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Thread: Brandon Graham v. Jerry Hughes

  1. #21
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    [QUOTE=Come Back to NY;3423962]Tate drops a lot of catchable throws.....Williams doesn't....

    [I]"Hughes is believed to be a 2nd round pick anyways"[/I] link??[/QUOTE]

    [url]http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=76844&draftyear=2010&genpos=OLB[/url]

    [url]http://www.mockingthedraft.com/pages/2010-nfl-draft-wide-receivers[/url]
    Last edited by raysdaone; 12-28-2009 at 10:52 PM.

  2. #22
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    [QUOTE=raysdaone;3424005][url]http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=76844&draftyear=2010&genpos=OLB[/url]

    [url]http://www.mockingthedraft.com/pages/2010-nfl-draft-wide-receivers[/url][/QUOTE]

    wouldn't bother with the second link...

    as far as draft scout; good guys but like everyone else December rankings are meaningless...

    [url]http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings[/url]

    a guy like Hughes who can get after the QB the way he does and has shown the ability to play in space rarely gets out of round one....

  3. #23
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    [QUOTE=Come Back to NY;3424036]wouldn't bother with the second link...

    as far as draft scout; good guys but like everyone else December rankings are meaningless...

    [url]http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings[/url]

    a guy like Hughes who can get after the QB the way he does and has shown the ability to play in space rarely gets out of round one....[/QUOTE]

    I dont like CBS at all. They have Taylor Mays as the #3 prospect?? and Brandon Lafell as #6. These rankings suck. Both those players have had miserable seasons. The only way they go top 10 is if Al Davis is doing the entire draft.

    The thing with Hughes is that hes not strong enough as a Defensive end, so he projects as a LB in the NFL. Therefore, he needs to be in coverage and play against the run. Hughes reminds me of Osi Umenyiora and Cliff Avril.
    Last edited by raysdaone; 12-28-2009 at 11:25 PM.

  4. #24
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    [QUOTE=raysdaone;3424046]I dont like CBS at all. They have Taylor Mays as the #3 prospect?? and Brandon Lafell as #6. These rankings suck. Both those players have had miserable seasons. The only way they go top 10 is if Al Davis is doing the entire draft.[/QUOTE]

    those are NFLDraftScout's rankings at CBS....

    [QUOTE]The thing with Hughes is that hes not strong enough as a Defensive end, so he projects as a LB in the NFL. Therefore, he needs to be in coverage and play against the run. Hughes reminds me of Osi Umenyiora and Cliff Avril.[/QUOTE]

    Umenyiora was a terrific player before his knee injury....

  5. #25
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    [QUOTE=Come Back to NY;3424090]those are NFLDraftScout's rankings at CBS....


    Umenyiora was a terrific player before his knee injury....[/QUOTE]

    Then they suck. I still think Hughes is a 2nd round pick.

    Wonder if he can play OLB in the 3-4? probably not.

  6. #26
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    [QUOTE=raysdaone;3424113]Then they suck. I still think Hughes is a 2nd round pick.

    Wonder if he can play OLB in the 3-4? probably not.[/QUOTE]

    Are you out of your mind?? I can show you plenty of drafts where Hughes is drafted in the first round. Considering he is almost universally considered the the top 3-4 OLB prospect or at least the 1b, I don't see why this is so crazy. As for your comment on him being able to play OLB, you are just showing your ignorance if you really think he is a not a great prospect for the switch.

  7. #27
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    [QUOTE=TheMo;3424338]Are you out of your mind?? I can show you plenty of drafts where Hughes is drafted in the first round. Considering he is almost universally considered the the top 3-4 OLB prospect or at least the 1b, I don't see why this is so crazy. As for your comment on him being able to play OLB, you are just showing your ignorance if you really think he is a not a great prospect for the switch.[/QUOTE]

    Like Vernon Gholston?

  8. #28
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    [QUOTE=raysdaone;3424357]Like Vernon Gholston?[/QUOTE]

    apples and oranges bro- Gholston was rarely used in space at OSU and basically just up the field....TCU puts Hughes in space, asks him to make plays out to the flanks, in pursuit and do more than just pin his ears back and rush the QB

  9. #29
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    [QUOTE=raysdaone;3424113]Then they suck. I still think Hughes is a 2nd round pick.

    Wonder if he can play OLB in the 3-4? probably not.[/QUOTE]

    they don't suck- it's just at this point in time places which rank players based on the opinions of others have a 1000 different opinions thrown at them...

  10. #30
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    [QUOTE=raysdaone;3424357]Like Vernon Gholston?[/QUOTE]

    Wait so because VG was the best 3-4 OLB prospect (even this is debatable, Greg Hardy outta Ole Miss is the VG of this year-- a guy who [B]could[/B] be a good 3-4 OLB but is more of a guarantee as a 4-3 rush end) and has been a bust thus far, we should never draft the top 3-4 OLB prospect? Even with all this said your argument fail to acknowledge that the draft is, was, and always will be a crap shoot. The past is of limited value, at least in the way you are using it. And like CBNY said VG and Hughes couldn't be anymore different outside of being ranked as the top rush 3-4 LB.

  11. #31
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    [QUOTE=TheMo;3424710]Wait so because VG was the best 3-4 OLB prospect (even this is debatable, Greg Hardy outta Ole Miss is the VG of this year-- a guy who [B]could[/B] be a good 3-4 OLB but is more of a guarantee as a 4-3 rush end) and has been a bust thus far, we should never draft the top 3-4 OLB prospect? Even with all this said your argument fail to acknowledge that the draft is, was, and always will be a crap shoot. The past is of limited value, at least in the way you are using it. And like CBNY said VG and Hughes couldn't be anymore different outside of being ranked as the top rush 3-4 LB.[/QUOTE]

    I just feel that we have bigger needs on offense. And you cant kill me for my opinions, I just don't like Hughes in round 1 especially since he would only come in on passing downs to rush the passer. If this becomes a greater need we can go OLB again in the 1st round in 2011. I want our franchise QB to have as many weapons as possible , and going DL in round 2 serves as protection for when Ellis retires. I think Devito/Pouha could end up replacing Douglas at RE.

  12. #32
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    This is also a quote from WalterFootball.com:

    "teams are much more hesitant to take rush linebackers now because the conversion is so unpredictable. Just look at last year's results - no one in the top 15 selections took a rush linebacker. The Chargers (No. 16), Broncos (18) and Packers (26) went with one, but only Green Bay's selection (Clay Matthews) has panned out thus far."

    I don't want to have two first round picks sitting on the bench. We don't have the luxury of having 4 first round picks at OLB. I also think we shouldn't cut VG, we should convert him to DE and have him eat up blockers. Thats how I use him in Madden. LOL:D

  13. #33
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    [QUOTE=raysdaone;3424775]I just feel that we have bigger needs on offense. And you cant kill me for my opinions, I just don't like Hughes in round 1 especially since he would only come in on passing downs to rush the passer. If this becomes a greater need we can go OLB again in the 1st round in 2011. I want our franchise QB to have as many weapons as possible , and going DL in round 2 serves as protection for when Ellis retires. I think Devito/Pouha could end up replacing Douglas at RE.[/QUOTE]

    I think an arsenal of Braylon Edwards, J-Co, Leon Washington, and Dustin Keller is pretty awesome for an air attack not to mention a excellent run game with LW, TJ, and Greene. If anything I think we should try to bring some youth to the Oline in the later rounds. We are literally one of the worst pass rushing teams I can think of in terms of just pure ability. Sure we can scheme around it but that can only get you so far. Our best pass rusher is Pace and I look at him as a great all around player, not that player who can consistently make the QB nervous. Also so we are clear I complete respect your opinion, however, I will try to make you see the light :P. Remember you are entitled to your opinion... no matter how wrong it may be :D lol. Oh and I actually really think we should play VG at 3-4 end if the light bulb isn't going on. Might as well try to get something out of that investment haha.

  14. #34
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    [QUOTE=raysdaone;3424786]This is also a quote from WalterFootball.com:

    "teams are much more hesitant to take rush linebackers now because the conversion is so unpredictable. Just look at last year's results - no one in the top 15 selections took a rush linebacker. The Chargers (No. 16), Broncos (18) and Packers (26) went with one, but only Green Bay's selection (Clay Matthews) has panned out thus far."

    I don't want to have two first round picks sitting on the bench. We don't have the luxury of having 4 first round picks at OLB. I also think we shouldn't cut VG, we should convert him to DE and have him eat up blockers. Thats how I use him in Madden. LOL:D[/QUOTE]

    Well, Clay Matthews has been terrific, Larry English looks very good for the Chargers and Ayers has been ok and is getting decent minutes. Just saying they haven't panned out is not true looking at the situations of these players. In the end, we are in the position to let a high draft pick learn the ropes no matter at what position because we have no real holes on either side of the ball. This is something good teams and teams who view long term success can do, have young guys learn behind the starters and work them in slowly. Then, when the current starters age or leave, then you have a guy who can immediately step in without losing a beat. Now in terms of OLB neither Thomas or Pace are real old yet we sure would look better if we find a guy who can beat his man on a consistent basis. Ware, Dumervil, Harrison - all these guys can do it and it changes offenses, schemes and opens up possibilities for the defensive gameplan.

    Bit said something very important, that even with blitzes we couldn't get to Manning. Looking at our entire season though, that has been a problem that when we don't bring more people, we rarely get to the QB with our defensive line. If we would find a stud on the edge it would give us a great advantage and we would have the player you need at the end of the game. Remember the long drives we gave up at the end of many games. Watch Dallas vs New Orleans about a week ago and you see how that doesn't happen. Ware and Spencer constantly got home and Brees had no chances to make a play. Sure, OLB isn't a need right now but when you have a guy where our FO and CS thinks that he can turn into an elite pass rusher in the NFL, then you take him. We won't say we can't select this or that position because we don't have any holes. To waste the pick on the slightest need we see and reach for a player not first round worthy would be a big and shortsighted mistake.

  15. #35
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    [QUOTE=Flaming Mo;3425066]Well, Clay Matthews has been terrific, Larry English looks very good for the Chargers and Ayers has been ok and is getting decent minutes. Just saying they haven't panned out is not true looking at the situations of these players. In the end, we are in the position to let a high draft pick learn the ropes no matter at what position because we have no real holes on either side of the ball. This is something good teams and teams who view long term success can do, have young guys learn behind the starters and work them in slowly. Then, when the current starters age or leave, then you have a guy who can immediately step in without losing a beat. Now in terms of OLB neither Thomas or Pace are real old yet we sure would look better if we find a guy who can beat his man on a consistent basis. Ware, Dumervil, Harrison - all these guys can do it and it changes offenses, schemes and opens up possibilities for the defensive gameplan.

    Bit said something very important, that even with blitzes we couldn't get to Manning. Looking at our entire season though, that has been a problem that when we don't bring more people, we rarely get to the QB with our defensive line. If we would find a stud on the edge it would give us a great advantage and we would have the player you need at the end of the game. Remember the long drives we gave up at the end of many games. Watch Dallas vs New Orleans about a week ago and you see how that doesn't happen. Ware and Spencer constantly got home and Brees had no chances to make a play. Sure, OLB isn't a need right now but when you have a guy where our FO and CS thinks that he can turn into an elite pass rusher in the NFL, then you take him. We won't say we can't select this or that position because we don't have any holes. To waste the pick on the slightest need we see and reach for a player not first round worthy would be a big and shortsighted mistake.[/QUOTE]

    I dont think were going to go into the draft with any real need, as it always should be. I think we'll sign one or two free agents; hopefully Miles Austin and Elvis Dumervil. Even if we get one of those, whoever we miss out on is what position we should draft.

    I also think that if Jerry Hughes does well in the process leading up to the draft we can either trade back into the late picks of the first round like we did for Keller, or trade back with our original pick, although, Tanny doesn't have a history of that and take whomever he sees fit.

    I have all faith in the world in Tanny, and even though he gets killed for the VG pick, who else were we going to take? his hand was forced. I don't blame him for that. I think in that draft what we should have done was taken the deal BAL and JAX made to get Derrick Harvey, and picked anyone at the end of round 1.

    P.S. I still LOVE Golden Tate and Dez Bryant. And am going to see what Hughes does during the draft process.

  16. #36
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    [QUOTE=TheMo;3425042]I think an arsenal of Braylon Edwards, J-Co, Leon Washington, and Dustin Keller is pretty awesome for an air attack not to mention a excellent run game with LW, TJ, and Greene. If anything I think we should try to bring some youth to the Oline in the later rounds. We are literally one of the worst pass rushing teams I can think of in terms of just pure ability. Sure we can scheme around it but that can only get you so far. Our best pass rusher is Pace and I look at him as a great all around player, not that player who can consistently make the QB nervous. Also so we are clear I complete respect your opinion, however, I will try to make you see the light :P. Remember you are entitled to your opinion... no matter how wrong it may be :D lol. Oh and I actually really think we should play VG at 3-4 end if the light bulb isn't going on. Might as well try to get something out of that investment haha.[/QUOTE]

    I dont really like Braylon for the development of Sanchez. Hes always letting him down, remember the Buffalo game. I'd sign him to 1 year and make him the #2, while J-Co is #1 and find a real slot guy with great hands. Keller is good but hes in a slump right now. I want Mark to have weapons like Manning did in '04. A #1, #2, Pass catching TE, and a great Slot guy. If we can create an offense that can score 24pts per game, Rex can do w.e. with the defense and well win. That's the formula I want to see be created with the Jets.

  17. #37
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    [url]http://www.thehuddlereport.com/[/url]

    This site was ranked #5 in drafting accuracy last year beating out the mouth Kiper. Mock Drafts updated periodically and player analysis added all the time. Lots of useful info and very informative.:D

    Even has a draft links page that lists many other mock draft sites if you like to get a consensus pick for your team. ( Never works out that way but what the heck)
    Last edited by FauxJet07; 01-01-2010 at 08:02 PM.

  18. #38
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    [QUOTE=raysdaone;3425274]I dont think were going to go into the draft with any real need, as it always should be. I think we'll sign one or two free agents; hopefully Miles Austin and Elvis Dumervil. Even if we get one of those, whoever we miss out on is what position we should draft.

    I also think that if Jerry Hughes does well in the process leading up to the draft we can either trade back into the late picks of the first round like we did for Keller, or trade back with our original pick, although, Tanny doesn't have a history of that and take whomever he sees fit.

    I have all faith in the world in Tanny, and even though he gets killed for the VG pick, who else were we going to take? his hand was forced. I don't blame him for that. I think in that draft what we should have done was taken the deal BAL and JAX made to get Derrick Harvey, and picked anyone at the end of round 1.

    P.S. I still LOVE Golden Tate and Dez Bryant. And am going to see what Hughes does during the draft process.[/QUOTE]

    I'd still take Gholston over Harvey.

  19. #39
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    [QUOTE=SenorGato;3429810]I'd still take Gholston over Harvey.[/QUOTE]

    Man Harvey must be retired or prohibited from playing in the US.

  20. #40
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    [QUOTE=C Mart;3429882]Man Harvey must be retired or prohibited from playing in the US.[/QUOTE]

    Nah, just highly mediocre and I don't think his ceiling is anything special.

    Plus, Gholston plays harder and doesn't come into camps fat. If anything, Gholston's conditioning looked more NFL-y this year compared to last. He's not the dunce who doesn't want to improve that this board tries very hard to portray him as because it's easy enough to do right now.

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