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Thread: footballs future has the jets selecting

  1. #21
    Here's a thorough scouting report...

    6′2, 248 pounds | Outside linebacker/Defensive end | Texas Christian

    Pass rush: Plays two yards deep outside. Very good footwork. Properly adjusts his feet to get around the corner quickly. Pass rush moves are ordinary. Mostly a speed rusher. Never really showed consistently that he was comfortable with his spin move.

    Pursuit: The effort Hughes displays is outstanding. He’s a very aggressive player who always plays until the whistle. Has good speed in pursuit. Lateral movement is solid.

    Quickness/Explosion: Good first step off the snap. With his hand down, Hughes has as good of a burst off the snap as any pass rusher in the nation. Easily fires past linemen who don’t quickly get into position.

    Run defend: At defensive end, Hughes really struggled at times against the run. Tackles could easily lock him up and shut him down. Did a much better job against tight ends and fullbacks, where he could use leverage and disengage. Can be fooled by fakes and misdirection plays.

    Size: Has ideal size for a 3-4 outside linebacker but would be considered slightly undersized as an end. Looks to have long arms and is high cut. Not especially tight skinned.

    Strength/Ability to shed blocks: Has good functional playing strength for a linebacker. If he wants to stay at end, Hughes will have to get much stronger. He struggles to get of blocks and can be engulfed by linemen.

    Tackling: A very good, aggressive tackler. Uses his length nicely as a tackler. Showed he has a nose for the ball by forcing eight fumbles over his final two seasons.

    Technique: Stays low to the ground coming around the corner. Shows a good rip move. Needs to use his hands better to stack and shed.

    Versatility: Played defensive end exclusively for his first three years. During his senior year, Hughes would often take his hand off the ground and play more of a traditional linebacker. A good 3-4 outside linebacker option who may not be able to play anything else.

    Final word: As a pass rusher, Hughes is very good. But he’ll need to do a better job against the run and learn how to drop into coverage. He shows a solid first step, which helped him lead the nation in sacks in 2008. He shows above average lateral quickness, but needs to learn how to shed blocks better.

    He’ll be a good value pick for a 3-4 team in the second round.
    I'd take the chance on Hughes at 29, we have nothing to lose...

  2. #22
    i just don't see how he is any better at rushing the passer than a guy like worlids. if he's not an every down player he's not a 1st rounder. i'd rather take a guy who plays every down. plus, why take a sack specialist in the first round who doesn't have any moves besides the outside speed move? didn't the jets already get burned by that?

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by JetsFanJim View Post
    I'm not a big fan of drafting Hughes. I just can't imagine a scenario where he is the best player available.

    Round 1 - Terrence Cody
    Round 2 - Jason Worilds
    Round 4 - Arthur Jones

    That is what I am really hoping to see.
    I'd have a big problem with this draft.

    Jones is just awful and Cody isn't much better. The guy is so weak and has zero balance that I really can't see him being a good NFL player.

    Worilds I'm OK with but he has his flaws too.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Bay Ridge Jet View Post
    at least we have 2 of the non-duds
    it's too bad we've been thru a few of their duds and the worst pick in the history of the draft..

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Jets & Ham View Post
    All I'm trying to say is I don't believe the trend is an actual philosophy. I think its just a coincidence, which is not unusual because most of the 1st Rd blue chippers DO come from the so called football factories, so on average they will always make up a greater percentage of 1st Rd Picks than the mid majors or smaller schools.
    QFT. Its a trend until its not. People said BB doesn't draft LBs early until they drafted Mayo. For a while, the Jets were trading back and accumulating picks....until they started trading up. Rest assured, the trend of the Pats to only trade down will go out the window when they have a guy they really like that is within their reach.

    No GM/Personnel guy worth their salt has a preconceived notion about where players must come from, when to draft certain positions or categorically refuse to trade up/down.

    If Jerry Hughes and Carrington are the BAP according to the Jets when their respective picks come around, the jets won't pass up one of them simply because they went to a mid-major. That has already been factored in when grading them pre-draft. Wherever the Jets have Hughes on their board, the competition he played against obviously was factored in when giving him that grade.

  6. #26
    there are always examples of guys from high profile schools who stink and guys from smaller schools who excel.

    joe flacco and big ben are 2 qbs who came from smaller schools and have had nice success early in their careers. there's no reason jerry hughes can't excel, much of this is dependent on the coaching, the scheme and the supporting cast.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by bitonti View Post
    jerry hughes has over 28 career sacks

    i'll be impressed if any1 can name a single decent NFL prospect he beat for any of those 28 sacks.

    further more if Mike Tannenbaum comes home after 2 days of the draft with a player from Tcu and another from Arkansas St I'll eat my hat.

    Maybe he takes 1 mid major... maybe. But not 2. Tanny is all about the football factories... his draft record is plain as day.
    Bit, I hear what you are saying and have mentioned that before. However, what if Rex has changed Tanny's thought process on that, especially if it's a defensive player since, as we all know, that is Rex's specialty.

  8. #28
    plus, this is the first draft where rex will have input on defensive players. last year they took 3 offensive guys so rex didn't have to opine on what kinds of guys he wants. this is rex's first chance to draft a few guys just for his defense, so this should be real interesting.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by augustiniak View Post
    there are always examples of guys from high profile schools who stink and guys from smaller schools who excel.

    joe flacco and big ben are 2 qbs who came from smaller schools and have had nice success early in their careers. there's no reason jerry hughes can't excel, much of this is dependent on the coaching, the scheme and the supporting cast.
    I agree and you could even point out a bunch of pass rushers from smaller schools doing great in the NFL... James Harrison (Kent State), DeMarcus Ware and Osi Umenyiora (Troy), Elvis Dumervil (Louisville), Dwight Freeney (Syracuse), Jared Allen (Idaho State), Trent Cole (Cincinnati), Julius Peppers (North Carolina)...

    In the end it all comes down to the individual player. I still see what bit is saying, the Jets have consistently made picks from big time conferences in recent years and I will go that far that they really like the Big Ten for their selections. Mangold, Keller, Harris, Greene, Schobel...

  10. #30
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    i could stand Hughes, but carrington, not so much.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Flaming Mo View Post
    I agree and you could even point out a bunch of pass rushers from smaller schools doing great in the NFL... James Harrison (Kent State), DeMarcus Ware and Osi Umenyiora (Troy), Elvis Dumervil (Louisville), Dwight Freeney (Syracuse), Jared Allen (Idaho State), Trent Cole (Cincinnati), Julius Peppers (North Carolina)...

    In the end it all comes down to the individual player. I still see what bit is saying, the Jets have consistently made picks from big time conferences in recent years and I will go that far that they really like the Big Ten for their selections. Mangold, Keller, Harris, Greene, Schobel...
    although, now rex is involved, and his influence may change it up. he may say, look, if you give me a guy like hughes, i'll tell you right now we can cut vernon and he's peferct for my needs. or he may say look, you give me a guy like aluaha, and i can have a fierce line for years and you can draft a rush lb in the 2nd round. rex has proven he knows defense, so you have to believe he will have input here. this isn't like mangini telling tanny to draft gholston b/c 'he broke the sack record for ohio state'. this is a guy who took slightly above average defensive talent in many positions and even with a jenkins injury led the league in defense. rex's opinion will weigh in (ha) on this draft.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by augustiniak View Post
    plus, this is the first draft where rex will have input on defensive players. last year they took 3 offensive guys so rex didn't have to opine on what kinds of guys he wants. this is rex's first chance to draft a few guys just for his defense, so this should be real interesting.
    ok so looking at Rex's history especially on defense... he doesn't seem to want first rounders!

    unless it's a man-to-man corner (which he's said repeatedly can never have enough DB) or some other sure fire stud like Ray Lewis... that no one would refuse... REX's MO is to find gems and coach em up.

    Rex seems to be more comfortable with the late rounders and undrafted types, and he's found or coached _Dozens_ of these types over the years.

    so my guess is tanny has certain positions he is willing to spend first round money on... and he will certain ask for Rex's blessing... but it's Tanny's show until about Saturday... then Rex gets more of a voice.
    ***

    Ham why so extreme? I never said "TCU is on a no draft list" What I said was Tanny might take 1 of these players not both... and 2 questions im still waiting for an answer 1) can anyone name a decent tackle he's beaten... shouldn't be hard for a first rounder 2) why did he skip senior bowl? what was he hiding?

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by bitonti View Post
    ok so looking at Rex's history especially on defense... he doesn't seem to want first rounders!

    unless it's a man-to-man corner (which he's said repeatedly can never have enough DB) or some other sure fire stud like Ray Lewis... that no one would refuse... REX's MO is to find gems and coach em up.

    Rex seems to be more comfortable with the late rounders and undrafted types, and he's found or coached _Dozens_ of these types over the years.

    so my guess is tanny has certain positions he is willing to spend first round money on... and he will certain ask for Rex's blessing... but it's Tanny's show until about Saturday... then Rex gets more of a voice.
    ***

    Ham why so extreme? I never said "TCU is on a no draft list" What I said was Tanny might take 1 of these players not both... and 2 questions im still waiting for an answer 1) can anyone name a decent tackle he's beaten... shouldn't be hard for a first rounder 2) why did he skip senior bowl? what was he hiding?
    If mangini could influence tanny to draft gholston at #6, rex, with a real defensive resume, can certainly impact who the jets take at 29. in the end, rex has to utilize the guy, so i do agree that tanny will create a short list of remaining guys and they'll get rex's input, among others.

  14. #34
    I hate footballsfuture. They banned me for using asterisks.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Buzzsaw View Post
    Anyone worried about Hughes height? I didn't realize that he's just under 6'2". For a 3-4 OLB that is very short, I think of the prototype size to be something like 6'4"/6'5", +270lbs
    I guess we will be turning down those Dumervill, James Harrison for gholston trades.

  16. #36
    Elvise Dummervill - Louisville
    Jared Allen - Idaho State
    Dwight Freeny - Syracuse
    Trent Cole - Cincinnati
    Demarcus Ware - Troy
    James Harrison - Kent State
    Aaron Schobel - Texas Christian

    All players with at least 10 sacks last year.

    Is TCU really miles below most of these schools?

  17. #37
    by the way to put this conversation into perspective here is my final list
    http://draftdaddy.com/2010_top_200.pdf

    I have Jerry Hughes at 35, Alex Carrington at 41... so I have gone on record that I like both of these players and coming home with both is a good haul. I have Linval Joseph around 50, I like him very much as well. This isn't about who I like.

    However how Tanny thinks about these things... that's way different from me or you or most fans. He's thinking about it like a guy with his job on the line, in the nation's biggest media market.




    I had to look it up the last time the Jets took a guy like Hughes or even Linval Joseph in round 1 was Bryan Thomas in 2002 out of Alabama Birmingham.That was a rough couple of years to read the papers, in regards to the first round draft pick. Thomas actually came through and luckily became a decent player but it was a long road... and that's a common theme among guys from smaller programs it takes them longer sometimes to contribute. Drob the next year from the SEC was in the long run a bigger bust but started 80+ games for the Jets. The football factory guys are more prepared... by and large.

    Ever since 2002 it has been football factories all the way... in rounds 1 and 2... even 3... around 4 they can throw in a louisville but they'd rather not... their hits were FSU Leon Washington and Missouri Brad Smith. Even in the late rounds they have replaced the Benders with the Slausons and it's pretty much all football factory diet for them right now.

    and if they want to target small schoolers or BCS non football factories that's great... but there's a value for everyone... that value is not necessarily as high as other players... where a guy goes to school affects his price.


    Quote Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
    Elvise Dummervill - Louisville
    Jared Allen - Idaho State
    Dwight Freeny - Syracuse
    Trent Cole - Cincinnati
    Demarcus Ware - Troy
    James Harrison - Kent State
    Aaron Schobel - Texas Christian

    All players with at least 10 sacks last year.

    Is TCU really miles below most of these schools?
    In general, no. since they put in the scholarship limits, there is more talent at more places.

    a possible explanation should be evident in the fact that list has 2, maybe 3 first rounders on it, there's a difference between draft value and real value...



    but thats a question for Tanny not me, im trying to predict the pick not necessarily hope for a pick...
    Last edited by bitonti; 04-14-2010 at 06:16 PM.

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