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Thread: Justice Dept: FBI abused Patriot Act

  1. #1
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    Justice Dept: FBI abused Patriot Act

    WASHINGTON - The FBI improperly and, in some cases, illegally used the USA Patriot Act to secretly obtain personal information about people in the United States, a Justice Department audit concluded Friday.

    And for three years the FBI has underreported to Congress how often it forced businesses to turn over the customer data, the audit found.

    FBI agents sometimes demanded the data without proper authorization, according to the 126-page audit by Justice Department Inspector General Glenn Fine. At other times, the audit found, the FBI improperly obtained telephone records in non-emergency circumstances.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11100916/
    wow - yeah no one saw this coming

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    The freedom of privacy is slowly trickling away in this country because of fear tactics in the name of terrorism. Our way of life and core principles are changing, and that signifies victory for our enemies. The founding fathers must be rolling in their graves.

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    who would've thunk it?

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    A Bad thing indeed.

    But at least they see it was done wrong, they made the failure/problem public, and they are taking responsabillity and taking steps to fix it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish
    A Bad thing indeed.

    But at least they see it was done wrong, they made the failure/problem public, and they are taking responsabillity and taking steps to fix it.
    Yeah and why did they find out about it?


    "Fine's annual review is required by Congress, over the objections of the Bush administration."



    it's GOOD to have checks and balances... especially when you have such a corrupt administration in the White House

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish
    A Bad thing indeed.

    But at least they see it was done wrong, they made the failure/problem public, and they are taking responsabillity and taking steps to fix it.
    exactly..instead of pushing it under the rug they are going to repair...nothing is perfect and face it, we are learning on the fly here with the state of the world as it is

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    Would this be information about your grandma or about suspected terrorists?

    (and yes, it does make a difference.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetswin
    ...nothing is perfect and face it, we are learning on the fly here with the state of the world as it is

    Lesson 1 - It may not be in your best interests to supply training and weapons to a cave dwelling maniac even if he is the enemy of your enemy.


    Lesson 2 - It may not be in your best interests to supply training and weapons to a Middle Eastern despot even if he is the enemy of your enemy.

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    The BUSH Justice Department released this report.

    Don't you libs believe everything the administration reports is a lie? Wonder what Craig Livingstone and Anthony Marceca think of this report.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PlumberKhan
    Lesson 1 - It may not be in your best interests to supply training and weapons to a cave dwelling maniac even if he is the enemy of your enemy.


    Lesson 2 - It may not be in your best interests to supply training and weapons to a Middle Eastern despot even if he is the enemy of your enemy.
    The US always thinks short-term. It never seems to think long-term.

    And THAT, above all else, is it's failure.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish
    The US always thinks short-term. It never seems to think long-term.

    And THAT, above all else, is it's failure.
    And that is why the war in Iraq is destined for failure.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kennyo7
    And that is why the war in Iraq is destined for failure.
    As we've already covered (repeatedly), the reason we are "destined for failure" in Iraq has more to do with improper tactics, preperation and planning than it does with long-term thinking.

    It was previous Presidents/Congresses lack of long-term thought that put us where we are now. It's Bush's (and his staff and his commanders) inabillity to plan or strategize worth a damn that has us screwed going forward.

    Had Iraq been broken up along ethnic lines upon our initial Millitary victory, success was absolutely possible. It wasn't, and now it isn't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish
    As we've already covered (repeatedly), the reason we are "destined for failure" in Iraq has more to do with improper tactics, preperation and planning than it does with long-term thinking.

    It was previous Presidents/Congresses lack of long-term thought that put us where we are now. It's Bush's (and his staff and his commanders) inabillity to plan or strategize worth a damn that has us screwed going forward.

    Had Iraq been broken up along ethnic lines upon our initial Millitary victory, success was absolutely possible. It wasn't, and now it isn't.
    No you are wrong.
    The problem is lack of long term thinking.
    Breaking up Iraq along ethnic lines is easier said than done. The three groups have to agree on how the nation is divided and that wont be easy or w/o blood shed. The key is the oil rich land that lies on primarily Shia land. Why are the shia going to give it/or some of it up. And how much of that land must be given up to keep the Kurds and Sunnis happy.
    Going to war w/o thinking about this and having potential plans for solution is a lack of long term thinking.
    The short term thinking was how our military would topple saddam. That was a no brainer. The real problem lay down the road.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by kennyo7
    No you are wrong.
    The problem is lack of long term thinking.
    Breaking up Iraq along ethnic lines is easier said than done. The three groups have to agree on how the nation is divided and that wont be easy or w/o blood shed. The key is the oil rich land that lies on primarily Shia land. Why are the shia going to give it/or some of it up. And how much of that land must be given up to keep the Kurds and Sunnis happy.
    Going to war w/o thinking about this and having potential plans for solution is a lack of long term thinking.
    The short term thinking was how our military would topple saddam. That was a no brainer. The real problem lay down the road.
    It's only hard if you care how the locals feel instead of caring how many of your onw men die. In this case, after deposing the Tyrant they were too afriad to fight, their feelings are the least of my concerns. Overwhelming Force and Martial Law overcomes any unhappyness with which section they get at the start. But like I said, we've already covered this, and we simply agree to disagree. No worries, it's well too late one way or the other now anyhow.

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    I think everyone should have seen this coming a mile away. But, at the end of the day, there hasn't been a terror attack against the Unites States since 2001. And, personally speaking, none of my liberties have ever been compromised.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pauliec
    I think everyone should have seen this coming a mile away. But, at the end of the day, there hasn't been a terror attack against the Unites States since 2001. And, personally speaking, none of my liberties have ever been compromised.
    How do you know? There is no way to tell whether your financial or communication information has ever been monitored or not.

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    Quote Originally Posted by parafly
    How do you know? There is no way to tell whether your financial or communication information has ever been monitored or not.
    If you don't know, and it never effects you, were your liberties actually breatched?

    Such deep issues, lol. I am no fan of a police state, but finding the balance on the razors edge of keeping us safe vs. keeping us free is awful awful tough. I usually lean towards the "free" side, but seeing how our enemies are smart enough to use our own freedoms to kill us, it becomes much tougher.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish
    If you don't know, and it never effects you, were your liberties actually breatched?

    Such deep issues, lol. I am no fan of a police state, but finding the balance on the razors edge of keeping us safe vs. keeping us free is awful awful tough. I usually lean towards the "free" side, but seeing how our enemies are smart enough to use our own freedoms to kill us, it becomes much tougher.
    As I have said before, those who object to the Patriot Act will be the first to scream "how did the CIA and FBI not know" should another terror attack occur.
    If you object to the Patriot Act, then how should we be tracking potential terrorists?

  19. #19
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    Nobody fault the US for not looking long-term and then blaming Bush for fighting the war in iraq. We could have mopped up iraq (with many civilian casualties) in a matter of weeks and left. And just what would have filled that void? Exactly what happened in afghanistan with the taliban.

    The first iraq war proves that you can win a war and it could be a disaster in the long run. Winning decisively and leaving the original problem (saddam) to fester finds us where we are now. And if we had finished saddam then, possibly what's happening today would have happened 16 years ago -- a terrorist and insurgent playground.

    Not doing anything in iraq in 1991 may have left saddam in charge of a vast majority of the ME.

    I don't mean to upset you libs, but the world is a complex and dangerous place and loaded with dictators and barbarians. And I hate to break to you, but the dictators and barbarians don't come from America.
    Last edited by Spirit of Weeb; 03-09-2007 at 06:18 PM.

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    When you find out it would be too late.

    Quote Originally Posted by pauliec
    I think everyone should have seen this coming a mile away. But, at the end of the day, there hasn't been a terror attack against the Unites States since 2001. And, personally speaking, none of my liberties have ever been compromised.

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