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Thread: One Town's War on Gay Teens

  1. #41
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    Not that "Gay teens" in any way reminds me of his MIA status, but where the heck has Warfist been? Self ban? Vaca to the motherland? :confused:

  2. #42
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    [QUOTE=brady's a catcher;4374032]Not that "Gay teens" in any way reminds me of his MIA status, but where the heck has Warfist been? Self ban? Vaca to the motherland? :confused:[/QUOTE]

    Collecting beads...

    [url]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/21/buffalo-bars-offering-free-boob-job-mardi-gras-beads_n_1292132.html?hpweird=y[/url]
    Last edited by PlumberKhan; 02-22-2012 at 04:39 PM.

  3. #43
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    [QUOTE=PlumberKhan;4374034]Collecting beads...

    [url]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/21/buffalo-bars-offering-free-boob-job-mardi-gras-beads_n_1292132.html?hpweird=y[/url][/QUOTE]


    Well that just makes too much sense.

  4. #44
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    [QUOTE=brady's a catcher;4374032]Not that "Gay teens" in any way reminds me of his MIA status, but where the heck has Warfist been? Self ban? Vaca to the motherland? :confused:[/QUOTE]

    Hope all is well and he's simply taking a self-imposed breather from JI due to general frustration. He seemed very upset in his last post a couple of weeks ago.

    Bring back the fist!

  5. #45
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    [QUOTE=brady's a catcher;4373934]It's not a Repub thing, it's an extremist religion thing. The article makes that clear. [B]And it's Orthodox Jew[/B], Muslim, Bapist, Born again, Mormon, etc. When people gravitate to the extremes of these religions, this is the kind of ideology that is produced.[/QUOTE]

    Not really, no:

    [url]http://statementofprinciplesnya.blogspot.com/[/url]

    [QUOTE]We, the undersigned Orthodox rabbis, [I]rashei yeshiva[/I], [I]ramim[/I], Jewish educators and communal leaders affirm the following principles with regard to the place of Jews with a homosexual orientation in our community:

    1.[B] All human beings are created in the image of God and deserve to be treated with dignity and respect ([I]kevod haberiyot[/I]). Every Jew is obligated to fulfill the entire range of mitzvot between person and person in relation to persons who are homosexual or have feelings of same sex attraction. Embarrassing, harassing or demeaning someone with a homosexual orientation or same-sex attraction is a violation of Torah prohibitions that embody the deepest values of Judaism.[/B]

    2. [B]The question of whether sexual orientation is primarily genetic, or rather environmentally generated, is irrelevant to our obligation to treat human beings with same-sex attractions and orientations with dignity and respect. [/B]

    3. Halakhah sees heterosexual marriage as the ideal model and sole legitimate outlet for human sexual expression. The sensitivity and understanding we properly express for human beings with other sexual orientations does not diminish our commitment to that principle.

    4. Halakhic Judaism views all male and female same-sex sexual interactions as prohibited. The question of whether sexual orientation is primarily genetic, or rather environmentally generated, is irrelevant to this prohibition. While halakha categorizes various homosexual acts with different degrees of severity and opprobrium, including [I]toeivah[/I], this does not in any way imply that lesser acts are permitted. But it is critical to emphasize that halakha only prohibits homosexual acts; it does not prohibit orientation or feelings of same-sex attraction, and nothing in the Torah devalues the human beings who struggle with them. (We do not here address the issue of [I]hirhurei aveirah[/I], a halakhic category that goes beyond mere feelings and applies to all forms of sexuality and requires precise halakhic definition.)

    5. Whatever the origin or cause of homosexual orientation, many individuals believe that for most people this orientation cannot be changed. Others believe that for most people it is a matter of free will. Similarly, while some mental health professionals and rabbis in the community strongly believe in the efficacy of “change therapies”, most of the mental health community, many rabbis, and most people with a homosexual orientation feel that some of these therapies are either ineffective or potentially damaging psychologically for many patients.
    [B]
    We affirm the religious right of those with a homosexual orientation to reject
    therapeutic approaches they reasonably see as useless or dangerous. [/B]

    6. [B]Jews with a homosexual orientation who live in the Orthodox community confront serious emotional, communal and psychological challenges that cause them and their families great pain and suffering.[/B] For example, homosexual orientation may greatly increase the risk of suicide among teenagers in our community. [B]Rabbis and communities need to be sensitive and empathetic to that reality. Rabbis and mental health professionals must provide responsible and ethical assistance to congregants and clients dealing with those human challenges.[/B]

    7. [B]Jews struggling to live their lives in accordance with halakhic values need and deserve our support. Accordingly, we believe that the decision as to whether to be open about one's sexual orientation should be left to such individuals, who should consider their own needs and those of the community.[/B] [B]We are opposed on ethical and moral grounds to both the “outing” of individuals who want to remain private and to coercing those who desire to be open about their orientation to keep it hidden.[/B]

    8. [B]Accordingly, Jews with homosexual orientations or same sex-attractions should be welcomed as full members of the synagogue and school community. As appropriate with regard to gender and lineage, they should participate and count ritually, be eligible for ritual synagogue honors, and generally be treated in the same fashion and under the same halakhic and hashkafic framework as any other member of the synagogue they join. Conversely, they must accept and fulfill all the responsibilities of such membership, including those generated by communal norms or broad Jewish principles that go beyond formal halakha.[/B]

    We do not here address what synagogues should do about accepting members
    who are openly practicing homosexuals and/or living with a same-sex partner.
    Each synagogue together with its rabbi must establish its own standard with
    regard to membership for open violators of halakha.
    Those standards should be applied fairly and objectively.


    9. Halakha articulates very exacting criteria and standards of eligibility for particular religious offices, such as officially appointed cantor during the year or [I]baal tefillah[/I] on the High Holidays. Among the most important of those criteria is that the entire congregation must be fully comfortable with having that person serve as its representative. This legitimately prevents even the most admirable individuals, who are otherwise perfectly fit halakhically, from serving in those roles. It is the responsibility of the lay and rabbinic leadership in each individual community to determine eligibility for those offices in line with those principles, the importance of maintaining communal harmony, and the unique context of its community culture.

    10. Jews with a homosexual orientation or same sex attraction, even if they engage in same sex interactions, should be encouraged to fulfill [I]mitzvot[/I] to the best of their ability. All Jews are challenged to fulfill [I]mitzvot[/I] to the best of their ability, and the attitude of “all or nothing” was not the traditional approach adopted by the majority of halakhic thinkers and [I]poskim[/I] throughout the ages.

    11. [B]Halakhic Judaism cannot give its blessing and imprimatur to Jewish religious
    same-sex commitment ceremonies and weddings, and halakhic values proscribe individuals and communities from encouraging practices that grant religious legitimacy to gay marriage and couplehood. But communities should display sensitivity, acceptance and full embrace of the adopted or biological children of homosexually active Jews in the synagogue and school setting, and we encourage parents and family of homosexually partnered Jews to make every effort to maintain harmonious family relations and connections.[/B]

    12. Jews who have an exclusively homosexual orientation should, under most circumstances, not be encouraged to marry someone of the other gender, as
    this can lead to great tragedy, unrequited love, shame, dishonesty and ruined
    lives. They should be directed to contribute to Jewish and general society in
    other meaningful ways. Any such person who is planning to marry someone of
    the opposite gender is halakhically and ethically required to fully inform his or her potential spouse of their sexual orientation.


    We hope and pray that by sharing these thoughts we will help the Orthodox
    community to fully live out its commitment to the principles and values of
    Torah and Halakha as practiced and cherished by the children of Abraham, who
    our sages teach us are recognized by the qualities of being [I]rahamanim[/I]
    (merciful), [I]bayshanim[/I] (modest), and [I]gomelei hasadim [/I]
    engaging in acts of loving-kindness).[/QUOTE]

  6. #46
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    [QUOTE=Bonhomme Richard;4374001]First Bachmann, then Cain, then Gingrich, and now Santorum is the guy to beat.

    The only reason he's gained traction is because Romney is an extremely weak front runner, not because he hates gays.[/QUOTE]

    I didn't mean to suggest its the REASON he has traction. Just saying a guy with his views shouldn't be so accepted. Bachmann isn't exactly inclusive herself.

  7. #47
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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4374062]Not really, no:

    [url]http://statementofprinciplesnya.blogspot.com/[/url][/QUOTE]

    Whatever.....orthodox Jews are whacked..just like evangelicals and Muslims who practice Sharia law...deserves its own thread!

  8. #48
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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4374062]Not really, no:

    [url]http://statementofprinciplesnya.blogspot.com/[/url][/QUOTE]


    Thanks for the info Doggin. Certainly am not trying to single out Jews (I am a member of the tribe, officially).

    I thought I had read about some Hasidic/Orthodox (embarrasingly, I don't know the difference) communities where gays were shunned and homosexuality was considered a sin. I don't mean even mean the learger Hasidim, just that some groups go off the reserveation, just like the loonies who picket marine funerals, etc.

  9. #49
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    [QUOTE=Tucker134;4374081]Whatever.....orthodox Jews are whacked..just like evangelicals and Muslims who practice Sharia law...deserves its own thread![/QUOTE]


    But you're a model of sanity?

  10. #50
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    [QUOTE=brady's a catcher;4374089]But you're a model of sanity?[/QUOTE]

    Good point....but compared to those groups, yes...

  11. #51
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    [QUOTE=Tucker134;4374081]Whatever.....orthodox Jews are whacked..just like evangelicals and Muslims who practice Sharia law...deserves its own thread![/QUOTE]

    No, it certainly does not.

  12. #52
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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4374062]Not really, no:

    [url]http://statementofprinciplesnya.blogspot.com/[/url][/QUOTE]
    Oh, that's nice.

    I wonder what would the Orthodox rabbi would say if I started banging his daughter? Goy, he'd probably order a death mitzvah.

  13. #53
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    [QUOTE=sackdance;4374127]Oh, that's nice.

    I wonder what would the Orthodox rabbi would say if I started banging his daughter? Goy, he'd probably order a death mitzvah.[/QUOTE]

    Death mitzvah?

  14. #54
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    [QUOTE=Bonhomme Richard;4374119]No, it certainly does not.[/QUOTE]

    TUCKER'S WORLD!!

    TUCKER'S WORLD!!

    PARTY TIME!!

    EXCELLENT!!!

  15. #55
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    [QUOTE=brady's a catcher;4374088]Thanks for the info Doggin. Certainly am not trying to single out Jews (I am a member of the tribe, officially).

    I thought I had read about some Hasidic/Orthodox (embarrasingly, I don't know the difference) communities where gays were shunned and homosexuality was considered a sin. I don't mean even mean the learger Hasidim, just that some groups go off the reserveation, just like the loonies who picket marine funerals, etc.[/QUOTE]

    homosexual sex [I][B]is[/B][/I] a sin. So is masturbation. So is eating pork. That doesn't mean masturbators, gays, or pork eaters should be treated like paraiahs, shunned, etc.

    (Hassidic sects are groups of orthodox jews who closely follow a charismatic leader type rabbi, usually a dynastic rabbinic family, typically originally from a small town in poland or russia . . . the "Lubavitcher Rebbe", for example, was originally the title of the head rabbi of the town of Lubavitch in White Russia; the "Gerrer Rebbe" was the head rabbi of the town of "Gur" in (I believe) poland. Orthodox is a more generic term, meaning a jew who follows the dictates of Jewish law).

  16. #56
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    [QUOTE=sackdance;4374127]Oh, that's nice.

    I wonder what would the Orthodox rabbi would say if I started banging his daughter? Goy, he'd probably order a death mitzvah.[/QUOTE]

    You? He'd probably mourn his daughter's lack of taste more than just the fact that she went off the derech. I mean in a rabbinic family, "use of mental faculties" is typically prized.

    "Death Mitzvah". Oy.

  17. #57
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    [QUOTE=PlumberKhan;4374184]TUCKER'S WORLD!!

    TUCKER'S WORLD!!

    PARTY TIME!!

    EXCELLENT!!![/QUOTE]

    :D

    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4374189]You? He'd probably mourn his daughter's lack of taste more than just the fact that she went off the derech. I mean in a rabbinic family, "use of mental faculties" is typically prized.

    [B]"Death Mitzvah". Oy.[/B][/QUOTE]

    I have to admit, that was kind of funny.

  18. #58
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    [QUOTE=Tucker134;4374081]Whatever.....orthodox Jews are whacked..just like evangelicals and Muslims who practice Sharia law...deserves its own thread![/QUOTE]

    disagree

  19. #59
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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4374188]homosexual sex [I][B]is[/B][/I] a sin. So is masturbation. So is eating pork. That doesn't mean masturbators, gays, or pork eaters should be treated like paraiahs, shunned, etc.

    (Hassidic sects are groups of orthodox jews who closely follow a charismatic leader type rabbi, usually a dynastic rabbinic family, typically originally from a small town in poland or russia . . . the "Lubavitcher Rebbe", for example, was originally the title of the head rabbi of the town of Lubavitch in White Russia; the "Gerrer Rebbe" was the head rabbi of the town of "Gur" in (I believe) poland. Orthodox is a more generic term, meaning a jew who follows the dictates of Jewish law).[/QUOTE]


    Thanks for the info Doggin.

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    [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10ZjzgKi5a4[/url]
    [QUOTE]Texas Republican senate candidates Craig James, a former NFL player, and Ted Cruz went after former Dallas mayor Tom Leppert (R) for marching in a gay pride parade during a debate yesterday in an effort to portray Leppert as “pro-gay” and out of touch with conservative values. Both men pledged to stay away from gay festivities if elected and James went so far as to suggest that being gay is a choice that will be punished by God:

    MODERATOR: Are you saying Mayor Leppert is in favor of gay marriage?

    CRUZ: What I am saying is that when a mayor of a city chooses twice to march in a parade celebrating gay pride, that’s a statement – and it’s not a statement I agree with.

    JAMES: I think right now in this country, our moral fiber is sliding down a slope that is going to be hard to stop if we don’t stand up with leaders who don’t go ride in gay parades. I can assure you I will never ride in a gay parade. And I hear what you’re saying, Tom, but leaders – our kids out there people need to see examples.

    MODERATOR: Do you think people choose to be gay?

    JAMES: I think it’s a choice, I do.

    MODERATOR: It’s not in the genes?

    JAMES: I think that you have to make that choice. But in that case right there, they are going to have to answer to the Lord for their actions. We should not give benefits to those civil unions.[/QUOTE]

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