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Thread: When You Can't Pass Something, Just Do it Anyway: The Dream Act

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    When You Can't Pass Something, Just Do it Anyway: The Dream Act

    [QUOTE][B][U]Obama administration to offer Immunity to illegal immigrants[/U][/B]

    Published June 15, 2012

    Associated Press

    WASHINGTON — The Obama administration will stop deporting and begin granting work permits to younger illegal immigrants who came to the U.S. as children and have since led law-abiding lives.

    The policy change, described to The Associated Press by two senior administration officials, will affect as many as 800,000 immigrants who have lived in fear of deportation. It also bypasses Congress and partially achieves the goals of the so-called DREAM Act, a long-sought but never enacted plan to establish a path toward citizenship for young people who came to the United States illegally but who have attended college or served in the military.

    Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano was to announce the new policy Friday, one week before President Barack Obama plans to address the National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed Officials’ annual conference in Orlando, Fla. Republican presidential challenger Mitt Romney is scheduled to speak to the group on Thursday.

    Under the administration plan, illegal immigrants will be immune from deportation if they were brought to the United States before they turned 16 and are younger than 30, have been in the country for at least five continuous years, have no criminal history, graduated from a U.S. high school or earned a GED, or served in the military. They also can apply for a work permit that will be good for two years with no limits on how many times it can be renewed. The officials who described the plan spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss it in advance of the official announcement.

    The policy will not lead toward citizenship but will remove the threat of deportation and grant the ability to work legally, leaving eligible immigrants able to remain in the United States for extended periods.

    “Many of these young people have already contributed to our country in significant ways,” Napolitano wrote in a memorandum describing the administration’s action. “Prosecutorial discretion, which is used in so many other areas, is especially justified here.”

    The extraordinary move comes in an election year in which the Hispanic vote could be critical in swing states like Colorado, Nevada and Florida. While Obama enjoys support from a majority of Hispanic voters, Latino enthusiasm for the president has been tempered by the slow economic recovery, his inability to win congressional support for a broad overhaul of immigration laws and by his administration’s aggressive deportation policy. Activists opposing his deportation policies last week mounted a hunger strike at an Obama campaign office in Denver, and other protests were planned for this weekend.

    The change is likely to cause an outcry from congressional Republicans, who are sure to perceive Obama’s actions as an end run around them. Republicans already have complained that previous administration uses of prosecutorial discretion in deportations amount to back-door amnesty. Romney and many Republican lawmakers want tighter border security measures before considering changes in immigration law. Romney opposes offering legal status to illegal immigrants who attend college but has said he would do so for those who serve in the armed forces.

    An NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll last month found Obama leading Romney among Hispanic voters 61 percent to 27 percent. But his administration’s deportation policies have come under fire, and Latino leaders have raised the subject in private meetings with the president. In 2011, Immigration and Customs Enforcement deported a record 396,906 people and is expected to deport about 400,000 this year.

    A December poll by the Pew Hispanic Center showed that 59 percent of Latinos disapproved of the president’s handling of deportations.

    The changes come a year after the administration announced plans to focus on deporting serious criminals, immigrants who pose threats to public safety and national security, and serious immigration law violators.

    One of the officials said the latest policy change is just another step in the administration’s evolving approach to immigration.

    Under the plan, immigrants whose deportation cases are pending in immigration court will have to prove their eligibility for a reprieve to ICE, which will begin dealing with such cases in 60 days. Any immigrant who already has a deportation order and those who never have been encountered by immigration authorities will deal with the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services.

    The exact details of how the program will work, including how much immigrants will have to pay to apply and what proof they will need, still are being worked out.

    In making it harder to deport, the Obama administration is in essence employing the same eligibility requirements spelled out in the proposed DREAM Act.

    The administration officials stopped short of calling the change an administrative DREAM Act — the name is an acronym for Development, Relief and Education for Alien Minors — but the qualifications meet those laid out in a 2010 version that failed in the Senate after passing in the House. They said the DREAM Act, in some form, and comprehensive overhaul of the immigration system remained an administration priority.

    Illegal immigrant children won’t be eligible to apply for the deportation waiver until they turn 16, but the officials said younger children won’t be deported either.

    Last year, Napolitano announced plans to review about 300,000 pending deportation cases and indefinitely suspend those that didn’t meet department priorities. So far, Immigration and Customs Enforcement has reviewed more than 232,000 cases and decided to stop working on about 20,000. About 4,000 of those 20,000 have opted to keep fighting in court to stay in the United States legally. For the people who opted to close their cases, work permits are not guaranteed.
    [/QUOTE]

    Congrats my Liberal pro-illegal friends. You got your Dream Act after all.

  2. #2
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    That sound? Tom Jefferson rolling over in his grave.

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    Every time they say there are going to be all these strings attached, when the bill does come out it's totally different. It will be to 50 years old, a few DWI'S Ok, of course you can bring your cousins, G.E.D.? just say "you're working on it. Just got here? just say "you've been "living in the shadows"

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    Prosecutorial discretion. I don't think, however, Obama can set policy for future administrations; he can say "we won't deport", or "we'll issue work permits", but he can't forever waive the past violations or prevent future ones.

    That said, I am nowhere near as far to the right as you are on this one, 'Fish; IMO, kids who were brought here as children and who are productive members of society ought to be allowed to stay as permanent resident aliens; no path to citizenship, no right to grant anyone else status by relationship (i.e. any other blood relatives could be deported, they can't grant permanent residence status to anyone through marriage, and their children would not get automatic citizenship, but would have to apply for it), but if they are here and contributing, and did not themselves knowingly commit any illegal act to get here, they can stay.

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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4492675]Prosecutorial discretion. I don't think, however, Obama can set policy for future administrations; he can say "we won't deport", or "we'll issue work permits", but he can't forever waive the past violations or prevent future ones.

    That said, I am nowhere near as far to the right as you are on this one, 'Fish; IMO, kids who were brought here as children and who are productive members of society ought to be allowed to stay as permanent resident aliens; no path to citizenship, no right to grant anyone else status by relationship (i.e. any other blood relatives could be deported, they can't grant permanent residence status to anyone through marriage, and their children would not get automatic citizenship, but would have to apply for it), but if they are here and contributing, and did not themselves knowingly commit any illegal act to get here, they can stay.[/QUOTE]

    When the Law has no meaning, and can be ignored at a whim or some whispy idea of teh "greater good", then we have no Law to start with.

    :dunno:

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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4492675]Prosecutorial discretion. I don't think, however, Obama can set policy for future administrations; he can say "we won't deport", or "we'll issue work permits", but he can't forever waive the past violations or prevent future ones.

    That said, I am nowhere near as far to the right as you are on this one, 'Fish; IMO, kids who were brought here as children and who are productive members of society ought to be allowed to stay as permanent resident aliens; no path to citizenship, no right to grant anyone else status by relationship (i.e. any other blood relatives could be deported, they can't grant permanent residence status to anyone through marriage, and their children would not get automatic citizenship, but would have to apply for it), but if they are here and contributing, and[B] did not themselves knowingly commit any illegal act[/B] to get here, they can stay.[/QUOTE]

    So much for "ignorance of the law is no excuse". If an American born 13 year old kid breaks the law, damn sure that excuse won't work. But a Mexican born 13 year old? No problem, you're been contributing. By that I mean you've been taking a seat in a school at tax payer expense, adding to over crowded classrooms. You've gotten free medical care, raising the cost for those of who work so we can have health insurance, which we still have to pay for every month.

    But you've managed to avoid having a criminal record, congrats. :rolleyes:

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    [QUOTE=Warfish;4492682]When the Law has no meaning, and can be ignored at a whim or some whispy idea of teh "greater good", then we have no Law to start with.

    :dunno:[/QUOTE]

    If Obungler won't enforce the laws of this nation, he needs to be removed from office.

    I can't wait until November to stand in line and vote this incompetent turd out of office.....

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    [QUOTE=Warfish;4492682]When the Law has no meaning, and can be ignored at a whim or some whispy idea of teh "greater good", then we have no Law to start with.

    :dunno:[/QUOTE]

    Then we've never had laws because prosecutorial discretion has always been a feature of the justice system.

    [QUOTE=brady's a catcher;4492751]So much for "ignorance of the law is no excuse". If an American born 13 year old kid breaks the law, damn sure that excuse won't work. But a Mexican born 13 year old? No problem, you're been contributing. By that I mean you've been taking a seat in a school at tax payer expense, adding to over crowded classrooms. You've gotten free medical care, raising the cost for those of who work so we can have health insurance, which we still have to pay for every month.

    But you've managed to avoid having a criminal record, congrats. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

    It's not a question of ignorance of the law, it's a question of responsibility for the crime. A kid brough over illegally by a parent has no responsibility for entering illegally, and ought to be treated like any other alien seeking permanent residence. The only reason not to is based on not wanting to incentivize bad behavior -hence the detriments I proposed

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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4492812]Then we've never had laws because prosecutorial discretion has always been a feature of the justice system.[/quote]

    Part of the problem IMO. It's a gateway to fraud, corruption and unfairness.

    You;d never expect an Accountant to have "accounting discretion" on what and how things are reported.

    But the very Law.....it's so flexable, it may as well not exist. Since it can be whatever those in power want it to be at any given moment.

    No wonder you support the Healthcare Mandate. You simply don't see Law as a limit to Power. You see it as a bag of jello, to be formed into whatever you want it to mean on any given day to suit you.

    [QUOTE]It's not a question of ignorance of the law, it's a question of responsibility for the crime. A kid brough over illegally by a parent has no responsibility for entering illegally[/QUOTE]

    Right, their parants and guradians have that responsabillity, and the State should be enforcing the Law and deporting those parents, and their minro children with them.

    Not giving them everything a Citizen has and more (including in some cases preferential treatemnt over actual Citizens, as in In-State tuition and acceptance) as a reward for having broken the Law and cheated the system, a system I should point out, that we citizens are paying for.

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    Just another example of how (D) = (R)....



    :rolleyes:

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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4492812]Then we've never had laws because prosecutorial discretion has always been a feature of the justice system.



    It's not a question of ignorance of the law, it's a question of responsibility for the crime. A kid brough over illegally by a parent has no responsibility for entering illegally, and ought to be treated like any other alien seeking permanent residence. The only reason not to is based on not wanting to incentivize bad behavior -[B]hence the detriments I propose[/B]d[/QUOTE]

    But doggin the the only detriment is no citizenship. So you're saying they should be treated like any other alien seeking residence who came here legally?

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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4492812]Then we've never had laws because prosecutorial discretion has always been a feature of the justice system.



    It's not a question of ignorance of the law, it's a question of responsibility for the crime. A kid brough over illegally by a parent has no responsibility for entering illegally, and ought to be treated like any other alien seeking permanent residence. The only reason not to is based on not wanting to incentivize bad behavior -hence the detriments I proposed[/QUOTE]

    When that child becomes an adult doesn't he or she have a responsability for being here illegally?

    A child brought in may not have a responsability for enterring illegally but an adult here who remains illegally does.

    We have limited immigration for a reason. It's not about how you got here it's about numbers.

    We have a political system and the President as the executive certainly has the right to do this under our system. The remedy is impeachment or to change the executive through the ballot box.
    Last edited by Winstonbiggs; 06-15-2012 at 04:35 PM.

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    [url]http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/06/15/12242056-obama-immigration-order-poses-dilemma-for-eligible-illegal-immigrants?lite[/url]
    DHS Secretary Janet Napolitano told NBC News that there was no immediate danger of applicants' being targeted for deportation, saying the order would be binding for the next two years regardless of who is president. [B]That means Romney, if elected in November, could overturn it as early as 2014, however.
    [/B]
    Rep. Charles Gonzalez, D-Texas, chairman of the Congressional Hispanic Caucus, praised Obama on Friday for "taking action to avoid further injustices against young people."

    But "a legislative remedy is still needed," he said.


    Hadn't heard about the bolded. Gotta say, pretty well played Obama. This locks up the Latino vote. But in truth, Romney was getting very little of it anyway. And LOL at the esteemed D from Texas, of course it's not enough. Just a coincidence that his last name is Gonzalez, I'm quite sure.

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    [QUOTE=brady's a catcher;4492891]Rep. Charles Gonzalez, D-Texas, chairman of the Congressional Hispanic Caucus, praised Obama on Friday for "taking action to avoid further injustices against young people." [/QUOTE]

    Some days I wonder if I've been dropped through a time-warp into some insane alternate reality.....

    So, to deport an illegal immigrant is "injustice against young people" and makes those who support it racists, nativists and anti-immigrant.

    But when that illegal takes a spot at school from an equally qualified American Citizen, gets to pay less in tuition than an American Citizen from another State, or better yet getting a scholorship that would otherwsie have gone to an American Citizen, and then gets treatement in the schools medical office without having to pay.....thats justice?

    Seriously. I'm living in the crazy world where good looking people look like man-pigs, and the beautiful blond humanwoman is really ugly and deformed. Twilight Zone, here I am.

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    You all need to read the "dream" act bill, It excludes no one and most is based on the word of the applicant. Chain migration? no problema. There are 10 mile by 10 mile square areas of Houston that not a word of English is spoken and they look at Americans with disdain, have no interest in being American or wanting to assimilate. The ones they parade out are a aberration.

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    [QUOTE=Winstonbiggs;4492882]. The remedy is impeachment [/QUOTE]

    this...

    Just another example of KIng BO doing what is best for him, at the expense of law abiding tax paying AMericans. This guy cannot be gone fast enough, liberal law arguments aside.

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    [QUOTE=acepepe;4492900]You all need to read the "dream" act bill, It excludes no one and most is based on the word of the applicant. Chain migration? no problema. There are 10 mile by 10 mile square areas of Houston that not a word of English is spoken and they look at Americans with disdain, have no interest in being American or wanting to assimilate. The ones they parade out are a aberration.[/QUOTE]

    Your labor force.

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    [QUOTE=cr726;4493215]Your labor force.[/QUOTE]

    :rolleyes:

    Yeah, cause dirt poor while, black, asian, hispanic Americans won't work for crappy wages, especially when they have families to support. The "doing the jobs Americans won't do" is my 2nd favorite illegal lovers meme.

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    [QUOTE=doggin94it;4492675]Prosecutorial discretion. I don't think, however, Obama can set policy for future administrations; he can say "we won't deport", or "we'll issue work permits", but he can't forever waive the past violations or prevent future ones.

    That said, I am nowhere near as far to the right as you are on this one, 'Fish; [B]IMO, kids who were brought here as children and who are productive members of society[/B] ought to be allowed to stay as permanent resident aliens; no path to citizenship, no right to grant anyone else status by relationship (i.e. any other blood relatives could be deported, they can't grant permanent residence status to anyone through marriage, and their children would not get automatic citizenship, but would have to apply for it), but if they are here and contributing, and did not themselves knowingly commit any illegal act to get here, they can stay.[/QUOTE]

    That's the problem, The Democrats always bring out the shining example " Juan" has work two jobs while maintaining a 4.0 and has dreams of medical school so he can find a cure for his cancer ridden mother." Or "Maria", The 20 year old girl with the large inquisitive eyes, whom, as a 4 year old was brought to this county and speaks not a word of Spanish (witch is curious as her parents speak not a word of English)Is now in U.T law school on grants and in state tuition, she want to be an International Attorney, so she can help restore the native lands of her people to it's rightful owners.

    They don't show you, "Jose" a 18 year old gang banger with no arrests other than some juvie sht. But, is still a "student".
    Or "Consuela" Who is a 26 year old with 3 kids on WIC, foods tamps, AFDC, and lives in public housing, but is working on her GED!!!

    Guess witch one there are more of? by about 85%

  20. #20
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    [QUOTE=cr726;4493215]Your labor force.[/QUOTE]

    Naah, I only hire dumb white guys.



    I'm hiring, by the way.:D

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