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Thread: here's a story that the MSM ignores

  1. #1

    here's a story that the MSM ignores

    [quote]Marine says urinated on dead Iraqi at Haditha
    Thu May 10, 2007 8:01 AM IST

    By Marty Graham

    CAMP PENDLETON, Calif. (Reuters) - Angered that a beloved member of his squad had been killed in an explosion, a U.S. Marine urinated on one of the 24 dead Iraqi civilians killed by his unit in Haditha, the Marine testified on Wednesday.

    Sgt. Sanick Dela Cruz, who has immunity from prosecution after murder charges against him were dismissed, also said he watched his squad leader shoot down five Iraqi civilians who were trying to surrender.

    In dramatic testimony in a pretrial hearing for one of the seven Marines charged in the Nov. 2005 Haditha killings and alleged cover-up, Dela Cruz described his bitterness after a roadside bomb ripped Lance Cpl. Miguel Terrazas, known as T.J., into two bloody pieces.

    [b]"I know it was a bad thing what I've done, but I done it because I was angry T.J. was dead and I pissed on one Iraqi's head,"[/b] said an unemotional Dela Cruz in a military courtroom in Camp Pendleton, north of San Diego, California.

    Dela Cruz also said he watched squad leader Sgt. Frank Wuterich shoot five men whose hands were tied up near a car. Dela Cruz said he also shot the five men as they laid on the ground.

    Wuterich "walked to me and told me that if anybody asked, they were running away and the Iraqi Army shot them," Dela Cruz testified.

    Three Marines have been charged with murder, and four officers have been charged with dereliction of duty and obstructing the investigation.

    Prosecutors contend the killings were revenge for Terrazas' death, while the Marines charged say it was a clearing operation, conducted under lawful orders, that had disastrous results.

    Squad leader Wuterich's lawyer later called Dela Cruz's testimony false.

    "It's about the fourth or fifth version of events we've heard from Sgt. Dela Cruz. It's false, of course," Neal Puckett said in an e-mail. "It's just so sad that he is being required to testify against his fellow Marine NCO in order to guarantee his freedom. He's a victim, too."

    ASKED TO LIE

    The Marine Corps initially reported the deaths as a result of the bombing and a firefight with insurgents. Reporting by Time magazine in January 2006 later prompted the Marine Corps to investigate the killings.

    Dela Cruz said he was asked four times to lie about what happened in Haditha, although no one asked him about the killings for a time.

    A Chicago native, Dela Cruz saw intense action in his first Iraq tour of duty in 2004. A Marine Corps News article once featured him as one of the unsung heroes of the Iraq war.

    Wednesday's hearing focused on Capt. Randy Stone, who served as the legal advisor for the Kilo Company. Stone, 34, is charged with violating an order and two counts of dereliction of duty in connection with the killings.

    On Nov. 19, a convoy of Marines from the Kilo Company was traveling through the town of Haditha when a roadside bomb detonated, killing Terrazas and injuring two others. Surviving Marines stopped a car and shot its five occupants, then swept through two houses, killing the people inside.

    According to testimony, the five men in the vehicle were the first of the 24 victims. Dela Cruz said that after he helped Wuterich shoot the men, he went in one direction with Iraqi soldiers while Wuterich went in another direction.

    Another Marine, Sgt. Albert Espinosa, testified on Wednesday that he pressed for an investigation of the killings almost immediately after it occurred in November 2005.

    He testified Wednesday that he was frustrated by the apparent indifference of his commanding officers. "We deserve an answer to what happened and wasn't happy with the answers I was getting," 1st Sgt. Albert Espinosa testified.



    Reuters 2007. All Rights Reserved.

    [/quote]

    [url]http://in.today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=worldNews&storyID=2007-05-10T075524Z_01_NOOTR_RTRJONC_0_India-297504-1.xml&archived=False[/url]

  2. #2
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    You're a prince.

  3. #3
    That wasn't ignored, I saw it on the front page of Google News yesterday.

  4. #4
    [QUOTE=bitonti][url]http://in.today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=worldNews&storyID=2007-05-10T075524Z_01_NOOTR_RTRJONC_0_India-297504-1.xml&archived=False[/url][/QUOTE]

    I see your hatred for the military hasn't waned.

  5. #5
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    Why does Bit hate the military for posting this? If people in the military did bad things and/ror lied about them or covered them up, they SHOULD be punished. It's worse in the long run for behavior like this to go unpunished, that would harm the military more then the short term bad PR that this incident recieves. Every large organization as problems with rogue behavior and can make mistakes by trying to do too much CYA than is ethical (all organizations and individuals do CYA all the time to some degree). It's how you respond to stuff like that that matters.

    Bitonti is simply making a point that the MSM ignores all types of stories. We on the right know they ignore some stories that, if not ignored, would help our side. He's simply using this as an example of the MSM ignoring a story that would harm our side...so to speak (it's not really that simple, but you know what I mean).

  6. #6
    thanks 5ever.

    Note i had to go to Reuters India to get this story, Reuters America (which is considered to be left leaning) didn't post it. Also not found as a headline on Fox, ABC, CNN etc.


    by the way i point out these incidents when they occur because I want this country to continue to be the best in the world. When stuff like this occurs we can either look away (until it happens again) or deal with it. I don't think it's healthy to cover-up any wrong doings that's not what living in a democracy is about.

  7. #7
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    [QUOTE=jets5ever]Why does Bit hate the military for posting this? If people in the military did bad things and/ror lied about them or covered them up, they SHOULD be punished. It's worse in the long run for behavior like this to go unpunished, that would harm the military more then the short term bad PR that this incident recieves. Every large organization as problems with rogue behavior and can make mistakes by trying to do too much CYA than is ethical (all organizations and individuals do CYA all the time to some degree). It's how you respond to stuff like that that matters.

    Bitonti is simply making a point that the MSM ignores all types of stories. We on the right know they ignore some stories that, if not ignored, would help our side. He's simply using this as an example of the MSM ignoring a story that would harm our side...so to speak (it's not really that simple, but you know what I mean).[/QUOTE]
    Um, the source is Reuters!

    Isn't that main stream?

  8. #8
    [QUOTE=jets5ever]Why does Bit hate the military for posting this? If people in the military did bad things and/ror lied about them or covered them up, they SHOULD be punished. It's worse in the long run for behavior like this to go unpunished, that would harm the military more then the short term bad PR that this incident recieves. Every large organization as problems with rogue behavior and can make mistakes by trying to do too much CYA than is ethical (all organizations and individuals do CYA all the time to some degree). It's how you respond to stuff like that that matters.

    Bitonti is simply making a point that the MSM ignores all types of stories. We on the right know they ignore some stories that, if not ignored, would help our side. He's simply using this as an example of the MSM ignoring a story that would harm our side...so to speak (it's not really that simple, but you know what I mean).[/QUOTE]

    Every time the military is involved in any type of a scandal, bitonti is the first to post it.

    I don't have the time nor the inclination to search his anti military posts but, he has elucidated his disdain for the military on this board many, many times.

    Even going so far as to take the word of terrorists over the word of US military personnel and accusing them of commiting atrocities without evidence. Only on accusations of known terrorists.

    Bitonti hates the military.... Anyone with a room temperature IQ can see that.

  9. #9
    [QUOTE=bitonti]thanks 5ever.

    Note i had to go to Reuters India to get this story, Reuters America (which is considered to be left leaning) didn't post it. Also not found as a headline on Fox, ABC, CNN etc.


    by the way i point out these incidents when they occur because I want this country to continue to be the best in the world. When stuff like this occurs we can either look away (until it happens again) or deal with it. I don't think it's healthy to cover-up any wrong doings that's not what living in a democracy is about.[/QUOTE]


    Psst...

    Fox News ran the story back in January... ;)

    [url]http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2007Jan09/0,4670,HadithaInvestigation,00.html[/url]

    [quote]Official: Evidence Doesn't Back Marines

    Tuesday, January 09, 2007

    By ROBERT BURNS, AP Military Writer
    E-MAIL STORY
    PRINTER FRIENDLY VERSION

    WASHINGTON — U.S. criminal investigators found no evidence to support the claim of Marines charged in the deaths of unarmed Iraqi civilians that five were shot after trying to flee the scene of a roadside bombing that killed one Marine, a senior defense official said Saturday.

    Investigators determined that all five Iraqis were shot within arm's length of each other and no more than 18 feet from the white taxi they were ordered to exit by members of a Marine squad in the western Iraqi town of Haditha, said the official, who is familiar with reports produced by the Naval Criminal Investigative Service.

    The official spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to publicly discuss details of the killings on Nov. 19, 2005.

    Two Marines are charged with murder in the five deaths. They are Staff Sgt. Frank D. Wuterich and Sgt. Sanick P. Dela Cruz.

    Two other Marines _ Lance Cpl. Justin L. Sharratt and Lance Cpl. Stephen B. Tatum _ face murder charges in connection with the deaths of other Iraqi civilians shot shortly after the killings by the taxi.

    Through his lawyers, Wuterich has claimed he acted appropriately and within military rules governing the use of deadly force in combat.

    (Story continues below)

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    Mark Zaid, an attorney for Wuterich, said in an interview Saturday he was highly disappointed that information from the government's investigative report on Haditha had been leaked to the media. He called it an effort by unidentified Pentagon officials to "portray a negative slant of these Marines."

    Tatum's attorney, Jack Zimmerman, said he got the report the day after Christmas and has not "even begun to crack it." He called disclosure of details from the report a "serious, serious violation" and said he may ask the military to investigate the source of the leak.

    Attempts on Saturday to reach lawyers for DelaCruz and Sharratt were unsuccessful.

    [b]Dela Cruz told investigators he fired bullets into the five bodies as they lay on the ground and that he later urinated on one, the defense official said.[/b]

    These details about the deaths were first reported in Saturday's Washington Post, which said it obtained a copy of a lengthy government investigative report. The Post published photos from the investigative file that had not previously been made public; one shows the five Iraqis sprawled near the taxi.

    One of the five may have been kneeling at the time he was shot, the defense official told The Associated Press.

    In addition to the four Marines facing murder charges, four other Marines who were not at the scene were charged with dereliction of duty for failing to report or properly investigate the killings. In all, the case involves the deaths of 24 Iraqi civilians.

    The Haditha investigation is the biggest U.S. criminal case involving civilian deaths so far in the Iraq war.

    Members of an explosive ordnance disposal team that was summoned to the scene scoured the taxi and found no weapons or evidence of bomb-making materials, the defense official said. At least two, and possibly four, of the five Iraqis were students; the other was the taxi driver, who was taking the students to school.

    The Marines claimed later that the five were attempting to flee and that they fit the profile of military-age men who, in the past, had acted as spotters for insurgents setting off roadside bombs. Zaid said Wuterich's position is that the five had disobeyed the Marines' orders, issued in Arabic, and were starting to flee. He said the report that they were up to 18 feet from the taxi supports Wuterich's position.

    The NCIS investigators determined that the five had no apparent link to the bombing that morning in Haditha that shattered a Marine Humvee utility vehicle and killed Lance Cpl. Miguel Terrazas; two other Marines were injured.

    The shooting of the men near the taxi was the first in a series of violence responses by the Marines, according to the NCIS investigation. The Marines subsequently raided four nearby houses, killing 18 unarmed civilians inside three of the residences. One other was shot dead outside. Among the dead were women and children.

    The Marines were with Kilo Company, 3rd Battalion, 1st Marine Regiment, based at Camp Pendleton, Calif.

    After the deaths, the Marines announced that 15 civilians had been killed in Haditha from a roadside bombing and a Marine firefight with insurgents. The Marines said eight insurgents also were killed. The Marines have since acknowledged that that report was false.

    The matter, involving an unusually large number of civilian casualties, was not investigated by the military until a Time magazine reporter inquired about the deaths in January 2006.

    The military launched the first phase of its investigation in February, and in March it began a separate administrative probe focusing on how the matter was reported in official Marine Corps channels and whether there was an attempted cover-up. On the basis of that investigation, four Marines were charged with dereliction of duty.

    The NCIS began its probe in March and it grew into the agency's largest criminal investigation in years.

    One worry of military prosecutors is that American investigators failed to persuade the families of the any of the 24 dead to permit their bodies to be exhumed and examined to obtain forensic evidence.

    The NCIS had hoped to gain access to the bodies so they could, for example, compare wounds on the bodies to the blood stain patterns at the scene and to other evidence and witness statements.

    U.S. government officials went so far as to propose through the Iraqi government in Baghdad last year that a nongovernment humanitarian organization with medical credentials be permitted to exhume and examine the 24 bodies, but the families rejected that approach.[/quote]

  10. #10
    Maybe Dela Cruz is lying to cover his own ass. Just a possibility.

  11. #11
    deanpatsfan i think YOU hate the military because you support policies that break the military.

  12. #12
    [QUOTE=bitonti]deanpatsfan i think YOU hate the military because you support policies that break the military.[/QUOTE]

    The miltary is broken because Murtha, Reid and Pelosi say so?

    Strangely, I haven't heard any active military commanders claim the military is broken.

  13. #13
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    [QUOTE=DeanPatsFan]The miltary is broken because Murtha, Reid and Pelosi say so?

    Strangely, I haven't heard any active military commanders claim the military is broken.[/QUOTE]

    [URL=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A51687-2005Jan5.html]http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A51687-2005Jan5.html[/URL]

    Two years and a troop surge later, I can't see the situation being any better today.

  14. #14
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    [QUOTE=DeanPatsFan]Psst...

    Fox News ran the story back in January... ;)

    [url]http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2007Jan09/0,4670,HadithaInvestigation,00.html[/url][/QUOTE]

    :applause: :applause: :applause:

  15. #15
    He recieved immunity from the charges within this case. He would be charged with purgery if he lied on the stand.

    [QUOTE=MnJetFan]Maybe Dela Cruz is lying to cover his own ass. Just a possibility.[/QUOTE]

  16. #16
    the story fox news ran in jan was different, this story is about his testimony in a courtroom that happened on May 9. there is no way foxnews or anyone else could have ran this story in Jan because the testimony didn't occur until two days ago.

  17. #17
    [QUOTE=bitonti]the story fox news ran in jan was different, this story is about his testimony in a courtroom that happened on May 9. there is no way foxnews or anyone else could have ran this story in Jan because the testimony didn't occur until two days ago.[/QUOTE]
    Well, symbolic gestures (like Korans in toilets) count big time with lefties. So, testimony of peeing on a body is a [I]'stop the presses![/I]' type story. Does it matter now? No. Not unless you wish to revisit and milk a wee chapter of a much larger conflict, which is something you clearly relish.

  18. #18
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    [QUOTE=sackdance]Well, symbolic gestures (like Korans in toilets) count big time with lefties. So, testimony of peeing on a body is a [I]'stop the presses![/I]' type story. Does it matter now? No. Not unless you wish to revisit and milk a wee chapter of a much larger conflict, which is something you clearly relish.[/QUOTE]
    But remember how dipping a crucifix in urine was considered "art"?

  19. #19
    [QUOTE=sackdance] Does it matter now? No. [/QUOTE]

    stories like this promote terror around the world. It's a perfect recruiting poster for terrorists. Just because it doesn't matter to you don't mean it doesn't matter.

  20. #20
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    [QUOTE=bitonti]stories like this promote terror around the world. It's a perfect recruiting poster for terrorists. Just because it doesn't matter to you don't mean it doesn't matter.[/QUOTE]
    Same could be said for most positions.

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