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Thread: Yeah, Americans LOVE their healthcare

  1. #1
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    Yeah, Americans LOVE their healthcare

    For those who really believe that US healthcare is in sterling shape and doesn't need to be changed,
    I would suggest you pay attention to what the vast majority of your fellow citizens think....

    From Yahoo:

    Americans want overhaul of health system: survey By Julie Steenhuysen
    18 minutes ago



    More than 80 percent of Americans think the U.S. health system needs either fundamental change or a complete overhaul, according to a survey released on Thursday.

    Access to care, better coordination between different health providers and better flow of health information were among their chief complaints, the Harris Interactive poll found -- just as another poll found that health insurance costs have doubled for Americans since 1996.

    "It's clear that our health care system isn't giving Americans the health care they need and deserve," said Karen Davis, president of the nonprofit Commonwealth Fund, which commissioned the survey.

    Both major presidential candidates, Democrat Barack Obama and Republican John McCain, have pledged to address problems with the U.S. health system. About 47 million Americans do not have insurance.

    In the poll, which surveyed a random sample of 1,004 U.S. adults in May, 32 percent agreed the system needed complete rebuilding, while 50 percent thought it required fundamental change.

    These views were similar regardless of income and insurance status, with 81 percent of those who were insured for the prior year and 89 percent who were uninsured during the prior year calling for either fundamental change or complete rebuilding.

    Overall, 16 percent of adults said the health care system works relatively well and needed only minor reform.

    Most said health insurance needs to be simplified, and 9 out of 10 said they supported the wider use of health information systems that could improve coordination between health providers.

    PREMIUMS HAVE JUMPED SINCE 1996

    The nonprofit fund also released findings of a report suggesting ways to improve the U.S. system. It recommends rewarding health providers for high quality care, and offering patients incentives for seeking out health providers that offer the best and most efficient care.

    Much of the report focused on ways to improve efficiency and accountability among health providers.

    Inefficiencies and rising costs have resulted in a 100 percent increase in health premiums for private sector employers and their workers in just over a decade, according to the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality, which is part of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

    Its national survey, released on Thursday, found the average premium for a family insurance plan rose to $11,381 in 2006, from $4,954 in 1996, while the average cost for a single premium rose to $4,118 from $1,992.

    Employers paid for most of the increases, but employees saw their share rise as well, climbing to an average of $2,890 for family coverage in 2006 from $1,275 in 1996, and an average of $788 per year for single coverage, up from $342.

    Americans spend double what people in other industrialized countries do on health care, but often have more trouble seeing doctors, are the victims of more errors and go without treatment more often.

    A Commonwealth Fund survey last year found that Americans spent $6,697 per capita on health care in 2005, or 16 percent of gross domestic product, compared to $3,326 in Canada, or 9.8 percent of GDP.

    (Editing by Maggie Fox and Stacey Joyce)

  2. #2
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    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;2674587]For those who really believe that US healthcare is in sterling shape and doesn't need to be changed,
    I would suggest you pay attention to what the vast majority of your fellow citizens think....

    From Yahoo:

    Americans want overhaul of health system: survey By Julie Steenhuysen
    18 minutes ago



    More than 80 percent of Americans think the U.S. health system needs either fundamental change or a complete overhaul, according to a survey released on Thursday.

    Access to care, better coordination between different health providers and better flow of health information were among their chief complaints, the Harris Interactive poll found -- just as another poll found that health insurance costs have doubled for Americans since 1996.

    "It's clear that our health care system isn't giving Americans the health care they need and deserve," said Karen Davis, president of the nonprofit Commonwealth Fund, which commissioned the survey.

    Both major presidential candidates, Democrat Barack Obama and Republican John McCain, have pledged to address problems with the U.S. health system. About 47 million Americans do not have insurance.

    In the poll, which surveyed a random sample of 1,004 U.S. adults in May, 32 percent agreed the system needed complete rebuilding, while 50 percent thought it required fundamental change.

    These views were similar regardless of income and insurance status, with 81 percent of those who were insured for the prior year and 89 percent who were uninsured during the prior year calling for either fundamental change or complete rebuilding.

    Overall, 16 percent of adults said the health care system works relatively well and needed only minor reform.

    Most said health insurance needs to be simplified, and 9 out of 10 said they supported the wider use of health information systems that could improve coordination between health providers.

    PREMIUMS HAVE JUMPED SINCE 1996

    The nonprofit fund also released findings of a report suggesting ways to improve the U.S. system. It recommends rewarding health providers for high quality care, and offering patients incentives for seeking out health providers that offer the best and most efficient care.

    Much of the report focused on ways to improve efficiency and accountability among health providers.

    Inefficiencies and rising costs have resulted in a 100 percent increase in health premiums for private sector employers and their workers in just over a decade, according to the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality, which is part of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

    Its national survey, released on Thursday, found the average premium for a family insurance plan rose to $11,381 in 2006, from $4,954 in 1996, while the average cost for a single premium rose to $4,118 from $1,992.

    Employers paid for most of the increases, but employees saw their share rise as well, climbing to an average of $2,890 for family coverage in 2006 from $1,275 in 1996, and an average of $788 per year for single coverage, up from $342.

    Americans spend double what people in other industrialized countries do on health care, but often have more trouble seeing doctors, are the victims of more errors and go without treatment more often.

    A Commonwealth Fund survey last year found that Americans spent $6,697 per capita on health care in 2005, or 16 percent of gross domestic product, compared to $3,326 in Canada, or 9.8 percent of GDP.

    (Editing by Maggie Fox and Stacey Joyce)[/QUOTE]
    And how exactly would you manage the smoker complaining of a cough who is demanding a CAT Scan even though it is not indicated? These are the battles doctors in the front lines face daily, yet the policy makers do not understand. Doctors are put in the position of either being the "bad guy" and refuse to order the test and thus anger or alienate a patient (who would be more likely to sue if a bad outcome occurred, according to many studies), or if they order a test they will be labeled as "overutilizers" by the pencil pushers, and also blamed for "driving up per capita healthcare costs".

  3. #3
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    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;2674587]
    I would suggest you pay attention to what the vast majority of your fellow citizens think....[/QUOTE]

    The "vast majority" of Americans also believe in Angels, and watch American Idol.

    Forgive me, but I'll take the uninformed ignorance of "the vast majority" with a boulder of salt when forming public policy.

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    poll every other country in the word and you'll get the same or worse.

  5. #5
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    [QUOTE=acepepe;2675096]poll every other country in the word and you'll get the same or worse.[/QUOTE]

    Actually, that's completely false. We rank very poorly among industrialized nations in the satisfaction rates with our healthcare system. But I wouldn't expect you to know that. And if you did know it, you would deny it. That's why there is no chance of having an intelligent discussion of this issue here. Warfish's perpetual "I'm skeptical of anything that doesn't agree with my prejudices and pessimistic about anything I do agree with," is virtually impossible to engage. It's an issue of temprament, not reason. In any other industry/business, if 80% of your customers said you need to make significant changes to your product and 40% said you need to change "fundamentally" I think you would pay attention. Not Warfish. Believe it or not, every healthcare provider pays close attention to patient satisfaction. It actually does matter.

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    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;2675225]Actually, that's completely false. We rank very poorly among industrialized nations in the satisfaction rates with our healthcare system. But I wouldn't expect you to know that. And if you did know it, you would deny it. That's why there is no chance of having an intelligent discussion of this issue here. Warfish's perpetual "I'm skeptical of anything that doesn't agree with my prejudices and pessimistic about anything I do agree with," is virtually impossible to engage. It's an issue of temprament, not reason. In any other industry/business, if 80% of your customers said you need to make significant changes to your product and 40% said you need to change "fundamentally" I think you would pay attention. Not Warfish. Believe it or not, every healthcare provider pays close attention to patient satisfaction. It actually does matter.[/QUOTE]

    How about considering the possibility that population has unrealistic expectations regarding their healthcare?

  7. #7
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    16 Percent were satisfied? Must be the old people and the folks who's employer pays their ins.:huh:

    I have a hard time believing that that Americans are more commonly victims of errors. We pay our doctors better than most countries that is why they choose to stay here. I was talking to an old lady who seemed knowledgeable and she said our system is expensive but better than Canad's as far as quality. The good doctors in Canada would rather work here for more money.

    Yes my premiums have doubled. I been paying a long time and never been to the doctors. Doctors and Lawyers necessary evils but I stay away from them as much as I can. :(

    Hypocondriacts, alcoholics, drug addicts and others will abuse the system. Wonder how they deal with it in Canada? :huh:

  8. #8
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    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;2675225]Actually, that's completely false. We rank very poorly among industrialized nations in the satisfaction rates with our healthcare system. But I wouldn't expect you to know that. And if you did know it, you would deny it. That's why there is no chance of having an intelligent discussion of this issue here. Warfish's perpetual "I'm skeptical of anything that doesn't agree with my prejudices and pessimistic about anything I do agree with," is virtually impossible to engage. It's an issue of temprament, not reason. In any other industry/business, if 80% of your customers said you need to make significant changes to your product and 40% said you need to change "fundamentally" I think you would pay attention. Not Warfish. Believe it or not, every healthcare provider pays close attention to patient satisfaction. It actually does matter.[/QUOTE]

    91% say we need a new congress. so I'm sure you will be calling San frarn Nan to let her know she sucks (not to digress)

  9. #9
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    [QUOTE=HDCentStOhio;2675240]How about considering the possibility that population has unrealistic expectations regarding their healthcare?[/QUOTE]

    Ah yes, spoken like a doctor. Those silly patients don't know what's good for them, expect miracles, and don't follow our advice anyway. Let's not consider the possibility that the ability to communicate, to empathize, and to recognize that we are not dealing with a symptom but a person might make for better outcomes.... Your comment also doesn't explain the fact that other countries do much better when it comes to how patients feel they are being treated. How could that be? In what ways specifically is our medical practice/training superior to that in Britain, France or Germany?

    In addition, note that we spend double what Canadians spend for their health care. Are we getting double the results?

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    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;2675663][B]Ah yes, spoken like a doctor[/B]. Those silly patients don't know what's good for them, expect miracles, and don't follow our advice anyway. Let's not consider the possibility that the ability to communicate, to empathize, and to recognize that we are not dealing with a symptom but a person might make for better outcomes.... Your comment also doesn't explain the fact that other countries do much better when it comes to how patients feel they are being treated. How could that be? In what ways specifically is our medical practice/training superior to that in Britain, France or Germany?

    In addition, note that we spend double what Canadians spend for their health care. Are we getting double the results?[/QUOTE]
    And your posts are spoken like a pencil pushing administrator who has never treated a patient but thinks a few courses in finance makes them an expert on medical care. You obviously have not dealt with the front lines of medicine, and don't know how unreasonable some requests or expectations are from patients. Requests for whole body scans because Aunt so and so had a tumor 20 years ago that started with similar symptoms. "Just talk to the patient and alleviate their concerns" doesn't work 100% of the time. But you wouldn't know this from just looking at spreadsheets.

    US medical training is tops in the world. Why do doctors come from all over the world to train here? Our technology and research is top notch, and while other countries may have a few institutions of world reknown, it is much more extensive here.

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    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;2675663]Ah yes, spoken like a doctor. Those silly patients don't know what's good for them, expect miracles, and don't follow our advice anyway. Let's not consider the possibility that the ability to communicate, to empathize, and to recognize that we are not dealing with a symptom but a person might make for better outcomes.... Your comment also doesn't explain the fact that other countries do much better when it comes to how patients feel they are being treated. How could that be? In what ways specifically is our medical practice/training superior to that in Britain, France or Germany?

    In addition, note that we spend double what Canadians spend for their health care. Are we getting double the results?[/QUOTE]

    Why dont you go to Canada and Europe for a few years and report back. I'm sure your insight will be eagerly anticipated. Everyone wants to complain and moan and say how bad it is in America....if its so bad please go somewhere else. No one is stopping you...it is a free country. We have THE best medical system in the world...I urge you to find one that provides better care anywhere. So please go on your medical care world tour and report back.

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    [QUOTE=sec.101row23;2676457]Why dont you go to Canada and Europe for a few years and report back. I'm sure your insight will be eagerly anticipated. Everyone wants to complain and moan and say how bad it is in America....if its so bad please go somewhere else. No one is stopping you...it is a free country. We have THE best medical system in the world...I urge you to find one that provides better care anywhere. So please go on your medical care world tour and report back.[/QUOTE]

    Because everyone in America can afford to go across the world or even up to Canada to seek better medical care. :rolleyes:

  13. #13
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    [QUOTE=Sharrow;2676614]Because everyone in America can afford to go across the world or even up to Canada to seek better medical care. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

    Whats your point???? My point was that if you think its so much better everywhere else then go there and see. If you hate it here so much then leave.

  14. #14
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    Great point. Don't fix a problem go find a worse problem. Great point indeed. When your child makes a mistake do you tell him or her to knock on the neighbor's door and stay there. Mistakes are ignored your home.

    [QUOTE=sec.101row23;2676627]Whats your point???? My point was that if you think its so much better everywhere else then go there and see. If you hate it here so much then leave.[/QUOTE]

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    [QUOTE=sec.101row23;2676627]Whats your point???? My point was that if you think its so much better everywhere else then go there and see. If you hate it here so much then leave.[/QUOTE]

    My point was that your point was stupid. Anybody who uses "If you don't like it, gtfo" is a complete and utter moron. Period. What, people can't want things to get better? People can't look for ways to improve and work towards that improvement? Jesus dude, you're just really ignorant.

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    [QUOTE=sec.101row23;2676627]Blah, Blah, Blah.[/QUOTE]

    Let me tell you something. If you don't want America to be the best country it can be, why don't you get the **** out? lol.

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    [QUOTE=cr726;2676636]Great point. Don't fix a problem go find a worse problem. Great point indeed. When your child makes a mistake do you tell him or her to knock on the neighbor's door and stay there. Mistakes are ignored your home.[/QUOTE]

    The original topic was how many people complain about the quality of the health care they recieve here in the United States. Our point was that it is the best health care in the world...and that people dont realize how good it actually is. My comment if you dont like it go somewhere else was made because everyone likes to complain how bad things are here in America. My point was if you think its so bad then go somewhere else and find out how good we have it.

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    [QUOTE=Sharrow;2676648]My point was that your point was stupid. Anybody who uses "If you don't like it, gtfo" is a complete and utter moron. Period. What, people can't want things to get better? People can't look for ways to improve and work towards that improvement? Jesus dude, you're just really ignorant.[/QUOTE]

    Hey moron look at the original topic. People are complaining about the quality of health care they recieve in America. And yea if you liberals hate America as much as you do...you should go somewhere else. Work towards improvement??? When has a liberal improved anything??? except for the lazy, unemployed and Illegals.

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    [QUOTE=sec.101row23;2676667]When has a liberal improved anything??? except for the lazy, unemployed and Illegals.[/QUOTE]

    Not that I think the current liberals have it right, but you need to go learn your history dude, the world would suck balls right now without the liberals of the past, just like it would without the conservatives of the past. Imo, that balance is an essential thing in society.

  20. #20
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    If I don't agree with your opinion I should leave the country.

    What makes our healthcare the best? Please stand up your opinion.

    [QUOTE=sec.101row23;2676660]The original topic was how many people complain about the quality of the health care they recieve here in the United States. Our point was that it is the best health care in the world...and that people dont realize how good it actually is. My comment if you dont like it go somewhere else was made because everyone likes to complain how bad things are here in America. My point was if you think its so bad then go somewhere else and find out how good we have it.[/QUOTE]

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