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Thread: OT- If Pete Rose cant make the hall Why Barry?

  1. #1
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    OT- If Pete Rose cant make the hall Why Barry?

    Let me first start by saying I don't condone what Pete Rose did.

    But the guy flat out did it on the field. IMO he has paid his price. Its a damn Travesty that the all time hit KING is not in the Hall Of Fame because he made some bets.

    BUT Barry Bonds can CHEAT which IMO is the worst thing you can do as far as the integrity of the game. Some of baseballs records that stood for years are broken because of Performance Enhancing drugs.

    Now some of you will say Players have been cheating for years yada yada..

    like Corking bats, taking greenies, whatever.. Did Baseballs records DIE because of those things??? no.

    Bonds took it to a whole new Level.

    So my Point is, If Pete Rose is BANNED from baseball for Making bets and betting on his team to win,

    then Bonds should Be Banned from Baseball for LIFE with no chance of paroll.

    What Really bothers me the most is that Bonds is blaming everyone but himself for all his problems publicly. He is actually believing his own lies!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by LETSGOJETS
    Let me first start by saying I don't condone what Pete Rose did.

    But the guy flat out did it on the field. IMO he has paid his price. Its a damn Travesty that the all time hit KING is not in the Hall Of Fame because he made some bets.

    BUT Barry Bonds can CHEAT which IMO is the worst thing you can do as far as the integrity of the game. Some of baseballs records that stood for years are broken because of Performance Enhancing drugs.

    Now some of you will say Players have been cheating for years yada yada..

    like Corking bats, taking greenies, whatever.. Did Baseballs records DIE because of those things??? no.

    Bonds took it to a whole new Level.

    So my Point is, If Pete Rose is BANNED from baseball for Making bets and betting on his team to win,

    then Bonds should Be Banned from Baseball for LIFE with no chance of paroll.

    What Really bothers me the most is that Bonds is blaming everyone but himself for all his problems publicly. He is actually believing his own lies!!
    First off Pete Rose belongs in the Hall of Fame. The Hall of Fame is for accomplishment ON THE FIELD. Therefore Rose should be there. The only reason he isn't is because of the ban.
    What are you gonna ban Bonds for? Breaking a rule that didn't exist? There was no steroid policy in baseball until last year. Look, I don't disagree that his success was fueled by steroids, at least since '98. But prior to '98 he already had Hall of Fame numbers. He hasn't officially broken any rules, you can't touch him, just be pissed off.

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    Bonds cheated in order to upstage other cheaters in McGwire and Sosa. He's a bad person and he should be punished. I just don't think leaving a legend out of the Hall, like Rose or Bonds, is the way to do it.

    I really don't like the singling out of just Barry Bonds by the media. Bonds is just as much a cheater as McGwire, Sosa, Palmeiro, Giambi, Pudge, (Brett Boone?) are. They're all crooked and they all should be dealt with accordingly adn most won't get into the Hall. Going after just Bonds as a respesentation of the steroid era though lets the others off the hook. Bonds, and probably Pudge, are the only ones on that list who's talent and production put them in the Hall before the steroid era. And in doing so, I think they belong, along with Pete Rose/Joe Jackson/etc...

    What pisses me off about this situation more than anything is the fact that Bonds was going down as the single most dominant baseball force in my lifetime, and he tarnished it all by getting jealous of McGwire/Sosa's cheating and deciding to follow suit. The entire situation just sucks for the fans.

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    [QUOTE=swityak11] Bonds, and probably Pudge, are the only ones on that list who's talent and production put them in the Hall before the steroid era. QUOTE]


    NO F'in way that if bonds Retired in 1997 he would make the hall.

    How can you say that?

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    Mike Schmidt recently admitted to using amphetamines for most of his career. They were not banned then but are now. Should we take his Hall of Fame plaque away?

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    Quote Originally Posted by klecko73god
    First off Pete Rose belongs in the Hall of Fame. The Hall of Fame is for accomplishment ON THE FIELD. Therefore Rose should be there. The only reason he isn't is because of the ban.
    What are you gonna ban Bonds for? Breaking a rule that didn't exist? There was no steroid policy in baseball until last year. Look, I don't disagree that his success was fueled by steroids, at least since '98. But prior to '98 he already had Hall of Fame numbers. He hasn't officially broken any rules, you can't touch him, just be pissed off.

    So Rose gets banned for breaking a rule. And the reason the no betting rule was even created was because "it messes with the integrity of the game"

    Taking Steroids and breaking some of baseball's records that have stood for years is FAR and beyond messing with the Integrity

    thats messing with the Integrity in the worst sense!!

    However, Bonds is still Playing baseball and will be eligible for the hall.

    It makes me sick
    Last edited by LETSGOJETS; 03-09-2006 at 01:07 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisrud
    Mike Schmidt recently admitted to using amphetamines for most of his career. They were not banned then but are now. Should we take his Hall of Fame plaque away?

    I knew it was a matter of time before someone said anything about the greenies or Amphetamines...

    thats like telling me

    I got a ticket for J walking so Im just as bad as the dude who robbed the bank... We both broke the law right???

    the degree of what Bonds did to cheat, is 10X worse than some greenie pills

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    Betting on baseball is worse than steroids.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBound
    Betting on baseball is worse than steroids.

    BullS.hit

    BULL S.HIT

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    [QUOTE=LETSGOJETS]
    Quote Originally Posted by swityak11
    Bonds, and probably Pudge, are the only ones on that list who's talent and production put them in the Hall before the steroid era. QUOTE]


    NO F'in way that if bonds Retired in 1997 he would make the hall.

    How can you say that?
    After the '98 season, which is when the steroid use started, according to the book. Bonds had 1917 hits, 411 HR, 1216 RBI, 445 SB, 1364 Runs scored, a career BA of .290, 5 30-30 seasons and MLBs only 40-40 season. He was 32 years old, its not a big stretch to say he would have been in the Hall of Fame if he played another 4-5 years at about the same level. In fact there are guys in the Hall with number worse than what he had after 98.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LETSGOJETS
    NO F'in way that if bonds Retired in 1997 he would make the hall.

    How can you say that?
    I can easily say that. EqA is a bit flawed but is probably the closest stat available to measure individual offensive production. Its doesn't figure in his 8 Gold Gloves.

    Bonds (Pre-99)
    OPS - .982
    OPS+ - 162
    EqA - .331

    Some other notable career EqA's for comparison...
    Babe Ruth - .373
    Ted Williams - .366
    Hank Aaron - .323
    Mickey Mantle - .344
    Willie Mays - .325
    Ty Cobb - .332

    Bonds was up there with the best the game has ever seen before the steroids.
    Last edited by ozu; 03-09-2006 at 01:19 PM.

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    [QUOTE=klecko73god]
    Quote Originally Posted by LETSGOJETS
    After the '98 season, which is when the steroid use started, according to the book. Bonds had 1917 hits, 411 HR, 1216 RBI, 445 SB, 1364 Runs scored, a career BA of .290, 5 30-30 seasons and MLBs only 40-40 season. He was 32 years old, its not a big stretch to say he would have been in the Hall of Fame if he played another 4-5 years at about the same level. In fact there are guys in the Hall with number worse than what he had after 98.

    actually If I'm not mistaken, it says in 1998 he started not after.

    you cant go on what if..

    What he accomplished up to 1998 should be considered his records, and everything else thrown out.

    see, Steroids does more than make you hit the ball farther. It gives you the confidence that you have an edge. and when you give Barry Bonds an edge, thats beyond ridiculous.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LETSGOJETS
    So Rose gets banned for breaking a rule. And the reason the no betting rule was even created was because "it messes with the integrity of the game"

    Taking Steroids and breaking some of baseball's records that have stood for years is FAR and beyond messing with the Integrity

    thats messing with the Integrity in the worst sense!!

    However, Bonds is still Playing baseball and will be eligible for the hall.

    It makes me sick
    That's exactly my point. The thing that sucks the most about this is he can not and will not be punished, at least not officially.

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    Quote Originally Posted by swityak11
    I can easily say that. EqA is a bit flawed but is probably the closest stat available to measure individual offensive production. Its doesn't figure in his 8 Gold Gloves.

    Bonds (Pre-99)
    OPS - .982
    OPS+ - 162
    EqA - .331

    Some other notable career EqA's for comparison...
    Babe Ruth - .373
    Ted Williams - .366
    Hank Aaron - .323
    Mickey Mantle - .344
    Willie Mays - .325
    Ty Cobb - .332

    Bonds was up there with the best the game has ever seen before the steroids.


    I never said he wasnt a great player.. but how does that Put him in the hall if his career ended in 1997?

    thats 10 years in the Bigs, no Championships, One of the Worst Post season Numbers ever...

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    Quote Originally Posted by LETSGOJETS
    I never said he wasnt a great player.. but how does that Put him in the hall if his career ended in 1997?

    thats 10 years in the Bigs, no Championships, One of the Worst Post season Numbers ever...
    If championships and post season numbers were basis for HoF voting, people like Jim Leyritz would be getting in. Thankfully a players dominance relative to the time he was playing counts a whole lot more... (See Sandy Koufax with less than 10 full seasons).

    Before the steroid era, Bonds had 3 MVPs, 8 Gold Gloves, 7 Silver Sluggers, and 8 All Star appearances. That he'd get in on those accomplishments alone is a no brainer as far as I'm concerned.
    Last edited by ozu; 03-09-2006 at 01:45 PM.

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    Before all the steroids Bonds was a three-time MVP and a seven time Gold Glove winner to say he wasn't a Hall of Famer at that point is ridiculous. Do you know how many people have won three MVPs?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisrud
    Before all the steroids Bonds was a three-time MVP and a seven time Gold Glove winner to say he wasn't a Hall of Famer at that point is ridiculous. Do you know how many people have won three MVPs?
    'before the steroids'... he could've been on roids the whole time!

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