Mark Sanchez will be our #1 QB in 2013

[McGinley]

Originally Posted by SAR I

So last week you said "If we had a good quarterback, this year's Jets team would have gone 10-6".

Therefore, for the Jets to have gone 9-7 and 11-5 in successive years in '09 and '10 they must have had a good quarterback.

SAR I

As well as great running game and a great (younger) defense. Mark has always been meh-average.

[dustykeller]

Mark Sanchez is a peter puffin' stargazer.

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by eaglenj

Even if you take away his inaccuracy and put that blame on the receivers and you allow that our OC was terrible and the running game was bad, where do the turnovers fall?

Did we have such bad skill players in 2011 when holmes and keller were healthy? Because he was still a turnover machine.

Maybe you can blame the line for sacks, but who gets the blame for the RIDICULOUS amount of fumbles he had? Or his inability to know when to thrown the ball away.

Every defender of sanchez mentions his "talent", and there is no denying that, but the guy has zero football intellect and feel for the game. He didnt have it as a rookie and he doesnt have it after 4 seasons being a starter. Throwing the ball away and covering the football when you take a sack are BASIC principles that he simply doesnt get.

I think he should improve with the MM offense, lets all pray its as our backup.

Turnovers are a direct-result of game-feel.

Mark Sanchez can't get comfortable in the pocket because the WR's don't get open, we have no TE's, the OL is porous, and he doesn't even have the luxury of what 31 other NFL starting quarterbacks have- an emergency dump-off RB.

Mark Sanchez was not a playoff turnover machine. When we went on that 16-4 run, Mark Sanchez was not a turnover machine. He morphed into that having 2 offensive coordinators, a bad OL, and a merry-go-round of receiving targets over the last two seasons. Not to mention the Tebow distraction, the failing running game, being asked to throw 40 times per game instead of 25, and on and on.

An NFL offense is based on comfortability and precision. There's no way for any QB to be comfortable in the situation Mark Sanchez was thrown into.

SAR I

[Untouchable]

Originally Posted by SAR I

Getting Alex Smith would be the most hypocritical move in JI history.

Alex Smith looked "great" because of the fantastic 49ers team and awesome 49ers head coach around him. Isn't that the argument that the anti-Sanchez brigade uses against Mark?

SAR I

When the hell has Sanchez ever even come close to completing 70% of his passes or posting a 3:1 TD/INT ratio?

Smith isn't some stud, franchise QB but he's a helluva lot better than Sanchez. That's not even debateable.

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by McGinley

As well as great running game and a great (younger) defense. Mark has always been meh-average.

How do you know?

His first season he was a rookie. Tough to judge.

His second season he was great. 5 miracle 4th quarter comebacks. The 11-5 record our second-best in team history.

His third season was the Wayne Hunter/Plaxico Burress/Ladanian Tomlinson failshow. Still would have made the playoffs if the defense did its job at Philadelphia and against the Giants.

His fourth season was the "we don't need no stinkin' playmakers we have Tim Tebow" show.

If you look at the 20 game span between his first 10 rookie games and the start of the 2011 season, Mark Sanchez won 16 out of 20 games including some very high pressure playoff wins and some very important regular season wins against elite teams.

Since Plax/LT/Keller/Edwards got hurt or old or traded, Mark Sanchez looks terrible. Connect the dots. So does the defense, by the way. So does special teams, by the way. Mark Sanchez isn't the reason the Jets are a 6-10 squad. The problems go way deeper than that.

SAR I

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by Untouchable

When the hell has Sanchez ever even come close to completing 70% of his passes or posting a 3:1 TD/INT ratio?

Smith isn't some stud, franchise QB but he's a helluva lot better than Sanchez. That's not even debateable.

Who cares?

Chad Pennington could have completed 100% of his passes, he still wouldn't have made it to the Super Bowl.

These stupid stats mean nothing as they are skewed by circumstances:

2009: Rookie
2010: 11-5, 5 miracle comebacks.
2011: Aging WR and RB, injured TE, lousy OL.
2012: No playmakers, rest of team just as bad.

That's not the list of "excuses". That's the list of "facts". There comes a point where an offense is so depleted of talent that it simply can't function, no mater how good the QB is. Tom Brady doesn't win 8 games with the 2012 Jets. Neither does Joe Montana.

SAR I

[parafly]

Labeling Sanchez as "great" at any point is simply laughable. He was "good" for about 5 games at the end of 2010, that's about it.

The bottom line is Sanchez is not an NFL caliber QB. The game is too fast for him, his awareness is about as bad as it gets, and he doesn't see the field well. That's not even taking into consideration his severe physical limitations concerning his accuracy and height.

It's time to put an end to the Mark Sanchez era. Most of us know this already, unfortunately his contract will make it tough to see this reality in the short term.

[Snell41]

Originally Posted by Untouchable

When the hell has Sanchez ever even come close to completing 70% of his passes or posting a 3:1 TD/INT ratio?

Smith isn't some stud, franchise QB but he's a helluva lot better than Sanchez. That's not even debateable.

Smith isn't a debate of Smith vs Sanchez, he's a debate of whether you want to just go with him as the QB for the next 3-5 years, because that's the kind of contract he's going to want. He's going to also want some guarantees that he's the starter. If we can't give him both then he's going to sign elsewhere.

[Tonetime86]

Originally Posted by 56mehl56

Compare the offensive talents and the way the Patriots set up their short passing game, then watch how the Jets do it, no comparison whatsoever.

The Pats create space with their exceptional Te's, they overload zones, they have the Oline and wr's run questionably legal pick plays. The Jets drop their wr 2 yards behind the LOS and then try to beat the 9-10 men who are stacked in the box. Otherwise they'll send the primary reciever 5 yards downfield on 3rd and 10's . The box is always stacked against the Jets because 1) they feature the run 2) they hardly ever attack the perimeter or deep downfield. You'll say that's because Sanchez can't throw deep. I'll contend its all part of the offensive mindset.

So you're trying to tell me any QB can be as successful as Tom Brady, as long as the proper scheme is installed (I'm obviously exaggerating). I am not trying to understate the importance of coaching because all coaching isn't equal, but you make it sound so easy. Guess what, if we can notice that defenses stack the box against the Jets, you can be damn sure the offense sees it too and are familiar with the various counter methods.

[dustykeller]

Originally Posted by SAR I

Who cares?

Chad Pennington could have completed 100% of his passes, he still wouldn't have made it to the Super Bowl.

These stupid stats mean nothing as they are skewed by circumstances:

2009: Rookie
2010: 11-5, 5 miracle comebacks.
2011: Aging WR and RB, injured TE, lousy OL.
2012: No playmakers, rest of team just as bad.

That's not the list of "excuses". That's the list of "facts". There comes a point where an offense is so depleted of talent that it simply can't function, no mater how good the QB is. Tom Brady doesn't win 8 games with the 2012 Jets. Neither does Joe Montana.

SAR I

No. That sounds like a list of bullsh!t excuses.

[SAR I]

Originally Posted by dustykeller

No. That sounds like a list of bullsh!t excuses.

No, those are the facts.

Just because you're tired of hearing them and live in a Twitter Now! world doesn't make the facts untrue. Boredom isn't a rationale for stupidity.

SAR I

[Untouchable]

Originally Posted by SAR I

Who cares?

Chad Pennington could have completed 100% of his passes, he still wouldn't have made it to the Super Bowl.

These stupid stats mean nothing as they are skewed by circumstances:

2009: Rookie
2010: 11-5, 5 miracle comebacks.
2011: Aging WR and RB, injured TE, lousy OL.
2012: No playmakers, rest of team just as bad.

That's not the list of "excuses". That's the list of "facts". There comes a point where an offense is so depleted of talent that it simply can't function, no mater how good the QB is. Tom Brady doesn't win 8 games with the 2012 Jets. Neither does Joe Montana.

SAR I

LOL

Stats absolutely matter when you have a QB who consistently, year in and year out turns the ball over more than he puts it in the endzone.

Fact: Mark Sanchez is one of the most inaccurate QB's in the NFL

Fact: Mark Sanchez is one of the most turnover prone QB's in the NFL

Fact: Mark Sanchez is one of the most mentally weak QB's in the NFL

Fact: Mark Sanchez needs every facet of the offense to be firing on all cylinders just to turn in a halfway decent performance


The kid is ruined, the kid sucks, the kid still needs to be held by the hand even in his 5th year in the league.

Is Mark Sanchez the sole problem on this offense? No, but he's a pretty damn big part of it.

[dustykeller]

Originally Posted by SAR I

No, those are the facts.

Just because you're tired of hearing them and live in a Twitter Now! world doesn't make the facts untrue. Boredom isn't a rationale for stupidity.

SAR I

No, they're excuses.

Sanchez's mental capacity for this game is destroyed. He'll have a fruitful career as the next Jim Sorgi.

[56mehl56]

Originally Posted by Tonetime86

So you're trying to tell me any QB can be as successful as Tom Brady, as long as the proper scheme is installed (I'm obviously exaggerating). I am not trying to understate the importance of coaching because all coaching isn't equal, but you make it sound so easy. Guess what, if we can notice that defenses stack the box against the Jets, you can be damn sure the offense sees it too and are familiar with the various counter methods.

No , I'm not saying every QB can be a Brady , a Montana etc..

What I'm saying and have been saying is the Jets offensive strategy for the past 4 years has resembled that of a pop-warner football squad.

Sure we all see the box stacked and we sit at the games or at home and say here comes a Shonn Green run. The problem is our HC in conjunction with his past OC's would simply force it because he/they believed that's the way you win football games G&P and good defense. Sure there are many ways to counter , he never felt it was necessary. In his first two years he had the personnel to pull it off and it looked semi-competent in years 3 & 4 he didn't and they never adapted. I know Santonio is a prima donna but why do you think he had the issues in 2011 the offense revolved around the run , he was a sidebar. In 2012 because of injuries everything came unglued on offense.

When our HC outwardly admits that maybe he made a mistake with trying to stick with the G&P it speaks volumes. I'm not saying our offense can be transformed into the GB Packers or Atlanta Falcons etc... but its time to take it out of the stone age.

[56mehl56]

Originally Posted by dustykeller

No, they're excuses.

Sanchez's mental capacity for this game is destroyed. He'll have a fruitful career as the next Jim Sorgi.

What exactly does that mean. Its easy to throw around the cliche's but what background evidence do you have to support those claims.

Because all I hear is he sucks, he buttfumbles , he couldn't win he's inaccurate , he throw's picks how do you correlate them to his mental capacity. Are you saying he's too dumb to read defenses, are you breaking down gamefilm to prove that point or you just piling on top of what everyone else says. I'm not trying to be a dick I'm just sick of seeing people propogate misconceptions because its the in thing to do.

[LIJetsFan]

I find it very difficult to have any faith in Sanchez but there is a glimmer of hope:

In 2011 Sanchez looked sharp until the Ravens game where the oline collapsed and he got creamed. After Mangold returned he continued to get frequently creamed with the banged up oline and especially with Hunter as a revolving door. He finally lost it completely with 3 games to go.

In the 2012 off season he pulled himself together and looked sharp against Buffalo and in a few other early games. With no running game, far too many heartbreaking WR drops, and going from bad to worse in the OC dept., he lost it long before the bye.

My point is that I expect he’ll come into 2013 sharp. Somehow being away from the team he manages to pull himself together. So, the glimmer of hope is that our new GM gets him decent support, our new OC sets things us so that he can play within himself, and our new QB coach keeps his mechanics straight.

In the right environment there is still a glimmer of a chance that he’ll remember how to read defenses and lead receivers.

[detjetsfan]

Originally Posted by Untouchable

=Smith isn't some stud, franchise QB but he's a helluva lot better than Sanchez. That's not even debateable.

Alex Smith would have been eaten for lunch by defenses if he had Sanchez's offensive roster to work with last season.

[JetItalia]

great point again SAR. its assanine to bring in Alex Smith when it would just be Mark Sanchez part deux, if you actually believe Mark Sanchez stinks (which I dont). Smith, like Sanchez, succeeds with help and effort around him. Hes not Manning or Brady. I am tired of hearing from every NY fan that our best hope of finding Manning or Brady is in Flynn or Smith, or the draft. Good like finding it.

Again, the fairweather "what have you done for me lately, glass half empty" Jet fans are going to continue to act the same way - they would be great on NFL Live with Trey Wingo and and the like, making the easy comments that arent thought through...

Originally Posted by SAR I

Getting Alex Smith would be the most hypocritical move in JI history.

Alex Smith looked "great" because of the fantastic 49ers team and awesome 49ers head coach around him. Isn't that the argument that the anti-Sanchez brigade uses against Mark?

SAR I

[JetItalia]

a lot of these NY fairweather fans would sound great on NFL Fantasy Live on NFL network. "Brady and Manning are studs to start this week, definitely bench Mark Sanchez!", which then equals "well, i never really was around or rooted for the Jets when they were really bad, so im not used to losing, and if we dont make the playoffs every year, its because our QB sucks - his numbers stink, there you go!"

Originally Posted by SAR I

No, those are the facts.

Just because you're tired of hearing them and live in a Twitter Now! world doesn't make the facts untrue. Boredom isn't a rationale for stupidity.

SAR I

[dustykeller]

Originally Posted by 56mehl56

What exactly does that mean. Its easy to throw around the cliche's but what background evidence do you have to support those claims.

Because all I hear is he sucks, he buttfumbles , he couldn't win he's inaccurate , he throw's picks how do you correlate them to his mental capacity. Are you saying he's too dumb to read defenses, are you breaking down gamefilm to prove that point or you just piling on top of what everyone else says. I'm not trying to be a dick I'm just sick of seeing people propogate misconceptions because its the in thing to do.

Watch the games and you'll figure it out. Sanchez makes poor decisions, is awful at going through his progressions, and his accuracy is embarrassing. SAR will have you believe that it's the rest of the roster's fault, but anybody with an iota of football intelligence knows that these are signs of regression. Remember when Sparano was hired and Sanchez was all jakked up because he claimed he was grasping the playbook a lot faster...yada yada yada. Sparano's playbook is vanilla compared to Schotty's.

The funny thing is, Sanchez was making the same mistakes during the AFC championship years too, but that was written off to him being a rookie and whatnot. Now it's the rest of the roster's fault. Puh-lease.