View Poll Results: Isiah guilty or innocent?

Voters
36. You may not vote on this poll
  • Guilty

    13 36.11%
  • Innocent

    5 13.89%
  • No clue, lets hear more evidence

    18 50.00%
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 21 to 29 of 29

Thread: OT: Isiah and the Knicks

  1. #21
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    29,953
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by cornjulio21
    Sorry but evaluating talent and moves as a GM are not totally separate. Don't you think he had to evaluate Jerome James to determine his worth for a contract?
    I think Thomas is an egomaniac disaster. He'll make moves jut to make them and see himself in the press. Channing Frye was a good pick and really a no-brainer IMHO. Lee was good, Nate was stupid. Jamaal? Steph? Q? The cap situation. Even taking Curry without the DNA test is a ridiculous position. It shows his willingness to do anything to get ahead and he does not care who he hurts.
    If evaluating the talent of prospects and evaluating the talent of current NBA players were one and the same, then personel who worked in the draft department of every team in the NBA would be consulted on every trade and every free agent which dealt with current NBA players.

    Look at strictly his draft history with the Raptors and the Knicks, the roster speaks for itself. Strictly in terms of high schoolers and college players he knows what to look for. For some reason he can't figure it out with pro's though. Why? Who knows. It's Isiah Thomas, he was a nutjob when he was a player and he's a nutjob as a GM.

    Why Isiah has made some of the signings he has is one of the biggest mysteries in sports today. The Jerome James contract might be worse than what the Celtics gave Brian Scalabrine this year, it's a toss up between the two for "worst contract of the decade." Honestly I think the guy just doesn't understand how the salary cap works in basketball, thus, he should not be running ANY team ANYWHERE.

    It's a little early to say Nate's a stupid pick. The guy plays hard for the 20-30 minutes he gets per game, is a fan favorite, and makes some great plays here and there. Granted he makes a lot of dumb plays, but he's a rookie so that's a given. That Bulls game last week certainly wouldn't have gone into overtime had it not been for Nate stepping up in that last minute and weaving through the D. The jury's out on him and will be for a while.
    Last edited by RutgersJetFan; 01-26-2006 at 01:32 PM.

  2. #22
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Miami, Fl
    Posts
    18,661
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBound
    Isaiah "Clarence" Thomas?

    is that a pubic hair in your coke???

  3. #23
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    15,550
    Post Thanks / Like
    Clarence knows how to evalute talent, but he's not second to none

  4. #24
    Rookie
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    New Jerz
    Posts
    903
    Post Thanks / Like
    as a GM i like Thomas. he has drafts well (Lee, Frye, Sweets, ariza). A lot of people complain about his trades. But when thomas got this team, it was in cap hell and the players we had were grossly overpaid. IT's first move was getting marbury. IT got him b/c he was a marketable player and at the time he was just about our only "high profile" player. Wheather you like him or not marbs is a top 10 pg, and he has been getting better this year by playing better overall ball.

    Look at the team he inherited: 2003 roster

    PG Charlie Ward
    SG Allan Houston
    SF Latrell Sprewell
    PF Antonio McDyess
    C Kurt Thomas

    bench
    PG Howard Eisley
    SF Shandon Anderson
    PF Clarence Weatherspoon
    C Othella Harrington

    2005 roster:
    PG Marbury
    Sg crawford
    G/F Q Rich
    F antonio Davis
    C Eddy Curry

    bench

    Frye
    Lee
    Ariza
    nate
    Mo taylor
    Penny

    Yes he did trade a lot of players away and yes he traded them frequently, but you cant deny the fact that we got younger and better players, then we had. People ask why he didnt help our cap situation out. Well people are forgettign that when you make trades the salaries need to match up. So you cant just trade marbs for nothing. This is why he has not gotten us under the cap. He traded the dead weight for players with much more talent

    IMO all we need now is time to gel

  5. #25
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    22,105
    Post Thanks / Like

    Guilty!!!!!....

    Of basketball transgressions. I couldn't care less if he was groping that former woman's basketball player's protruding Adam's apple (just kidding).

    Isiah has made some really horrible decisions as a GM. The thing is, he's best at drafting players and he goes out and gives up an unprotected 2006 first round draft pick for Eddie Curry whom the Bulls were desperate to get rid of. The Knicks have a shot at the #1 overall pick this year but that pick will have to go to the Bulls. Plus, he agreed to swap the Knicks pick with the Bulls in the 2007 season. AND, he still owes Phoenix a first rounder for the Stephon Marbury trade. That is three potential lotter picks up in flames.

  6. #26
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    9,674
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Vilma4Prez
    as a GM i like Thomas. he has drafts well (Lee, Frye, Sweets, ariza). A lot of people complain about his trades. But when thomas got this team, it was in cap hell and the players we had were grossly overpaid. IT's first move was getting marbury. IT got him b/c he was a marketable player and at the time he was just about our only "high profile" player. Wheather you like him or not marbs is a top 10 pg, and he has been getting better this year by playing better overall ball.

    Look at the team he inherited: 2003 roster

    PG Charlie Ward
    SG Allan Houston
    SF Latrell Sprewell
    PF Antonio McDyess
    C Kurt Thomas

    bench
    PG Howard Eisley
    SF Shandon Anderson
    PF Clarence Weatherspoon
    C Othella Harrington

    2005 roster:
    PG Marbury
    Sg crawford
    G/F Q Rich
    F antonio Davis
    C Eddy Curry

    bench

    Frye
    Lee
    Ariza
    nate
    Mo taylor
    Penny

    Yes he did trade a lot of players away and yes he traded them frequently, but you cant deny the fact that we got younger and better players, then we had. People ask why he didnt help our cap situation out. Well people are forgettign that when you make trades the salaries need to match up. So you cant just trade marbs for nothing. This is why he has not gotten us under the cap. He traded the dead weight for players with much more talent

    IMO all we need now is time to gel
    Has the team really improved since that time? I agree that Isiah is pretty good in the draft---hes got a long history of it---but this team is terrible. The team he inherited in 2003 made the playoffs with 39 wins. The prior year they had 37. Last year they fell to 33 last season. And this year are on pace for 26 or 27. He doesnt allow his team to mesh and is bringing in terrible guys. Say what you will about Marburys talent---hes terrible. You should have learned your lesson watching him in New Jersey and Phoenix. The teams were better before him and after him. He is not a guy you build around, and New York doesnt need a marquee name to draw fans. All they need to do is win and he isn't going to provide it...Crawford has been ok and Q is terrible and everyone in the league knew it. Phoenix was more than happy to be rid of him. Curry has been a slight bust in his young NBA career thus far. I dont care if they were younger or more name value than those old Charlie Ward/Howard Eisley teams or not. The bottom line is that those teams won games. Isiah's fantasy GM approach has seen the team get worse and worse. If he isn't held in check he'll trade away someone like Frye for a Tim Thomas type player.

  7. #27
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    1,536
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by RutgersJetFan
    If evaluating the talent of prospects and evaluating the talent of current NBA players were one and the same, then personel who worked in the draft department of every team in the NBA would be consulted on every trade and every free agent which dealt with current NBA players.

    Look at strictly his draft history with the Raptors and the Knicks, the roster speaks for itself. Strictly in terms of high schoolers and college players he knows what to look for. For some reason he can't figure it out with pro's though. Why? Who knows. It's Isiah Thomas, he was a nutjob when he was a player and he's a nutjob as a GM.

    Why Isiah has made some of the signings he has is one of the biggest mysteries in sports today. The Jerome James contract might be worse than what the Celtics gave Brian Scalabrine this year, it's a toss up between the two for "worst contract of the decade." Honestly I think the guy just doesn't understand how the salary cap works in basketball, thus, he should not be running ANY team ANYWHERE.

    It's a little early to say Nate's a stupid pick. The guy plays hard for the 20-30 minutes he gets per game, is a fan favorite, and makes some great plays here and there. Granted he makes a lot of dumb plays, but he's a rookie so that's a given. That Bulls game last week certainly wouldn't have gone into overtime had it not been for Nate stepping up in that last minute and weaving through the D. The jury's out on him and will be for a while.
    It's not too early to call Nate a stupid pick. Like Earl Boykins he can be a valuable NBA player, but he can never be a star because he will always be a defensive liability. At that point in the first round if you are going to reach, it's got to be for a guy that could dominate at his position and be a guy who can start in the NBA. At his size he wil never dominate...ever.
    Nate should never have gone before the 10th pick in the 2nd round. Monta Ellis, a HS kid who the Warriors got in the 40's, would have been a better reach than Nate.
    Last edited by cornjulio21; 01-26-2006 at 04:34 PM.

  8. #28
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    2,495
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by RutgersJetFan
    Simple, look at every first round choice he's ever made for any franchise.

    Toronto - Damon Stoudamire, Marcus Camby, Tracy McGrady
    New York - Sweetney, and Frye, Robinson, and Lee (all in one draft). Also remember he called Trevor Ariza in the 2nd round.

    Sooner or later you have to give the guy credit for being an astute judge of talent when it comes to high schoolers and college players. The trades and signings he's made have absolutely been horrific, and if you reread my post you'll see that I've already said he's a complete disaster as a GM. But Isiah is a great drafter and his history shows that, if there's legitimate facts you can point to that show to him only getting "lucky" in every draft, then I'd love to hear them. Because some of the choices he did make, like choosing Stoudamire over Ed O'Bannon, McGrady over Danny Fortson, Lee over S. Stoudamire and Ewing....those were all Isiah.
    you can say good drafter, just not a good talent evaluator, becuase when he makes trades or signs free agents the talent he's aquiring is usually awful.

  9. #29
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    29,953
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by gmogmo
    you can say good drafter, just not a good talent evaluator, becuase when he makes trades or signs free agents the talent he's aquiring is usually awful.
    Please reread the post, at nowhere did I dissagree with any of what you just said.

    "Sooner or later you have to give the guy credit for being an astute judge of talent when it comes to high schoolers and college players."

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Follow Us