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Thread: Are You a Hard Worker, or are you Lucky and Fortunate?

  1. #1
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    Are You a Hard Worker, or are you Lucky and Fortunate?

    I've been listening to ALOT of left-leaning radio of late (go go Sirius/XM!), and I've noticed a very specific trend of discussion.

    The consistently describe themselves (callers and hosts) and anyone with any level of success "Lucky", and that their success is based more on being "fortunate" than anything else.

    Obviously, this is mirroered at the upper policy level on the left, in describing the "wealthiest americans" as "the most fortunate amongst us".

    This is also reflected in their discussions of those recieving welfare/support of one form or another, consistently describing these recipients as "hard working Americans" universally, and without exception.

    It raises the question, [B][U]is success in America based more on luck and being fortunate, than it is based on hard work?[/U][/B]

    So I ask each of you, do you have what you have today more due to being fortunate (or reverse, do you suffer due to being unlucky or unfortunate), or is your situation based more on your own efforts and hard work?

    And how would you determine if a success was luck, or work?
    Last edited by Warfish; 09-13-2011 at 11:14 AM.

  2. #2
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    I'm a govt worker, so none of the above. :alien:

  3. #3
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    we are all lucky to be born in America

    we could have been born in Afghanistan where no matter how hard you work you get screwed.

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    [QUOTE=Warfish;4141982]It raises the question, [B][U]is success in America based more on luck and being fortunate, than it is based on hard work?[/U][/B][/QUOTE]


    No it's a little of both.

    Case in point: Steve Jobs. His technological foresight and vision (a talent I believe you either have or don't) is an ability that makes him more fortunate. At the same time he's also been known for having an infamously (is that a word?) rigorous work schedule (that he imposes on himself and his employees). That combination of talent and work ethic is why Apple is what it is today.

    As with all things (as hard as it is for people on here to believe) there's no cut and dried, black or white answer. You need both. One is basically worthless without the other.

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    Source makes a good point but it was more hard work than anything that got Jobs to where he is...

    I consider myself both as well. I was fortunate enough that my family had done well prior to my birth and their continued success afforded me things that others do not have the opportunity to have.

    I chose however to do my own thing for a while, sans some help here and there and would consider myself a hard worker...

  6. #6
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;4142086]we are all lucky to be born in America[/QUOTE]

    I wasn't born in America.

    And my parents had literally nothing when we arrived here.

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    [QUOTE=AlwaysGreenAlwaysWhite;4142143]Source makes a good point but it was more hard work than anything that got Jobs to where he is...[/QUOTE]

    Without his talent, the work ethic wouldn't matter. With him retiring, Apple's biggest issue going forward is replacing his abilities, not his work ethic. It's the reason why the company's stock dropped as soon as the news of his resignation came out.

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    [QUOTE=Warfish;4141982] [B][U]is success in America based more on luck and being fortunate, than it is based on hard work?[/U][/B][/QUOTE]

    Both.

    Bill Gates: Work
    Paris Hilton: Luck


    What determines if work is hard or not, Warfish?

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    [QUOTE=Warfish;4142146]I wasn't born in America.

    And my parents had literally nothing when we arrived here.[/QUOTE]

    well you are lucky to be here now

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    [QUOTE=Warfish;4142146]I wasn't born in America.

    And my parents had literally nothing when we arrived here.[/QUOTE]

    You're lucky people like you weren't in charge of the country when you were trying to come here. ;)

  11. #11
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    [QUOTE=sourceworx;4142168]You're lucky people like you weren't in charge of the country when you were trying to come here. ;)[/QUOTE]

    How so?

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    [QUOTE=Warfish;4142173]How so?[/QUOTE]

    They would have told you to GFY, and sent you back where you came from. :D

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    [QUOTE=sourceworx;4142179]They would have told you to GFY, and sent you back where you came from. :D[/QUOTE]

    Not when he roll past the Statue of Liberty and land to sign your papers, legally making you a citizen...

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    [QUOTE=sourceworx;4142156]Without his talent, the work ethic wouldn't matter. With him retiring, Apple's biggest issue going forward is replacing his abilities, not his work ethic. It's the reason why the company's stock dropped as soon as the news of his resignation came out.[/QUOTE]

    Talented dude, of course...

    But talent is either harnessed or it isn't...

    I'm sure there's a few talented homeless guys on a corner somewhere who didn't have the drive to make it happen...

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    [QUOTE=sourceworx;4142179]They would have told you to GFY, and sent you back where you came from. :D[/QUOTE]

    You'll have to explain that to me, as I don't understand what you mean, smileys nonwithstanding.

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    Lucky: Born in the USA, given good opportunity for quality education
    Hard Worker: I wouldn't be posting on this site during the day if true :D

    The bottom line is that intelligence and personal priorities are the keys. There is a bit of underlying luck involved, but for the most part, I make my own luck.

  17. #17
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    I feel myself to be as expert as one could be here through my experiences of working with wealthy and non wealthy clients... I have had MANY clients sell their business for 7 figures and have seen talented clients lose it all.

    Luck is a small part of it in some cases of success. In RARE cases, it may be more than small.

    Talent IMO is slightly secondary to hard work. Intuition/brains is most important. As an example, a client (former CPA) built a "store" in 1997. Netted 300K a year. I would have stopped at one store and enjoyed the income. He built a 2nd, 3rd etc... I was the accountant for about 5 years until he went public in the 2004 era... I made about 50K on the deal, he made $30 mil.


    He has 30 mil in the bank (Im still his personal CPA) and is now opening small kiosks in malls. Crazy...but he is driven.

    He worked 7 days, 16 hours a day and it was not something I could do nor had any desire. 300K a year would be OK for me. YET...the people along the way who felt thewere owed and that he was lucky is alarming.


    I have rarely met people earning 350K and above that aren't driven and hard worlking. The mistake made by some outsiders is they measure work in hours.

    Most (practically all) people say they work hard as they have nothing to compare it to.

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    [QUOTE=Warfish;4142198]You'll have to explain that to me, as I don't understand what you mean, smileys nonwithstanding.[/QUOTE]

    I'm just busting your chops, based on your past posts on immigration.

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    [QUOTE=AlwaysGreenAlwaysWhite;4142197]Talented dude, of course...

    But talent is either harnessed or it isn't...

    I'm sure there's a few talented homeless guys on a corner somewhere who didn't have the drive to make it happen...[/QUOTE]

    No disagreement. You can be the most talented person in the world. If you don't choose utilize it, you're not going to benefit from it.

    Like I said, you need both. One without the other is useless.

  20. #20
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    [QUOTE=AlwaysGreenAlwaysWhite;4142197]Talented dude, of course...

    But talent is either harnessed or it isn't...

    I'm sure there's a few talented homeless guys on a corner somewhere who didn't have the drive to make it happen...[/QUOTE]



    I know there are many, many, many kids growing up in poverty and raised by a single parents or no parents or terrible parents who are never going to have the opportunity to harness their natural abilities. IMHO this because they do not get the nurturing that is needed early in life to be a success in our society.

    America is "leaving money on the table"

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