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Thread: corner or wide-out in round 1

  1. #41
    [QUOTE=bitonti;3455926]just watching the NFL replay again, Bryan Thomas and Shaun Ellis had key sacks at the end... Bryan Thomas especially had a great game. Pace has been beastly at times. If they draft a rush backer, I don't think he plays. He sits on the bench with Vernon Gholston and plays specials.[/QUOTE]

    Another factor people are overlooking is Jamal Westerman. Ryan has raved about his since training camp and Westerman may ultimately turn into a James Harrison or Adalius Thomas (although the odds are against it).

  2. #42
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;3455926]just watching the NFL replay again, Bryan Thomas and Shaun Ellis had key sacks at the end... Bryan Thomas especially had a great game. Pace has been beastly at times. If they draft a rush backer, I don't think he plays. He sits on the bench with Vernon Gholston and plays specials.[/QUOTE]

    I agree, Bryan Thomas had a fantastic game last week.

  3. #43
    [QUOTE=bitonti;3455926]just watching the NFL replay again, Bryan Thomas and Shaun Ellis had key sacks at the end... Bryan Thomas especially had a great game. Pace has been beastly at times. If they draft a rush backer, I don't think he plays. He sits on the bench with Vernon Gholston and plays specials.[/QUOTE]

    I see Thomas as a situational player, ideally, in pass rushing situations he really shouldn't be on the field. He just never really developed in that regard. I mean, lets be honest for a minute, he plays the rush OLB position and had 2 sacks this season. That's not what I call getting the job done. Real nice player against the run though.

    You draft a pass rusher, slot him in in those blitz situations, and let him pick up 5-6 sacks that way, and become a full-time player by 2011. That'd be my plan at least.

  4. #44
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    [QUOTE=Ven0m;3456423]I see [B]Thomas[/B] as a [B]situational player[/B], ideally, in pass rushing situations he really shouldn't be on the field. He just never really developed in that regard. I mean, lets be honest for a minute, he plays the rush OLB position and had [B]2 sacks[/B] this season. That's not what I call getting the job done. Real [B]nice player against the run[/B] though.

    You draft a pass rusher, slot him in in those blitz situations, and let him pick up 5-6 sacks that way, and become a full-time player by 2011. That'd be my plan at least.[/QUOTE]

    What he said.

    Between Brandon Graham, Sergio Kindle and Jerry Hughes, the bottom part of round 1 is looking like it will be filled with pass rushers. Consider the value too.

  5. #45
    We need a pass rusher, badly! Our inability to get pressure w/ out all out blitz is a problem. We need an OLB.

  6. #46
    [QUOTE=Ven0m;3456423]I see Thomas as a situational player, ideally, in pass rushing situations he really shouldn't be on the field. .[/QUOTE]

    REX disagrees. And the results speak for themselves. Check the tape from last week BT looked like a pass rusher.

  7. #47
    [QUOTE=bitonti;3457637]REX disagrees. And the results speak for themselves. Check the tape from last week BT looked like a pass rusher.[/QUOTE]

    thomas is useful in ryan's defense, but he's not a difference maker. no offense is sitting in meetings during the week saying 'how the heck are we going to stop bryan thomas?' he's decent, and he'd be more highly regarded on jet message boards if he weren't mistakenly drafted in round 1.

    the jets need some youth on the d-line, whether it's a speed-type edge rusher like brandon graham, or a de/dt hybrid type who can replace ellis. they dealt abraham, failed most likely with gholston and lost jenkins for half this year. there is no d-line depth and it is the weak link in ryan's pressure defense at this point.

  8. #48
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    [QUOTE=Ven0m;3456423]I see Thomas as a situational player, ideally, in pass rushing situations he really shouldn't be on the field. He just never really developed in that regard. I mean, lets be honest for a minute, he plays the rush OLB position and had 2 sacks this season. That's not what I call getting the job done. Real nice player against the run though.

    You draft a pass rusher, slot him in in those blitz situations, and let him pick up 5-6 sacks that way, and become a full-time player by 2011. That'd be my plan at least.[/QUOTE]

    to your point-

    you rely on guys like Bryant Thomas who are inconsistent or even players like DeVito who lack the upside, and rely on them on a fulltime basis and you're never going to take the next step up....these guys are solid but not difference makers...

  9. #49
    Trent Dilfer was on MK yesterday, and was asked if it offends him how people refer to him as "along for the ride" with the Ravens (or something like that). He was honest and said he HAD to realize his place on the team -- to just NOT LOSE GAMES -- in order for them to have the success they had.

    More to the point, he said you can't win with an average QB unless you have an ELITE defense. He said too many teams throw that word around, and don't really know what it means.

    He feels the Jets are a pass-rusher away from being elite (he said they still need "bells-and-whistles" in their schemes).

    That said . . . GET ME THAT GUY!!! (not enough of a draft-nik to know who that is . . . that's why I come to this forum:D)

  10. #50
    [QUOTE=Come Back to NY;3457689]to your point-

    you rely on guys like Bryant Thomas who are inconsistent or even players like DeVito who lack the upside, and rely on them on a fulltime basis and you're never going to take the next step up....these guys are solid but not difference makers...[/QUOTE]

    I have to ask, what's the next step up from the league's #1 defense??

  11. #51
    [QUOTE=bitonti;3457877]I have to ask, what's the next step up from the league's #1 defense??[/QUOTE]

    You're telling me this D couldn't possibly improve? All we have to do is maintain?

    If we got bigger, faster, younger that #1 D only gets better. And yes, we're allowed to get younger considering the strong leadership from our young vets...Scott, Revis, Jenkins, Pace, Harris, Ellis (who has a couple years) and Rhodes...all high end talents at their positions too.

    If this DL had more big, athletic, versatile DE in the mold of a Seymour or Ngata we'd be even more awesome. If this LB corps had a dominant pass rusher, we'd be elite.

    Oghobaase 2010. Whoever wants to step up as a pass rusher should try Sunday...or then iunno...Brandon Graham 2010....Brandon Lang...really don't care as long as it's somebody.
    Last edited by SenorGato; 01-15-2010 at 01:08 PM.

  12. #52
    [QUOTE=SenorGato;3457890]You're telling me this D couldn't possibly improve? All we have to do is maintain?
    [/QUOTE]

    no but im saying the offense needs more help than the defense on the whole. we dont know that a jerry hughes would even play over bryan thomas.

  13. #53
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;3457896]no but im saying the offense needs more help than the defense on the whole. we dont know that a jerry hughes would even play over bryan thomas.[/QUOTE]

    You're right, we have no idea if someone like Jerry Hughes or Graham would play over BT... however we DO know that BT is about as JAGish as they come. Nice player, does a decent job...

    I feel he should be upgraded in the near future, or at least find a guy who can get to the QB because if there's one thing BT has proven is that sacks and QB pressures aren't his strong suit.

    Of course we don't KNOW if a kid in the draft is better right now, but the hope is that he WILL BE within a year or two.

    I'm just glad the Jets will have an opportunity to take the best football player available because there will be many quality guys at just about every position there when they pick.

    And I still wouldn't be opposed to trading out of the first round all together and picking up more selections in this deep draft.

  14. #54
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;3457877]I have to ask, what's the next step up from the league's #1 defense??[/QUOTE]

    um- improving a very mediocre and inconsistent pass rush....

  15. #55
    To answer the question in the thread title after thinking about it, I'm going to say WR.

    I'm sick and tired of watching Edwards drop passes.

    Plus I have a man-crush on Kareem Jackson now and would take him in 2. PERFECT for the Jets...would love watching him and Revis maul the sh!t out of opposing WRs.

  16. #56
    [QUOTE=bitonti;3457896]no but im saying the offense needs more help than the defense on the whole. we dont know that a jerry hughes would even play over bryan thomas.[/QUOTE]

    The offense IMO is the one we just want to maintain going into 2010.

    We've got two WRs...possibly we draft a third...we have an elite OL...we have 3 very good RBs...we have a young QB...we have a TE...Anyone we draft for the offense wouldn't start unless he forced himself...just like anyone on D we draft.

    If we do let Edwards go, then I'm down for a new WR. Otherwise it'll just be done because that guy is BPA.

    I still think the best we can do is trade back.

    But yea...Oghobaase 2010.

  17. #57
    [QUOTE=SenorGato;3457989]
    I still think the best we can do is trade back.
    [/QUOTE]

    Easier said then done.

  18. #58
    i just don't see a scenario where the jets go offense in round 1 after trading multiple picks 2x to get a qb and rb last draft. it's not what ryan will recommend even if edwards is not retained. they'll bring in veteran wrs before drafting one in round 1. ryan needs a bona fide pass rusher and a reliable #2 cb for this team to build his dream defense. if jenkins returns and can be even a situational player next year, the overwhelming need is a DE to rotate in with, and eventually replace ellis. given that this draft class seems to be deep in DL talent, need may meet best player available for the jets in late round 1. beyond that, who knows what falls to them in round 2, but it's not likely they'll be trading up to get anyone in round 2 unless they trade out of round 1 to get more picks.

  19. #59
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;3457896]no but im saying the offense needs more help than the defense on the whole. we dont know that a jerry hughes would even play over bryan thomas.[/QUOTE]

    Under Tannenbaum:

    Offensive 1st round picks: Brick, Mangold, Keller, Sanchez

    Defensive 1st round picks: Revis, Gholston

    Jerry Hughes or Brandon Graham or Sergio Kindle wouldn't likely [I]start[/I] over Bryan Thomas their rookie year, but definitely play a chunk of the snaps and be likely be in on 3rd down.

    It's not like we haven't drafted offense in the past 4 or 5 years. The offense will improve with Sanchez.

    I'm down to get a better WR than Braylon in round 1 but that depends on the player.

    Aurelius Benn and Golden Tate both drop a lot of passes... not necessarily the best upgrade over Braylon.


    And the defense, whilst #1, does have weaknesses. We don't have a great pass rush threat, we struggle against the run. But I anticipate, now, after having seen Jenkins everywhere on ESPN the past couple of days, that he'll be back and our troubles against the run will disappear.

    That leaves the pass rush. I know you want a second corner, and I can't argue that, if Lito leaves, that is a possibility, but since we have Revis and you can't be GREAT at every spot, I'd rather improve the front 7, namely OLB and DE (the attacking players on the D) than the back 4 (coverage players).

  20. #60
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    The defense knows they can play. Rex knows they can be elite no matter what the change. But we have a rookie QB going into his second season that hasn't even had a full offseason with some of the players on the offense. Keep the offense the same this year... let them grow into their role. Until then as long as we have to rely on our defense to fall back on we MUST get younger/bigger/faster/stronger for the long haul.

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