more junk science

bitonti · 11-09-2004, 05:33 PM

[url=http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/11/1109_041109_polar_ice.html]http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20..._polar_ice.html[/url]

[img]http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/11/images/041109_arctic_ice.jpg[/img]

Section109Row15 · 11-09-2004, 05:35 PM

Don't worry we have the Clean Air Act, oh and No Child Left Behind.

bitonti · 11-09-2004, 05:38 PM

Bush has the best environmental policy - he's waiting for Jesus to come out of the sky and take all the saved people to heaven and send all the damned people to hell - it's called the rapture, and it's real! :blink:

jets5ever · 11-09-2004, 05:46 PM

Bitonti - I am going to ask a serious question -

What assumptions are imbedded in the models they used to reach these conclusions? Do you know or can you find out for me?

Savage69 · 11-09-2004, 05:48 PM

Bit just wondering..Was the Ice Age the fault of Bush also?? When the
Earth was formed wasn't the whole suface riddled with erupting
Volcano's?? And then it cooled and life was formed..Was that the first
Bitonti?? Man's time on Earth is a small amount of what the Globe has
gone through in the eon's of time..The Weather has changed many times!
And I don't think a Republican or Democrat had anything to do with them!! ;)

JetFanTransplant · 11-09-2004, 05:55 PM

Fine by me. I will be long gone and I will make sure I buy some land "at least 23 feet above sea level" this way I will have ocean front property to leavy my childrens children.

:P

bitonti · 11-09-2004, 07:29 PM

i never said this was all Bush's fault but i did say he doesn't care or even admit it's real! Not a good thing for owners of waterfront property...

Bugg · 11-09-2004, 08:05 PM

There have been ice ages and worldwide hot stretches which make places tropical that takes 10s of thousands of years. Even if the changes you say are in fact true(1.8 degrees F rise in last 100 years), how do we know if any of it isn't just natural? Most of man's natural progress to civilization(for lack of a better word) is only since the end of the last ice age some 10-15,000 years ago. At best, given the rate of change, this all may be antecdotal ratehr than scientific since the sample isn't nearly big enough to say otherwise. You really don't know. If Mt. St. Helens or Yellowstoen goes Krakatoa tommorrow, we'll drop 5-10 degrees in a month.

bitonti · 11-09-2004, 08:19 PM

[quote][i]Originally posted by jets5ever[/i]@Nov 9 2004, 05:46 PM
[b] Bitonti - I am going to ask a serious question -

What assumptions are imbedded in the models they used to reach these conclusions? Do you know or can you find out for me? [/b][/quote]
since you wanted to know more...

here's a source even New England Hick would be reluctant to dispute B)

[quote][b]Bowdoin College Arctic Experts Contribute Findings to Arctic Climate Impact Assessment

BRUNSWICK, Maine, Nov. 9 (AScribe Newswire) -- A four-year study documenting accelerated climate changes in the Arctic released this week raised major concerns about global warming and its immediate effect on indigenous populations. The Arctic Climate Impact Assessment (ACIA) was compiled by an international group of 250 scientists.
[/b][/quote]

B)

YorkPAJetsFan · 11-09-2004, 09:33 PM

Well if you haven't noticed, most of the coastal states are blue. Maybe Bush is smarter than you think.

11-10-2004, 12:07 AM

George Bush just released a statement regarding this problem, Bit. To paraphrase, it went something like this:

"The Bible tells us of a Great Flood centuries ago that came and wiped out the World when God was upset at the lack of mor'lity. This is just the same deal. I have no doubt that this new great flood is the work of God, and it will cleanse the Earth of gays, muslims and nigra's ever'where. Thank you, and God Bless America."

11-10-2004, 12:12 AM

[quote][i]Originally posted by YorkPAJetsFan[/i]@Nov 9 2004, 09:33 PM
[b] Well if you haven't noticed, most of the coastal states are blue. Maybe Bush is smarter than you think. [/b][/quote]
I don't get it...Why would Bush want to wipe out all of the intellectual centers of the United States? Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Oh, I get it now. Sorry! :lol:

The Gun Of Bavaria · 11-10-2004, 12:38 AM

My problem with the global warming theories, etc is that we've only been tracking weather since the late 1800s and some, not all, but some of these death scenarios are based upon records which in the scheme of humankind is a mere hiccup in history.

Before you launch an attack on me, I know that there are other ways to measure historical weather data through digging up of ancient rock and drilling into ice sheets.

I just have trouble that evern after 100 years of measuring weather, all of a sudden in the mid 90s Global Warming became the new "Acid Rain" of our generation.

Depp down, as I sit in Detroit with a cool 37 degrees and one of the coldest summers in my 30 years in Marquette, I believe any weather changes are based in part to a cyclical weather pattern experienced by Earth as a planet.

11-10-2004, 01:35 AM

[quote][i]Originally posted by The Gun Of Bavaria[/i]@Nov 10 2004, 12:38 AM
[b] My problem with the global warming theories, etc is that we've only been tracking weather since the late 1800s and some, not all, but some of these death scenarios are based upon records which in the scheme of humankind is a mere hiccup in history.

Before you launch an attack on me, I know that there are other ways to measure historical weather data through digging up of ancient rock and drilling into ice sheets.

I just have trouble that evern after 100 years of measuring weather, all of a sudden in the mid 90s Global Warming became the new "Acid Rain" of our generation.

Depp down, as I sit in Detroit with a cool 37 degrees and one of the coldest summers in my 30 years in Marquette, I believe any weather changes are based in part to a cyclical weather pattern experienced by Earth as a planet. [/b][/quote]
Thank you, Pat. After 100 years of research, it is you who has finally demystified global warming. We'll be sure to forward your post to the National Weather Service, Greenpeace, and the International Center for Ecological Study. I'm sure they'll breathe a sigh of relief and name a tropical storm after you in your honor.

PS, Stephen Hawkings called. He wishes to have lunch with you to "talk shop." Are you available Thursday?

:lol: ;) :lol:

The Gun Of Bavaria · 11-10-2004, 03:01 AM

[quote][i]Originally posted by TomShane+Nov 10 2004, 01:35 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (TomShane @ Nov 10 2004, 01:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-The Gun Of Bavaria[/i]@Nov 10 2004, 12:38 AM
[b] My problem with the global warming theories, etc is that we've only been tracking weather since the late 1800s and some, not all, but some of these death scenarios are based upon records which in the scheme of humankind is a mere hiccup in history.

Before you launch an attack on me, I know that there are other ways to measure historical weather data through digging up of ancient rock and drilling into ice sheets.

I just have trouble that evern after 100 years of measuring weather, all of a sudden in the mid 90s Global Warming became the new "Acid Rain" of our generation.

Depp down, as I sit in Detroit with a cool 37 degrees and one of the coldest summers in my 30 years in Marquette, I believe any weather changes are based in part to a cyclical weather pattern experienced by Earth as a planet. [/b][/quote]
Thank you, Pat. After 100 years of research, it is you who has finally demystified global warming. We'll be sure to forward your post to the National Weather Service, Greenpeace, and the International Center for Ecological Study. I'm sure they'll breathe a sigh of relief and name a tropical storm after you in your honor.

PS, Stephen Hawkings called. He wishes to have lunch with you to "talk shop." Are you available Thursday?

:lol: ;) :lol: [/b][/quote]
Can't make lunch with Hawkings....he talks too much

Jet Moses · 11-10-2004, 08:40 AM

[quote][i]Originally posted by bitonti[/i]@Nov 9 2004, 07:29 PM
[b] i never said this was all Bush's fault but i did say he doesn't care or even admit it's real! Not a good thing for owners of waterfront property... [/b][/quote]
Bit, have you picked out a new team to root for? It will help you assimilate faster to your new surroundings.

[img]http://www.abdcards.com/mfmtlalo.jpg[/img]
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

bitonti · 11-10-2004, 11:39 AM

im not going anywhere

let's be real you don't need measurements (or a scientific degree) to take heed of simple stats like the 5 hottest years in human recorded history have all taken place in the last decade.

jetsfaninCO · 11-10-2004, 12:20 PM

Don't all you libs start moving out here to the Rockies hoping to get a way from all the floods. All of us Cons will be sitting at 6,000 ft picking you off one by one.

Guns you have a place in CO any time you need one.

jets5ever · 11-10-2004, 12:22 PM

[quote][i]Originally posted by bitonti[/i]@Nov 10 2004, 11:39 AM
[b] im not going anywhere

let's be real you don't need measurements (or a scientific degree) to take heed of simple stats like the 5 hottest years in human recorded history have all taken place in the last decade. [/b][/quote]
Bitonti - conclusions like that are the problem. You are extrapolating wildly based on a few data points. Humans haven't been around that long, and they haven't been recording tempuratures accurately for very long either. Our data set is simply way, way too small. Laughably so. Also, it is one thing to observe and record data, it is quite another to attribute conclusively the causes of those observations.

11-10-2004, 11:06 PM

[quote][i]Originally posted by TomShane[/i]@Nov 10 2004, 12:07 AM
[b] George Bush just released a statement regarding this problem, Bit. To paraphrase, it went something like this:

"The Bible tells us of a Great Flood centuries ago that came and wiped out the World when God was upset at the lack of mor'lity. This is just the same deal. I have no doubt that this new great flood is the work of God, and it will cleanse the Earth of gays, muslims and nigra's ever'where. Thank you, and God Bless America." [/b][/quote]
Certainly Bush knows about the New Covenant. The World may end...but it won't be by a flood. Been there, done that.

11-09-2004, 05:33 PM	#1
bitonti searching Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philly Posts: 38,786	[url=http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/11/1109_041109_polar_ice.html]http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20..._polar_ice.html[/url] [img]http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/11/images/041109_arctic_ice.jpg[/img]

11-09-2004, 05:35 PM	#2
Section109Row15 Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Washington, D.C. Posts: 3,406	Don't worry we have the Clean Air Act, oh and No Child Left Behind.

11-09-2004, 05:38 PM	#3
bitonti searching Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philly Posts: 38,786	Bush has the best environmental policy - he's waiting for Jesus to come out of the sky and take all the saved people to heaven and send all the damned people to hell - it's called the rapture, and it's real! :blink:

11-09-2004, 05:46 PM	#4
jets5ever Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Boston Posts: 11,692	Bitonti - I am going to ask a serious question - What assumptions are imbedded in the models they used to reach these conclusions? Do you know or can you find out for me?

11-09-2004, 05:48 PM	#5
Savage69 Jets Insider VIP Charter JI Member Join Date: May 1999 Posts: 39,278	Bit just wondering..Was the Ice Age the fault of Bush also?? When the Earth was formed wasn't the whole suface riddled with erupting Volcano's?? And then it cooled and life was formed..Was that the first Bitonti?? Man's time on Earth is a small amount of what the Globe has gone through in the eon's of time..The Weather has changed many times! And I don't think a Republican or Democrat had anything to do with them!! ;)

11-09-2004, 05:55 PM	#6
JetFanTransplant Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: On some beach... somewhere... Posts: 3,735	Fine by me. I will be long gone and I will make sure I buy some land "at least 23 feet above sea level" this way I will have ocean front property to leavy my childrens children. :P

11-09-2004, 07:29 PM	#7
bitonti searching Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philly Posts: 38,786	i never said this was all Bush's fault but i did say he doesn't care or even admit it's real! Not a good thing for owners of waterfront property...

11-09-2004, 08:05 PM	#8
Bugg Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 4,530	There have been ice ages and worldwide hot stretches which make places tropical that takes 10s of thousands of years. Even if the changes you say are in fact true(1.8 degrees F rise in last 100 years), how do we know if any of it isn't just natural? Most of man's natural progress to civilization(for lack of a better word) is only since the end of the last ice age some 10-15,000 years ago. At best, given the rate of change, this all may be antecdotal ratehr than scientific since the sample isn't nearly big enough to say otherwise. You really don't know. If Mt. St. Helens or Yellowstoen goes Krakatoa tommorrow, we'll drop 5-10 degrees in a month.

11-09-2004, 08:19 PM	#9
bitonti searching Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philly Posts: 38,786	[quote][i]Originally posted by jets5ever[/i]@Nov 9 2004, 05:46 PM [b] Bitonti - I am going to ask a serious question - What assumptions are imbedded in the models they used to reach these conclusions? Do you know or can you find out for me? [/b][/quote] since you wanted to know more... here's a source even New England Hick would be reluctant to dispute B) [quote][b]Bowdoin College Arctic Experts Contribute Findings to Arctic Climate Impact Assessment BRUNSWICK, Maine, Nov. 9 (AScribe Newswire) -- A four-year study documenting accelerated climate changes in the Arctic released this week raised major concerns about global warming and its immediate effect on indigenous populations. The Arctic Climate Impact Assessment (ACIA) was compiled by an international group of 250 scientists. [/b][/quote] B)

11-09-2004, 09:33 PM	#10
YorkPAJetsFan Undrafted Free Agent Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Harrisburg, PA Posts: 226	Well if you haven't noticed, most of the coastal states are blue. Maybe Bush is smarter than you think.

11-10-2004, 12:07 AM	#11
TomShane Edit Status Guest Posts: n/a	George Bush just released a statement regarding this problem, Bit. To paraphrase, it went something like this: "The Bible tells us of a Great Flood centuries ago that came and wiped out the World when God was upset at the lack of mor'lity. This is just the same deal. I have no doubt that this new great flood is the work of God, and it will cleanse the Earth of gays, muslims and nigra's ever'where. Thank you, and God Bless America."

11-10-2004, 12:12 AM	#12
TomShane Edit Status Guest Posts: n/a	[quote][i]Originally posted by YorkPAJetsFan[/i]@Nov 9 2004, 09:33 PM [b] Well if you haven't noticed, most of the coastal states are blue. Maybe Bush is smarter than you think. [/b][/quote] I don't get it...Why would Bush want to wipe out all of the intellectual centers of the United States? Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Oh, I get it now. Sorry! :lol:

11-10-2004, 12:38 AM	#13
The Gun Of Bavaria Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Detroit, Michigan Posts: 8,682	My problem with the global warming theories, etc is that we've only been tracking weather since the late 1800s and some, not all, but some of these death scenarios are based upon records which in the scheme of humankind is a mere hiccup in history. Before you launch an attack on me, I know that there are other ways to measure historical weather data through digging up of ancient rock and drilling into ice sheets. I just have trouble that evern after 100 years of measuring weather, all of a sudden in the mid 90s Global Warming became the new "Acid Rain" of our generation. Depp down, as I sit in Detroit with a cool 37 degrees and one of the coldest summers in my 30 years in Marquette, I believe any weather changes are based in part to a cyclical weather pattern experienced by Earth as a planet.

11-10-2004, 01:35 AM	#14
TomShane Edit Status Guest Posts: n/a	[quote][i]Originally posted by The Gun Of Bavaria[/i]@Nov 10 2004, 12:38 AM [b] My problem with the global warming theories, etc is that we've only been tracking weather since the late 1800s and some, not all, but some of these death scenarios are based upon records which in the scheme of humankind is a mere hiccup in history. Before you launch an attack on me, I know that there are other ways to measure historical weather data through digging up of ancient rock and drilling into ice sheets. I just have trouble that evern after 100 years of measuring weather, all of a sudden in the mid 90s Global Warming became the new "Acid Rain" of our generation. Depp down, as I sit in Detroit with a cool 37 degrees and one of the coldest summers in my 30 years in Marquette, I believe any weather changes are based in part to a cyclical weather pattern experienced by Earth as a planet. [/b][/quote] Thank you, Pat. After 100 years of research, it is you who has finally demystified global warming. We'll be sure to forward your post to the National Weather Service, Greenpeace, and the International Center for Ecological Study. I'm sure they'll breathe a sigh of relief and name a tropical storm after you in your honor. PS, Stephen Hawkings called. He wishes to have lunch with you to "talk shop." Are you available Thursday? :lol: ;) :lol:

11-10-2004, 03:01 AM	#15
The Gun Of Bavaria Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Detroit, Michigan Posts: 8,682	[quote][i]Originally posted by TomShane+Nov 10 2004, 01:35 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>[b]QUOTE[/b] (TomShane @ Nov 10 2004, 01:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-The Gun Of Bavaria[/i]@Nov 10 2004, 12:38 AM [b] My problem with the global warming theories, etc is that we've only been tracking weather since the late 1800s and some, not all, but some of these death scenarios are based upon records which in the scheme of humankind is a mere hiccup in history. Before you launch an attack on me, I know that there are other ways to measure historical weather data through digging up of ancient rock and drilling into ice sheets. I just have trouble that evern after 100 years of measuring weather, all of a sudden in the mid 90s Global Warming became the new "Acid Rain" of our generation. Depp down, as I sit in Detroit with a cool 37 degrees and one of the coldest summers in my 30 years in Marquette, I believe any weather changes are based in part to a cyclical weather pattern experienced by Earth as a planet. [/b][/quote] Thank you, Pat. After 100 years of research, it is you who has finally demystified global warming. We'll be sure to forward your post to the National Weather Service, Greenpeace, and the International Center for Ecological Study. I'm sure they'll breathe a sigh of relief and name a tropical storm after you in your honor. PS, Stephen Hawkings called. He wishes to have lunch with you to "talk shop." Are you available Thursday? :lol: ;) :lol: [/b][/quote] Can't make lunch with Hawkings....he talks too much

11-10-2004, 08:40 AM	#16
Jet Moses Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 5,281	[quote][i]Originally posted by bitonti[/i]@Nov 9 2004, 07:29 PM [b] i never said this was all Bush's fault but i did say he doesn't care or even admit it's real! Not a good thing for owners of waterfront property... [/b][/quote] Bit, have you picked out a new team to root for? It will help you assimilate faster to your new surroundings. [img]http://www.abdcards.com/mfmtlalo.jpg[/img] :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

11-10-2004, 11:39 AM	#17
bitonti searching Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philly Posts: 38,786	im not going anywhere let's be real you don't need measurements (or a scientific degree) to take heed of simple stats like the 5 hottest years in human recorded history have all taken place in the last decade.

11-10-2004, 12:20 PM	#18
jetsfaninCO All Pro Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,965	Don't all you libs start moving out here to the Rockies hoping to get a way from all the floods. All of us Cons will be sitting at 6,000 ft picking you off one by one. Guns you have a place in CO any time you need one.

11-10-2004, 12:22 PM	#19
jets5ever Hall Of Fame Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Boston Posts: 11,692	[quote][i]Originally posted by bitonti[/i]@Nov 10 2004, 11:39 AM [b] im not going anywhere let's be real you don't need measurements (or a scientific degree) to take heed of simple stats like the 5 hottest years in human recorded history have all taken place in the last decade. [/b][/quote] Bitonti - conclusions like that are the problem. You are extrapolating wildly based on a few data points. Humans haven't been around that long, and they haven't been recording tempuratures accurately for very long either. Our data set is simply way, way too small. Laughably so. Also, it is one thing to observe and record data, it is quite another to attribute conclusively the causes of those observations.

11-10-2004, 11:06 PM	#20
Maxman Edit Status Guest Posts: n/a	[quote][i]Originally posted by TomShane[/i]@Nov 10 2004, 12:07 AM [b] George Bush just released a statement regarding this problem, Bit. To paraphrase, it went something like this: "The Bible tells us of a Great Flood centuries ago that came and wiped out the World when God was upset at the lack of mor'lity. This is just the same deal. I have no doubt that this new great flood is the work of God, and it will cleanse the Earth of gays, muslims and nigra's ever'where. Thank you, and God Bless America." [/b][/quote] Certainly Bush knows about the New Covenant. The World may end...but it won't be by a flood. Been there, done that.