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Thread: Pelosi ridiculously effective

  1. #1
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    Pelosi ridiculously effective

    WASHINGTON Sworn in just over two weeks ago as the first female speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi wasted no time showing who's boss.

    The California Democrat rammed six major bills through the House at breakneck speed, stomped out smoking privileges near the House floor, partially sidelined a powerful Democratic committee chairman and decided she liked traditionally Republican office space so much she claimed it for herself.

    By Democrats' timekeeping, she did it all in far under the 100 legislative hours she had allotted.

    "We did what we promised the American people we would," Pelosi declared on Friday, pledging it was "just the beginning."

    Pelosi's initial agenda, completed Thursday, included measures with wide popular support: increasing the minimum wage, broadening stem cell research, allowing government bargaining on Medicare drug prices, cutting student loan costs, putting in place terrorism-fighting recommendations from the Sept. 11 commission and rolling back energy company tax breaks.

    [url]http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/politics/4486573.html[/url]

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    pretty successful and I like most of what they did

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    [QUOTE=Tanginius]pretty successful and I like most of what they did[/QUOTE]

    As the First Woman in her position I can only expect her too set a good example of how things should be run.

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    How hard is it, really, to pass legislation in a Body you control with a strong majority?

    And how much of what she passed helps average Americans? Most of it will just result in more social welfare, and more taxes coming out of my pocket.

    Yep. Thanks for THAT. :rolleyes:

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    This is all just more big government garbage. Some of these policies are disastrous.

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    [QUOTE=Warfish]How hard is it, really, to pass legislation in a Body you control with a strong majority?

    And how much of what she passed helps average Americans? Most of it will just result in more social welfare, and more taxes coming out of my pocket.

    Yep. Thanks for THAT. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]


    now, wait a second. She did commandeer some office space and tell people to stop smoking inside. That has to count for something.

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    [QUOTE=jets5ever]This is all just more big government garbage. Some of these policies are disastrous.[/QUOTE]

    Which policies are disasterous?

    [I]
    increasing the minimum wage, broadening stem cell research, allowing government bargaining on Medicare drug prices, cutting student loan costs, putting in place terrorism-fighting recommendations from the Sept. 11 commission and rolling back energy company tax breaks.[/I]

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    [QUOTE=Jetdawgg]Which policies are disasterous?

    [I]
    increasing the minimum wage, broadening stem cell research, allowing government bargaining on Medicare drug prices, cutting student loan costs, putting in place terrorism-fighting recommendations from the Sept. 11 commission and rolling back energy company tax breaks.[/I][/QUOTE]

    Raising the minimum wage harms poor people and people with the least skills. It is a bad thing. If the Dems truly cared about poor people or people wuth the lowest skills, they'd abolish the minimum wage. Lowering the rate on college loans will very likely end up increasing the rate at which prices for college go up, and they are already going up too fast. The sky-rocketing prices of college courses are the main reason why people can't afford it, not the rate on the loan. A lower rate is a good idea, provided the government doesn't have to reimburse the lenders to whom they have gauranteed a return, which is happening now since loan rates are already artificially lower than market rates. So, this reduction will make the government's burden even higher and will likely have to be funded with new taxes. There is no such thing as a free lunch. There is no way to reduce the rate with adding on to these costs because no lender can make money lending at these rates...if they could, they would already. What this is is Big Government, and it should be stated as such...but liberals love to mask their policies in faux empathy...empathy they pay for with everyone ELSE's money. They want the federal government to start paying for a larger portion of college. That's a fine position to take, but be honest about it and it's costs for everyone. That's a debate that should occur out in the open, not wrapped as some sort of ridiculous "rate reduction" as if you can simply wave a wand and change ecomic reality.

    Embryonic stem cell research is a decent enough cause I guess, but I fail to see why the US government has to be in the business of creating human life simply to destroy it, especially with other sources of stem cells (like the recent breakthroughs with stem cells from amniotic fluid) and adult stem cells have shown more promise than embryonic, to date.

    The Dems promised they'd enact "all" 9-11 Commisssion recommendations, but they aren't doing that because some of them required changes to the status quo vis a vis Congress. So now, when they clearly are not following their platform, the new spin is they are enacting the "terrorism-fighting" recommendations of the Commission, as if the ones they are neglecting to enact deal with jaywalking or something. And is the 9-11 Commission report wisdom incarnate, the all-knowing one speaking ex cathedra about policy?

    Allowing the government to "negotiate" drug prices is code for price contols. Price controls will be DISASTROUS and have failed everywhere and everywhen they have ever been tried. This will literally cost people their lives by limiting their choices and creating an environment where new drugs are not developed.

    "Rolling back tax breaks" is a fancy word for raising taxes. Dems never want to come out and admit that they are rasising taxes, so they use these phrases, or use class warfare and phrases like "the rich" that stupid people buy into. The notion that taxes can be raised without other ramifications is ridiculously stupid. This will end up making us MORE dependent on forgien oil and will end up raising the prices we pay for it. The companies will pass these additional costs onto us.
    Last edited by jets5ever; 01-22-2007 at 05:12 PM.

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    Democrats think spending is the cureall for everything. Next is higher taxes!

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    [QUOTE=MnJetFan]Democrats think spending is the cureall for everything. Next is higher taxes![/QUOTE]

    Thanks to the deficit that GWB left behind with his unpaid for war. Great idea GWB, pay for a war with a credit card and then blame the democrats.

    There goes the "borrow and spend" republicans again....

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    [QUOTE=jets5ever]Raising the minimum wage harms poor people and people with the least skills. It is a bad thing. If the Dems truly cared about poor people or people wuth the lowest skills, they'd abolish the minimum wage. [/QUOTE]


    I'm interested to see your reasoning for this comment. Please elaborate.

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    [QUOTE=sourceworx]I'm interested to see your reasoning for this comment. Please elaborate.[/QUOTE]


    I've written about it at length in other threads...wish I knew how to search around better. Let me try to find one, so I don't have to post it all again....

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    [QUOTE=jets5ever]Raising the minimum wage harms poor people and people with the least skills. It is a bad thing. If the Dems truly cared about poor people or people wuth the lowest skills, they'd abolish the minimum wage. Lowering the rate on college loans will very likely end up increasing the rate at which prices for college go up, and they are already going up too fast. The sky-rocketing prices of college courses are the main reason why people can't afford it, not the rate on the loan. A lower rate is a good idea, provided the government doesn't have to reimburse the lenders to whom they have gauranteed a return, which is happening now since loan rates are already artificially lower than market rates. So, this reduction will make the government's burden even higher and will likely have to be funded with new taxes. There is no such thing as a free lunch. There is no way to reduce the rate with adding on to these costs because no lender can make money lending at these rates...if they could, they would already. What this is is Big Government, and it should be stated as such...but liberals love to mask their policies in faux empathy...empathy they pay for with everyone ELSE's money. They want the federal government to start paying for a larger portion of college. That's a fine position to take, but be honest about it and it's costs for everyone. That's a debate that should occur out in the open, not wrapped as some sort of ridiculous "rate reduction" as if you can simply wave a wand and change ecomic reality.


    [COLOR=Blue]???????????[/COLOR]

    Embryonic stem cell research is a decent enough cause I guess, but I fail to see why the US government has to be in the business of creating human life simply to destroy it, especially with other sources of stem cells (like the recent breakthroughs with stem cells from amniotic fluid) and adult stem cells have shown more promise than embryonic, to date.


    [COLOR=Blue]Let's just leave this all to the private industry. W/o some intervention here who knows what these guys will create. They (private industry) already want us to eat cloned meat w/o our knowledge of it.[/COLOR]

    The Dems promised they'd enact "all" 9-11 Commisssion recommendations, but they aren't doing that because some of them required changes to the status quo vis a vis Congress. So now, when they clearly are not following their platform, the new spin is they are enacting the "terrorism-fighting" recommendations of the Commission, as if the ones they are neglecting to enact deal with jaywalking or something. And is the 9-11 Commission report wisdom incarnate, the all-knowing one speaking ex cathedra about policy?

    [COLOR=Blue]It is a strech here. "All" of the 911 will never be enabled. The major ones like Port Security/Airport Security/Rail Security which have all been ignored by this president is a step in the right direction.[/COLOR]


    Allowing the government to "negotiate" drug prices is code for price contols. Price controls will be DISASTROUS and have failed everywhere and everywhen they have ever been tried. This will literally cost people their lives by limiting their choices and creating an environment where new drugs are not developed.

    [COLOR=Blue]I suppose the current system is working? People are running to CA for drugs and the big pharms continue to squash the generic makers. I saw where Pfizer now is laying off 10,000 folks. They plan had to be in mind a long time ago. They did not come up with the idea last week.

    The system that GWB had in place is not working.[/COLOR]


    "Rolling back tax breaks" is a fancy word for raising taxes. Dems never want to come out and admit that they are rasising taxes, so they use these phrases, or use class warfare and phrases like "the rich" that stupid people buy into. The notion that taxes can be raised without other ramifications is ridiculously stupid. This will end up making us MORE dependent on forgien oil and will end up raising the prices we pay for it. The companies will pass these additional costs onto us.[/QUOTE]


    The unpaid for war of the republican adminsitration will cause a lot more tax increases. The borrow and spend republican philosphy is another failure. Then they say "the dems raise taxes" This is only to clean up the mess that the republicans have left.

    [COLOR=Blue]After Reagan got out of office, Bush 1 had to raise taxes and we did not have a long war then. You think that econmy is good? Well when you look under the covers and see it is on a credit card you may want to think again.

    This admin is a failure and the people have repudiated it in the last election. [/COLOR]

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    [QUOTE=sourceworx]I'm interested to see your reasoning for this comment. Please elaborate.[/QUOTE]


    The theory is people are paid as a function of their productivity. While "Hard" work is welcomed, it doesn't necessarily result in more productive work. Think how hard it would be for men to move something that ways a ton, as compared to a crane or truck. People who earn the least typically are the least productive. They have not developed the skills to be a more productive worker yet, whether it is from lack of education, opportunity, work etc. If you subscribe to the theory that wage is a function of productivity, when you artificially raise the wage above that of what the function of productivity would be, these less productive workers would not be able to find a job. No one is going to hire a worker that losses them money. While working, workers typically develop skills that make them more productive. Again , since they are now more productive, these workers should be able to get jobs paying better wages

    What usually happens in situations like this is typical of what happens when rent controls are instituted. The few get a "good deal" (unnaturally higher wage or lower rent) while the majority (of unskilled workers/renters) get screwed (can not find work even though they are willing to work for less of a wage/ housing shortages driving up rents.) The ultimate "kick in the nuts" in this situation is it leads to off the book hires. These people work for less of a wage and don't pay taxes.


    Unfortunately, i am not as articulate as 5. I hope I explain the theory suffice
    Last edited by Lawyers, Guns and Money; 01-23-2007 at 11:09 AM.

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    [QUOTE=Jetdawgg]The unpaid for war of the republican adminsitration will cause a lot more tax increases. The borrow and spend republican philosphy is another failure. Then they say "the dems raise taxes" This is only to clean up the mess that the republicans have left.

    [COLOR=Blue]After Reagan got out of office, Bush 1 had to raise taxes and we did not have a long war then. You think that econmy is good? Well when you look under the covers and see it is on a credit card you may want to think again.

    This admin is a failure and the people have repudiated it in the last election. [/COLOR][/QUOTE]


    I suppose "???????" is your implying that my words were ridiculous? Interesting. I don't know if I can be any clearer.

    Yes, we should leave that research to the private sector.

    The Dems backed out of their promise regarding "all" the 9/11 Commisson recs. Glad you agree.


    Big Pharm spends billions and billions on research for new drugs. When that research fails, as Pfizer's high profile project did recently, these firms suffer. Laying off 10,000 is part of what they have to do to compete. The only reason these firms risk billions of dollars on research is because some of that research pays off. If you enact price controls on what they can charge, their profits will shrink and that risky research won't be worth it to them. The population as a whole will lose out on tons of new and innovative drugs and drug companies will stop producing as much as they do now. The innovation of the American pharmaceutical indsustry has improved the lives of millions of Americans because drugs are very sophisticated nowadays and people can ameliorate conditions, treat conditions and prevent many conditions with simple meds, instead of more expensive inpatient or outpatient care. You seem to have this belief that prices can be set by some third party wthout consequences. Minimum wage laws, rent control, price controls for drugs, rates for loans, etc....you cannot wave a wand and change economic reality.

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    [QUOTE=Lawyers, Guns and Money]The theory is people are paid as a function of their productivity. While "Hard" work is welcomed, it doesn't necessarily result in more productive work. Think how hard it would be for men to move something that ways a ton, as compared to a crane or truck. People who earn the least typically are the least productive. They have not developed the skills to be a more productive worker yet, whether it is from lack of education, opportunity, work etc. If you subscribe to the theory that wage is a function of productivity, when you artificially raise the wage above that of what the function of productivity would be, these less productive workers would not be able to find a job. No one is going to hire a worker that losses them money. While working, workers typically develop skills that make them more productive. Again , since they are now more productive, these workers should be able to get jobs paying better wages

    What usually happens in situations like this is typical of what happens when rent controls are instituted. The few get a "good deal" (unnaturally higher wage or lower rent) while the majority (of unskilled workers/renters) get screwed (can not find work even though they are willing to work for less of a wage/ housing shortages driving up rents.) The ultimate "kick in the nuts" in this situation is it leads to off the book hires. These people work for less of a wage and don't pay taxes.


    Unfortunately, i am not as articulate as 5. I hope I explain the theory suffice[/QUOTE]


    Thanks, I can definitely see your point.

  17. #17
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    [QUOTE=Jetdawgg]The unpaid for war of the republican adminsitration will cause a lot more tax increases. The borrow and spend republican philosphy is another failure. Then they say "the dems raise taxes" This is only to clean up the mess that the republicans have left.

    [COLOR=Blue]After Reagan got out of office, Bush 1 had to raise taxes and we did not have a long war then. You think that econmy is good? Well when you look under the covers and see it is on a credit card you may want to think again.

    This admin is a failure and the people have repudiated it in the last election. [/COLOR][/QUOTE]



    You know why I can't take anything you say seriously? Because every so often you come out with gems like "The government is trying to get us to eat cloned meat!!!"

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    [QUOTE=jets5ever]I suppose "???????" is your implying that my words were ridiculous? Interesting. I don't know if I can be any clearer.

    Yes, we should leave that research to the private sector.

    The Dems backed out of their promise regarding "all" the 9/11 Commisson recs. Glad you agree.


    Big Pharm spends billions and billions on research for new drugs. When that research fails, as Pfizer's high profile project did recently, these firms suffer. Laying off 10,000 is part of what they have to do to compete. The only reason these firms risk billions of dollars on research is because some of that research pays off. If you enact price controls on what they can charge, their profits will shrink and that risky research won't be worth it to them. The population as a whole will lose out on tons of new and innovative drugs and drug companies will stop producing as much as they do now. The innovation of the American pharmaceutical indsustry has improved the lives of millions of Americans because drugs are very sophisticated nowadays and people can ameliorate conditions, treat conditions and prevent many conditions with simple meds, instead of more expensive inpatient or outpatient care. You seem to have this belief that prices can be set by some third party wthout consequences. Minimum wage laws, rent control, price controls for drugs, rates for loans, etc....you cannot wave a wand and change economic reality.[/QUOTE]

    Big comapnies don't innovate. Innovation cames from small companies. New start ups. Big companies buy these smaller ones for what they produce. The big companies then scale the products/services.

    As for the 10,000 people...What a disaster. Some people here will never get back up on their feet to the same level. (No minimum wage if it was left up to you).

    What about their pensions? All those years that they gave to Pfizer down in an instant. The CEO will get paid though. Millions for doing a lousy job.

    Great philosophy we got going here. Pick on the little guys and reward the failures at teh top.

  19. #19
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    [QUOTE=Jetdawgg]Big comapnies don't innovate. Innovation cames from small companies. New start ups. Big companies buy these smaller ones for what they produce. The big companies then scale the products/services.

    As for the 10,000 people...What a disaster. Some people here will never get back up on their feet to the same level. (No minimum wage if it was left up to you).

    What about their pensions? All those years that they gave to Pfizer down in an instant. The CEO will get paid though. Millions for doing a lousy job.

    Great philosophy we got going here. Pick on the little guys and reward the failures at teh top.[/QUOTE]

    No offense, but you're not smart enough for me to spend time talking to anymore. You simply refuse to think.

  20. #20
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    [QUOTE=jets5ever]No offense, but you're not smart enough for me to spend time talking to anymore. You simply refuse to think.[/QUOTE]

    5, I thought you were smarter than this bro......havn't you gotton it yet?

    --It's Small Business (LIKE HIS) that do all the good in America.

    --It's Former Slave Decendants (LIKE HIM) that deserve special treatment and reparations.

    --It's Liberals (LIKE HIM) that fix all the problems, and have all the answers.

    --It's Environmentalists (LIKE HIM) that caree about teh Earth, and will keep it safe.

    --It's Marines (LIKE HIM) that keep us safe, and then tell us how great they are.

    You noticing a trend yet old freind?

    Dawgg is the Greatest American Ever to Live. In fact, I believe the Earth actually orbits.....Dawgg! :eek: His greateness is THAT BIG.

    I'm suprised you couldn't figure this out 5, really.

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