Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 58

Thread: "Money as Debt"

  1. #1

    "Money as Debt"

    [URL="http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279"]"money as Debt[/URL]

    A 47 minute video explaining the mechanisms of our currency and banking system. The 20th most-watched video on "Google Video." The debt-based monetary system has led to starvation in the midst of plenty in every single society that has made it law. More people wake up to this fact day by day, and this is the real reason why Ron Paul raised the most money anyone has ever raised in 1 day: he is the only candidate willing to challenge this rather fraudulent monetary system that makes handsome profits for a few at the expense of many. This false monetary standard is the root cause of the financial stress we face today.

    We are not taught how the monetary system works in public schools (or even NYU's econ program from my personal experience) because it would end this racket for the private banking industry. All we are told is that the Federal Reserve is god.

    [I]"The difficulty in understanding monetary theory is this: central banks are very good at press relations. Central banks employ a large fraction of economists, therefore there is a bias to tell the story in a way favorable to the central banks."[/I] -Milton Friedman, Nobel Laureate in economics, 8/28/2006
    Last edited by JetsCrazey; 02-26-2008 at 06:16 PM.

  2. #2
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Not bababooey and I resent the implication
    Posts
    21,029
    I've been hearing this for awhile, I worked with an older gentleman who was into this stuff when I was younger.

    I'd be interested in what 5ever's opinion on this is. I honestly don't have the required schooling/experience to know if the situation is as dire as these things always predict.

  3. #3
    [QUOTE=CTM;2390440]I honestly don't have the required schooling/experience to know if the situation is as dire as these things always predict.[/QUOTE]

    We will not have another Great Depression because central banks no longer allow deflation. Instead, we have inflation, which is not as bad as deflation but in the long-term it adds up and becomes the most vicious tax on the middle class there is. Inflation is the mechanism by which wealth is transferred from the low/middle class to the speculating class since the speculators are the first ones who get to use the newly created money. The middle class gets devalued money, and that loss of value gets transferred to the speculators.

    However, it's important to understand the systematic flaws we have that lead to the immense maldistribution of wealth that gets worse every years. The modern economy is capable of supplying everyone with ample food and clothing. It doesn't because the bounty is constantly skimmed by interest bearing debt to banks that create the money out of thin air.
    I've never met anyone who could justify this system and explain why private banks should get the profit of of creating money out of thin air, money that is backed by the productive energies of the entire people. It is a false system, plain and simple. By depending on banks to create unstable artificial money, we have a lack of real money, and this is a major contributer to recessions instead of stability.
    Last edited by JetsCrazey; 02-26-2008 at 07:40 PM.

  4. #4
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Not bababooey and I resent the implication
    Posts
    21,029
    Jetscrazey,

    wouldn't it be true that the policies have allowed for our tremendous growth, progress and overall prosperity?

  5. #5
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Not bababooey and I resent the implication
    Posts
    21,029
    Oh, and can you explain how someone could take advantage of what speculators are doing?

  6. #6
    JetsCrazey

    It is entirely possible that the world could go through another deflationary event, and I would say very much on the cards in the next decade or so.

    Look at Japan in the late 80's and into the 90's.

  7. #7
    [QUOTE=CTM;2390462]Jetscrazey,

    wouldn't it be true that the policies have allowed for our tremendous growth, progress and overall prosperity?[/QUOTE]

    You know, I'd seem pretty rich too if I borrowed tens of billions of dollars from China everyday. But it's not real prosperity, its borrowed prosperity, and this is interest-bearing debt. Anyone who says this is sustainable is lying to you. All this prosperity has been at the expense of screwing future generations, and the bills are starting to come, and interest rates will get higher as more entities reject a falling dollar.

    I stress this point: [B]every great empire in world history that has abandoned asset-backed currency as we did in the 1970s ultimately deteriorated after the abandonment[/B]

    David Walker, US Comptroller General:

    [I]“I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Afghanistan or Pakistan but our own fiscal irresponsibility,...I don't know anybody who has done their homework, has researched history, and who's good at math who would tell you that we can grow our way out of this problem, we are on a path toward an explosion of debt, with the looming retirement of the baby boomers, spiraling healthcare costs, plummeting savings rates and increasing reliance on foreign lenders, [and] we face unprecedented fiscal risk.”[/I]
    Last edited by JetsCrazey; 02-26-2008 at 07:54 PM.

  8. #8
    [QUOTE=CTM;2390466]Oh, and can you explain how someone could take advantage of what speculators are doing?[/QUOTE]

    We are in a long-term inflationary period that began about a year ago. Smart people will invest in BRIC countries and buy commodities. Anything of real value will appreciate during an inflationary time, and we are in a food shortage so commodities are rising day-by-day. Gold will also be good to have.

  9. #9
    [QUOTE=Black Death;2390471]JetsCrazey

    It is entirely possible that the world could go through another deflationary event, and I would say very much on the cards in the next decade or so.

    Look at Japan in the late 80's and into the 90's.[/QUOTE]

    It's possible, but I don't see it happening because deflation means gold prices fall, and activity in the gold market in recent years shows consolidation of the gold market in the hands of people connected with the Bushes, Saudis, Bilderberg, etc etc.
    This to me means that the the rule-makers expect inflation. The gold price will rise as the Federal Reserve inflates the currency into oblivion to prevent the derivatives crisis from causing financial Armaggedon. The Fed will create as much money as needed to save the bond insurance companies that have bit off hundreds of billions more than they can chew. If the bond insurers get downgraded to a credit rating that actually seems accurate, it will cause a meltdown in the stock market.
    Last edited by JetsCrazey; 02-26-2008 at 08:03 PM.

  10. #10
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Not bababooey and I resent the implication
    Posts
    21,029
    [QUOTE=JetsCrazey;2390477]We are in a long-term inflationary period that began about a year ago. Smart people will invest in BRIC countries and buy commodities. Anything of real value will appreciate during an inflationary time, and we are in a food shortage so commodities are rising day-by-day. Gold will also be good to have.[/QUOTE]

    Damn am I dumb. I was looking to buy 100 ounces of gold last July, I balked once finding out how much it cost to make the transaction. Now it's $300 more an ounce then before..

    Do you know any good legit sites I can go to learn?

    I've got about a decent amount liquid that is being eating alive by inflation. I'm trying to buy a business with it, as I figure it's a better investment for me being naive to the commodities market and too bearish on our economy for US stock plays.

  11. #11
    [QUOTE=JetsCrazey;2390494]It's possible, but I don't see it happening because deflation means gold prices fall, and activity in the gold market in recent years shows consolidation of the gold market in the hands of people connected with the Bushes, Saudis, Bilderberg, etc etc.
    This to me means that the the rule-makers expect inflation. The gold price will rise as the Federal Reserve inflates the currency into oblivion to prevent the derivatives crisis from causing financial Armaggedon. The Fed will create as much money as needed to save the bond insurance companies that have bit off hundreds of billions more than they can chew. If the bond insurers get downgraded to a credit rating that actually seems accurate, it will cause a meltdown in the stock market.[/QUOTE]

    You make some excellent points.

    However, the reason I can foresee a deflationary event are basically twofold - one demographics and one to do with debt. As to the first - demograpically the big spending group of people, the baby boomers, are now on their way into retirement. They are looking to save rather than to spend - it has been their spending that has funded the massive prosperity the USA has seen in the last decade or so. The next generations aren't as large nor as rich as the baby boomers. Japan had a similar demographic issue before it went through its deflationary event of the 1990's.

    As to debt, what has funded the prosperity has been debt. When interest rates were low that encouraged people to access the cheap credit available and they used that to spend on cars, TV's, houses etc - but the problem with that is that there is only so much debt that anyone can take on. You can't just keep on adding debt to fuel a spending boom; at some stage the debt will have to be factored in and you'll have to contract your spending and start paying off the debt. US debt, both public and private, is already at record levels.

    The two together - the fact the baby boomers are now starting to ease up on their spending, and the fact that there is only so much debt you can saddle yourself with, means we could well be in for a deflationary event in the next decade or so.

    On your other points - I think it was Lenin who said something like the one way to seriously tamper with the prosperity of a county is to devalue its currency. Basically that is what is underway in the United States at the moment. This will also have the effect of tampering with the value of the debt the USA owes to places like Japan and China - by just creating more money you devalue your currency and therefore devalue the debt you owe. This will have serious repercussions in other countries - then there is also the fact that it is US spending which is fuelling the booming economies of Asia - and it is this boom that is fueling the resources boom in places like South America, Africa and Australia.

    The whole shebang is a pack of cards and one nasty shock could bring the whole thing down.

  12. #12
    [QUOTE=CTM;2390531]Damn am I dumb. I was looking to buy 100 ounces of gold last July, I balked once finding out how much it cost to make the transaction. Now it's $300 more an ounce then before..

    Do you know any good legit sites I can go to learn?

    I've got about a decent amount liquid that is being eating alive by inflation. I'm trying to buy a business with it, as I figure it's a better investment for me being naive to the commodities market and too bearish on our economy for US stock plays.[/QUOTE]

    Your best bet for gold and silver talk is kitco.

  13. #13
    I'd recommend [url]www.jsmineset.com[/url]. It's a free blog run by Jim Sinclair, a mining and precious metals industry expert who is known for being spot-on. He's been rubbing elbows with the establishment since the 70s, and called this derivatives crisis in 2003 and he called gold's rise to well over 1000 and eventually to $1650 back when it was at $248. His commentary can be complicated to understand for those not well-versed in economics, but try to follow along, because he has a knack for finding the truth of the situation. I've yet to be able to disprove any of his predictions.

    He thinks that after the US Dollar Index tanks as low as .52, they will reintroduce the Federal Reserve Gold Certificate Ratio to stabilize it for a period of time until that no longer suits the powers-that-be and finally a North American Currency will be forced on us, as Vicente Fox confirmed on Larry King Live not long ago.
    [url]http://youtube.com/watch?v=gYGrn0hZlCQ[/url]
    Last edited by JetsCrazey; 02-26-2008 at 10:05 PM.

  14. #14
    All League
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Middlesex County, NJ
    Posts
    3,366
    [QUOTE=JetsCrazey;2390320][URL="http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279"]"money as Debt[/URL]

    A 47 minute video explaining the mechanisms of our currency and banking system. The 20th most-watched video on "Google Video." The debt-based monetary system has led to starvation in the midst of plenty in every single society that has made it law. More people wake up to this fact day by day, and this is the real reason why Ron Paul raised the most money anyone has ever raised in 1 day: he is the only candidate willing to challenge this rather fraudulent monetary system that makes handsome profits for a few at the expense of many. This false monetary standard is the root cause of the financial stress we face today.

    We are not taught how the monetary system works in public schools (or even NYU's econ program from my personal experience) because it would end this racket for the private banking industry. All we are told is that the Federal Reserve is god.

    [I]"The difficulty in understanding monetary theory is this: central banks are very good at press relations. Central banks employ a large fraction of economists, therefore there is a bias to tell the story in a way favorable to the central banks."[/I] -Milton Friedman, Nobel Laureate in economics, 8/28/2006[/QUOTE]


    Leftist Crap-ola

  15. #15
    [QUOTE=crazyeffinjetsfan;2390776]Leftist Crap-ola[/QUOTE]

    Leftist? LOL

    Sweet retort, by the way. crazyeffin, ftw!

  16. #16
    [QUOTE=crazyeffinjetsfan;2390776]Leftist Crap-ola[/QUOTE]

    Lefist? No. That shows a misunderstanding of the current system. The setup we have NOW is leftist. Government and banking industry are married and conjoined. Govt runs up a deficit and goes to the private Fed to just print the money and create inflation.

    What I propose is a truly conservative monetary policy. Let the demands of the free market control monetary growth, not a centralized, chartered banking cartel like we have now. THAT is socialist, Marx's 5th plank actually.
    Last edited by JetsCrazey; 02-26-2008 at 11:12 PM.

  17. #17
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Van down by the river
    Posts
    23,068
    [QUOTE=crazyeffinjetsfan;2390776]Leftist Crap-ola[/QUOTE]

    [IMG]http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/9622/pz2123or.gif[/IMG]

  18. #18
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Not bababooey and I resent the implication
    Posts
    21,029
    So is hyperinflation as real possibility or just a scare tactic of those trying to fear-monger globalization and NWO?

  19. #19
    [QUOTE=CTM;2391429]So is hyperinflation as real possibility or just a scare tactic of those trying to fear-monger globalization and NWO?[/QUOTE]
    Hyperinflation is a real possibility. The banks and bond insurers are going bankrupt and the Fed will issue as much money as is needed to keep them solvent. The closest comparison to what we are going through in terms of monetization of bankruptcy is Germany's Weimar Republic during the 1920s, possibly the most famous instance of 20th century hyperinflation.

    Already the M3 money supply (no longer made public by the Fed in order to hide the ridiculous monetary expansion from the public but reconstructed by private economists) is increasing by about 15% per year. Monetary inflation always leads to price inflation eventually.
    Last edited by JetsCrazey; 02-27-2008 at 10:22 AM.

  20. #20
    [QUOTE=CTM;2391429]So is hyperinflation as real possibility or just a scare tactic of those trying to fear-monger globalization and NWO?[/QUOTE]

    If the money supply keeps increasing like this, I think itís a possibility. I donít believe in the NWO, I canít see international players giving up some of their own power in order to conspire. Not to mention the trust issue.

    I do believe that governments like to spend more than they have in order to pander to their voter base in order to stay in power. Therefore, they incur debt. In order to pay off the debt, they increase the money supply so they are making payments that cost less in real terms. Who pays for this? All of us.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Follow Us