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Thread: Solar gets cheap fast

  1. #41
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    [QUOTE=MnJetFan;4256394]How many loans will Obama have to make to have this work out?[/QUOTE]

    MnJetFan - the conservative version of cr276

  2. #42
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    [QUOTE=Trades;4254897]Sounds like a good reason to invest in research rather than trying to force a product that isn't reasy onto the market.[/QUOTE]

    it's fairly ready. China is building miles of solar arrays. big institutions can put up massive solar power plants and generate lots of cheap energy. But i think the avg consumer putting cells on his roof will be dissapointed when he or she sees what the future holds.

  3. #43
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;4256483]it's fairly ready. China is building miles of solar arrays. big institutions can put up massive solar power plants and generate lots of cheap energy. But i think the avg consumer putting cells on his roof will be dissapointed when he or she sees what the future holds.[/QUOTE]

    The cost ratio is still 2.5:1 on the best estimates of solar:fossil fuels. It isn't ready. China is not America, they build empty cities just for their image to the outside world.

  4. #44
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    [QUOTE=Trades;4256494]The cost ratio is still 2.5:1 on the best estimates of solar:fossil fuels. It isn't ready. China is not America, they build empty cities just for their image to the outside world.[/QUOTE]

    within 10 years that ratio will be 1:1 or below

  5. #45
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;4256513]within 10 years that ratio will be 1:1 or below[/QUOTE]

    Perfect have your salesman call me in 10 years then.

  6. #46
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    [QUOTE=Trades;4256520]Perfect have your salesman call me in 10 years then.[/QUOTE]

    it should also be noted there are externalities that aren't factored into the price of solar

    1) the price of waging war in the Middle east (Energy independent)

    2) the healthcare price of lung disease from fossil fuel (usually coal) emissions

    3) the economic cost of not having enough power to meet supply

    also we talk about kw/hour but a large power plant, nuclear, coal or nat gas is more expensive than a solar array. Cells, pipes and mirrors in the desert is way more build able than a 20 billion dollar nuclear plant that no one wants in their backyard.

    trades serious question do you work for an oil/gas company? I don't understand why anyone would be so pro-fossil fuels.

  7. #47
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;4256537]it should also be noted there are externalities that aren't factored into the price of solar

    1) the price of waging war in the Middle east (Energy independent)

    2) the healthcare price of lung disease from fossil fuel (usually coal) emissions

    3) the economic cost of not having enough power to meet supply

    also we talk about kw/hour but a large power plant, nuclear, coal or nat gas is more expensive than a solar array. Cells, pipes and mirrors in the desert is way more build able than a 20 billion dollar nuclear plant that no one wants in their backyard.

    trades serious question do you work for an oil/gas company? I don't understand why anyone would be so pro-fossil fuels.[/QUOTE]

    LOL, no I work for a Pharma. I am not pro-fossil fuels. I am pro-cost effective solution. For the record I have repeatedly said that we shoudl remove ALL subsidies and let all products stand on their own merrits.

  8. #48
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    [QUOTE=Trades;4256588] For the record I have repeatedly said that we shoudl remove ALL subsidies and let all products stand on their own merrits.[/QUOTE]

    agreed and solar has alot of merits that fossil fuels do not. We don't have to pollute the air or send money to the middle east to enjoy solar power.

  9. #49
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;4256628]agreed and solar has alot of merits that fossil fuels do not. We don't have to pollute the air or send money to the middle east to enjoy solar power.[/QUOTE]

    I agree and when it is ready to compete it should. Solar has been hanging around since the 80s as being ready in about 10 years. We'll see if it ever makes it. Not to mention the impact to the leopard spotted gecko that it will impact in the desert.

  10. #50
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    [QUOTE=bitonti;4256628]agreed and solar has alot of merits that fossil fuels do not. We don't have to pollute the air or send money to the middle east to enjoy solar power.[/QUOTE]

    Hope you've started to think about the next power source for when the sun inevitably burns out.

  11. #51
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    [QUOTE=JetPotato;4256728]Hope you've started to think about the next power source for when the sun inevitably burns out.[/QUOTE]

    Humans will be long gone before the sun "burns out," either gone from this planet or gone from existence. Earth will be swallowed up during the Sun's Red Giant phase long before the sun "dies" as a White Dwarf billions of years from now.

  12. #52
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    [QUOTE=parafly;4256852]Humans will be long gone before the sun "burns out," either gone from this planet or gone from existence. Earth will be swallowed up during the Sun's Red Giant phase long before the sun "dies" as a White Dwarf billions of years from now.[/QUOTE]

    Yeah, that's all part of the process of dying. Either way, eventually we're fu**ed.

  13. #53
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    [QUOTE=JetPotato;4256855]Yeah, that's all part of the process of dying. Either way, eventually we're fu**ed.[/QUOTE]

    Not necessarily ... we just need to last long enough for our technology to take us elsewhere.

  14. #54
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    [QUOTE=parafly;4256858]Not necessarily ... we just need to last long enough for our technology to take us elsewhere.[/QUOTE]

    Well then we better start the government funding us some rocket transport ships now.

  15. #55
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    [QUOTE=JetPotato;4256868]Well then we better start the government funding us some rocket transport ships now.[/QUOTE]

    Our understanding of physics needs to go a long way before we even think about rocket transport ships.

    The distances involved in getting from point A to point B are simply far too vast. The far distant future lies in wormholes, light speed (or faster) travel, and traveling by shrinking space in front of you instead of propelling through it.

  16. #56
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    [QUOTE=parafly;4256886]Our understanding of physics needs to go a long way before we even think about rocket transport ships.

    The distances involved in getting from point A to point B are simply far too vast. The far distant future lies in wormholes, light speed (or faster) travel, and traveling by shrinking space in front of you instead of propelling through it.[/QUOTE]

    Oh good - then we can call it The Wormhole Tax. It will be the first appropriate program name we've gotten from our Black Hole government in a while. Sucks up your cash into the void of infinite nothingness.

  17. #57
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    [QUOTE=JetPotato;4256894]Oh good - then we can call it The Wormhole Tax. It will be the first appropriate program name we've gotten from our Black Hole government in a while. Sucks up your cash into the void of infinite nothingness.[/QUOTE]

    this is like when Bush backed Hydrogen cars

    it's a classic misdirection, let's look way into the future and then we don't have to talk about the problems of today

    bottom line, setting up a solar array somewhere in the desert is way cheaper than setting up a coal plant, a natural gas plant or a nuclear plant. even with the spotted gecko being taken care of. It's mirrors and panels and pipes.

    So we can talk about kilowatt hours all day long but no one (private business) has the will to try to build a giant 13 figure (tens of billions) nuclear plant.

  18. #58
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    Yeah, that solar energy is really taking off.

  19. #59
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    I have solar panels at my home. I installed them in 2009 with help from Obama's stimulus and a generous grant from my home state of Maryland. As I make power, I also sell solar credits called SRECS to aggregators, who sell them on the market to energy companies... it's a classic cap and trade program.

    Even with all that help, I calculated a 15 year breakeven. Solars not cheap. I'll be back later with pictures and more details if anyone is interested.

  20. #60
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    [QUOTE=dcJet;4488941]I have solar panels at my home. I installed them in 2009 with help from Obama's stimulus and a generous grant from my home state of Maryland. As I make power, I also sell solar credits called SRECS to aggregators, who sell them on the market to energy companies... it's a classic cap and trade program.

    Even with all that help, I calculated a 15 year breakeven. Solars not cheap. I'll be back later with pictures and more details if anyone is interested.[/QUOTE]

    I looked in to this myself recently. The breakeven point was between 9-14 years. That time horizon did not meet my standard for a wise investment. Oh and they also said I had too many large trees shading my roof. Even with the government paying more then half the cost it didn't yet make sense to do it.

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