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Thread: 4-6 Defense

  1. #1

    4-6 Defense

    46 defense (forty-six)

    The 46. The strong safety in the box and the 2 outside linebackers shifted to the same side outside of the defensive end

    This formation was invented by Buddy Ryan, defensive coordinator of the Chicago Bears during the 1980s. Instead of having four linemen and six linebackers (as the name may suggest), it's actually a 4-4 set using 4-3 personnel. This was accomplished by moving a safety up into the "box" instead of a fourth linebacker. The '46' refers not to any lineman/linebacker orientation but was the jersey number of hard hitting strong safety Doug Plank, the player Buddy Ryan first used in this role at Chicago. The other feature of the 46 was the placement of both "outside" linebackers on the same side of the formation, with the defensive line shifted the opposite way with the weak defensive end about 1 to 2 yards outside the weak offensive tackle. This defense was the philosophical equivalent of the "Notre Dame Box" offense devised by Knute Rockne in the 1930s, in that it used an unbalanced field and complex pre-snap motion to confuse the opposing offense. Chicago rode this defense into a 15-1 season in 1985, culminating in a 46-10 win over New England in Super Bowl XX.

    Question is how often will we use it and will be affective. Fascinating concept invented by Papa Ryan.

  2. #2

    Vrentas: Jets defensive line coach Karl Dunbar excited to employ Buddy Ryan's 46 D

    [B]Published: Thursday, May 17, 2012, 5:15 AM
    [/B]
    Karl Dunbar thinks he has it pretty good in his new gig as the Jets’ defensive line coach. He has two first-round picks, a pair of trusty veterans in Sione Pouha and Mike DeVito, and a supporting cast of young linemen with upside. He sees great potential for the Jets to mix up their fronts, moving players into spots where they’ll be most successful and throwing off opponents.

    And one iteration that has Dunbar particularly excited? The 46 defense, invented by Buddy Ryan on the successful 1980s Bears teams and carried on by Rex Ryan. Dunbar said the Jets used the formation “a bunch” last year and plan to use it even more — “as much as we can” — in 2012.

    “We’re going to play a lot of that 46 defense,” Dunbar said with a grin. “You get in that 46 defense, you’re going to get a lot of one-on-one blocks, and when we put athletic guys on the field, bad things happen for the offense.”

    The 46 defense is one variation of a 4-3 front, with four down linemen and eight men in the box. Dunbar has a long history with it, dating back to his days as a defensive lineman for the Arizona Cardinals from 1994-95, when Buddy Ryan was his head coach and Rex was his position coach.

    He can’t wait to coach it here with the Jets, particularly because he feels like it’s a perfect fit for their personnel.

    The Jets have used a base 3-4 front under Ryan, but they’ve always mixed and matched schemes and personnel groupings. They have used many calls with four down linemen and many in the 46 defense.

    Their selection of Quinton Coples, a defensive end out of North Carolina, 16th overall, may allow them to use even more fronts with four down linemen. Dunbar pointed out that the Jets often used four-down fronts last year, but outside linebackers Calvin Pace and Aaron Maybin were at the ends. Now, Coples can be on the edge, with Pouha, Kenrick Ellis or Muhammad Wilkerson inside, he said.

    [B]The objective will be to put players in spots where they can be most successful, and they’ll be “a little mixture of it all.” And Dunbar believes the plan will include a lot of the 46 defense.[/B]

    “As much as our guys do well in it, you’re going to see it,” said Dunbar, who coached stars like Jared Allen, Kevin Williams and Pat Williams in the past six seasons with the Vikings. “We put in the 46 today, and coach was telling the front we still call it the 46 because of his daddy, and we’re going to play it the way his daddy taught it.”

    [B]Dunbar continued to explain: “It’s attack, it’s getting up the field, we’re not holding blocks. Every man for himself, we’re going to get to the quarterback.”

    Dunbar explained that the “bear front” associated with the 46 defense gives offenses fits because the offensive linemen have to block defenders one on one, instead of double teaming or zone blocking. Passes come out more quickly as a result, and if the opponent does look to throw deep, Dunbar said the Jets have an advantage because of their two elite cornerbacks.[/B] [B]

    Dunbar believes Coples is “an awesome fit” for the 46 defense. He said Coples could line up as a “3-technique,” which is over the outside shoulder of the guard, or as a defensive end. He also sees Coples used as a “wide nine,” a pure pass-rushing spot outside the tight end.[/B]

    When Coples was still on the board in the first round of last month’s draft, Dunbar perked up. Coples’ 6-6, 285-pound frame and 4.7 speed offer a unique skill set, and Dunbar said he didn’t worry about his production dropping from 10 sacks as a junior to 7½ as a senior.

    “I don’t see a problem with that,” Dunbar said. “I saw a great athlete, and he’s going to get a chance to show who he is. From the things I’ve seen in the three days of practice and mini-camp we had, I’m loving every minute.”

    [B]And he’s loving every minute, too, of coaching the 46 defense he once played nearly two decades ago.

    “And it’s still working,” he said. “I think when you’ve got the right pieces of the puzzle in, it’s a great defense.”[/B]

    [URL]http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2012/05/jets_defensive_line_coach_karl.html[/URL]
    Last edited by C Mart; 05-26-2012 at 10:21 AM.

  3. #3

    NYT: Jets and the 46 Defense

    The Jets’ defensive line coach, Karl Dunbar, said earlier this week that [URL="http://nflfilms.nfl.com/2012/05/18/jets-plan-to-use-more-46-in-2012/"]he looked forward[/URL] to using more of the 46 defense next season.
    [URL="http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2012/05/jets_defensive_line_coach_karl.html"]Jenny Vrentas, The Star-Ledger:[/URL][INDENT]“We’re going to play a lot of that 46 defense,” Dunbar said with a grin. “You get in that 46 defense, you’re going to get a lot of one-on-one blocks, and when we put athletic guys on the field, bad things happen for the offense.” [/INDENT]The defense, created by Jets Coach Rex Ryan’s father, Buddy, seems ancient. For a refresher and for the answer to the question posed at the end of this post, follow the link to [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-6-the-46-defense/"]Jene Bramel’s primer on the 46 defense [/URL]on the Fifth Down in 2010:[INDENT]Most descriptions of the 46 defense talk about pressure. For Ryan, it was more than that. He was sending six defenders on almost every play, except when he was sending seven or eight.

    The persona of the scheme and its parts was meant to be relentless, intimidating and destructive. His defense set scoring and yardage records. In one season in Houston, Ryan’s Oiler defense knocked nine starting quarterbacks out of games with injury or because of poor play. He punched an offensive coordinator on national television, put bounties on the heads of opposing players and didn’t hesitate to butt heads with Mike Ditka.

    Despite all that, the 46 is rarely used in today’s N.F.L, and only as a changeup front. Coordinators still believe in pressure, but rarely use the 46. Why? What was so great about the Bear 46, but couldn’t stand the test of time?

    [URL]http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/05/19/jets-and-the-46-defense/[/URL]

    [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=EY7nAGRuW0E#%21"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=EY7nAGRuW0E#![/URL]

    [/INDENT]
    Last edited by C Mart; 05-26-2012 at 10:33 AM.

  4. #4
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    I love the aggressive 46. But when New England goes 2 WR, 2 TE, or some other team goes all spread, you can't run the 46 pressure defense anyway.

  5. #5

    NYT: Guide to N.F.L. Defenses, Part 6: The 46 Defense

    September 11, 2010, [I]6:30 am[/I] [B][SIZE=2]Guide to N.F.L. Defenses, Part 6: The 46 Defense[/SIZE][/B]

    By [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/author/jene-bramel/"]JENE BRAMEL[/URL]

    [I]Jene Bramel writes for [URL="http://www.footballguys.com/"]Footballguys.com[/URL]. You can also [URL="http://twitter.com/jenebramel"]follow him on Twitter[/URL] and reach him at [EMAIL="bramel@footballguys.com"]bramel@footballguys.com[/EMAIL].
    [/I]
    Though he died just before the 46 defense peaked in Super Bowl XXIV, you can’t help hearing John Facenda’s voice whenever you see video of or read about Buddy Ryan and the “Monsters of the Midway” defense.

    [I]“Blitz is defined as a sudden, savage attack.[/I]

    [I] It is indeed all of this.

    Send more defenders than the offense has blockers to absorb.

    From the left side,

    From the right side,

    From up the middle they come.

    All with blood in their eye.

    All with one idea.

    Get the quarterback.

    [/I][I]Get “The Man.” [/I]

    Most descriptions of the 46 defense talk about pressure. For Ryan, it was more than that. He was sending six defenders on almost every play, except when he was sending seven or eight. The persona of the scheme and its parts was meant to be relentless, intimidating and destructive. His defense set scoring and yardage records. In one season in Houston, Ryan’s Oiler defense knocked nine starting quarterbacks out of games with injury or because of poor play. He punched an offensive coordinator on national television, put bounties on the heads of opposing players and didn’t hesitate to butt heads with Mike Ditka.

    Despite all that, the 46 is rarely used in today’s N.F.L, and only as a changeup front. Coordinators still believe in pressure, but rarely use the 46.

    Why? What was so great about the Bear 46, but couldn’t stand the test of time?

    Here’s a diagram of the most common 46 alignment:
    [IMG]http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/09/11/sports/11fifthdown-46/11fifthdown-46-blogSpan.jpg[/IMG]

    First, it must be noted that the 46 isn’t a 4-6 front. Ryan was apparently incapable of calling any of his players by name. He’d give them nicknames or just call them by their number. The 46 defense was named for Doug Plank, the Bear strong safety who wore jersey No. 46. The 46 is a variation of the 4-3, with eight in the box and six men on the line.

    Most think of the 46 as an exceptional pass rushing scheme. And it was.

    But the scheme was just as devastating against the run. Ryan put three monster linemen opposite the three interior offensive linemen. One nose tackle aligned head up on the center, and two very solid end/tackle players were aligned in a 3-technique opposite both guards. This tackle-nose-tackle combination has also been called a TNT front. If the line didn’t make the play, they effectively occupied enough blockers to keep both second-line defenders (including HOF MLB Mike Singletary) free to hit whatever came through. It was all but impossible to run against the personnel the Bears had in the mid-1980s. Teams were forced to throw and throw often.

    When they threw, they had to deal with pressure from anywhere and everywhere. While Ryan would sometimes choose to fall back in coverage from the 46, he usually brought the house. Both outside linebackers (Wilber Marshall and Otis Wilson) were stud pass rushers and Richard Dent was aligned wide to crash down the weak side. Add in the interior pass rush of Steve McMichael and Dan Hampton, who flanked Refrigerator Perry, and there wasn’t a weak link anywhere on the front.

    In most cases, the strong safety came down in the box and played like a linebacker. But Ryan frequently mixed up his 46 fronts by switching an outside backer and the strong safety.

    But the personnel was the key. Ryan started tinkering with the scheme in 1982, but it wasn’t until Dent broke out in 1984 and Marshall and Perry began contributing in 1985 that the 46 really hit its stride. And the 1986 team, which wasn’t coordinated by Ryan, may have been even better than the team that flirted with perfection in 1985.

    Ryan had very good personnel in Philadelphia and Houston. But the 46 gradually fell out of favor as teams began to exploit its primary weakness – an undermanned secondary. If you protected well enough or had a quarterback with a quick, accurate release – or both – you could get rid of the ball before the pressure got to the pocket. West Coast offenses and premier quarterbacks strafed the 46 with big plays. Even in its best seasons, the Bear 46 was giving up very high yards-per-completion numbers. The big plays eventually sank the scheme as a base defense.

    Don’t be left with the impression that Ryan was a one-hit wonder. He was instrumental in designing the Jet defense that helped Joe Namath pull off the upset in Super Bowl III and later had a big role in the development of the Purple People Eater lines in Minnesota. The 46 just became too risky to play every down.

    The 46 made a small comeback in Dallas, Houston, Baltimore and with the Jets in recent seasons and heavily influences the schemes in Tennessee, Minnesota, Philadelphia and St. Louis. Any 4-3 scheme that brings an eighth man into the box and moves players around looking for pass-rushing mismatches has probably been influenced in some part by Buddy Ryan’s philosophy. But it’s no longer used as more than a change of pace. In its day, though, it sure was fun to watch.

    [I]Links to the previous installments in the seven-part series:[/I]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/06/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-1/"]Part 1: Guide to N.F.L. Defenses[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/07/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-2-evolution-of-4-3-front/"]Part 2: Evolution of the 4-3 Front[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/08/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-3-the-4-3-front-continued/"]Part 3: The 4-3 Front Continued[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/09/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-4-the-3-4-front/"]Part 4: The 3-4 Front[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/10/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-5-the-zone-blitz/"]Part 5: The Zone Blitz[/URL]

    [URL]http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-6-the-46-defense/[/URL]

  6. #6
    [QUOTE=chirorob;4478122]I love the aggressive 46. But when New England goes 2 WR, 2 TE, or some other team goes all spread, you can't run the 46 pressure defense anyway.[/QUOTE]

    Could that be why the Jets went out looking for these hybrid DB/LB (AAllen, LLandry, Bell, even ESmith, DDavis, UDFA Marcus Dowtin (sleeper)) types and hybrid CB/S types (Bush, maybe D'Lynn/Sneed)???


    Sneed and Dowtin are my 2 UDFA sleeper picks..Sneed has his own thread:

    [B]Marcus Dowtin[/B]
    [B]Positives: [/B]Has a lean, cut-up physique. Highly athletic — quiet, [B]safety-like movement skills[/B]. Good balance and body control. Quick-handed, quick-footed and agile to slip blocks. Flows laterally and ranges sideline-to-sideline. Closes fast. Fills the hole with authority. Shows striking ability. Drops effortlessly into zone and can intercept. Was used as a pass rusher and can get home as a blitzer. Productive. MVP of Battle of Florida all-star game.
    [B]Negatives: [/B]Small-framed and lacks ideal bulk. Can be covered up by larger blockers. Overruns some plays. Occasionally tackles high — will lasso or grab more than he should instead of driving through ballcarriers. Was athletically superior as a Division II player. Character needs to be looked into.
    [B]Summary: [/B]A legit SEC athlete, Dowtin stuffed the stat sheet in his only season at North Alabama. Has intriguing physical ability and versatility to play multiple spots in a fast-flowing, 4-3 front, [B]as well as handle nickel linebacker duties [/B]and excel on special teams if he falls in line.
    [URL]http://www.profootballweekly.com/prospects/player/marcus-dowtin-38/[/URL]


    And another UDFA to keep an eye on and could be a CB/S hybrid-[B]-Donnie Fletcher[/B]:
    [COLOR=Black][B][/B][/COLOR][B]Positives: [/B]Big, lean, athletic build. Very good eyes and instincts. Aware and assignment-sound in zone coverage — leverages the field and has a feel for routes. Good ball skills and reactions. Intercepts outside his frame. Flashes hitting ability when he has a clean shot. Football-smart, durable, four-year starter.
    [B]Negatives: [/B]Has short arms and small hands. Ability to press is a question mark. Average speed, twitch and closing burst. Hip stiffness shows in transition. Tends to clutch and grab. Underpowered, wrap-and-drag tackler. Production and performance fell off as a senior. Only shows up on game day. Questionable character.
    [B]Summary: [/B]More smooth than sudden, Fletcher is a monotone, cover-2 cornerback who was used almost exclusively in disciplined, zone coverage in college. Has appealing size, ball skills and special-teams ability, but must recover from a disappointing season and poor Senior Bowl week showing.

    [url]http://www.profootballweekly.com/prospects/player/donnie-fletcher-4/[/url]



    "Fletcher (6 feet, 201 pounds) had some issues in coverage because he doesn’t have blazing speed. Some scouts feel he might end up at a safety in the NFL."
    [url]http://www.bcinterruption.com/2012/1/30/2756913/2012-senior-bowl-nfl-draft-boston-college-donnie-fletcher[/url]

    Positives: Well-sized, opportunistic cornerback who flashes skill. Aggressive and a hard-hitter who lays his shoulders into opponents. Displays a good break to the throw out of his plant, works hard to get a hand in and fights to break up the pass. Effectively positions himself against opponents when the ball is in the air. Does a nice job diagnosing the action. Relatively effective staying with receivers out of their breaks.

    Negatives: Played below expectations as a senior. Not a strong open-field tackler. Has marginal deep speed.

    Analysis: Fletcher displayed a lot of skill coming into his senior season yet at times looks very average on the field in 2011. He offers potential as a zone cornerback who can be used in dime situations.

    Projection: 6-7 [LEFT][COLOR=#000000]
    Read more: [URL]http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/draft-2012/players/78725.html#ixzz1vz6MHmuW[/URL]
    [/COLOR][/LEFT]
    Last edited by C Mart; 05-26-2012 at 11:06 AM.

  7. #7
    don't think the 46 can work in today's NFL.Offenses too spread out.

    All the Pats will do is out Brady in the shotgun and he'll throw quick passes to the te's and wideout's

    Don't forget in 85 Marino shredded the 46 defense doing the same thing.

    Today's NFL you need the Giants method.Get pressure with the front 4 and have the back 7 playing coverage...that being said I'm liking our d line

  8. #8
    Thinking about the comments about Coples in this front and reading about putting the 2 OLBs on the same side is very interesting.

    My take is that we can play the hybrid DBs, to keep speed on the field and then be able to slide our front either way as coples can play a wide DE/OLB if we put the LBs opposite him with wilkerson shifting to an interior DL position, or flip the exact opposite way, with Coples playing an interior spot and wilkerson either playing DT with pace or maybin out wide or even wilkerson as a wide DE.

    I do worry about the quick strike offenses creating issues with this D, but we just don't have to play it against NE. This type of defense's main job is to stop the run and put teams in obvious passing situations. The biggest weakness is having your CBs in man coverage and because of revis, that problem is lessened.

    When you have Revis taking one WR out of the game, then the 46 seems perfectly suited to face SF (stop Gore, force smith to beat you), Houston (causes confusion with zone blocking to slow arian), the Titans to slow johnson, and the Chargers who run the ball and throw vertically (not quick strike-west coast offense).

  9. #9
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    [QUOTE=C Mart;4478124]September 11, 2010, [I]6:30 am[/I] [B][SIZE=2]Guide to N.F.L. Defenses, Part 6: The 46 Defense[/SIZE][/B]

    By [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/author/jene-bramel/"]JENE BRAMEL[/URL]

    [I]Jene Bramel writes for [URL="http://www.footballguys.com/"]Footballguys.com[/URL]. You can also [URL="http://twitter.com/jenebramel"]follow him on Twitter[/URL] and reach him at [EMAIL="bramel@footballguys.com"]bramel@footballguys.com[/EMAIL].
    [/I]
    Though he died just before the 46 defense peaked in Super Bowl XXIV, you can’t help hearing John Facenda’s voice whenever you see video of or read about Buddy Ryan and the “Monsters of the Midway” defense.

    [I]“Blitz is defined as a sudden, savage attack.[/I]

    [I] It is indeed all of this.

    Send more defenders than the offense has blockers to absorb.

    From the left side,

    From the right side,

    From up the middle they come.

    All with blood in their eye.

    All with one idea.

    Get the quarterback.

    [/I][I]Get “The Man.” [/I]

    Most descriptions of the 46 defense talk about pressure. For Ryan, it was more than that. He was sending six defenders on almost every play, except when he was sending seven or eight. The persona of the scheme and its parts was meant to be relentless, intimidating and destructive. His defense set scoring and yardage records. In one season in Houston, Ryan’s Oiler defense knocked nine starting quarterbacks out of games with injury or because of poor play. He punched an offensive coordinator on national television, put bounties on the heads of opposing players and didn’t hesitate to butt heads with Mike Ditka.

    Despite all that, the 46 is rarely used in today’s N.F.L, and only as a changeup front. Coordinators still believe in pressure, but rarely use the 46.

    Why? What was so great about the Bear 46, but couldn’t stand the test of time?

    Here’s a diagram of the most common 46 alignment:
    [IMG]http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/09/11/sports/11fifthdown-46/11fifthdown-46-blogSpan.jpg[/IMG]

    First, it must be noted that the 46 isn’t a 4-6 front. Ryan was apparently incapable of calling any of his players by name. He’d give them nicknames or just call them by their number. The 46 defense was named for Doug Plank, the Bear strong safety who wore jersey No. 46. The 46 is a variation of the 4-3, with eight in the box and six men on the line.

    Most think of the 46 as an exceptional pass rushing scheme. And it was.

    But the scheme was just as devastating against the run. Ryan put three monster linemen opposite the three interior offensive linemen. One nose tackle aligned head up on the center, and two very solid end/tackle players were aligned in a 3-technique opposite both guards. This tackle-nose-tackle combination has also been called a TNT front. If the line didn’t make the play, they effectively occupied enough blockers to keep both second-line defenders (including HOF MLB Mike Singletary) free to hit whatever came through. It was all but impossible to run against the personnel the Bears had in the mid-1980s. Teams were forced to throw and throw often.

    When they threw, they had to deal with pressure from anywhere and everywhere. While Ryan would sometimes choose to fall back in coverage from the 46, he usually brought the house. Both outside linebackers (Wilber Marshall and Otis Wilson) were stud pass rushers and Richard Dent was aligned wide to crash down the weak side. Add in the interior pass rush of Steve McMichael and Dan Hampton, who flanked Refrigerator Perry, and there wasn’t a weak link anywhere on the front.

    In most cases, the strong safety came down in the box and played like a linebacker. But Ryan frequently mixed up his 46 fronts by switching an outside backer and the strong safety.

    But the personnel was the key. Ryan started tinkering with the scheme in 1982, but it wasn’t until Dent broke out in 1984 and Marshall and Perry began contributing in 1985 that the 46 really hit its stride. And the 1986 team, which wasn’t coordinated by Ryan, may have been even better than the team that flirted with perfection in 1985.

    Ryan had very good personnel in Philadelphia and Houston. But the 46 gradually fell out of favor as teams began to exploit its primary weakness – an undermanned secondary. If you protected well enough or had a quarterback with a quick, accurate release – or both – you could get rid of the ball before the pressure got to the pocket. West Coast offenses and premier quarterbacks strafed the 46 with big plays. Even in its best seasons, the Bear 46 was giving up very high yards-per-completion numbers. The big plays eventually sank the scheme as a base defense.

    Don’t be left with the impression that Ryan was a one-hit wonder. He was instrumental in designing the Jet defense that helped Joe Namath pull off the upset in Super Bowl III and later had a big role in the development of the Purple People Eater lines in Minnesota. The 46 just became too risky to play every down.

    The 46 made a small comeback in Dallas, Houston, Baltimore and with the Jets in recent seasons and heavily influences the schemes in Tennessee, Minnesota, Philadelphia and St. Louis. Any 4-3 scheme that brings an eighth man into the box and moves players around looking for pass-rushing mismatches has probably been influenced in some part by Buddy Ryan’s philosophy. But it’s no longer used as more than a change of pace. In its day, though, it sure was fun to watch.

    [I]Links to the previous installments in the seven-part series:[/I]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/06/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-1/"]Part 1: Guide to N.F.L. Defenses[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/07/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-2-evolution-of-4-3-front/"]Part 2: Evolution of the 4-3 Front[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/08/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-3-the-4-3-front-continued/"]Part 3: The 4-3 Front Continued[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/09/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-4-the-3-4-front/"]Part 4: The 3-4 Front[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/10/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-5-the-zone-blitz/"]Part 5: The Zone Blitz[/URL]

    [URL]http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-6-the-46-defense/[/URL][/QUOTE]

    Excellent read.

    I think that one of the best plusses is that we didn't go for this scheme until
    we had the right players for it. That is one [B]distinct [/B] difference between our
    recent D and O efforts.

  10. #10
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    [QUOTE=chirorob;4478122]I love the aggressive 46. But when New England goes 2 WR, 2 TE, or some other team goes all spread, you can't run the 46 pressure defense anyway.[/QUOTE]

    I bet the 46 is being installed [I]because[/I] of NE's 2te sets. Why not have an extra guy in the box to jam a TE route? We play man coverage for the most part anyway. Brady has proved to be a biotch when hit a few times. I think it's just what the Dr. ordered.

    The spread... not so much. :D

  11. #11
    [QUOTE=C Mart;4478120][B]Published: Thursday, May 17, 2012, 5:15 AM
    [/B]
    Karl Dunbar thinks he has it pretty good in his new gig as the Jets’ defensive line coach. He has two first-round picks, a pair of trusty veterans in Sione Pouha and Mike DeVito, and a supporting cast of young linemen with upside. He sees great potential for the Jets to mix up their fronts, moving players into spots where they’ll be most successful and throwing off opponents.

    And one iteration that has Dunbar particularly excited? The 46 defense, invented by Buddy Ryan on the successful 1980s Bears teams and carried on by Rex Ryan. Dunbar said the Jets used the formation “a bunch” last year and plan to use it even more — “as much as we can” — in 2012.

    “We’re going to play a lot of that 46 defense,” Dunbar said with a grin. “You get in that 46 defense, you’re going to get a lot of one-on-one blocks, and when we put athletic guys on the field, bad things happen for the offense.”

    The 46 defense is one variation of a 4-3 front, with four down linemen and eight men in the box. Dunbar has a long history with it, dating back to his days as a defensive lineman for the Arizona Cardinals from 1994-95, when Buddy Ryan was his head coach and Rex was his position coach.

    He can’t wait to coach it here with the Jets, particularly because he feels like it’s a perfect fit for their personnel.

    The Jets have used a base 3-4 front under Ryan, but they’ve always mixed and matched schemes and personnel groupings. They have used many calls with four down linemen and many in the 46 defense.

    Their selection of Quinton Coples, a defensive end out of North Carolina, 16th overall, may allow them to use even more fronts with four down linemen. Dunbar pointed out that the Jets often used four-down fronts last year, but outside linebackers Calvin Pace and Aaron Maybin were at the ends. Now, Coples can be on the edge, with Pouha, Kenrick Ellis or Muhammad Wilkerson inside, he said.

    [B]The objective will be to put players in spots where they can be most successful, and they’ll be “a little mixture of it all.” And Dunbar believes the plan will include a lot of the 46 defense.[/B]

    “As much as our guys do well in it, you’re going to see it,” said Dunbar, who coached stars like Jared Allen, Kevin Williams and Pat Williams in the past six seasons with the Vikings. “We put in the 46 today, and coach was telling the front we still call it the 46 because of his daddy, and we’re going to play it the way his daddy taught it.”

    [B]Dunbar continued to explain: “It’s attack, it’s getting up the field, we’re not holding blocks. Every man for himself, we’re going to get to the quarterback.”

    Dunbar explained that the “bear front” associated with the 46 defense gives offenses fits because the offensive linemen have to block defenders one on one, instead of double teaming or zone blocking. Passes come out more quickly as a result, and if the opponent does look to throw deep, Dunbar said the Jets have an advantage because of their two elite cornerbacks.[/B] [B]

    Dunbar believes Coples is “an awesome fit” for the 46 defense. He said Coples could line up as a “3-technique,” which is over the outside shoulder of the guard, or as a defensive end. He also sees Coples used as a “wide nine,” a pure pass-rushing spot outside the tight end.[/B]

    When Coples was still on the board in the first round of last month’s draft, Dunbar perked up. Coples’ 6-6, 285-pound frame and 4.7 speed offer a unique skill set, and Dunbar said he didn’t worry about his production dropping from 10 sacks as a junior to 7½ as a senior.

    “I don’t see a problem with that,” Dunbar said. “I saw a great athlete, and he’s going to get a chance to show who he is. From the things I’ve seen in the three days of practice and mini-camp we had, I’m loving every minute.”

    [B]And he’s loving every minute, too, of coaching the 46 defense he once played nearly two decades ago.

    “And it’s still working,” he said. “I think when you’ve got the right pieces of the puzzle in, it’s a great defense.”[/B]

    [URL]http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2012/05/jets_defensive_line_coach_karl.html[/URL][/QUOTE]

    Excellent Post! Bring back the Sack Exchange. Seek and destroy like a hot missile!

  12. #12
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    [QUOTE=C Mart;4478121]The Jets’ defensive line coach, Karl Dunbar, said earlier this week that [URL="http://nflfilms.nfl.com/2012/05/18/jets-plan-to-use-more-46-in-2012/"]he looked forward[/URL] to using more of the 46 defense next season.
    [URL="http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2012/05/jets_defensive_line_coach_karl.html"]Jenny Vrentas, The Star-Ledger:[/URL][INDENT]“We’re going to play a lot of that 46 defense,” Dunbar said with a grin. “You get in that 46 defense, you’re going to get a lot of one-on-one blocks, and when we put athletic guys on the field, bad things happen for the offense.” [/INDENT]The defense, created by Jets Coach Rex Ryan’s father, Buddy, seems ancient. For a refresher and for the answer to the question posed at the end of this post, follow the link to [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-6-the-46-defense/"]Jene Bramel’s primer on the 46 defense [/URL]on the Fifth Down in 2010:[INDENT]Most descriptions of the 46 defense talk about pressure. For Ryan, it was more than that. He was sending six defenders on almost every play, except when he was sending seven or eight.

    The persona of the scheme and its parts was meant to be relentless, intimidating and destructive. His defense set scoring and yardage records. In one season in Houston, Ryan’s Oiler defense knocked nine starting quarterbacks out of games with injury or because of poor play. He punched an offensive coordinator on national television, put bounties on the heads of opposing players and didn’t hesitate to butt heads with Mike Ditka.

    Despite all that, the 46 is rarely used in today’s N.F.L, and only as a changeup front. Coordinators still believe in pressure, but rarely use the 46. Why? What was so great about the Bear 46, but couldn’t stand the test of time?

    [URL]http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/05/19/jets-and-the-46-defense/[/URL]

    [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=EY7nAGRuW0E#%21"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=EY7nAGRuW0E#![/URL]

    [/INDENT][/QUOTE]

    I think Dunbar is a perfect example of if you cant do teach.. He was a 8th rd pick of the Steelers out of LSU.. Full name is Karmichael MacKenzie Dunbar II. He started 1 game in his short career and had no sacks.. Maybe the Ghost can come back as a teacher for a course that shows how to make millions and do nothing in return.. Oh and I do think Dunbar is a good line coach..:yes:

  13. #13
    [QUOTE=Savage69;4478153]I think Dunbar is a perfect example of if you cant do teach.. He was a 8th rd pick of the Steelers out of LSU.. Full name is Karmichael MacKenzie Dunbar II. He started 1 game in his short career and had no sacks.. Maybe the Ghost can come back as a teacher for a course that shows how to make millions and do nothing in return.. Oh and I do think Dunbar is a good line coach..:yes:[/QUOTE]

    While I could care less about his playing career, it is nice to hear from someone who's already experienced success with what he's discussing.

    I'm hoping for good things from Sparano as well, but he doesn't come with the resume a guy like Dunbar has . . .

  14. #14
    [QUOTE=Shark99;4478151]Excellent Post! Bring back the Sack Exchange. Seek and destroy like a hot missile![/QUOTE]

    :yes::yes::yes::D

  15. #15
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    Yes this defense is perfect for a team full of hybrids. DT/DEs DE/LBs LB/Ss. Now we just got a LB that can roam sideline to sideline, and we already have man to man CBs. I'd love it if we had a safety that could cover to play center field.

  16. #16
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    While its true the Bears road their innovative and unconventional defense to a super bowl win and a place in the argument of most dominant teams of all time (which I think they were, btw). Its also true, that offenses caught up with that defense very quickly and within 2 years the Bears were out of the playoffs and Ryan took his defense to Philly and AZ for two stops as a HC, where he only made the playoffs 2 years and won zero playoff games.

    The last person to use that concept effectively was Jeff Fisher with some of his good Titan teams in the early 2000's. Personally I think Rex has been doing quite well with the defensive concepts he learned while with the Ravens, that he doesn't need to dust off his father's old stand by's. The game is entirely different than it was in 1985, and what worked then, won't necessarily be effective now.

    I think its just an interesting twist to a father-son story, and an explanation for the Jets bringing in a couple of SS types, when coverage safeties is what the Jets seem to need

  17. #17
    [QUOTE=C Mart;4478124]September 11, 2010, [I]6:30 am[/I] [B][SIZE=2]Guide to N.F.L. Defenses, Part 6: The 46 Defense[/SIZE][/B]

    By [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/author/jene-bramel/"]JENE BRAMEL[/URL]

    [I]Jene Bramel writes for [URL="http://www.footballguys.com/"]Footballguys.com[/URL]. You can also [URL="http://twitter.com/jenebramel"]follow him on Twitter[/URL] and reach him at [EMAIL="bramel@footballguys.com"]bramel@footballguys.com[/EMAIL].
    [/I]
    Though he died just before the 46 defense peaked in Super Bowl XXIV, you can’t help hearing John Facenda’s voice whenever you see video of or read about Buddy Ryan and the “Monsters of the Midway” defense.




    [I]“Blitz is defined as a sudden, savage attack.[/I]

    [I] It is indeed all of this.

    Send more defenders than the offense has blockers to absorb.

    From the left side,

    From the right side,

    From up the middle they come.

    All with blood in their eye.

    All with one idea.

    Get the quarterback.

    [/I][I]Get “The Man.” [/I]

    Most descriptions of the 46 defense talk about pressure. For Ryan, it was more than that. He was sending six defenders on almost every play, except when he was sending seven or eight. The persona of the scheme and its parts was meant to be relentless, intimidating and destructive. His defense set scoring and yardage records. In one season in Houston, Ryan’s Oiler defense knocked nine starting quarterbacks out of games with injury or because of poor play. He punched an offensive coordinator on national television, put bounties on the heads of opposing players and didn’t hesitate to butt heads with Mike Ditka.

    Despite all that, the 46 is rarely used in today’s N.F.L, and only as a changeup front. Coordinators still believe in pressure, but rarely use the 46.

    Why? What was so great about the Bear 46, but couldn’t stand the test of time?

    Here’s a diagram of the most common 46 alignment:
    [IMG]http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/09/11/sports/11fifthdown-46/11fifthdown-46-blogSpan.jpg[/IMG]

    First, it must be noted that the 46 isn’t a 4-6 front. Ryan was apparently incapable of calling any of his players by name. He’d give them nicknames or just call them by their number. The 46 defense was named for Doug Plank, the Bear strong safety who wore jersey No. 46. The 46 is a variation of the 4-3, with eight in the box and six men on the line.

    Most think of the 46 as an exceptional pass rushing scheme. And it was.

    But the scheme was just as devastating against the run. Ryan put three monster linemen opposite the three interior offensive linemen. One nose tackle aligned head up on the center, and two very solid end/tackle players were aligned in a 3-technique opposite both guards. This tackle-nose-tackle combination has also been called a TNT front. If the line didn’t make the play, they effectively occupied enough blockers to keep both second-line defenders (including HOF MLB Mike Singletary) free to hit whatever came through. It was all but impossible to run against the personnel the Bears had in the mid-1980s. Teams were forced to throw and throw often.

    When they threw, they had to deal with pressure from anywhere and everywhere. While Ryan would sometimes choose to fall back in coverage from the 46, he usually brought the house. Both outside linebackers (Wilber Marshall and Otis Wilson) were stud pass rushers and Richard Dent was aligned wide to crash down the weak side. Add in the interior pass rush of Steve McMichael and Dan Hampton, who flanked Refrigerator Perry, and there wasn’t a weak link anywhere on the front.

    In most cases, the strong safety came down in the box and played like a linebacker. But Ryan frequently mixed up his 46 fronts by switching an outside backer and the strong safety.

    But the personnel was the key. Ryan started tinkering with the scheme in 1982, but it wasn’t until Dent broke out in 1984 and Marshall and Perry began contributing in 1985 that the 46 really hit its stride. And the 1986 team, which wasn’t coordinated by Ryan, may have been even better than the team that flirted with perfection in 1985.

    Ryan had very good personnel in Philadelphia and Houston. But the 46 gradually fell out of favor as teams began to exploit its primary weakness – an undermanned secondary. If you protected well enough or had a quarterback with a quick, accurate release – or both – you could get rid of the ball before the pressure got to the pocket. West Coast offenses and premier quarterbacks strafed the 46 with big plays. Even in its best seasons, the Bear 46 was giving up very high yards-per-completion numbers. The big plays eventually sank the scheme as a base defense.

    Don’t be left with the impression that Ryan was a one-hit wonder. He was instrumental in designing the Jet defense that helped Joe Namath pull off the upset in Super Bowl III and later had a big role in the development of the Purple People Eater lines in Minnesota. The 46 just became too risky to play every down.

    The 46 made a small comeback in Dallas, Houston, Baltimore and with the Jets in recent seasons and heavily influences the schemes in Tennessee, Minnesota, Philadelphia and St. Louis. Any 4-3 scheme that brings an eighth man into the box and moves players around looking for pass-rushing mismatches has probably been influenced in some part by Buddy Ryan’s philosophy. But it’s no longer used as more than a change of pace. In its day, though, it sure was fun to watch.

    [I]Links to the previous installments in the seven-part series:[/I]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/06/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-1/"]Part 1: Guide to N.F.L. Defenses[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/07/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-2-evolution-of-4-3-front/"]Part 2: Evolution of the 4-3 Front[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/08/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-3-the-4-3-front-continued/"]Part 3: The 4-3 Front Continued[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/09/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-4-the-3-4-front/"]Part 4: The 3-4 Front[/URL]
    [URL="http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/10/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-5-the-zone-blitz/"]Part 5: The Zone Blitz[/URL]

    [URL]http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/guide-to-n-f-l-defenses-part-6-the-46-defense/[/URL][/QUOTE]

    Very nice now let's make it happen!

  18. #18
    [QUOTE=IHATEDOLPHINS;4478134]don't think the 46 can work in today's NFL.Offenses too spread out.

    All the Pats will do is out Brady in the shotgun and he'll throw quick passes to the te's and wideout's

    Don't forget in 85 Marino shredded the 46 defense doing the same thing.

    Today's NFL you need the Giants method.Get pressure with the front 4 and have the back 7 playing coverage...that being said I'm liking our d line[/QUOTE]

    The WCo offense basically made what was a great defense 46 defense obsolete. Bill Walsh showed everyone had to beat that defense.
    Last edited by Raider9175; 05-26-2012 at 10:52 PM.

  19. #19
    [QUOTE=Savage69;4478153]I think Dunbar is a perfect example of if you cant do teach.. He was a 8th rd pick of the Steelers out of LSU.. Full name is Karmichael MacKenzie Dunbar II. He started 1 game in his short career and had no sacks.. Maybe the Ghost can come back as a teacher for a course that shows how to make millions and do nothing in return.. Oh and I do think Dunbar is a good line coach..:yes:[/QUOTE]

    Works for me! Unleash the beast. Shark attack!

  20. #20
    [QUOTE=eaglenj;4478136]Thinking about the comments about Coples in this front and reading about putting the 2 OLBs on the same side is very interesting.

    My take is that we can play the hybrid DBs, to keep speed on the field and then be able to slide our front either way as coples can play a wide DE/OLB if we put the LBs opposite him with wilkerson shifting to an interior DL position, or flip the exact opposite way, with Coples playing an interior spot and wilkerson either playing DT with pace or maybin out wide or even wilkerson as a wide DE.

    I do worry about the quick strike offenses creating issues with this D, but we just don't have to play it against NE. This type of defense's main job is to stop the run and put teams in obvious passing situations. The biggest weakness is having your CBs in man coverage and because of revis, that problem is lessened.

    When you have Revis taking one WR out of the game, then the 46 seems perfectly suited to face SF (stop Gore, force smith to beat you), Houston (causes confusion with zone blocking to slow arian), the Titans to slow johnson, and the Chargers who run the ball and throw vertically (not quick strike-west coast offense).[/QUOTE]
    The 4-6 prolly won't be the base D as the spread offense will shred it if Jets stick to it in prolonged periods. But used judiciously from time to time to confuse qb's and teams which already look vulnerable to it, it could pay dividends.

    Now Jets D personnel certainly seem to have the tools to pull it off for big plays. We'll soon see. Can't wait!!

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