Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 27

Thread: U.S. Postal net loss of $8.3 billion

  1. #1
    Practice Squad
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    484
    Post Thanks / Like

    U.S. Postal net loss of $8.3 billion

    [url]http://www.federalnewsradio.com/index.php?nid=35&sid=2387275[/url]

    [QUOTE]The U.S. Postal Service will begin to default on its financial obligations just over four months from now unless Congress takes action to relieve it of its obligation to pre-fund retiree health care accounts, its leader told lawmakers Tuesday.

    USPS expects to post a net loss of $8.3 billion for this fiscal year, nearly as much as it lost last year. And with its $15 billion debt limit due to be reached this year, more borrowing is not an option,[/QUOTE]
    You see them advertise like crazy.
    $8 billion a year they have been losing for some time. To put in perspective the NFL is fighting over 9 billion in revenue I believe.
    It's just insane and has been going on with both political parties in power.

    It's very important for governments to demonstrate the ability to run a business efficiently.
    1) to prove government can do this 2) also for the pride of government workers.

    Once running a small business the solutions seem so easy.
    The junk mail we all get is at a discounted price. Jump this price to the regular price.

    Of course you lose the majority of the junk mail.
    Then you not only cut it down to five days a week of mail but possibly as little as two or three days a week...

    I get two bills every other month from the mail.
    Tell me where I'm wrong? What am I missing?

  2. #2
    JetsInsider.com Legend
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    37,727
    Post Thanks / Like
    Three day a week Service (M, W, F)

    And Junk Mail pays more, since the State does not own business free mail?

    Sounds good as a start to me.

    I'd also say a total review of Mail Employees salaries and benefits would be nice. They make absolute bank. ;)

  3. #3
    All League
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    3,638
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=Warfish;4032189]Three day a week Service (M, W, F)

    And Junk Mail pays more, since the State does not own business free mail?

    Sounds good as a start to me.

    I'd also say a total review of Mail Employees salaries and benefits would be nice. They make absolute bank. ;)[/QUOTE]

    from what I understand one of the proponents of the USPS is because in really rural areas they can be cut off from a mail service, so maybe keep those around and get rid of some in the more urban areas, I mean, here I have about 6 USPS buildings that are about a 5-10 minute drive away, why do we need so many USPS offices here?

  4. #4
    JetsInsider.com Legend
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    37,727
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=piney;4032192]from what I understand one of the proponents of the USPS is because in really rural areas they can be cut off from a mail service, so maybe keep those around and get rid of some in the more urban areas, I mean, here I have about 6 USPS buildings that are about a 5-10 minute drive away, why do we need so many USPS offices here?[/QUOTE]

    So serve a tiny fractional minority, at the expense of the massive majority?

    Cities (in general) have so many locations due to volume. Which can be stunning in it's numbers in any decent sized city.

    Certainly reviewing need of each location, volume, and efficientcy is a good idea. And chopping off (and selling off the land under) unneccessary locations, a good idea. But simply closing some City spots whilst keeping open all the Asscratch Iowa locations is too heavy-handed.

  5. #5
    Practice Squad
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    484
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=Warfish;4032189]Three day a week Service (M, W, F)

    And Junk Mail pays more, since the State does not own business free mail?

    Sounds good as a start to me.

    I'd also say a total review of Mail Employees salaries and benefits would be nice. They make absolute bank. ;)[/QUOTE]
    This of course does not include the health insurance and retirement fund
    [QUOTE]Pay Scales (PS) For The Post Office


    Starting pay is $19 per hour, $39,520 per year, for part time flexible mail carriers. Mail handlers start at $13.92 per hour, $28,953 per year, and clerks start at $18.26 per hour, $37,980 per year. Mail handler workers are initially hired under the Postal Service’s part time flexible pay scale and work 40 or more hours per week. The average pay and benefits for career bargaining unit employees was $63,771 per year, excluding corporate-wide expenses, in 2007. The largest pay system in the Postal Service is predominantly for bargaining unit employees. There are also Executive and Administrative Schedules for non- bargaining unit members, with pay ranging from $20,875 up to an authorized maximum of $108,166.[/QUOTE]
    [url]http://postalwork.net/pay_scales.htm[/url]

  6. #6
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Long Island
    Posts
    13,518
    Post Thanks / Like
    Does anyone really use snail mail anymore?

    Other than when I send in my taxes, I rarely if ever use the USPS. I pay and receive all of my bills online. Plus the only mail I ever get are those annoying credit card offers. The banks could have bailed themselves out if they simply stopped spending all that money on wasted paper.

  7. #7
    All League
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    3,638
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=Warfish;4032200]So serve a tiny fractional minority, at the expense of the massive majority?

    Cities (in general) have so many locations due to volume. Which can be stunning in it's numbers in any decent sized city.

    Certainly reviewing need of each location, volume, and efficientcy is a good idea. And chopping off (and selling off the land under) unneccessary locations, a good idea. But simply closing some City spots whilst keeping open all the Asscratch Iowa locations is too heavy-handed.[/QUOTE]

    I don't know, I just think the only reason to have a USPS is for that purpose, a private company like FedEx has no reason to open up a location in a rural area, I don't even think we need the USPS in the cities, I doubt anyone would be inconvenienced if they did away with them totally here.

    If we don't use the USPS for rural areas then it really serves no purpose, at least IMO.

  8. #8
    JetsInsider.com Legend
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    37,727
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=piney;4032234]I don't know, I just think the only reason to have a USPS is for that purpose, a private company like FedEx has no reason to open up a location in a rural area, I don't even think we need the USPS in the cities, I doubt anyone would be inconvenienced if they did away with them totally here.

    If we don't use the USPS for rural areas then it really serves no purpose, at least IMO.[/QUOTE]

    /shrug

    I think we need to get out of the business of subsidizing people personal choices. Want to live in the middle of nowhere, you get no post office.

    Public Service should help/serve the majority of possible users, at the lowest possible cost, with the stringint-est limitations on use/qualification possible, at below-average salaries for it's workers.

    /shrug.

  9. #9
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Philly
    Posts
    38,782
    Post Thanks / Like
    the pensions is what drives alot of these failing bottom line

    whether it's GM or the USPS very few businesses do pensions anymore. it's sucks but that's life.

    still think the Post office has a net positive effect to the nation. it's one of those things holding the country together. like the interstate highways, power grid, and the train systems. it's a service that modern governments are expected to provide.

  10. #10
    Hall Of Fame
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    In Morris Co., N.J. at the right end of a Browning 12 gauge, with Nick to my left n Rex to my right.
    Posts
    16,703
    Post Thanks / Like
    They need to start selling those Mickey Mouse stamps with LSD as the glue again.

  11. #11
    JetsInsider.com Legend
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    37,727
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=bitonti;4032252]the pensions is what drives alot of these failing bottom line

    whether it's GM or the USPS very few businesses do pensions anymore. it's sucks but that's life.

    still think the Post office has a net positive effect to the nation. [B][U][COLOR="Red"]it's one of those things holding the country together[/COLOR][/U][/B]. like the interstate highways, power grid, and the train systems. it's a service that modern governments are expected to provide.[/QUOTE]

    Think you've watched "The Postman" one time too many.;)

  12. #12
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    greenwich village, NYC
    Posts
    8,131
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=cedk;4032174][URL]http://www.federalnewsradio.com/index.php?nid=35&sid=2387275[/URL]


    You see them advertise like crazy.
    $8 billion a year they have been losing for some time. To put in perspective the NFL is fighting over 9 billion in revenue I believe.
    It's just insane and has been going on with both political parties in power.

    It's very important for governments to demonstrate the ability to run a business efficiently.
    1) to prove government can do this 2) also for the pride of government workers.

    Once running a small business the solutions seem so easy.
    The junk mail we all get is at a discounted price. Jump this price to the regular price.

    Of course you lose the majority of the junk mail.
    Then you not only cut it down to five days a week of mail but possibly as little as two or three days a week...

    I get two bills every other month from the mail.
    Tell me where I'm wrong? What am I missing?[/QUOTE]

    You do realize that the USPS is not funded by tax dollars, but is entirely supported by revenues from its own sales? The issue with its deficit, despite tremendous downsizing (120,000 employees) is its pension plan, which it is required by Congress to fund without access to pension assets. The USPS is the equivalent of a private corporation beholden to extensive federal regulation and guidelines because of its function. So you're missing the rather basic fact that it's not a taxpayer funded government agency.

  13. #13
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    18,353
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;4032289]You do realize that the USPS is not funded by tax dollars, but is entirely supported by revenues from its own sales? The issue with its deficit, despite tremendous downsizing (120,000 employees) is its pension plan, which it is required by Congress to fund without access to pension assets. The USPS is the equivalent of a private corporation beholden to extensive federal regulation and guidelines because of its function. So you're missing the rather basic fact that it's not a taxpayer funded government agency.[/QUOTE]

    It's deficit is funded by the federal government and is about to default.

    There is a "promise to repay" but default is assured, so while this sounds neat, the PO is like fax machine company. Some sales but the end is near and it will fall to the taxpayers.

    NC is full of retired postman from NY and NJ in their early 50's on full pensions. MAN oh man...... WHAT a dangerous job!

  14. #14
    JetsInsider.com Legend
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    凸(⊙▂⊙✖ )
    Posts
    30,911
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=sourceworx;4032228]Does anyone really use snail mail anymore?

    Other than when I send in my taxes, I rarely if ever use the USPS. I pay and receive all of my bills online. Plus the only mail I ever get are those annoying credit card offers. The banks could have bailed themselves out if they simply stopped spending all that money on wasted paper.[/QUOTE]

    ebay man. It's been the only thing keeping it afloat this long. You would think with the boom in shipping revenue would have helped them.

  15. #15
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    greenwich village, NYC
    Posts
    8,131
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=southparkcpa;4032316]It's deficit is funded by the federal government and is about to default.

    There is a "promise to repay" but default is assured, so while this sounds neat, the PO is like fax machine company. Some sales but the end is near and it will fall to the taxpayers.

    NC is full of retired postman from NY and NJ in their early 50's on full pensions. MAN oh man...... WHAT a dangerous job![/QUOTE]

    That a complete mischaracterization of what's happening. The USPS is in a catch 22. It's funded by its own revenues but it is hostage to the federal government in a variety ways... when it earns a profit the profit is subject to on-budget rules, and it has been forced to use the federal pension system, which it has paid into at a surplus only to watch the Congress divert its funds for other purposes.

    The fact that most U.S. citizens are using fewer USPS services due to improved [URL="http://www.huliq.com/10061/post-office-wants-pension-reform-cut-85-billion-deficit#"][COLOR=darkgreen]electronic[/COLOR][/URL] and computer communication, turns out not to be the main source of the problem. Congress learned from the Postmaster General that the decrease in usage and the attendant fees that they have taken out of the system rank second to “...the result of an inflexible business model due to the laws that govern the Postal Service.”
    [B]Most particularly, Donahoe cited a federal regulation instituted in 2007 that "...required the Postal Service to pre-fund retiree health benefits (RHB) in amounts of approximately $5.5 billion per year." There is no other entity in the federal bureaucracy that must abide by similar rules. There is a direct correlation, said Donahoe between the Postal Services' budget woes and the institution of the rule on RHB. [/B]
    [B]Audited financial results for the four years prior to RHB taking effect show the USPS running in the black. But for the requirements of the RHB, the Postmaster General insists the Postal Service would still be running within its budget and showing [/B][URL="http://www.huliq.com/10061/post-office-wants-pension-reform-cut-85-billion-deficit#"][COLOR=darkgreen][B]revenue[/B][/COLOR][/URL][B] above and beyond that. In addition to asking Congress to reconsider its decision to burden the agency in this way, Donahoe reiterated some familiar and introduced some new remedies for the budget woes.[/B]
    Serious consideration must be given at this point to reducing the work week to five days, by eliminating weekend deliveries all together, Donahoe insists. He proposed some methods to better compete in the world-wide package shipment business and to connect with customers outside the physical post office locations. He also testified that streamlining work routines and labor rules, unrelated to labor unions, must be reviewed to assist in getting the agency back to fiscal health.

  16. #16
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    18,353
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;4032338]That a complete mischaracterization of what's happening. The USPS is in a catch 22. It's funded by its own revenues but it is hostage to the federal government in a variety ways... when it earns a profit the profit is subject to on-budget rules, and it has been forced to use the federal pension system, which it has paid into at a surplus only to watch the Congress divert its funds for other purposes.

    The fact that most U.S. citizens are using fewer USPS services due to improved [URL="http://www.huliq.com/10061/post-office-wants-pension-reform-cut-85-billion-deficit#"][COLOR=darkgreen]electronic[/COLOR][/URL] and computer communication, turns out not to be the main source of the problem. Congress learned from the Postmaster General that the decrease in usage and the attendant fees that they have taken out of the system rank second to “...the result of an inflexible business model due to the laws that govern the Postal Service.”
    [B]Most particularly, Donahoe cited a federal regulation instituted in 2007 that "...required the Postal Service to pre-fund retiree health benefits (RHB) in amounts of approximately $5.5 billion per year." There is no other entity in the federal bureaucracy that must abide by similar rules. There is a direct correlation, said Donahoe between the Postal Services' budget woes and the institution of the rule on RHB. [/B]
    [B]Audited financial results for the four years prior to RHB taking effect show the USPS running in the black. But for the requirements of the RHB, the Postmaster General insists the Postal Service would still be running within its budget and showing [/B][URL="http://www.huliq.com/10061/post-office-wants-pension-reform-cut-85-billion-deficit#"][COLOR=darkgreen][B]revenue[/B][/COLOR][/URL][B] above and beyond that. In addition to asking Congress to reconsider its decision to burden the agency in this way, Donahoe reiterated some familiar and introduced some new remedies for the budget woes.[/B]
    Serious consideration must be given at this point to reducing the work week to five days, by eliminating weekend deliveries all together, Donahoe insists. He proposed some methods to better compete in the world-wide package shipment business and to connect with customers outside the physical post office locations. He also testified that streamlining work routines and labor rules, unrelated to labor unions, must be reviewed to assist in getting the agency back to fiscal health.[/QUOTE]

    HERE is the auditor report.

    [url]http://www.usps.com/financials/anrpt10/ar2010_finance_2.htm[/url]


    The auditors in fact CITE , directly in their report, the USPS need to rely on the US government and that this need is directly related to downward volume in mail. In CPA jargon, when the warning is directly in the report...IT AINT GOOD!

    Read the statements, read note 2, it is basically a poison pill about the post office operations.
    Last edited by southparkcpa; 05-18-2011 at 07:50 PM.

  17. #17
    Practice Squad
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    484
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;4032289]You do realize that the USPS is not funded by tax dollars, but is entirely supported by revenues from its own sales? The issue with its deficit, despite tremendous downsizing (120,000 employees) is its pension plan, which it is required by Congress to fund without access to pension assets. The USPS is the equivalent of a private corporation beholden to extensive federal regulation and guidelines because of its function. So you're missing the rather basic fact that it's not a taxpayer funded government agency.[/QUOTE]

    Yes I always understood they collect mega revenues.,forced on the consumer as the Government did not allow competition.
    We always payed more due to government.

    my biggest point was there inability to see the obvious of down sizing.
    Why? because the feds said we have the people by there throats.
    They Have Just kept raise pricing for years. You know they could have been making a profit and help feed the poor!
    Last edited by cedk; 05-18-2011 at 08:35 PM.

  18. #18
    All Pro
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    greenwich village, NYC
    Posts
    8,131
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=southparkcpa;4032348]HERE is the auditor report.

    [URL]http://www.usps.com/financials/anrpt10/ar2010_finance_2.htm[/URL]


    The auditors in fact CITE , directly in their report, the USPS need to rely on the US government and that this need is directly related to downward volume in mail. In CPA jargon, when the warning is directly in the report...IT AINT GOOD!

    Read the statements, read note 2, it is basically a poison pill about the post office operations.[/QUOTE]

    They're in the federal pension system... that's their reliance on the federal government. They also surplus funded their portion, but it goes into a general pool and they don't get credit for their portion as a percentage. No question that they have downward volume and will have to continue to change their mission and downsize. But my main point is the the USPS is a terrible example to use of government agency waste and inefficiency on the taxpayer dollar. The Post Office is an expressed responsibility of the Congress in the Constitution and that's the rub. The USPS funds it's own operating budget but it can't close a post office without Congressional approval. How do you run a business with constraints like that?

  19. #19
    Jets Insider VIP
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    18,353
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;4032408]They're in the federal pension system... that's their reliance on the federal government. They also surplus funded their portion, but it goes into a general pool and they don't get credit for their portion as a percentage. No question that they have downward volume and will have to continue to change their mission and downsize. But my main point is the the USPS is a terrible example to use of government agency waste and inefficiency on the taxpayer dollar. The Post Office is an expressed responsibility of the Congress in the Constitution and that's the rub. The USPS funds it's own operating budget but it can't close a post office without Congressional approval. How do you run a business with constraints like that?[/QUOTE]

    Wrong my friend...please read the financial statements. The US government funds their deficits every year. The pension system is of course crippling the system, as it is in EVERY agency but the financial statements clearly show a HUGE loss from operations EVERY year and managements report clearly talk about the decline in mail and their inability to close due to federal constraints.

    Ahhh....Government.

  20. #20
    All League
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    cape coral fl.
    Posts
    2,693
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=long island leprechaun;4032289]You do realize that the USPS is not funded by tax dollars, but is entirely supported by revenues from its own sales? The issue with its deficit, despite tremendous downsizing (120,000 employees) is its pension plan, which it is required by Congress to fund without access to pension assets. The USPS is the equivalent of a private corporation beholden to extensive federal regulation and guidelines because of its function. So you're missing the rather basic fact that it's not a taxpayer funded government agency.[/QUOTE]

    +1
    the more executives they fire in this company the better.. they are the ones mainly responsible for the fiscal mess that is the usps... the carriers should be the last to affix the blame to for all of this as well.... speaking as one i dont make the wages that are posted here, neither do i have any benefits like medical or dental... these are things that become available with seniority {years of service/availability of a permanent route issued}. i am whats basiclly called a "floater". i work a rural route three to four times a week only if the permanent carrier on that route takes the day off.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Follow Us