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Thread: Obama Kaine

  1. #1

    Obama Kaine

    Kristol basically calls the VP race in last paragraph, i like that guts

    see there's something for everyone this morning

    [quote]
    Kaine in 'Serious' Talks With Obama

    By Michael D. Shear and Shailagh Murray
    Washington Post Staff Writers
    Tuesday, July 29, 2008; A01

    Virginia Gov. Timothy M. Kaine has told close associates that he has had "very serious" conversations with Sen. Barack Obama about joining the Democratic presidential ticket and has provided documents to the campaign as it combs through his background, according to several sources close to Kaine.

    Sens. Evan Bayh (Ind.) and Joseph R. Biden Jr. (Del.) are also being seriously vetted by the campaign staff, according to sources with knowledge of the process.

    Obama has revealed little about which way he is leaning. And despite rising anticipation that a decision is imminent, campaign officials said an announcement is likely in mid-August, shortly before the Democratic National Convention. Obama's top aides, David Plouffe and David Axelrod, huddled yesterday in the Washington office of Eric Holder, who along with Caroline Kennedy is vetting potential running mates.

    Although rumors have circulated about former military leaders and other nontraditional contenders, including Republicans, Obama's pool of prospects is heavy on longtime senators with foreign policy experience. Kaine and Kansas Gov. Kathleen Sebelius are the only state leaders believed to be under serious consideration, sources close to Obama said.

    Democrats who have discussed possible choices with campaign officials and have knowledge of the vetting process said others being considered include Sens. Christopher J. Dodd (Conn.) and Hillary Rodham Clinton (N.Y.) and former senator Sam Nunn (Ga.). Republican Sen. Chuck Hagel (Neb.) and Democratic Sen. Jack Reed (R.I.) are mentioned as long shots.

    Aides to Kaine declined to comment about the possibility that Obama might pick him, referring all questions to the senator's campaign. "The governor has been pretty clear from the beginning, when Senator Obama asked him to be a national co-chair, that any conversation he has with the campaign, on any topic, are conversations that he is keeping private," said Delacey Skinner, Kaine's spokeswoman.

    But several people who have spoken to Kaine said he has talked about the seriousness of the possibility. Each spoke on the condition of anonymity, citing the campaign's desire to keep the process secret. One said Kaine has stressed that there are other top candidates but described his discussions with the campaign as "very serious."

    Two other associates said Kaine's staff is providing the background information necessary to allow the campaign to search for potential political land mines. One source said Kaine chief counsel Larry Roberts is coordinating with Obama's team. Roberts could not be reached for comment. Kaine will be in Washington today for his monthly interview on WTOP Radio.

    Kaine and Obama became friends after they campaigned together during Kaine's 2005 gubernatorial race. Kaine, who like Obama has Kansas roots, has returned the favor, stumping nationwide for the senator from Illinois during the primaries. In recent weeks, Kaine and his staff have been in frequent contact with Obama and his campaign about strategy and operations in Virginia and elsewhere. The governor has said he plans to attend the Democratic convention in Denver with his wife and children.

    Picking Kaine would seem to satisfy many considerations Obama has recently laid out. During an interview with Tom Brokaw on NBC's "Meet the Press" on Sunday, the presumptive Democratic nominee said he was looking for someone who shares his desire to change Washington politics.

    Kaine, a former Richmond mayor, would bring outside-the-Beltway credentials to the campaign. The relationship the two share would seem to fit with Obama's desire, as he said, for someone "with independence -- who's willing to tell me where he thinks, or she thinks, I'm wrong." And the governor probably would bolster Obama in Virginia, where the campaign is making an all-out push.

    But Kaine has no foreign policy background, and as a first-term governor, he may add to voters' concerns about Obama's experience. Kaine remains popular in Virginia, but he has had trouble dealing with Republicans and has no single defining achievement to point to on the campaign trail.

    In 2005, the major issue Republicans took aim at was his opposition to the death penalty, but since becoming governor, Kaine has declined to stop several executions.

    In interviews, Obama has hinted that experience would factor into his decision on a running mate.

    "I want somebody who I'm compatible with, who I can work with, who has a shared vision, who certainly complements me, in the sense that they provide a knowledge base or an area of expertise that can be useful. Because we're going to have a lot of problems and a lot of work to do," he said Sunday. "I want somebody who's going to be able to roll up their sleeves and really do some work."

    Speaking to Brokaw, he reiterated that Clinton "would be on anybody's short list." Yet few people close to the Obama campaign think she is a serious contender.

    Biden, whose own presidential bid ended in January, could help to balance Obama's shortcomings. He is one of his party's most prominent foreign policy voices, fluent in issues as varied as Iraq and narcotics trafficking. Elected in 1972, he also has deep ties to the Democratic establishment. With his blue-collar Scranton, Pa., roots, Biden could prove a valued surrogate in key Midwestern swing states.

    But the outspoken Biden also is known for the occasional verbal gaffe, and his long tenure in Washington could muddle Obama's call for change.

    Democratic observers say the safest bet may be Bayh, a former governor from a Republican state who is known for his centrist views. Obama supporters who are pressing for Bayh say that he would stir no controversy, nor would he overshadow the nominee, as an elder statesman like Biden might. Obama supporters who oppose Bayh counter that he is too conventional and too much of a Washington insider.

    Reed, a military expert, is viewed as a lower-profile version of Biden who could take on a substantial national security portfolio. Like Kaine, Sebelius, Dodd and Biden, Reed also is a Roman Catholic, and his roots are humble -- his father was a school custodian.

    Reed brushed aside speculation that was stirred last week when he accompanied Obama to Iraq and Afghanistan. "I am interested in serving in the United States Senate, and that interest trumps any consideration of serving as a vice president," he told the Providence Journal.

    As a decision approaches, speculation about Obama's choices has intensified.

    Speaking on "Fox News Sunday," the Weekly Standard's William Kristol said he thinks Obama has already decided on Kaine.

    Obama is "in Washington on Tuesday, two days from now. He'll have a secret meeting with Tim Kaine -- this is my theory -- they'll work it all out," Kristol said. "And then on Monday, next Monday, August 4th, 11 a.m. in Richmond, Obama and Tim Kaine, and that will be an attractive young ticket. . . . I'm way out there on a limb here."

    Staff writer Tim Craig contributed to this report.
    [/quote]

  2. #2
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    I can see why Obama would consider Kaine...but adding another guy with no accomplishments to speak of? I guess Kaine would be the fluff in the fluffernutter sandwich. Or is it the fluffernothing sandwich?

  3. #3
    If true, it's definitely a pick in the Gore mold, in that its made to reinforce certain aspects of Obama rather than to shore up a perceived weakness.

    Kaine is a fresh face, a credible agent of "change," and someone who has governed as a democrat in a red state, which means he knows how to reach across the aisle. Obviously, with Virginia in play, there's also a significant pickup opportunity, as well as some natural appeal to certain demographic groups that have been relatively resistant to Obama thus far.

    I sort of expected Obama to make a "Cheney" pick, which is the sort of veep choice that addresses a perceived weakness (somebody older or with more military experience, for instance). But that can be addressed by making it clear who your cabinet members might be beforehand (let it get out that Biden could be sec of state, and Wes Clark could be NSA, or something like that.).

  4. #4
    [QUOTE=nuu faaola;2653040]If true, it's definitely a pick in the Gore mold, in that its made to reinforce certain aspects of Obama rather than to shore up a perceived weakness.

    Kaine is a fresh face, a credible agent of "change," and someone who has governed as a democrat in a red state, which means he knows how to reach across the aisle. Obviously, with Virginia in play, there's also a significant pickup opportunity, as well as some natural appeal to certain demographic groups that have been relatively resistant to Obama thus far.

    I sort of expected Obama to make a "Cheney" pick, which is the sort of veep choice that addresses a perceived weakness (somebody older or with more military experience, for instance). But that can be addressed by making it clear who your cabinet members might be beforehand (let it get out that Biden could be sec of state, and Wes Clark could be NSA, or something like that.).[/QUOTE]



    A credible agent of "change" who does nothing to shore up perceived weaknesses.

    Sounds like a bull**** VP candidate.

  5. #5
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    [QUOTE=nuu faaola;2653040]
    a credible agent of "change" [/QUOTE]

    Seriously, what the hell does that mean? A "credible agent of change?"

  6. #6
    [QUOTE=shakin318;2653060]Seriously, what the hell does that mean? A "credible agent of change?"[/QUOTE]

    I only mean it in the branding sense. As a young governor, Kaine is plainly not a Washington insider and won't undermine one of Obama's central theme, which is that he can change the tone and approach to politics in Washington by seeking out common ground with conservatives in order to get stuff done.

    If he picks, sat, Hillary Clinton, its very hard to argue that his presidency will truly be something different. Kaine doesn't get in the way of that point.

  7. #7
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    [QUOTE=nuu faaola;2653070]I only mean it in the branding sense. As a young governor, Kaine is plainly not a Washington insider and won't undermine one of Obama's central theme, which is that he can change the tone and approach to politics in Washington by seeking out common ground with conservatives in order to get stuff done.

    If he picks, sat, Hillary Clinton, its very hard to argue that his presidency will truly be something different. Kaine doesn't get in the way of that point.[/QUOTE]

    He's a Catholic with a faith-based objection to abortion. That's not likely to help Obama pick up the still-simmering Hillary supporters.

    On the other hand, he's against the death penalty, and for stricter gun controls (understandable considering the V-Tech massacre), but those positions won't help with conservatives.

    He's also big on raising taxes...he should ask Mondale how that works out in a G.E.

  8. #8
    [QUOTE=shakin318;2653081]He's a Catholic with a faith-based objection to abortion. That's not likely to help Obama pick up the still-simmering Hillary supporters.

    On the other hand, he's against the death penalty, and for stricter gun controls (understandable considering the V-Tech massacre), but those positions won't help with conservatives.

    He's also big on raising taxes...he should ask Mondale how that works out in a G.E.[/QUOTE]

    There are very, very few still-simmering Hillary supporters. The most recent polls show Obama's support among Democrats is basically the same as McCain's among republicans. The few HRC dead enders are loud, but insignificant in number.

    Kaine is a popular Democratic governor in a red state, who carried areas that democrats almost never do in the last election there. Clearly those stances are not toxic for him.

    I do not think, by the way, that "conservatives" are the target with this pick. Obama has been reaching out quite a bit to younger evangelicals, who tend to favor greater government action to deal with stuff like domestic poverty and foreign aid. Somebody like Kaine --a devout Catholic-- is going to help with that group, which has a big presence in some battleground states (Ohio, for instance). He's also shown pretty good appeal (for a democrat) for those so-called "working class whites" we keep hearing about.

  9. #9
    [QUOTE=pauliec;2653057]A credible agent of "change" who does nothing to shore up perceived weaknesses.

    Sounds like a bull**** VP candidate.[/QUOTE]

    A lot of times picking a veep to shore up a perceived weakness simply has the effect of reminding people of the perceived weakness.

    One reason Lieberman wound up being a bad choice for Gore was that, as soon as the original excitement over having a Jew on the ticket faded, all the stories about him said "he picked the most pious guy he could find to distance himself for Clinton." The result was it drew extra attention to the weakness.

    If McCain were to pick somebody really young, like Bobby Jindal, the result would be: "Look how old McCain looks next to that guy."


    The other benefit of picking someone relatively unknown is that you get to dictate the early coverage of the choice. The first few waves of stories will be highly biographical and, by connection, very flattering. If it is Kaine, you'll hear over and over about his appeal within a red state, his religiosity, etc...

    If you pick a more nationally known figure, it's harder to dictate the coverage, because the media already has narratives for the choice. Joe Biden --who might be a good choice anyhow-- wouold bring a lot of stories about his plagiarism slip up in the 1980s.

    Should McCain pick Romney, for instance, it'll bring alot of coverage about what a douche he was in the primary and all the nasty things he and McCain said about each other. Same thing if Obama were to pick Clinton.

    All that aside, the veep tends not to have that big an impact on the result in most years. And one thing that's striking about Kaine is that he's far less charismatic than Obama, so it's almost like he's being picked in part because he won't overshadow the candidate.

    If he gets picked at all, that is.

  10. #10
    obama kaine

    sounds good on tv and it looks good on a sign

    Obama personally knows the guy & DNC really doesn't want to pluck another senator for VP, especially a red state guy when they are trying to build a majority.

  11. #11
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;2653219]obama kaine

    sounds good on tv and it looks good on a sign

    Obama personally knows the guy & DNC really doesn't want to pluck another senator for VP, especially a red state guy when they are trying to build a majority.[/QUOTE]

    An unlikely choice but a good one. Kaine is a southern governor whose done a good job in his state. Personally, I would have liked to see Obama pick Evan Bayh or Wesley Clark but Kaine is still a good choice.

    Another possibility would have been Kaine's predecessor Mark Warner. Warner is another Bill Clinton, charismatic, southern governor and very ambitious. Warner would probably be the frontrunner for the Veep nod but he's running for the Senate and he's whipping Jim Gilmor in the polls right now.
    Last edited by VincenzoTestaverde; 07-29-2008 at 10:10 PM.

  12. #12
    [QUOTE=VincenzoTestaverde;2655047]An unlikely choice but a good one. Kaine is a southern governor whose done a good job in his state. Personally, I would have liked to see Obama pick Evan Bayh or Wesley Clark but Kaine is still a good choice.

    Another possibility would have been Kaine's predecessor Mark Warner. Warner is another Bill Clinton, charismatic, southern governor and very ambitious. Warner would probably be the frontrunner for the Veep nod but he's running for the Senate and he's whipping Jim Gilmor in the polls right now.[/QUOTE]

    Warner would be awesome. He had a shot to win if he'd bothered to run in the first place.

  13. #13
    [QUOTE=VincenzoTestaverde;2655047]An unlikely choice but a good one.[/QUOTE]

    It's not unlikely at all. Obama is guaranteed to take his VP from the great State of Virginia. And Virginia is guaranteed to be a difference maker in the 2008 Election.

  14. #14
    [QUOTE=bitonti;2652967]Kristol basically calls the VP race in last paragraph, i like that guts

    see there's something for everyone this morning[/QUOTE]the only way obama has any chance is by picking a white woman.and even then...

  15. #15
    [QUOTE=Warfish;2655787]It's not unlikely at all. Obama is guaranteed to take his VP from the great State of Virginia. And Virginia is guaranteed to be a difference maker in the 2008 Election.[/QUOTE]

    Three good choices from there: Kaine, Webb, Warner. Any of the three would be a good pick. I actually like Kaine the least of that bunch, but still think he'd be an asset on the ticket.

    I would not totally rule out Kathleen Sebelius, the governor of Kansas, just yet. She has a lot of the same qualities as Kaine --in terms of being an effective dem governor in a red state, knowing how to work across the aisle and being a Washington outsider-- and also brings deep family ties to Ohio (her dad was guv there).

    Based on current polling, Obama has a decent shot in Virginia even without a local on the ticket.

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