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Thread: Nhl

  1. #1

    Nhl

    Now that Metro teams are out of it this board will slowly suffocate until next year.

    The NHL is in serious trouble in the USA. It is not a very popular sport outside of the north. The league should close some of the poor attendance teams in the south and scatter these players to the remaining teams.

    Any thoughts???

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by FloridaJet
    Now that Metro teams are out of it this board will slowly suffocate until next year.

    The NHL is in serious trouble in the USA. It is not a very popular sport outside of the north. The league should close some of the poor attendance teams in the south and scatter these players to the remaining teams.

    Any thoughts???
    The problem is not always the teams in the south though. Take a look at the New Jersey and Detroit games...Detroit has yet to sell out a home playoff game....DETROIT! Hockeytown, USA! New Jersey had trouble selling out a game all year, period...and was still sometimes 4000 seats + shy of a sellout in the playoffs. The fact is, that some of these teams with good talent, really good talent can't sell out their arenas. Yet, you have teams like Buffalo who sell 19000 plus tickets, and have 8000+ people standing outside the arena watching TV for 3 hours...

    I agree with the sentiment that this league would do well to contract a few teams, but I don't agree that it has to do it in the south...Take a long look at your fan attendance and support and contract the ones with the least amount....no matter where they are.

  3. #3
    I agree, but the problem with the NHL is that they keep isolating their fan base with the TV deals, the two strikes in 10 years, and closing many beloved franchises and moving them to worse areas. I think Qubec City could use its team back, so could Winnipeg, Hartford, and Oakland. If the NHL adopts the same strategy as MLS did: having smaller arenas which cater more to the fans' needs, they could be much more successful in these small cities with a good fanbase.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken O'Brien #7
    The problem is not always the teams in the south though. Take a look at the New Jersey and Detroit games...Detroit has yet to sell out a home playoff game....DETROIT! Hockeytown, USA! New Jersey had trouble selling out a game all year, period...and was still sometimes 4000 seats + shy of a sellout in the playoffs. The fact is, that some of these teams with good talent, really good talent can't sell out their arenas. Yet, you have teams like Buffalo who sell 19000 plus tickets, and have 8000+ people standing outside the arena watching TV for 3 hours...

    I agree with the sentiment that this league would do well to contract a few teams, but I don't agree that it has to do it in the south...Take a long look at your fan attendance and support and contract the ones with the least amount....no matter where they are.
    Very true. If you look at attendance figures for 2006-07, the bottom 10 are as follows:

    St. Louis
    Chicago
    NY Islanders
    Washington
    New Jersey
    Boston
    Phoenix
    Nashville
    Florida
    Atlanta

    You have to get to 8th worst before a Southern team is represented. Top 7 are North to Midwest teams with two of them being Original 6 teams. Amazing huh? With the exception of Atlanta and New Jersey, I'd say the other 8 teams here are teams with a very limited talent base. I don't know what to think about the Devils' fans. Is it the defensive style of hockey they play? Not enough fan base to support 3 Metro teams? Complacency? Beats me. But the answer is not to contract Southern teams alone obviously.

  5. #5
    The Devils have low attendance because they are like watching paint dry. They have by far been the most boring team to watch in the league for 10 years now.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Jordy
    Very true. If you look at attendance figures for 2006-07, the bottom 10 are as follows:

    St. Louis
    Chicago
    NY Islanders
    Washington
    New Jersey
    Boston
    Phoenix
    Nashville
    Florida
    Atlanta

    You have to get to 8th worst before a Southern team is represented. Top 7 are North to Midwest teams with two of them being Original 6 teams. Amazing huh? With the exception of Atlanta and New Jersey, I'd say the other 8 teams here are teams with a very limited talent base. I don't know what to think about the Devils' fans. Is it the defensive style of hockey they play? Not enough fan base to support 3 Metro teams? Complacency? Beats me. But the answer is not to contract Southern teams alone obviously.
    I think the problem with New Jersey is that the there isn't enough fan base to support 3 metro teams. It seems like there are just as many Ranger fans here as there are Devils fans and that's probably never going to change. I would be absolutely crushed though if the Devils ever got contracted.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by DevsJetsYanks88
    I think the problem with New Jersey is that the there isn't enough fan base to support 3 metro teams. It seems like there are just as many Ranger fans here as there are Devils fans and that's probably never going to change. I would be absolutely crushed though if the Devils ever got contracted.
    Of course there's more Rangers fans than Devils fans here, many were Rangers fans for decades before the Devils showed up.

    The Devils didnt help themselves by jacking up ticket prices once they won a pair of Cups, I used to go quite a bit but they really overcharged the casual average fan right out of it.

    If people arent going to the Meadowlands for games, then can someone please tell me how an arena in NEWARK is going to be a better draw?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Fishooked
    Of course there's more Rangers fans than Devils fans here, many were Rangers fans for decades before the Devils showed up.

    The Devils didnt help themselves by jacking up ticket prices once they won a pair of Cups, I used to go quite a bit but they really overcharged the casual average fan right out of it.

    If people arent going to the Meadowlands for games, then can someone please tell me how an arena in NEWARK is going to be a better draw?
    Well new venues always gives ticket sales a boost.

    Also Continental Airlines is a POS. That place is almost as boring as Devils hockey.
    Last edited by Tyler Durden; 05-08-2007 at 12:16 AM.

  9. #9
    You also have to look at the average ticket prices around the league as a whole as well. The average ticket price in the NHL is 43 bucks...43 Friggin bucks...My first NHL game in 1989 we sat in the upper level at Memorial Auditorium and spent 8 bucks a piece. I realize that was almost 20 years ago, but holy cow.

    There are only 4 NHL Teams (Chicago, San Jose, Anaheim, Buffalo) with an average ticket price below 35 dollars, with Buffalo being the lowest at a shade above 30 bucks.

    Also, the FCI (Fan Cost Index) went up 3.2% this year, to $258.08. The FCI takes into account how much a family of four would likely spend for a night of hockey. This includes 4 Average tickets, 2 small draft beers, 4 small soft drinks, 4 regular sized hot dogs, 2 game programs, 2 adult sized hats, and parking for one car. And this is for 3 hours of REGULAR SEASON HOCKEY.

    The NHL has priced themselves out of the "casual hockey fan's" budget. For a lot of families, especially those in areas that are not so great, areas where there is not a lot of work, or a struggling economy, that is a tough bill to swallow...

    If you combine ALL OF THAT INFO with the fact that you can only catch a game or two per week because the NHL is only nationally broadcasted on VS once or twice a week and NBC on Sunday, and you have a serious problem state-side. There is almost no advertisement to support hockey. You turn on Sportscenter during the playoffs? Don't you dare walk away to the fridge for a second or two, because you might miss the hockey highlights. The NHL playoffs are averaging a whopping total of 2.5 minutes of airtime on Sportscenter. Meanwhile, the same show will take double to triple that airtime to break down the NBA playoffs.

    Here is the scary thing to me. I live in Mechanicsburg, PA, about 10 mins outside of the state capital, Harrisburg. About 20 minutes down the road, is the Giant Center in Hershey that is home to the 05-06 Calder Cup Champions. Right Now, Hershey is dismantling Scranton-Wilkes-Barre in the playoffs and seem poised to make a second consecutive Calder Cup run. Those of us that know hockey, know how extremely difficult it is for an AHL team to win that Cup two years in a row...The AHL turnover is rediculous...Players get traded without your approval, they get called up to the big club and may not come back...At any given time, you could lose your best player to the NHL. While this is the sole purpose of a "Minor League," It also shows a GREAT coaching staff is in place if they can fight through all of that and challenge for the Cup for consecutive years.

    Sounds great, right? It is. It's awesome. I have been to 2 playoff games this year, and will be to more. Why? Because ticket prices for these games to sit in the lower level , around either blue line are 20 bucks a piece...My wife and I can go, enjoy ourselves, get some food and be out of there for less than 50 bucks. But the general public doesn't look at it that way. They say, "Well, its just the minor leaguers" or "Why do I want to go see guys who can't even make it in the NHL?" Meanwhile, 10 minutes down the road in Harrisburg, the same people flock every game night to see the last place AA Senators (Washington Nationals farm club) for a baseball game every home game.

    Hockey in general needs a marketing makeover. Give the casual fan, or a person who doesn't know anything about hockey, a reason to go to a game. Give them a reason to see it in person.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken O'Brien #7
    You turn on Sportscenter during the playoffs? Don't you dare walk away to the fridge for a second or two, because you might miss the hockey highlights. The NHL playoffs are averaging a whopping total of 2.5 minutes of airtime on Sportscenter. Meanwhile, the same show will take double to triple that airtime to break down the NBA playoffs.
    The answer to that one is simple. ESPN no longer has their NHL TV contract while they now have an NBA TV contract.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken O'Brien #7
    Hockey in general needs a marketing makeover. Give the casual fan, or a person who doesn't know anything about hockey, a reason to go to a game. Give them a reason to see it in person.
    The NHL needs an innovative leader who truly cares about the game and who has a connection to the game (ie. ex-player, coach, or GM). Gary Bettmann is no David Stern. He needs to go ASAP. He likes to play hardball when the NHLPA is up and we have had two work stoppages during his tenure. The NBA has never had a work stoppage under Stern. There's part of the problem right there.

  11. #11
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    The marketing scam is oblivious to me. I dont know how to properly market it. The NHLs first problem today is kids dont play hockey as much anymore. 10 years ago, all my friends played a roller league on Fort Hamilton Parkway, now the league doesnt exist due to lack of interest. This doesnt mean if kids played theyd watch, soccer is probably the most played sport of youths but not many care but if we had a viable league I bet it would change(for another day).

    Another problem is lack of American/North American starts. Candians and Americans need to be superstars. Americans lose interest quick today and if they can't pronounce half the leagues names they get frustrated (I have heard Jaromir Jagr butchered beyone belief by casual fans) and this leads them to believe its only Russians and Europeans playing. It sounds so ridiculous to me but I have seen it printed so many times.

    As for specific teams to be contracted. Florida, Phoneix, and Nashville. Chicago and St. Louis stink now but they have the most God-awful franchises. Chicago is gonna toss money at Briere and a few others so if they can win soon, they will be popular in a big market.(Like New York, Chicago loves a winner). St. Louis just needs to compete. Florida couldn't sell out the Stanley Cup, Nashville playoff tickets were about 5 dollars for nosebleeds and they didnt sell out. Phoneix's motto this year was "decade in the desert" I dont need to take a guess as to why it didnt work there. The NHL over-expanded in the past 15 years, they need to drop one team and give Quebec and Winnipeg teams back. Hockey worked best with all the Canadian franchises.

    Also, we have a superstar/hero of the sport in Crosby but hes useless in the NHL unless hes a Ranger or a King.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bay Ridge Jet
    The marketing scam is oblivious to me. I dont know how to properly market it. The NHLs first problem today is kids dont play hockey as much anymore. 10 years ago, all my friends played a roller league on Fort Hamilton Parkway, now the league doesnt exist due to lack of interest. This doesnt mean if kids played theyd watch, soccer is probably the most played sport of youths but not many care but if we had a viable league I bet it would change(for another day).

    Another problem is lack of American/North American starts. Candians and Americans need to be superstars. Americans lose interest quick today and if they can't pronounce half the leagues names they get frustrated (I have heard Jaromir Jagr butchered beyone belief by casual fans) and this leads them to believe its only Russians and Europeans playing. It sounds so ridiculous to me but I have seen it printed so many times.

    As for specific teams to be contracted. Florida, Phoneix, and Nashville. Chicago and St. Louis stink now but they have the most God-awful franchises. Chicago is gonna toss money at Briere and a few others so if they can win soon, they will be popular in a big market.(Like New York, Chicago loves a winner). St. Louis just needs to compete. Florida couldn't sell out the Stanley Cup, Nashville playoff tickets were about 5 dollars for nosebleeds and they didnt sell out. Phoneix's motto this year was "decade in the desert" I dont need to take a guess as to why it didnt work there. The NHL over-expanded in the past 15 years, they need to drop one team and give Quebec and Winnipeg teams back. Hockey worked best with all the Canadian franchises.

    Also, we have a superstar/hero of the sport in Crosby but hes useless in the NHL unless hes a Ranger or a King.
    I agree 100% with everything you said with the exception of giving Quebec and Winnepeg teams back. The only reason this helps hockey, is because it moves a strugging franchise to an area where people seemingly care about hockey. But people in Canada already love hockey, and nothing will ever change that. Look at the American markets that really want teams...Kansas City will have one in the next 10 years, I'm sure of it now that this Pittsburgh stadium deal is done. I will guess that Nashville will move to Kansas City.

    Jordy hit the nail on the head in the post above yours too...Gary Bettman is a waste. They need someone in there that really, truly cares about the game. Someone that knows what it's like to be in a player's shoes. Someone that can go out there and sell this game to the kids of america, and to the general public as a whole. I can think of half a dozen ex players that would be phenomenal at this. As much as I hate him, Mario Lemieux would be a great candidate. When he was doing the player/owner thing at the turn of the century, hockey was alive around these parts...people really love the guy, and he is a proven winner, and a smart businessman.

  13. #13
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    I also agree with what a lot of you had said.

    The problem is that the sport doesn't translate well over to TV for the average fan. All of us regular hockey fans have no problem with it, because its easier for us to see plays develop and have a feel for where the puck is going to be as plays happen.

    I'll give credit for Fox for at least TRYING something with that Foxtrack puck, or whatever it was. The game just moves too fast for most people, and they would almost gave to go to a game first to really appreciate the sport.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Fishooked
    I also agree with what a lot of you had said.

    The problem is that the sport doesn't translate well over to TV for the average fan. All of us regular hockey fans have no problem with it, because its easier for us to see plays develop and have a feel for where the puck is going to be as plays happen.

    I'll give credit for Fox for at least TRYING something with that Foxtrack puck, or whatever it was. The game just moves too fast for most people, and they would almost gave to go to a game first to really appreciate the sport.
    This is true...as annoying as that Fox thing was, I give them credit for trying...I know a lot of people that said that it helped them watch the game.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bay Ridge Jet
    The marketing scam is oblivious to me. I dont know how to properly market it. The NHLs first problem today is kids dont play hockey as much anymore. 10 years ago, all my friends played a roller league on Fort Hamilton Parkway, now the league doesnt exist due to lack of interest. This doesnt mean if kids played theyd watch, soccer is probably the most played sport of youths but not many care but if we had a viable league I bet it would change(for another day).

    Another problem is lack of American/North American starts. Candians and Americans need to be superstars. Americans lose interest quick today and if they can't pronounce half the leagues names they get frustrated (I have heard Jaromir Jagr butchered beyone belief by casual fans) and this leads them to believe its only Russians and Europeans playing. It sounds so ridiculous to me but I have seen it printed so many times.

    As for specific teams to be contracted. Florida, Phoneix, and Nashville. Chicago and St. Louis stink now but they have the most God-awful franchises. Chicago is gonna toss money at Briere and a few others so if they can win soon, they will be popular in a big market.(Like New York, Chicago loves a winner). St. Louis just needs to compete. Florida couldn't sell out the Stanley Cup, Nashville playoff tickets were about 5 dollars for nosebleeds and they didnt sell out. Phoneix's motto this year was "decade in the desert" I dont need to take a guess as to why it didnt work there. The NHL over-expanded in the past 15 years, they need to drop one team and give Quebec and Winnipeg teams back. Hockey worked best with all the Canadian franchises.

    Also, we have a superstar/hero of the sport in Crosby but hes useless in the NHL unless hes a Ranger or a King.
    I agree with most of your post except for the soccer part. I've heard the soccer analogy for years and years. You know what? No matter what the USA does, whether it be major leagues or World Cups, soccer will NEVER be a popular major sport in this country. Participation sport, yes. Fan support, no.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Fishooked
    Of course there's more Rangers fans than Devils fans here, many were Rangers fans for decades before the Devils showed up.

    The Devils didnt help themselves by jacking up ticket prices once they won a pair of Cups, I used to go quite a bit but they really overcharged the casual average fan right out of it.

    If people arent going to the Meadowlands for games, then can someone please tell me how an arena in NEWARK is going to be a better draw?
    Yes very true. Attendance used to be better than it is now. I think the new arena will help though. Continental is a dump.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken O'Brien #7
    This is true...as annoying as that Fox thing was, I give them credit for trying...I know a lot of people that said that it helped them watch the game.
    You would think with technology advancing since then, that they should be able to figure something out by now. I didnt care much for the 'vapor trail' effects on slap shots, but it did help you see the puck better at times.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by DevsJetsYanks88
    Yes very true. Attendance used to be better than it is now. I think the new arena will help though. Continental is a dump.
    Since I don't live in the New York area anymore, I don't know the answer to this. Is Continental more of a dump than the Mausoleum? Last time I was there, the Mausoleum was the biggest, smelliest dump of a professional arena I had ever been to.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fishooked
    You would think with technology advancing since then, that they should be able to figure something out by now. I didnt care much for the 'vapor trail' effects on slap shots, but it did help you see the puck better at times.
    At the risk of sounding like a snob, I hated the "glow" puck. I know the intentions were good but I found it extremely annoying and distracting. It would have been great if there was technology that would have allowed viewers to enable or disable the glow puck feature on their TV's.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Jordy
    Since I don't live in the New York area anymore, I don't know the answer to this. Is Continental more of a dump than the Mausoleum? Last time I was there, the Mausoleum was the biggest, smelliest dump of a professional arena I had ever been to.
    Yes, the coliseum is a dump asthetically. But its also the best arena to watch a hockey game at (just dont leave your seats to take a leak, because it also sports the worst concourse ever).

    As great as the garden is, its a horrible place to watch sports. I know rangers fans would be hardpressed to admit that, but its the truth. You have people walking in front of you the entire game, and you cannot see battles in the corners.

    As for the CAA, its a good place to watch a game and asthetically its better than the coliseum. CAA also has the advantage of busses from port authority. The issue with the devils is their style of play and the fact that the rangers fans in jersey outnumber devils fans.

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