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Thread: Sanchez, as a quarterback, has improved each of his first three seasons.

  1. #241
    [QUOTE=jetrider;4498782]You can estimate using passing attempts.

    You can't estimate sack% using rushing yardage, LOL, so I'm not sure why you're arguing in favor of rushing-based OL rankings like JPoppy and Jordyhole are using.[/QUOTE]

    I never mentioned rushing yardage.


    Let's look at some overall stats from 2010 to illustrate:

    In 2010, the Houston Texans were ranked 12th, having given up 33 sacks and the Detroit Lions were 17th in sacks allowed, giving up 36 sacks.

    Which of the two Olines were better in pass protection ?

  2. #242
    [QUOTE=Jordy;4498792]Don't waste your time trying to talk sense to this guy.

    He only understands "tough-guy-internet" talk and name-calling.[/QUOTE]


    Some serious ironing right there.:rolleyes:

  3. #243
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    [QUOTE=Jordy;4498753]You must have creamed your pants watching Moneyball and Billy Beane's propensity to rely on stats (OBP).[/QUOTE]

    Just pointing out the fact's that Sanchez has improved each of his 3 years in the league (regardless of what the critics may or may not say).

    I'm only using Eli Maning as an example of a quarterback who had to first develop before turning into a strong quarterback, as do most.

    Eli Manning struggled more than Sanchez has during Eli's first 3 seasons (Didn't make the SB until his 4th season and never posted a QB Rating of 80+ until his 5th season). Fans, such as (some of these Jet critics) were ready to run Manning out of town before giving him the chance to A.) Develop as a QB. B.) Learn from his mistakes. C.) Improve upon his learning of his mistakes. D.) Develop into a top 5 quarterback and last but not least.) Win Two Super Bowls.

    I'm not sure as to why we're using Eli Manning as an example to Sanchez though, that's an insult to Sanchez himself. Sanchez has had a much better/successful 3 years when compared to Eli (Or most quarterbacks when thinking about it).

    Eli only put up a record of 26-23 during his first 3 years in the league which included a 23-0 home playoff loss to the Panthers and a 23-20 road playoff loss against the Eagles). Eli posted an 0-2 playoff record during his first 3 years in the league. Sanchez on the other hand? 4-2 road playoff record.

    Did I forget to mention that Eli Manning also played like dog **** during his first two playoff appearances/games? Sanchez on the other hand? Posted some of the best QB ratings of all-time during his 6 road playoff games. The kid is a winner, he's just a winner in which hasn't won a super bowl yet.

    Since two AFC Championship game appearances aren't good enough for some of these Sanchez critics, how many QB's have won a SB during their first 3 years in the league? That's what I'd like to know.

  4. #244
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    [QUOTE=GuidoYaztremski;4498804]Some serious ironing right there.:rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

    Adopting the Hampur terminology. What a tool.

  5. #245
    [QUOTE=NY2FLDWC85;4498736]I could use another 30+ examples consisting of SB winning, All-Pro's and/or HOF QB's.[/QUOTE]

    I'm surprised you didn't.

  6. #246
    [QUOTE=NY2FLDWC85;4498805]Just pointing out the fact's that Sanchez has improved each of his 3 years in the league (regardless of what the critics may or may not say).

    I'm only using Eli Maning as an example of a quarterback who had to first develop before turning into a strong quarterback, as do most.

    Eli Manning struggled more than Sanchez has during Eli's first 3 seasons (Didn't make the SB until his 4th season and never posted a QB Rating of 80+ until his 5th season). Fans, such as (some of these Jet critics) were ready to run Manning out of town before giving him the chance to A.) Develop as a QB. B.) Learn from his mistakes. C.) Improve upon his learning of his mistakes. D.) Develop into a top 5 quarterback and last but not least.) Win Two Super Bowls.

    I'm not sure as to why we're using Eli Manning as an example to Sanchez though, that's an insult to Sanchez himself. Sanchez has had a much better/successful 3 years when compared to Eli (Or most quarterbacks when thinking about it).

    Eli only put up a record of 26-23 during his first 3 years in the league which included a 23-0 home playoff loss to the Panthers and a 23-20 road playoff loss against the Eagles). Eli posted an 0-2 playoff record during his first 3 years in the league. Sanchez on the other hand? 4-2 road playoff record.

    Did I forget to mention that Eli Manning also played like dog **** during his first two playoff appearances/games? Sanchez on the other hand? Posted some of the best QB ratings of all-time during his 6 road playoff games. The kid is a winner, he's just a winner in which hasn't won a super bowl yet.

    Since two AFC Championship game appearances aren't good enough for some of these Sanchez critics, how many QB's have won a SB during their first 3 years in the league? That's what I'd like to know.[/QUOTE]

    So, your conclusion is because Sanchez ' stats are better than Eli's in his first three years,Sanchez will eventually become an elite QB and better than Eli?

  7. #247
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    [QUOTE=GuidoYaztremski;4498804]Some serious ironing right there.:rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

    No kidding.

    Ditzbrained Jordina is too stupid to see who started the name-calling and derogatory comments in this thread.

    The all-time greatest hypocrite of JI, congrats to her.

  8. #248
    [QUOTE=GuidoYaztremski;4498810]So, your conclusion is because Sanchez ' stats are better than Eli's in his first three years,Sanchez will eventually become an elite QB and better than Eli?[/QUOTE]

    I'd say that it's a possibility.

    What it really says is that it takes time for QBs to develop and to become "elite", and that 3 years isn't enough time to tell with many QBs.

  9. #249
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    [QUOTE=Demosthenes9;4498827]I'd say that it's a possibility.

    What it really says is that it takes time for QBs to develop and to become "elite", and that 3 years isn't enough time to tell with many QBs.[/QUOTE]

    Eli is not elite.

  10. #250
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    [QUOTE=GuidoYaztremski;4498810]So, your conclusion is because Sanchez ' stats are better than Eli's in his first three years,Sanchez will eventually become an elite QB and better than Eli?[/QUOTE]

    Just using an example of one fan base (Giants) that tried to run a very talented (developing quarterback) out of town before giving him a chance ala the time needed in order to prove himself as a (future) winning quarterback. The same thing is happening with our fan base. What's common about the two fan bases? Both are New York fan bases (Jersey as well). And New Yorkers have never been patient in regards to winning/losing.

    Sanchez is only heading into his 4th season after being drafted as a raw rookie quarterback who lacked anything other than 1 season of college starting experience. In reality, we should have allowed Sanchez the chance (Rodgers behind Favre) to develop, learn the offense and practice as a backup QB for at least 2-3 years (that's how raw Sanchez was coming out) but instead? We had to throw Sanchez into the fire due to the fact that Kellen Clemens would have been our starting quarterback. Our coaching staff was forced to throw Sanchez into the fire while watching him make mistake after mistake after mistake as a developing QB. We all knew it'll happen, it's called a learning curve.

    He's only heading into his 4th season, has improved each of his 3 years in the league, has posted a winning record, has made the playoffs two of his first three years in the league with a 4-2 road playoff record, along with one of the all-time highest postseason QB rating (played like a playoff warrior during his 6 road games, kid played his ass off). To make it worse, he's been forced to run an offense (and develop as a quarterback at the same time) with an offensive coordinator in which who's recently been shown the door in regards to Shotty Jr.

    Now he's an experienced quarterback heading into his 4th season with a different offensive coordinator in Tony Sparano. I guarantee he'll post a QB rating of 82+ this up coming season.
    Last edited by NY2FLDWC85; 06-22-2012 at 06:06 PM.

  11. #251
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    [QUOTE=jpoppy7;4498790]To clarify, Jordy posted PFF's [B]pass protection [/B] rankings for the Jets OL. Those are not ground game heavy, they are only based on pass protection.

    I don't hate Sanchez. I also don't hate the rest of the Jets offense. I think Sanchez has improved to be a slightly-below average starting QB. Don't think he's the worst starting QB in the league or anything like that. He could continue to grow and become above-average, doubt he becomes elite but anything's possible.[/QUOTE]

    Anything coming from Jordina is certainly no validation.

    I need to see PFF's numbers from PFF and the methods used.

    Sounds to me like too much PFF human factor involved.

    If PFF ranked the Jets OL #1 strictly on pass protection, then that's even more ridiculous than using the ground game to boost the ranking.

    It's simply not believable.

    NFL.com's rankings are more reasonable. IMO.

  12. #252
    [QUOTE=NY2FLDWC85;4498805]Just pointing out the fact's that Sanchez has improved each of his 3 years in the league (regardless of what the critics may or may not say).

    I'm only using Eli Maning as an example of a quarterback who had to first develop before turning into a strong quarterback, as do most.

    Eli Manning struggled more than Sanchez has during Eli's first 3 seasons (Didn't make the SB until his 4th season and never posted a QB Rating of 80+ until his 5th season). Fans, such as (some of these Jet critics) were ready to run Manning out of town before giving him the chance to A.) Develop as a QB. B.) Learn from his mistakes. C.) Improve upon his learning of his mistakes. D.) Develop into a top 5 quarterback and last but not least.) Win Two Super Bowls.

    I'm not sure as to why we're using Eli Manning as an example to Sanchez though, that's an insult to Sanchez himself. Sanchez has had a much better/successful 3 years when compared to Eli (Or most quarterbacks when thinking about it).

    Eli only put up a record of 26-23 during his first 3 years in the league which included a 23-0 home playoff loss to the Panthers and a 23-20 road playoff loss against the Eagles). Eli posted an 0-2 playoff record during his first 3 years in the league. Sanchez on the other hand? 4-2 road playoff record.

    Did I forget to mention that Eli Manning also played like dog **** during his first two playoff appearances/games? Sanchez on the other hand? Posted some of the best QB ratings of all-time during his 6 road playoff games. The kid is a winner, he's just a winner in which hasn't won a super bowl yet.

    Since two AFC Championship game appearances aren't good enough for some of these Sanchez critics, how many QB's have won a SB during their first 3 years in the league? That's what I'd like to know.[/QUOTE]

    4 road playoff wins (about 200 yards in each) that were won by the defense + running game and the early struggles of a much more physically talented future HOF crosstown rival qb. Sad.
    Last edited by Monsterxman; 06-22-2012 at 06:11 PM.

  13. #253
    [QUOTE=Jordy;4498807]Adopting the Hampur terminology. What a tool.[/QUOTE]

    Lmfao.....thinking the hampur is his own 'lil private club. What a Gomer



    [QUOTE=Jordy;4498792]Don't waste your time trying to talk sense to this guy.

    He only understands "tough-guy-internet" talk and name-calling.

    [/QUOTE]

    THIS^^^^^????????


    Oh, I get it. You live on a one way street.
    .
    Last edited by GuidoYaztremski; 06-22-2012 at 06:12 PM.

  14. #254
    [QUOTE=jetrider;4498835]Anything coming from Jordina is certainly no validation.

    I need to see PFF's numbers from PFF and the methods used.

    Sounds to me like too much PFF human factor involved.

    If PFF ranked the Jets OL #1 strictly on pass protection, then that's even more ridiculous than using the ground game to boost the ranking.

    It's simply not believable.

    NFL.com's rankings are more reasonable. IMO.[/QUOTE]

    What's the confusion about???

    [QUOTE=Jordy;4497842]More psycho babble from another guy who likes to state his opinions as if they are fact engraved in granite.

    According to Pro Football Focus (and I'll take their analysis over yours):

    2009: The Jets' OL ranked #1 overall, #1 Run, [COLOR="Red"][B]#2 Pass[/B][/COLOR]

    2010: The Jets OL ranked #1 overall, #1 Run, [COLOR="Red"][B]#1 Pass.[/B][/COLOR]

    But you were right about one thing.

    2011: The Jets OL ranked #12 overall, #14 Run, [COLOR="Red"][B]#14 Pass.[/B][/COLOR]

    So they were pretty6 average in 2011.[/QUOTE]

    Three rankings for each season. 1st ranking is Overall. 2nd ranking is Run. 3rd ranking is Pass

  15. #255
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    [QUOTE=GuidoYaztremski;4498840]THIS^^^^^????????Oh, I get it.You live on a one way street.



    Lmfao.....thinking the hampur is his own 'lil private club. What a Gomer.[/QUOTE]

    LOL. You just re-quoted the same post and pretended you didn't essentially say the same thing?

    What's wrong? Did you not get the reaction you hoped for?

    FYI, I don't hang out in the Hampur nor do I act like I do nor do I talk like I do.

    LOL! And then you just edited it. What a tool!

  16. #256
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    [QUOTE=jetrider;4498817]No kidding.

    Ditzbrained Jordina is too stupid to see who started the name-calling and derogatory comments in this thread.

    The all-time greatest hypocrite of JI, congrats to her.[/QUOTE]

    Did I?

    If I did, it would be the first time. That's your MO.

  17. #257
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    [QUOTE=jetrider;4498835]Anything coming from Jordina is certainly no validation.

    I need to see PFF's numbers from PFF and the methods used.

    Sounds to me like too much PFF human factor involved.

    If PFF ranked the Jets OL #1 strictly on pass protection, then that's even more ridiculous than using the ground game to boost the ranking.

    It's simply not believable.

    NFL.com's rankings are more reasonable. IMO.[/QUOTE]

    [QUOTE=Demosthenes9;4498843]What's the confusion about???



    Three rankings for each season. 1st ranking is Overall. 2nd ranking is Run. 3rd ranking is Pass[/QUOTE]

    jetrider all talk and no action.

    Where are the nfl.com stats sweet cheeks? You know. The one's that show a variety of factors in ranking the OL? The ones you keep referring to and can't provide.

    Is it just sacks? Is it sacks and hits? Is it a multitude of factors?

    Answer: sadly, it's just sacks. No not the ones you teabag.

    Troll.

    Have a nice night!

  18. #258
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    [QUOTE=Demosthenes9;4498843]What's the confusion about???

    Three rankings for each season. 1st ranking is Overall. 2nd ranking is Run. 3rd ranking is Pass[/QUOTE]

    Yes, I know how to read ... do you? :rolleyes:

  19. #259
    [QUOTE=NY2FLDWC85;4498833] I guarantee he'll post a QB rating of 82+ this up coming season.[/QUOTE]

    is that good? :confused:

  20. #260
    [QUOTE=jetrider;4498835]Anything coming from Jordina is certainly no validation.

    I need to see PFF's numbers from PFF and the methods used.

    Sounds to me like too much PFF human factor involved.

    If PFF ranked the Jets OL #1 strictly on pass protection, then that's even more ridiculous than using the ground game to boost the ranking.

    It's simply not believable.

    NFL.com's rankings are more reasonable. IMO.[/QUOTE]

    Read: [url]http://www.profootballfocus.com/about/grading/[/url]

    An excerpt relevant to this dicussion:

    [QUOTE]The grading takes into account many things and effectively brings “intelligence” to raw statistics.
    .
    For example, a raw stat might tell you a tackle conceded a sack. However, how long did he protect the QB for before he gave it up? Additionally, when did he give it up? If it was within the last two minutes on a potentially game-tying drive, it may be rather more important than when his team is running out the clock in a 30-point blowout.[/QUOTE]

    I don't think PFF is perfect, but it is more useful for understanding how well an OL pass protects than just straight sack numbers.
    Last edited by jpoppy7; 06-22-2012 at 06:30 PM.

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