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View Poll Results: Do we need stricter consequences for racist posts?

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Thread: Politics Forum Ground Rules Request

  1. #81
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    [QUOTE=sackdance99;2942850]I agree!!

    doggin94it + :fireboy: = :D[/QUOTE]

    you are sick, why does it make you happy someone is going to burn and suffer in hell?

  2. #82
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    [QUOTE=sackdance;2943150]Using derogatory-slang terms is boorish, not criminal. The 'once-and-you're-done' mindset, which paralells the mindset of PC-codes on college campuses is moronic.

    The following is a recent quote from the leading left leaning party (the Labour Party) in historically one of Europe's most progressive countries, Holland: [I]"The mistake we can never repeat is stifling criticism of cultures and religions for reasons of tolerance."[/I]

    Eye-opening article: [url]http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/12/29/europe/politicus.php[/url]

    Even the Dutch are learning, the hard way, that with unquestioning multiculturalism (as in, "question your President, call him a monkey and equate him with Hitler because it's patriotic, but don't you dare insult your Yemeni neighbors or their culture!") come grave consequences.[/QUOTE]

    Actually, maybe I don't get what he means. I checked out the Israel thread and only saw one instance of a guy calling muslims a towelhead, and nothing else that imo could deserve a ban. I do agree that very few things should be 1st time bannable offenses. But that kind of thing shouldn't be tolerated here.

  3. #83
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    [QUOTE=HDCentStOhio;2940907]As one of Italian heritage, I personally laugh off the mafia stereotype. However, Dean and Fukush make a good point that others may take offense. Who is to judge what is offensive and what is not? Why not call the game "JI Assasins"? Why "JI Mafia"?[/QUOTE]

    I think this gets to the heart of the matter. It is exceedingly difficult to judge how offensive someone feels about something.

    I went to Albany State (graduated in 85). After living off campus as a sophomore and junior and seeing all of my friends graduate, I had to go back on campus as a senior. For about a month, I had no roommate. Then I went to the Delaware to fish for a weekend and returned to find a line of folks sitting along the wall of my room. They were giggling and acting weirdly, like they knew a joke was about to played on me and couldn't contain themselves. As I approached my room I asked them what was wrong. No one said anything. I asked again and again and finally, one of them giggled that I had gotten a new a black roommate.

    I had grown up in "lily white" (oops, heavily caucasoid dominant) Bayport where two "black" (I mean African American) kids went. I used to quote from the Truly Tasteless Joke Book and racist jokes reigned. But in that instant of revelation, I realized what it was like to be laughed at because of skin color (believe me, I know I can't feel what it is like to be black, but I did feel that there is something to how a black man feels.)

    From that moment outside my dormroom, I have tried to avoid racist jokes that have any ability to cut.

    I guess it's the walk a mile in my shoes thing ...........

    But that said, there is much to be said about us being, as a society, too sensitive for our own good. Growing up, I used to get teased unmercifully because, not only was I fat, but I had a car accident left one leg over three inches shorter than the other nickname: Weebles - he wobbles but he don;t fall down). On top of that I was a Mick, Great Grandma was half Jewish, Met fan, Jet fan and, at one time when very young, liked the Partridge Family and Donny Osmond! Needless to say, I got blasted by the other kids:).

    It was preparation for the posts I would one day read in some of these threads:)

    I can;t even begin to say what is right, other than that if you post things with the sole intent to hurt or harm, that's not cool. If there is a sense of trying to make a point (albeit rudely) that has a fair basis (for instance, the Men Who Wear Sandals - which in and of itself is offensive) as a response to being told you are going to Hell, I guess I kind of think you can;t tell someone they are going to Hell in a judgmental way and then expect them to be nice. But I also think we can't just let any words make us overreact. I am not even sure where the balance point is....

    I am rambling and have to go tutor.
    Last edited by JCnflies; 12-30-2008 at 12:45 PM.

  4. #84
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    [QUOTE=whatthe;2943158]you are sick, why does it make you happy someone is going to burn and suffer in hell?[/QUOTE]

    Because anyone who is that foolish to deny Jesus Christ, after he warns you hundreds of times throughout scripture, deserves to go there. That's why the Jews are under greater condemnation. I don't feel bad for them one bit. In fact Jesus said his judgment will be without mercy. How does that sound?

  5. #85
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    [QUOTE=sackdance99;2943713]Because anyone who is that foolish to deny Jesus Christ, after he warns you hundreds of times throughout scripture, deserves to go there. That's why the Jews are under greater condemnation. I don't feel bad for them one bit. In fact Jesus said his judgment will be without mercy. How does that sound?[/QUOTE]

    Didnt Jesus also say not to condem or judge anyone?

    And how can you be sure the Bible is real, wasnt it written by a group of men hundreds of years after Jesus supposedly existed, how can you be so sure it is real?

  6. #86
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    [QUOTE=whatthe;2943842]Didnt Jesus also say not to condem or judge anyone?

    And how can you be sure the Bible is real, wasnt it written by a group of men hundreds of years after Jesus supposedly existed, how can you be so sure it is real?[/QUOTE]

    Oh young whatthe, I wish you lots of luck trying to debate him, its been tried over and over again, he will not address rational and logical arguments.

  7. #87
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    I am not sure whether or not God "rejoices" at someone going to Hell - at least not in the sense that is on the surface. It is, in some ways, unclear in scripture. In addition to God being the example of what love truly is (as opposed to our perversion of it), He is also Judge. I know he must "rejoice" (at least in one sense) that justice is served. But Hell in and of itself was made for the angels, not man, and it doesn't take much to figure that God would wish we all accepted His sacrifice.

    Perhaps the "rejoicing" is a bit like being happy about the firing of Mangini. I get that it sure looks like Mangini will never lead us to the promised land (Super Bowl), but I still feel badly (on one level) because he had some redeeming qualities as well. So, yes, I am happy that he was fired. But if I just said that I am "rejoicing" that he is fired would not fully give the picture.

    Here's the thing about people going to Hell. If we know what Hell is and how painful it is (or at least a sense of it), it should cause all of us great pain. I like to look at "winning souls" the way Spurgeon did - namely that we should do every thing we can to encourage people toward Heaven and away from Hell. .......... in our actions, words and motives with an agape sense of love ever remembering Who it is we represent. One thing I try to keep in mind is when Moses struck the rock when the Israelites sinned. God got angry with Moses for presupposing His mind and punished Moses by never letting him into the promised land.

  8. #88
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    [QUOTE=whatthe;2943842]Didnt Jesus also say not to condem or judge anyone?

    And how can you be sure the Bible is real, wasnt it written by a group of men hundreds of years after Jesus supposedly existed, how can you be so sure it is real?[/QUOTE]

    Not exactly. THe gist of Jesus comments along these lines was not so much to permit wrong by others as much to recognize the wrong in yourself nad not to act like you are better than someone else.

    But every time Jesus saw sin he called it what it was. For instance, He did say Mary Magdelene sinned, but chose not to condemn her for it - same with the woman at the well. It is not like Jesus said it was no big deal. He would say something akin to "Go and sin no more."

    Jesus knew that if He could have a relationship first and then a behavior change would follow. We get it backwards when we think that we first change our behavior and then are worthy of the relationship.

    As for the other topic, perhaps you should start a thread. Suffice it to say there is a TON of info to be had on the authenticity of the Bible.
    Last edited by JCnflies; 12-30-2008 at 03:46 PM.

  9. #89
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    [QUOTE=JCnflies;2943854]I am not sure whether or not God "rejoices" at someone going to Hell - at least not in the sense that is on the surface. It is, in some ways, unclear in scripture. In addition to God being the example of what love truly is (as opposed to our perversion of it), He is also Judge. I know he must "rejoice" (at least in one sense) that justice is served. But Hell in and of itself was made for the angels, not man, and it doesn't take much to figure that God would wish we all accepted His sacrifice.

    [/QUOTE]

    This is why I could never, ever, follow your God. A person could spend a lifetime "sacrificing" their time, money...damn near anything for those less fortunate, and if they don't recognize the massive ego of your God, well then, off to hell with you.

  10. #90
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    [QUOTE=OrangeJet;2943931]A person could spend a lifetime "sacrificing" their time, money...damn near anything for those less fortunate, and if they don't recognize the massive ego of your God, well then, off to hell with you.[/QUOTE]

    Amen baby. Now you got it! And I gots news for ya, it's ain't changing. Deal with that!

    :boogie2:

  11. #91
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    [QUOTE=OrangeJet;2943931]This is why I could never, ever, follow your God. A person could spend a lifetime "sacrificing" their time, money...damn near anything for those less fortunate, and if they don't recognize the massive ego of your God, well then, off to hell with you.[/QUOTE]

    If you don;t mind, I'd like to mention something about that. Compared to me and you and maybe pretty much everybody else who ever lived, this person who sacrifices their time, money, etc sure seems like a far better person and far more deserving of good in the afterlife than just about anybody else.

    But what scripture teaches is that the standard is not other people but God himself. Is any one of us as holy as God is? That is what it takes to live in His presence in Heaven (according to scripture.) As good as that hypothetical person is, I doubt they never sinned or did anything wrong or selfish.

    Now if it is true that no one has been perfect, wouldn't it then follow that it is a gift that God that He would allow, if you were willing to accept His terms, eternal life with him?

    Now if you are suggesting this is not fair, I am with you. We all deserve Hell, period. The fact that He would forgive is what sets Christianity apart from all other faiths - grace. If you don't want to accept his terms, fine, but He holds all the cards.

    It seems that you say God has this massive ego. I am not sure ego is the right word. If such a being as God exists and if in His capacity as God he created everything, that entitles him to Supreme Authority. Now if God were on an all consuming power / ego trip, I think he'd say "to Hell with those lowlives" and have nothing to do with us ever again. But He did not! Instead, He condescended from above to say let me show them what I mean and became one of us. In so doing, He was even willing to suffer not only ridicule but some pretty vicious physical pain. To me, that sounds not like ego but service and forgiveness.

    I am not trying to argue the veracity of this (that can be done elsewhere and i am trying to not hijack this thread any more), only to as accurately as I can relay what the faith teaches.
    Last edited by JCnflies; 12-30-2008 at 04:48 PM.

  12. #92
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    [QUOTE=OrangeJet;2943931]This is why I could never, ever, follow your God. A person could spend a lifetime [B]"sacrificing"[/B] their time, money...damn near anything for those less fortunate, and if they don't recognize the massive ego of your God, well then, off to hell with you.[/QUOTE]


    Thats the beauty of Christianity, the sacrificing has already been done for you.

  13. #93
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    [QUOTE=JCnflies;2944039]
    It seems that you say God has this massive ego. I am not sure ego is the right word. If such a being as God exists and if in His capacity as God he created everything, that entitles him to Supreme Authority. Now if God were on an all consuming power / ego trip, I think he'd say "to Hell with those lowlives" and have nothing to do with us ever again. But He did not! Instead, He condescended from above to say let me show them what I mean and became one of us. In so doing, He was even willing to suffer not only ridicule but some pretty vicious physical pain. To me, that sounds not like ego but service and forgiveness.

    I am not trying to argue the veracity of this (that can be done elsewhere and i am trying to not hijack this thread any more), only to as accurately as I can relay what the faith teaches.[/QUOTE]

    Perhaps ego isn't the right word...but I flat out refuse to follow someone who would reward a rapist and punish a do-gooder simply for their feelings about Him.

    I didn't quote it, but I'd also like to comment on the "as holy as God" comment...is the above scenerio that I mentioned really holy?
    Last edited by OrangeJet; 12-30-2008 at 05:07 PM.

  14. #94
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    [QUOTE=The Crusher;2944099]Thats the beauty of Christianity, the sacrificing has already been done for you.[/QUOTE]

    Is that why Sackdance is such a douche to everyone?

  15. #95
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    [QUOTE=PlumberKhan;2944144]Is that why Sackdance is such a douche to everyone?[/QUOTE]

    No, thats his way of getting peoples attention. Everyone on this site like him or hate him, knows who he is and what he is about. I think he's willing to piss a few people off to help one get saved.

  16. #96
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    [QUOTE=OrangeJet;2944109]Perhaps ego isn't the right word...but I flat out refuse to follow someone who would reward a rapist and punish a do-gooder simply for their feelings about Him.

    I didn't quote it, but I'd also like to comment on the "as holy as God" comment...is the above scenerio that I mentioned really holy?[/QUOTE]

    One of the things that I have found is that just because you identify yourself with Christ does not mean you escape punishment - "only" eternal punishment. Look at David in his sin with Bathsheba and the fact that the son first born of that union God took. There are a million other examples.

    You are straying into one of the most difficult areas of Christianity to wrap our minds around - an area that definitely has to be taken on faith. I would call myself a Calvinist (at least mostly.) The point in Calvinism that I feel most strongly about is the belief that we do nothing to save ourselves, but that God saves us. The opposite view, that we save ourselves by our decision to follow Christ, is called Armenianism (sp?).

    So either, we are saved by God even before we are born and His pull on us is literally irresistible or we are born able to deny that call. Scripturally, Calvinism is right on the mark logically while Armenianism is more like how we think it ought to be and is more emotional.

    Here's where the faith comes in...... if we are saved based on what God has decided and nothing we could possibly do our own, that means that some God has decided, as some sort of cosmic corollary, that they will not be saved. At first glance this seems frighteningly unfair. The faith is in, knowing first hand the compassion and love of God as evidenced in our own lives, that God will not make such a determination without merit. How He makes that call, I will not know in this lifetime.

    I can probably write for hours on this, but as for the possibility of the hypothetical rapist gaining heaven and the do gooder Hell. To me the point about the do gooder is moot because, Biblically, no one deserves Heaven. As for the rapist. I can;t give an answer that makes sense to us - only that God can see something redeemable and that, despite the suffering, He somehow manages to both make good by the victim and regenerate the perpetrator.

    I am under no illusion that I can create some sort of brilliant argument that will sway you to accepting Christianity. I am only trying to give you the best answer I can at the moment. But you have inspired me to look and read up better ones. If I can find something, I'll let you know.

  17. #97
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    [QUOTE=The Crusher;2944280]No, thats his way of getting peoples attention. Everyone on this site like him or hate him, knows who he is and what he is about. I think he's willing to piss a few people off to help one get saved.[/QUOTE]

    The problem is too many people want kissy-poo bible truth. They WANT to be lied to. Better to take the harsh truth than find out too late when God smacks your backside into Hell when you die.

    For example Brian Dawkins from the Eagles told his coach Andy Reid that he was going to hell. Why? Because Dawkins has warned him countless times that his goofy cult Mormon religion is from the devil himself and is taking him to hell. Reid will not speak to Dawkins any longer but Dawkins told him the truth. Andy Reid will split hell wide open when he dies as a Mormon. He is without excuse. God sent a messenger (Brian Dawkins) to warn him but like the rest of you fools here in Jets Insider, you ignore this and will end up spending eternity in the Lake of Fire. You have been warned.

    [IMG]http://pm.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/hell.jpg[/IMG]

  18. #98
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    [QUOTE=sackdance99;2944795]The problem is too many people want kissy-poo bible truth. They WANT to be lied to. Better to take the harsh truth than find out too late when God smacks your backside into Hell when you die.

    For example Brian Dawkins from the Eagles told his coach Andy Reid that he was going to hell. Why? Because Dawkins has warned him countless times that his goofy cult Mormon religion is from the devil himself and is taking him to hell. Reid will not speak to Dawkins any longer but Dawkins told him the truth. Andy Reid will split hell wide open when he dies as a Mormon. He is without excuse. God sent a messenger (Brian Dawkins) to warn him but like the rest of you fools here in Jets Insider, you ignore this and will end up spending eternity in the Lake of Fire. You have been warned.

    [IMG]http://pm.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/hell.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]

    what is your reason for believing what you do

  19. #99
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    [QUOTE=whatthe;2944896]what is your reason for believing what you do[/QUOTE]

    I'm another messenger. I hope you get saved before it's too late. Turn or Burn today.

  20. #100
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    [QUOTE=sackdance99;2944795] He is without excuse. God sent a messenger (Brian Dawkins) to warn him but like the rest of [B]you fools here in Jets Insider, you ignore this and will end up spending eternity in the Lake of Fire[/B]. You have been warned.

    [IMG]http://pm.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/hell.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
    What about those that have you on ignore and can not see your "message"?

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