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Thread: Lets talk football.

  1. #581
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jordy View Post
    Isn't that why you were banned so many times in the past? I think you wear people out. It's only been a couple of weeks or so and I'm already worn out.
    You think you know, but have no idea. I was banned for being an over-hyped Rays fan. Won't happen again, refuse to talk about my Rays on this site. Lets not talk about being worn out by such and such, did you see how many people hate you during the troll-ban thread? You had over 900 votes. Last but not least, if you're "worn out", maybe you should A.) Stop quoting each and every post I make and B.) Put me on ignore.

    But, as we all know, that would make one less person you could argue with. You do know, you ruin every thread you post in, right? Because you're talking football 10% of the time and trolling, derailing and/or arguing the other 90%.

  2. #582
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY2FLDWC85 View Post
    You think you know, but have no idea. I was banned for being an over-hyped Rays fan. Won't happen again, refuse to talk about my Rays on this site. Lets not talk about being worn out by such and such, did you see how many people hate you during the troll-ban thread? You had over 900 votes. Last but not least, if you're "worn out", maybe you should A.) Stop quoting each and every post I make and B.) Put me on ignore.

    But, as we all know, that would make one less person you could argue with. You do know, you ruin every thread you post in, right? Because you're talking football 10% of the time and trolling, derailing and/or arguing the other 90%.
    Are you really that naive?

    C'mon. Put your money where your big mouth is.

  3. #583
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    Feel free to add your selections at anytime.

    Offensive and Defensive Rookies of the Year? I went with Trent Richardson and Quinton Coples.

    2012's Sleeper and Disappointment Teams? I went with the Chiefs as my sleeper and the Ravens as my disappointment teams.

    2012's Comeback Player of the Year? I decided to go with Jamaal Charles.

    Predicted Top 5 Defenses? I went with the Jets, Cowboys, 49ers, Steelers and Chiefs.

    Your expected 12 playoff teams? I took the Patriots, Jets, Steelers, Chiefs, Chargers, Texans, Giants, Cowboys, Packers, Bears, Saints and 49ers.

    Here's the current Tally-Up.


    Rookies of the Year:
    Trent Richardson: 7 votes.
    Robert Griffin III: 4 votes.
    Michael Floyd: 2 votes.
    David Wilson: 2 votes.

    Quinton Coples: 3 votes.
    Dont'a Hightower: 3 votes.
    Luke Kuechly: 2 votes.
    Mark Barron: 1 vote.
    Melvin Ingram: 1 vote.
    Bruce Irvin: 1 vote.
    Morris Claiborne: 1 vote.
    Chandler Jones: 1 vote.
    Courtney Upshaw: 1 vote.
    Mychal Kendricks: 1 vote.
    Tavon Wilson: 1 vote.

    Comeback Player of the Year:

    Peyton Manning: 3 votes.
    Jamaal Charles: 1 vote.
    Peyton Hillis: 1 vote.
    Carson Palmer: 1 vote.

    Sleeper Teams:
    NY Jets: 1 vote.
    Chiefs: 1 vote.
    Bills: 1 vote.
    Raiders: 1 vote.

    Disappointment Teams:
    Ravens: 2 votes.
    Steelers: 2 votes.
    Texans: 2 votes.
    Falcons: 1 vote.

    Top 5 Defenses:
    49ers: 3 votes.
    Jets: 3 votes.
    Steelers: 3 votes.
    Ravens: 2 votes.
    Cowboys: 2 votes.
    Chiefs: 1 vote.
    Bears: 1 vote.

    Playoff Teams:
    Steelers: 6 votes.
    Texans: 6 votes.
    Patriots: 5 votes.
    Broncos: 5 votes.
    Chargers: 4 votes.
    Jets: 3 votes.
    Ravens: 3 votes.
    Bengals: 2 votes.
    Chiefs: 1 vote.
    Raiders: 1 vote.

    49ers: 6 votes.
    Packers: 6 votes.
    Saints: 5 votes.
    Eagles: 5 votes.
    Giants: 4 votes.
    Bears: 4 votes.
    Lions: 3 votes.
    Cowboys: 2 votes.
    Falcons: 1 vote.
    Last edited by NY2FLDWC85; 07-05-2012 at 09:30 PM.

  4. #584
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY2FLDWC85 View Post
    I'll start with 20 signups. Baby steps. Keep in mind, by signing your name below, you agree to completely ignore each and every post of PatsFanTx, even if it means ignoring a post that he's quoted of you "trying" to throw you under the bus. Because these types of post's will happen. I'm willing to ignore it, if it means that as a fan base, our threads will no longer be trolled, hijacked and completely derailed because of one troll with just about 50,000 posts here on JI. I'm more than willing to acknowledge and ignore in order to start a JetsInsider movement against PatsFanTx.

    1.) X NY2FLDWC85.
    2.) x Dcat
    3.) x bcess
    4.) x sg3
    5.) x mohegangreen
    6.)
    7.)
    8.)
    9.)
    10.)
    11.)
    12.)
    13.)
    14.)
    15.)
    16.)
    17.)
    18.)
    19.)
    20.)

    5 down, 15 more to go. Get 20 signups and the list will be increased to 40. Baby steps.
    LOLZ

    You take the internet very seriously, don't you?

  5. #585
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY2FLDWC85 View Post
    Rookies of the Year:
    Trent Richardson: 7 votes.
    Robert Griffin III: 4 votes.
    Michael Floyd: 2 votes.
    David Wilson: 2 votes.

    Quinton Coples: 3 votes.
    Dont'a Hightower: 3 votes.
    Luke Kuechly: 2 votes.
    Mark Barron: 1 vote.
    Melvin Ingram: 1 vote.
    Bruce Irvin: 1 vote.
    Morris Claiborne: 1 vote.
    Chandler Jones: 1 vote.
    Courtney Upshaw: 1 vote.
    Mychal Kendricks: 1 vote.
    Tavon Wilson: 1 vote.
    You're really taking that one seriously?

    Who voted for Wilson? Seriously.

  6. #586
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    +1. Honestly, give it a rest man. Let the dust settle and move on

  7. #587
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY2FLDWC85 View Post
    Last 10 Offensive/Defensive rookies of the year.

    2002: Clinton Portis & Julius Peppers.
    2003: Anquan Boldin & Terrell Suggs.
    2004: Ben Roethlisberger & Jonathan Vilma.
    2005: "Cadillac" Williams & Shawne Merriman.
    2006: Vince Young & DeMeco Ryans.
    2007: Adrian Peterson & Patrick Willis.
    2008: Matt Ryan & Jerod Mayo.
    2009: Percy Harvin & Brian Cushing.
    2010: Sam Bradford & Ndamukong Suh
    2011: Cam Newton & Von Miller.

    Most of these previous rookie of the year winners have developed into 'the truth'. Which year instantly stands out to me? I'd have to say 2007 with Adrian Peterson and Patrick Willis. Roethlisberger and Vilma have also led their units (offense and defense) to Super Bowl championships. I'd have to rank Cadillac Williams and Merriman of 2005 as the weakest group of rookie of the year winners. Ryan and Mayo of 2008 aren't all that impressive either. Got a little side tracked for a second there, now it's time for the meat and potatoes of this topic of discussion.

    5 QB's, 3 RB's and 2 WR's have taken home the award over the past 10 seasons. What's that tell me? That offensive lineman, tight ends and fullbacks aren't likely to win this award. QB's have the advantage while both RB's and WR's are fair game. 8 of these 10 winners were first round draft picks. Portis and Boldin were both 2nd round draft picks. What's this tell me? I'm looking inside the 1st round for my up coming ROY.

    5 MLB's, 3 OLB's, 1 DE and 1 DT have taken home this award over the past 10 seasons. What's this show me? That secondary players (unless your a Charles Woodson type of prospect) aren't going to make enough impact plays to take home this award. Freaks of nature DE's such as Peppers and monster types of DT's such as Suh stand a fighting chance. This award has been dominated by MLB's and OLB's over the past 10 years with MLB holding a 50/30 advantage over OLB's due to the amount of tackles they're able to wrack up. 9 of these 10 winners were first round draft picks. Ryans was the only 2nd round draft pick, but went very high as the 1st pick of the 2nd round. Whats this telling me? I'm going with a first round selection this up coming season.

    OFFENSIVE ROOKIE OF THE YEAR: RB, Trent Richardson, Cleveland Browns.

    Why would I go with a RB over the likes of top rated QB's such as Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III? To me, it's a combination of things. Trent Richardson is the closest thing I've seen to AP coming out of college since Adrian Peterson himself. He has the overall size, strength and speed to go along with a physical 227-pound frame, and also rushes the football with lots of impact power. He's my lock to take it home for the Cleveland Browns.

    We all know that Andrew Luck has been ranked as the highest rated QB coming out since Elway. If you were to ask me, he's a lock to develop into a very good to great player, but he's not in a Sanchez type of situation situation (great defense, ground and pound offense, top of the line offensive line etc, etc). He's in more of a Ryan Leaf type of situation. That Colts defense is a shell of what it once was, they may not protect their QB by keeping points off the board, and he's walking into a 2-14 type of situation. I can envision/picture Luck having a 1998 Peyton Manning type of rookie season. May develop him into a stronger QB as time goes on, he may put up numbers; but it won't be pretty. As far as RG3? NFC East. He'll have to face those Giants, Cowboys and Eagles defense 6 times. The weather in NJ and Philly won't be pretty either. He'll also have to go up against D's such as the Steelers in Pittsburgh, Ravens, Bengals and even Saints. I don't like this kids chances of future success here in 2012.

    DEFENSIVE ROOKIE OF THE YEAR: DE, Quinton Coples, New York Jets.

    Why would I go with Quinton Coples over LB's such as Luke Kuechly and Dont'a Hightower or opposing DE's such as Melvin Ingram? To me it's simple. Jet fans may feel I'm only going with Coples because he's a Jet, but if that were the case I would have went with Stephen Hill over Richardson and everyone else. I'm going with Coples because I feel he's in best possible position to succeed 'right away' under a Rex Ryan/Darrelle Revis led defense. Coples is playing alongside a stacked defensive front with Pouha at NT and Wilkerson as the opposite DE. He'll be playing in front of veteran LB's such as Scott, Harris and Thomas. Will have an extra .5 to 1 second in regards to rushing the quarterback due to our trio of CB's in Revis, Cromartie and Wilson locking up opposing WR's. Not only that, but he's experienced in both the 3-4 and 4-3 defensive schemes during the years that he played with NC. Can line up as a 4-3 speed rushing DE, can play the run while getting into the backfield as a 3-4 DE etc, etc.

    At 6'6/285 pounds, look for Rex to line this kid up all over the defensive front. This is what Mayock had to say about Coples: "I've been highly critical of him. However, he showed up at the Senior Bowl and showed he could play like Julius Peppers". As being one of the highest rated DE's coming out of this years draft class, Coples is my pick. Another reason why I'm going with Coples, is because I trust Rex in regards to talent evaluation on the defensive line. When Rex seen Coples during his pro day? He promised Coples man to man, that if he were still on the board when the Jets were selecting 16th overall? That he'll become a Jet. Come draft day? Rex was a man of his word, and selected Quinton Coples. I truly believe Rex sees something in this kid.
    I think your nuts. I'm not so sure how good Rex is at evaluating defensive line talent. I do know that Rex is an egomaniac and thinks he can make someone who has a "reputation" into a viable pass rusher. I would love to be able to agree with you at the end of the season, but there is no way Coples is defensive rookie of the year.

  8. #588
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    Quote Originally Posted by rextilleon View Post
    I think your nuts. I'm not so sure how good Rex is at evaluating defensive line talent. I do know that Rex is an egomaniac and thinks he can make someone who has a "reputation" into a viable pass rusher. I would love to be able to agree with you at the end of the season, but there is no way Coples is defensive rookie of the year.
    To say "no way" is going to the opposite extreme of what you're accusing him of.

  9. #589
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    Quote Originally Posted by rextilleon View Post
    I think your nuts. I'm not so sure how good Rex is at evaluating defensive line talent. I do know that Rex is an egomaniac and thinks he can make someone who has a "reputation" into a viable pass rusher. I would love to be able to agree with you at the end of the season, but there is no way Coples is defensive rookie of the year.
    To question his mentality in regards to evaluating defensive talent in extremely foolish. Not only was Rex Ryan a defensive end in his own right, but was also Baltimore's defensive lines coach during the drafting of Terrell Suggs (who he later moved to defensive end) and was Baltimore's defensive coordinator during the drafting of Haloti Ngata. Not only that, but also drafted Wilkerson last year (the first Jets defensive lineman drafted under Rex Ryan). Wilkerson went on to have a monster rookie season, putting up 49 tackles, 3 sacks and 1 forced fumbles. Do you understand how productive that is for a rookie 3-4 DE? A little better than Richard Seymour's rookie season.

    When Rex Ryan watched Quinton Coples perform during his NFL pro day? Rex Ryan became amazed to say the least. He promised Quinton Coples, man to man, that if Coples were still on the board at 16? The Jets were taking him regardless of who was left on the board. Rex Ryan and Tanny did just that; they drafted Coples because of Rex Ryan's interest in this kid.

    If it's impossible for Quinton Coples to develop into this years defensive rookie of the year? To each his own, but who would you point to as your expected/potential defensive rookie of the year?

    Also, which players are you talking about in regards to Rex Ryan having a "egomaniac" type of personality in regards to "thinking" that he could turn players with "reputations" into a viable pass rusher? If you're talking about Aaron Mayin, a kid that was selected 11th overall during the 2009 NFL draft; you're not making any valid points. Throughout Maybin's first 2 years of playing time, he combined for 0 sacks and 1 forced fumble (27 games played). During Maybin's first season under coach Ryan, Maybin combined for 6 sacks/4 forced fumbles (13 games played). Hopefully you're not talking about Vernon Gholston either. Because Gholston was drafted by Mangini back in 2008. Rex Ryan got stuck with a bust with a monster salary cap. Yes, Rex Ryan tried not only give this kid confidence, but also tap into his potential. As any good coach would do. Even had one of our Jet players get into a fight with Vernon Gholston during training camp, in order to test Gholston's heart. It only took 2 seasons before Rex pulled the plug on Gholston.

    I also know that Rex Ryan was Baltimore's defensive line coach when they drafted Terrell Suggs back in 2003. In 2005 Rex became the Ravens' new defensive coordinator. What did Rex do in regards to Suggs? Rex moved Suggs from outside linebacker to defensive end in many of the defensive schemes. Despite registering a then-career-low 8 sacks, Suggs also set new career-highs in tackles with 69 (46 solo) and interceptions with 2. 1 year later? Suggs recorded 64 tackles, 9.5 sacks and set new career-high in pass deflections with 8. After the season he was voted to the Pro Bowl for the second time. For the season Suggs started nine games at right defensive end in the Ravens base 4-3 and seven games when the Ravens started game in a base 3-4 defense. Rex started to move this kid all over the football field. Rex Ryan later moved him to OLB when running a 3-4 defense, and Suggs has dominated as an OLB ever since.

    What did Rex Ryan see in Quinton Coples during his pro day? This is what led Rex to promising Coples that he's 'his guy'. Kid really does have all the makings of a beastly 3-4 defensive lineman.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQmysrkRd3o
    Last edited by NY2FLDWC85; 07-04-2012 at 11:14 PM.

  10. #590
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY2FLDWC85 View Post
    Change of Topic Discussion:


    All 12 Playoff Teams (No specific order).


    Giants.
    Cowboys.
    Packers.
    Chicago.
    Saints.
    49ers.

    (Teams such as the Lions and Falcons from last year, are replaced by the Cowboys and Bears of this year).

    I love the idea of Brandon Marshall reuniting with Jay Cutler. One hell of an offensive trio with Cutler gun-slinging at Quarterback, Matt Forte dominating as he's coming out of the backfield with Brandon Marshall feasting on the outside. Bennett, Knox and Hester should all benefit from the addition of Brandon Marshall. They also landed a 6'4 WR in Alshon Jeffery out of USC during the 2nd round. More weapons for Cutler to work with. Then, on the defensive side of the ball, you have two tackling machines in Urlacher and Briggs along with a pass rushing freak of nature in Julius Peppers coming off the end. That's enough to lead any front-7 when healthy. Shea McClellin, a 1st round draft pick could also thrive on the line playing opposite of Peppers. Now, I'm not sold on their defensive backfield, but I do believe and feel that Charles Tillman a top 5 CB in today's NFL. Neither Aaron Rodgers or Matthew Stafford completed a touchdown pass against Tillman last year, and he even frustrated Calvin Johnson in coverage. I also like Jennings opposite of Tillman with the addition of Kelvin Hayden (if he can stay healthy) as their nickel back. Look for Chicago to emerge as an NFC contender this up coming season.

    With the Cowboys? I know we say this each and every year, but I believe this is the year where they put it all together on the football field. Now that they have a full offseason of OTA's, practice, training camp and preseason? Look for Rob Ryan to lead a hungry group of defensive players. They should field an NFL top 5 defense this up coming season. I'm excited to see this Romo led Cowboys offense as well. They have offensive weapons everywhere. Romo under center. A nasty 1-2 punch featuring both DeMarco Murray and Felix Jones. A strong 1-2 punch on the outside in Dez Bryant (Who I now consider a top 5-10 WR) and Miles Austin (Who can become just as good as Bryant when healthy). A great security blanket for Romo and outstanding pass catching TE in his own right in Jason Witten. Two of my key reasons on why this Cowboys team finally puts it all together? 1.) Romo no longer has all this pressure being placed squarely on his shoulders. He now has a top of the line run game to fall back on with Murray and Jones. 2.) DeMarcus Ware has always been a great defensive leader, but he could never do it alone. Now Dallas has a defensive coordinator in Rob Ryan who brings true credibility to the defensive side of the ball. Expect for Big D's defense to dial in.

    Patriots.
    Jets.
    Steelers.
    Chiefs.
    Chargers.
    Texans.

    [Teams such as the Ravens, Bengals and Broncos from last year, are replaced by the Jets, Chiefs and Chargers of this year].

    Lets just say I'm looking for Rex Ryan to lead the Jets to our 3rd playoff appearance in 4 years. I've explained by reasons on why I have the Chiefs as my Sleeper Team of 2012 (replacing the Broncos). I've expressed why I feel Baltimore will become 2012's Disappointment Team (being replaced by the Jets) and I just feel that a veteran San Diego Chargers team not only has a lot more chemistry when compared to a younger Bengals team, but also feel that the Chargers are just a much better football team when compared to the Bengals. With Antonio Gates healthy, I look for the Chargers to bounce back as AFC West contenders. I don't think Andy Dalton can repeat his rookie performance of 20 TD's/13 INT's with QB Rating of 80.4. The book is out on Dalton, he'll become tested this up coming season. The AFC as a whole is wide open like never before. Even teams such as the Titans have the ability to replace the Texans of last year, but I'll stick with the Texans until proven otherwise.
    IMO...You are an excellent poster don't let folks deter you!!!

  11. #591
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    Quote Originally Posted by rextilleon View Post
    I think your nuts. I'm not so sure how good Rex is at evaluating defensive line talent. I do know that Rex is an egomaniac and thinks he can make someone who has a "reputation" into a viable pass rusher. I would love to be able to agree with you at the end of the season, but there is no way Coples is defensive rookie of the year.
    IMO...You are an excellent poster don't let folks deter you!!!

    Oh wait no that was the guy you're pretending to be saner than. Your predictions are 99% correct so I understand how you would think being egomaniac would be okay.

    I guess you missed on one of these at the most right?

    2002: Clinton Portis & Julius Peppers.
    2003: Anquan Boldin & Terrell Suggs.
    2004: Ben Roethlisberger & Jonathan Vilma.
    2005: "Cadillac" Williams & Shawne Merriman.
    2006: Vince Young & DeMeco Ryans.
    2007: Adrian Peterson & Patrick Willis.
    2008: Matt Ryan & Jerod Mayo.
    2009: Percy Harvin & Brian Cushing.
    2010: Sam Bradford & Ndamukong Suh
    2011: Cam Newton & Von Miller.

  12. #592
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY2FLDWC85 View Post
    To question his mentality in regards to evaluating defensive talent in extremely foolish. Not only was Rex Ryan a defensive end in his own right, but was also Baltimore's defensive lines coach during the drafting of Terrell Suggs (who he later moved to defensive end) and was Baltimore's defensive coordinator during the drafting of Haloti Ngata. Not only that, but also drafted Wilkerson last year (the first Jets defensive lineman drafted under Rex Ryan). Wilkerson went on to have a monster rookie season, putting up 49 tackles, 3 sacks and 1 forced fumbles. Do you understand how productive that is for a rookie 3-4 DE? A little better than Richard Seymour's rookie season.

    When Rex Ryan watched Quinton Coples perform during his NFL pro day? Rex Ryan became amazed to say the least. He promised Quinton Coples, man to man, that if Coples were still on the board at 16? The Jets were taking him regardless of who was left on the board. Rex Ryan and Tanny did just that; they drafted Coples because of Rex Ryan's interest in this kid.

    If it's impossible for Quinton Coples to develop into this years defensive rookie of the year? To each his own, but who would you point to as your expected/potential defensive rookie of the year?

    Also, which players are you talking about in regards to Rex Ryan having a "egomaniac" type of personality in regards to "thinking" that he could turn players with "reputations" into a viable pass rusher? If you're talking about Aaron Mayin, a kid that was selected 11th overall during the 2009 NFL draft; you're not making any valid points. Throughout Maybin's first 2 years of playing time, he combined for 0 sacks and 1 forced fumble (27 games played). During Maybin's first season under coach Ryan, Maybin combined for 6 sacks/4 forced fumbles (13 games played). Hopefully you're not talking about Vernon Gholston either. Because Gholston was drafted by Mangini back in 2008. Rex Ryan got stuck with a bust with a monster salary cap. Yes, Rex Ryan tried not only give this kid confidence, but also tap into his potential. As any good coach would do. Even had one of our Jet players get into a fight with Vernon Gholston during training camp, in order to test Gholston's heart. It only took 2 seasons before Rex pulled the plug on Gholston.

    I also know that Rex Ryan was Baltimore's defensive line coach when they drafted Terrell Suggs back in 2003. In 2005 Rex became the Ravens' new defensive coordinator. What did Rex do in regards to Suggs? Rex moved Suggs from outside linebacker to defensive end in many of the defensive schemes. Despite registering a then-career-low 8 sacks, Suggs also set new career-highs in tackles with 69 (46 solo) and interceptions with 2. 1 year later? Suggs recorded 64 tackles, 9.5 sacks and set new career-high in pass deflections with 8. After the season he was voted to the Pro Bowl for the second time. For the season Suggs started nine games at right defensive end in the Ravens base 4-3 and seven games when the Ravens started game in a base 3-4 defense. Rex started to move this kid all over the football field. Rex Ryan later moved him to OLB when running a 3-4 defense, and Suggs has dominated as an OLB ever since.

    What did Rex Ryan see in Quinton Coples during his pro day? This is what led Rex to promising Coples that he's 'his guy'. Kid really does have all the makings of a beastly 3-4 defensive lineman.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQmysrkRd3o

    Rex Ryan played division 2 ball and he thought he could develop Gholsten.

    Rex may have been the most under prepared HC I have ever seen coming into the Steeler game last year.

    I like REX but to annoint him as some GREAT coach is sort of , homer like.

  13. #593
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY2FLDWC85 View Post
    The Patriots had 4 All-Pro's last season, don't blame me because I feel there are better WR's heading into 2012 when compared to Wes Welker. Don't get mad at me because I'm not that high (as I once was) in regards to a 30 year old NT in Wilfork (who's part of a laughing stock defense). Gronkowski is a beast, yes, but I'm going with Gates and Graham this season. Especially Gates if Rivers lights it up. Last but not least, at the age of 30? I like a lot of other guards when compared to Logan Mankins. Younger guards; better guards.

    Gronkowski was the only 1st team All-Pro for NE last season. Maybe I should've selected Brady, Welker, Gronk, Wilfork, Mayo, Mankins and Woodhead as NE's potential All-Pro's this up coming season but sorry, I like a lot of other players over the one's in question (Other than Gronk). You want me to blow your little Patriot players? Sorry, I'm not ESPN or the NFL Network.

    Create a list that's better, make sure you have at least 1 player from all 32 NFL teams on it. Good luck with that.
    Hey Homer McHomestein, you are such a tool.

    Gronkowski: Age 23
    90 catches for 1300+
    17 TDS

    Gates: Age 33
    64 catches for 778
    7 TDS

    Let Talk Football!

  14. #594
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    Quote Originally Posted by FF2® View Post
    Hey Homer McHomestein, you are such a tool.

    Gronkowski: Age 23
    90 catches for 1300+
    17 TDS

    Gates: Age 33
    64 catches for 778
    7 TDS

    Let Talk Football!
    Lets not compare a player heading into his 3rd year to a future HOF pass catching talent in Antonio Gates.

    Antonio Gates: 9 years, 132 games played, 593 receptions, 7,783 receiving yards, 426 first down receptions, 76 TD's.

    Rob Gronkowski: 2 years, 32 games played, 132 receptions, 1,873 receiving yards, 99 first down receptions, 27 TD's.

    Gronkowski has been blessed to have played with one of the greatest quarterbacks of All-Time. Rivers is very good, but he's not all-time greatness. Gronkowski has a long ways to go, before he can be as much as mentioned in the same breath as an Antonio Gates type of pass catching TE. Talk to me after Gronk plays another 100 games, 461 receptions, 5,910 receiving yards, 327 first down receptions and 49 TD's.

    Antonio Gates: Has averaged 4.4 receptions, 58.9 receiving yards, 3.2 first down receptions, 0.57 TD's per game throughout his 9 year career.

    Rob Gronkowski: Has averaged 4.1 receptions, 58.5 receptions, 3.0 first down receptions, 0.84 TD's per game throughout his 2 year career.

    Trying to compare Gronk to Gates would be like trying to compare Grant Hill to Kobe Bryant. Trying to compare Gronk to Gates would also be like trying to compare Gates to Tony Gonzalez. Some people may consider Gronk as the best TE in today's NFL (look at his quarterback). I'll still rank Gates and Gonzalez ahead of Gronk until proven otherwise.

    So yeah, I'm going with a 32 year old TE as my all-pro over Gronkowski. Rivers had an off year last season and Gates missed 3 games due to injury but was bothered by injury for more than half the season (played through pain). All reports have it, that Gates is 100% for the first time since 2009, and when healthy? Can't be stopped. Now that Philip Rivers is prime for a comeback season, Vincent Jackson is no longer in SD, a healthy Gates will become Rivers favorite pass caching TE (As always) and he'll put up monster numbers.

    Gronkowski is blessed to play with Brady. Wouldn't put up those types of numbers with the Flacco's and Fitzpatrick's of the world. We all knew Gronkowski could pass catch after his rookie season, but none of us expected the type of season he put up last year with Brady. The book on Gronkowski is now out. He's no longer a sleeper. He can no longer sneak past opposing defenders. He'll become game planned for, he'll be double teamed more often than not and I can almost guarantee you, that a healthy Gates will out perform Gronkowski this up coming season; Brady or not. Gronkowski will be tested like never before this season.
    Last edited by NY2FLDWC85; 07-05-2012 at 01:48 PM.

  15. #595
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY2FLDWC85 View Post
    Lets not compare a player heading into his 3rd year to a future HOF pass catching talent in Antonio Gates.

    Antonio Gates: 9 years, 132 games played, 593 receptions, 7,783 receiving yards, 426 first down receptions, 76 TD's.

    Rob Gronkowski: 2 years, 32 games played, 132 receptions, 1,873 receiving yards, 99 first down receptions, 27 TD's.

    Gronkowski has been blessed to have played with one of the greatest quarterbacks of All-Time. Rivers is very good, but he's not all-time greatness. Gronkowski has a long ways to go, before he can be as much as mentioned in the same breath as an Antonio Gates type of pass catching TE. Talk to me after Gronk plays another 100 games, 461 receptions, 5,910 receiving yards, 327 first down receptions and 49 TD's.

    Antonio Gates: Has averaged 4.4 receptions, 58.9 receiving yards, 3.2 first down receptions, 0.57 TD's per game throughout his 9 year career.

    Rob Gronkowski: Has averaged 4.1 receptions, 58.5 receptions, 3.0 first down receptions, 0.84 TD's per game throughout his 2 year career.

    Trying to compare Gronk to Gates would be like trying to compare Grant Hill to Kobe Bryant. Trying to compare Gronk to Gates would also be like trying to compare Gates to Tony Gonzalez. Some people may consider Gronk as the best TE in today's NFL (look at his quarterback). I'll still rank Gates and Gonzalez ahead of Gronk until proven otherwise.

    So yeah, I'm going with a 32 year old TE as my all-pro over Gronkowski. Rivers had an off year last season and Gates missed 3 games due to injury but was bothered by injury for more than half the season (played through pain). All reports have it, that Gates is 100% for the first time since 2009, and when healthy? Can't be stopped. Now that Philip Rivers is prime for a comeback season, Vincent Jackson is no longer in SD, a healthy Gates will become Rivers favorite pass caching TE (As always) and he'll put up monster numbers.

    Gronkowski is blessed to play with Brady. Wouldn't put up those types of numbers with the Flacco's and Fitzpatrick's of the world. We all knew Gronkowski could pass catch after his rookie season, but none of us expected the type of season he put up last year with Brady. The book on Gronkowski is now out. He's no longer a sleeper. He can no longer sneak past opposing defenders. He'll become game planned for, he'll be double teamed more often than not and I can almost guarantee you, that a healthy Gates will out perform Gronkowski this up coming season; Brady or not. Gronkowski will be tested like never before this season.
    BB will love it when Gronk get double teamed leaving single coverage on Welker, Lloyd, and Hernandez. I can almost guarantee you you are 100% wrong on Gates having the better year, game planning or not. Brady has little to do with it. Gronk's such a huge target with great hands that he'd do similar numbers even if it were Sanchez throwing the ball.

  16. #596
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuidoYaztremski View Post
    BB will love it when Gronk get double teamed leaving single coverage on Welker, Lloyd, and Hernandez. I can almost guarantee you you are 100% wrong on Gates having the better year, game planning or not. Brady has little to do with it. Gronk's such a huge target with great hands that he'd do similar numbers even if it were Sanchez throwing the ball.
    Rex'll figure it out again and shut down the Patsie O once again, like 2009 and 2010, so prepare yourself to come off your high horse and hide in the weeds again...

  17. #597
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mohegangreen View Post
    Rex'll figure it out again and shut down the Patsie O once again, like 2009 and 2010, so prepare yourself to come off your high horse and hide in the weeds again...
    What happened, did Rex forget how to coach last year?


    And check your history, we split in '09 and '10. Pats embarrassed you 45-3 in '10 and you returned the favor in the playoffs. So in 7 chances, Rex had it figured out in 3 of them.
    Last edited by GuidoYaztremski; 07-05-2012 at 02:18 PM.

  18. #598
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY2FLDWC85 View Post
    Lets not compare a player heading into his 3rd year to a future HOF pass catching talent in Antonio Gates.

    Antonio Gates: 9 years, 132 games played, 593 receptions, 7,783 receiving yards, 426 first down receptions, 76 TD's.

    Rob Gronkowski: 2 years, 32 games played, 132 receptions, 1,873 receiving yards, 99 first down receptions, 27 TD's.

    Gronkowski has been blessed to have played with one of the greatest quarterbacks of All-Time. Rivers is very good, but he's not all-time greatness. Gronkowski has a long ways to go, before he can be as much as mentioned in the same breath as an Antonio Gates type of pass catching TE. Talk to me after Gronk plays another 100 games, 461 receptions, 5,910 receiving yards, 327 first down receptions and 49 TD's.

    Antonio Gates: Has averaged 4.4 receptions, 58.9 receiving yards, 3.2 first down receptions, 0.57 TD's per game throughout his 9 year career.

    Rob Gronkowski: Has averaged 4.1 receptions, 58.5 receptions, 3.0 first down receptions, 0.84 TD's per game throughout his 2 year career.

    Trying to compare Gronk to Gates would be like trying to compare Grant Hill to Kobe Bryant. Trying to compare Gronk to Gates would also be like trying to compare Gates to Tony Gonzalez. Some people may consider Gronk as the best TE in today's NFL (look at his quarterback). I'll still rank Gates and Gonzalez ahead of Gronk until proven otherwise.

    So yeah, I'm going with a 32 year old TE as my all-pro over Gronkowski. Rivers had an off year last season and Gates missed 3 games due to injury but was bothered by injury for more than half the season (played through pain). All reports have it, that Gates is 100% for the first time since 2009, and when healthy? Can't be stopped. Now that Philip Rivers is prime for a comeback season, Vincent Jackson is no longer in SD, a healthy Gates will become Rivers favorite pass caching TE (As always) and he'll put up monster numbers.

    Gronkowski is blessed to play with Brady. Wouldn't put up those types of numbers with the Flacco's and Fitzpatrick's of the world. We all knew Gronkowski could pass catch after his rookie season, but none of us expected the type of season he put up last year with Brady. The book on Gronkowski is now out. He's no longer a sleeper. He can no longer sneak past opposing defenders. He'll become game planned for, he'll be double teamed more often than not and I can almost guarantee you, that a healthy Gates will out perform Gronkowski this up coming season; Brady or not. Gronkowski will be tested like never before this season.

    This entire post can be summed up as:

    It is my personal, subjective opinion that Gates will have a better season than Gronk. Gates has a lengthy record of high production and will be healthy this season so I expect a bounce-back year, and Gronk is going to have more trouble this year because he will be facing more double teams and teams will be focusing on him more. That's it. That's all you actually said.

    But they are valid points in the sense that Gronk's numbers are almost certainly going to drop from that ridiculous season, as most seasons following the GOAT season at a position tend to do, esp. for the reasons you provided. Although, apparently in your hypothetical world, no one will be game-planning for and double-teaming Gates. And they certainly won't be doing that for Graham following his ridiculous season. Nope, this "game-planning" concept is a rare problem that will uniquely impact Gronk's numbers, and no one else's. And for someone who is awfully concerned about WRs declining in their 30s (which Gates essentially is), you're discounting Gates being 33 an awful lot, and as well the fact that Rivers came off of one of the worst seasons of his career, and could be heading in either direction.

    Your "guarantee" carries as much weight as your prediction that Coples will be DROY, Greene will be a top-10 back, the Jets will have the #1 defense, and all the others. They are your personal predictions, and nothing more. You're entitled to it, but don't expect people to accept them as gospel. It's just what you think (read: wants) to happen.
    Last edited by ASG0531; 07-05-2012 at 03:01 PM.

  19. #599
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuidoYaztremski View Post
    What happened, did Rex forget how to coach last year?
    Glad you should ask, last year obviously BB got the upper hand, so touché to that, Rex, I think, came up a little short on his personnel matchups and I think he's spent the off-season fine tuning personnel and coming up with his next chess move, so may the better man win, its a new season

  20. #600
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuidoYaztremski View Post
    What happened, did Rex forget how to coach last year?


    And check your history, we split in '09 and '10. Pats embarrassed you 45-3 in '10 and you returned the favor in the playoffs. So in 7 chances, Rex had it figured out in 3 of them.
    In 09 and 10 it was 3 - 2 in favor of ole' Sexy Rexy, Bro

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