchez, Mark Sanchez, Mark Sanchez. That's all that gets talked about here. As if he alone is the reason for our failure. He's not.

We have invested 80% of our resources on building the '85 Bears defense and it's bombing.

We have the best special teams coach in NFL history and he's bombing.

The Patriots have figured out the Rex Ryan defense and are exploiting it every time we play them.

Sure the QB sucks. Thing is, even as badly as Mark has played this season we'd be headed for 10-6 or 11-5 if the defense and special teams showed up in New England and against Miami.

SAR I

[ucrenegade]

Originally Posted by SAR I

Of course QB is a major problem. I don't think there's a poster on JI that thinks otherwise.

What is not discussed enough is:

1. We are supposed to win on D and the Rushing game so their failure is 10x the issue of the quarterback.

2. Our head coach is awful.

3. We knew coming out of Cortland how bad our O was and how good our D

was supposed to be. The O met our sorry expectations. The D disappointed fantastically.

Mark Sanchez, Mark Sanchez, Mark Sanchez. That's all that gets talked about here. As if he alone is the reason for our failure. He's not.

We have invested 80% of our resources on building the '85 Bears defense and it's bombing.

We have the best special teams coach in NFL history and he's bombing.

The Patriots have figured out the Rex Ryan defense and are exploiting it every time we play them.

Sure the QB sucks. Thing is, even as badly as Mark has played this season we'd be headed for 10-6 or 11-5 if the defense and special teams showed up in New England and against Miami.

SAR I

Your missing the point it still is a qb problem. Even the 85 bears and 00 ravens would not be as good if they were on the field 58 mins a game do a study and see how we'll our d shuts down the opponent the first half to 3 quarters then guess what they prob get frustrated and tired as hell with the 15 three and outs a game plus 5 qb to's............ All because we have mark suckchez

[Green Bandit]

Originally Posted by SAR I

The season stats mean nothing. Because we feast on inferior teams and lose to elite teams, it makes it look like we're much better than we are on defense.

In the seven games that we have lost, the defense is allowing 31 points per game and our best rusher is averaging less than 50 yards per game. For a team that is built to win on a stifling defense and a powerful rushing attack that's a suicide mission.

And had the defense and special teams played at their lofty abilities, with all those high draft picks, with the best defensive Cordinator in the league, with one of the best special teams coaches in NFL history, we are a playoff team this very day. They blew it at New England and didn't show up for Miami. Simple as that. If the defense and special teams play to their abilities in those two games, we are 7-5 and headed towards a 10-6 or 11-5 season. Mark had us in a position to win the game with 90 seconds left in New England, and didn't put us in the hole against Miami's backup QB.

Of course you can make the argument that Mark Sanchez blew two games as well, and I won't disagree with you. But the impact of our defense and special teams is where this team's bread-and-butter lies. They are the ones who blew the two most important games this season, not Mark Sanchez. They are the ones who are a colossal disappointment, moreso than Mark Sanchez.

SAR I

San Francisco
-10-0 San Fran at halftime.
-17 points in the fourth quarter
-And the other TD was a fumble recovery by the defense
-San Francisco held TOP 36:56 - 23:04
-Defense got gassed for staying on the field the whole game as the offense could not sustain a drive.
-Sanchez 13-29 1int

Houston
-After letting up 17 points in 1st half against a premier offense, the D only let up 6 points in the second half.
-Sanchez 14-31 1td 2int

Seattle
-Seattle 14-7 at half time 14 points in 4th qtr
-Dominated TOP 36:11 - 23:49
-Defense got gassed for staying on the field the whole game as the offense could not sustain a drive.
-Sanchez 9-22 1int


You're right stats don't tell the whole story but these do.

Out of 11 games so far this season, there were 5 games that Sanchez led the offense to only 7 POINTS OR LESS

But yes, Rex defense isnt good, so let's put ALL of the blame on them and maybe only a little on Sanchez.

[Winstonbiggs]

Sanchez is a bottom tier QB but the notion that the Jets are a really good football team with a top 10 NFL QB has little cred. This team has mediocre to inferior all over it and Sanchez is one of them. This is a team that is in decline not on the rise.

Sanchez would be a decent game manager at this point had he come up with a good offensive coaching staff that gave him talent to grow with.

If McElroy gets a chance to play on a regular basis with the current Jets management in place he will decline rapidly.

This team could draft the next Dan Marino and Tanny and Rex would turn him into a turd.

[sameoldjets]

i can see rex's reasoning for starting sanchez but at the same time i hope he has a really short hook. everyone needs to be realistic. mcelroy has played in one game and it turned out to be a win against a really poor offensive team. i guess the cardinal defense isn't that bad but still mcelroy benefited from a really good run game. if sanchez got the same running maybe he wins the game. and if the jets run as well against jax they win that one too.

[sameoldjets]

the patriots have figured out nothing about the jet's defense. remember in the first half they only gave up the one td. 3 td's were scored off turnovers by the offense or special teams. put any team that far in the whole and things will look much worse than they are.

Originally Posted by SAR I

Of course QB is a major problem. I don't think there's a poster on JI that thinks otherwise.

What is not discussed enough is:

1. We are supposed to win on D and the Rushing game so their failure is 10x the issue of the quarterback.

2. Our head coach is awful.

3. We knew coming out of Cortland how bad our O was and how good our D was supposed to be. The O met our sorry expectations. The D disappointed fantastically.

Mark Sanchez, Mark Sanchez, Mark Sanchez. That's all that gets talked about here. As if he alone is the reason for our failure. He's not.

We have invested 80% of our resources on building the '85 Bears defense and it's bombing.

We have the best special teams coach in NFL history and he's bombing.

The Patriots have figured out the Rex Ryan defense and are exploiting it every time we play them.

Sure the QB sucks. Thing is, even as badly as Mark has played this season we'd be headed for 10-6 or 11-5 if the defense and special teams showed up in New England and against Miami.

SAR I

[sdJETSetter]

Originally Posted by SAR I

What you are talking about has nothing to do with Mark Sanchez.

You are referring to Rex Ryan's strategy which is completely ass backwards in today's NFL and I couldn't agree more. So when you say Mark Sanchez isn't an elite quarterback, of course he isn't. He wasn't drafted to be an elite quarterback. He wasn't drafted with the hope that he would become the next Dan Marino, launching bombs 80 yards in the air to Mark Duper.

Mark Sanchez was brought here to be a game manager with the ability to occasionally stretch the field. When he had a running game and a set of receiving targets to complement that strategy, he did quite well, went on a 16-4 run, won 4 playoff games, was the best Jet on the field in 2 AFC Championship Games.

The reason Mark Sanchez is a bad quarterback right now is because we are asking him to be something he never was, and we haven't surrounded him with even the slightest bit of mediocre talent with which to have a reasonable expectation of success. He was not brought here to run Air Coryell, throwing the ball 50 times a game. The reason he's forced to do that is because the running game stinks and we have no other choice but to try to win it in the air without any offensive weaponry.

He's not Dan Marino. So he can't win games on his own. He's Mark Sanchez. All he needs is a little bit of support at a few offensive positions and he'll do just fine. As long as we haven't ruined him so badly he can never regain that form, that is.

SAR I

Boy , you must have been watching some Marino highlights lately....

He was traded up for and drafted top 5 overall to be a game manager? Seriously?

Where do you get this from, seriously? Im not trying to be a jerk, but how do you get the idea that Sanchez was drafted to be a game manager that can only be successful with a stellar defense, o line and running game?

Seriously, please respond, where do you get this from SAR...?
You cant make up things to have them suit your agenda.

Who said Mark Sanchez was traded up for and drafted to be a game manager? The team had just gone through the Pennington era, and NOBODY was looking for a game manager at that time.

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by sdJETSetter

He was traded up for and drafted top 5 overall to be a game manager? Seriously?

Where do you get this from, seriously? Im not trying to be a jerk, but how do you get the idea that Sanchez was drafted to be a game manager that can only be successful with a stellar defense, o line and running game?

Seriously, please respond, where do you get this from SAR...?
You cant make up things to have them suit your agenda.

Who said Mark Sanchez was traded up for and drafted to be a game manager? The team had just gone through the Pennington era, and NOBODY was looking for a game manager at that time.

I have no agenda. I merely have an opinion. I also remember that time vividly, remember what was said in the newspapers, remember what was quoted by the Jets.

Mark Sanchez was our only option in April 2009. Pennington was traded. Favre didn't want to come back. Clemens and Ratliff were useless. The available free agents were a bunch of scrubs and nobodies.

The Jets had no choice but to find a QB in the draft, visit with them, see them up close, fall in love with one, get him at all costs. Mark Sanchez was the pick. Because he was the only option, the Jets had to ensure that they were going to get him and not let another team jump up and grab him.

Mark Sanchez wasn't drafted at #5 because he was worth #5 money; he was drafted in a spot where there was a willing team to trade and that would ensure that he wouldn't slip away.

SAR I

[Rexipus Rex]

Originally Posted by SAR I

I have no agenda. I merely have an opinion. I also remember that time vividly, remember what was said in the newspapers, remember what was quoted by the Jets.

Mark Sanchez was our only option in April 2009. Pennington was traded. Favre didn't want to come back. Clemens and Ratliff were useless. The available free agents were a bunch of scrubs and nobodies.

The Jets had no choice but to find a QB in the draft, visit with them, see them up close, fall in love with one, get him at all costs. Mark Sanchez was the pick. Because he was the only option, the Jets had to ensure that they were going to get him and not let another team jump up and grab him.

Mark Sanchez wasn't drafted at #5 because he was worth #5 money; he was drafted in a spot where there was a willing team to trade and that would ensure that he wouldn't slip away.

SAR I

Good post.

With regard to QBs in the draft....it all comes back to supply and demand. So many teams are desperate for QBs and there are very few viable ones each year. That's why you've seen so many more QBs getting taken earlier and earlier in recent years even if they don't have the same pedigree as "traditional" first round QBs. Look at the last two years alone...you see guys like Locker, Ponder, Gabbert, Tannehill all get drafted in the top 12. Heck, even 29 year old Brandon Weeden was taken in the first round. That's what happens when the demand is higher than the supply...you get "overdrafted" QBs.

The Andrew Lucks/RGIIIs only come out once every 8-10 years. Expecting those types of QBs to be available each year is tomfoolery. The reality of it is when you take a QB high and he doesn't bust, you're still left with the Donovan McNabbs, Joe Flaccos, and Jay Cutlers of the world. They're solid starting QBs, but they're not "franchise QBs."

The fault in the matter isn't on the team taking Sanchez or what they traded to acquire Sanchez -- you have to take risks in this league. And when you look back on it, they really didn't give up squat to get Sanchez. Should they have taken Josh Freeman? Probably, yeah, but the 49ers should have taken Aaron Rodgers instead of Alex Smith.

I place a lot more of the blame in Sanchez not developing. A large part of that falls on Sanchez himself, but another large part falls on the front office improperly surrounding the team with offensive weapons after 2010 and the coaching staff constantly pushing and pulling him from being a game manager to a gunslinger back and forth a million times.

[dmitexxi]

Originally Posted by GuidoYaztremski

Sure thing.....

Hey Skippy! Nice stockings you got there....Nice pig, too.

I love you man (no homo)

Originally Posted by Borgoguy

Forget it. When a fervent die hard like sg3 goes off on Rex and the team, you know the whole shootin' match is over.

Maybe the Mayan's were right....

[cloudb2000]

This team is a joke

[jxc]

Originally Posted by SAR I

I have no agenda. I merely have an opinion. I also remember that time vividly, remember what was said in the newspapers, remember what was quoted by the Jets.

Mark Sanchez was our only option in April 2009. Pennington was traded. Favre didn't want to come back. Clemens and Ratliff were useless. The available free agents were a bunch of scrubs and nobodies.

The Jets had no choice but to find a QB in the draft, visit with them, see them up close, fall in love with one, get him at all costs. Mark Sanchez was the pick. Because he was the only option, the Jets had to ensure that they were going to get him and not let another team jump up and grab him.

Mark Sanchez wasn't drafted at #5 because he was worth #5 money; he was drafted in a spot where there was a willing team to trade and that would ensure that he wouldn't slip away.

SAR I

Josh Freeman (picked 12 spots later) and his 92.1 QB rating says "hello".

[dmitexxi]

Originally Posted by jxc

Josh Freeman (picked 12 spots later) and his 92.1 QB rating says "hello".

What's your point? He's not saying they should have, IF anything it speaks volumes of our terrible front office.

[Rexipus Rex]

Originally Posted by jxc

Josh Freeman (picked 12 spots later) and his 92.1 QB rating says "hello".

I don't know if Josh Freeman would have survived New York if he were asked to start right off the bat. He was horrendous in limited action as a rookie, and who knows if he could've handled the pressure.

Sure he's definitely better now, but he walked into a crappy team in 2009 and was allowed to work through his mistakes.

[donick-jets]

Its the best decision for us. If he blows he gets pulled and McElroy wins its over. Or maybe we get win and he gets some confidence back. I have been fan since 60s. We need stability

Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2

[Mogglez]

[jxc]

Originally Posted by dmitexxi

What's your point? He's not saying they should have, IF anything it speaks volumes of our terrible front office.

It's revisionist history that's why. SAR has wedded himself to this theory like Rex has wedded himself to Sanchez as the starter. Time will proved them both wrong, but at least SAR has the excuse that the "Jets ruined Sanchez".

The truth is Sanchez has been more bad than good from the day he arrived. There just isn't any top rated defense, special teams or rushing attack to bail him out anymore.

To say they drafted Sanchez because all the Jets needed was a game manager forgets the 2008 season.

Anyone remember the 2008 season? Remember winning five in a row including tough road victories against New England and the undefeated Titans?

Then Favre got injured but Mangini stuck with him, torpedoing the season and a chance at the playoffs. It's what got him fired.

So to believe SAR I is to just forget that the Jets were the hot pick for the Super Bowl in the middle of 2008 (Jets/Giants Super Bowl!?) and were a powerful team until Brett Favre got hurt.

Even Rex isn't boneheaded enough to switch from a gunslinger to a game manager and start making Super Bowl predictions in one season.

[Magnus]

Originally Posted by donick-jets

Its the best decision for us. If he blows he gets pulled and McElroy wins its over. Or maybe we get win and he gets some confidence back. I have been fan since 60s. We need stability

Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2

Stability of a player whose ceiling is being a mediocre QB? What's the point of that? He isn't going to bomb against the Jaguars defense. He is usually mediocre against easy defenses. It's the avg- above avg defenses that he is really bad against.

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by Rexipus Rex

Good post.

The Andrew Lucks/RGIIIs only come out once every 8-10 years. Expecting those types of QBs to be available each year is tomfoolery. The reality of it is when you take a QB high and he doesn't bust, you're still left with the Donovan McNabbs, Joe Flaccos, and Jay Cutlers of the world. They're solid starting QBs, but they're not "franchise QBs."

The fault in the matter isn't on the team taking Sanchez or what they traded to acquire Sanchez -- you have to take risks in this league. And when you look back on it, they really didn't give up squat to get Sanchez. Should they have taken Josh Freeman? Probably, yeah, but the 49ers should have taken Aaron Rodgers instead of Alex Smith.

I place a lot more of the blame in Sanchez not developing. A large part of that falls on Sanchez himself, but another large part falls on the front office improperly surrounding the team with offensive weapons after 2010 and the coaching staff constantly pushing and pulling him from being a game manager to a gunslinger back and forth a million times.

Precisely.

Not sure why we can't say "Mark is worth a second-look with a new coaching staff committed to offensive football and a set of quality receiving targets" without it being interpreted as saying "Mark is the best quarterback on earth!"

If Rex Ryan's master plan depended upon a Rodgers/Brees/Brady/Manning type, we'd have tried to get one.

Clearly he felt he just needed someone above average to compliment the #1 defense and #1 rushing attack in the NFL. He was wrong. On many levels, dead wrong.

SAR I

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by jxc

Josh Freeman (picked 12 spots later) and his 92.1 QB rating says "hello".

I'm not saying the Jets did the right thing or picked the right quarterback.

What I'm saying is that the Jets braintrust targeted Mark Sanchez and felt they needed to jump up and the only team that bit was Cleveland who just happened to be sitting at #5.

Besides, I'm positive that had the Jets treated Josh Freeman the same way they've treated Mark Sanchez he'd be a guy most would want to run out of town too.

SAR I