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Thread: The U.S. Promotes Universal Health Care, but Only in Other Countries

  1. #1

    The U.S. Promotes Universal Health Care, but Only in Other Countries

    American foreign policy had built such programs abroad since the Marshall Plan, so why not at home?


    A U.S. army officer provides free medical care in South Africa as part of an annual training exercise. (AP)

    Millions of lives are prolonged or saved throughout the world, thanks to United States-supported health programs. But Americans aren't so lucky. For many, the best way to get affordable treatment at U.S. taxpayers' expense might be to move to a poor country that is committed to building universal coverage, backed by U.S. development aid.

    The Supreme Court decision on the Affordable Care Act opens the possibility that the United States may now begin to domestically implement policies that foreign aid agencies and the Department of Defense have long supported, both politically and economically, as elements of U.S. foreign policy. It may now be possible to harmonize longstanding U.S. foreign and domestic policies regarding healthcare access for poor and middle class peoples.

    Dating back to the Marshall Plan in post-WWII Europe, General Douglas MacArthur's 1945-1949 occupation of Japan, and then the Korean War, it has been a matter of U.S. foreign policy to invest in the creation of universal health systems. More recently, the Marshall Plan was cited by AFRICOM in support of a Department of Defense engagement in health systems construction across Africa. This year, South Africa was the number one recipient of health aid from the United States, totaling nearly $470 million, much of which is supporting the country's 14-year program to build universal health coverage.

    Meanwhile, on the home front, 2012 polling shows that 26 percent of Americans have faced grave financial difficulties due to medical costs, and 58 percent have delayed treatments due to their inability to pay out-of-pocket expenses or insurance co-pays. For those without health insurance or Medicare coverage, a startling 81 percent say they forego treatments, as do 72 percent of poor Americans earning less than $40,000 per year. By 2010, medical bills were the number one cause of bankruptcy in the United States, exceeding housing foreclosure as cause for limiting food, heat, and rent purchasing. Four million Americans declared bankruptcy that year, citing medical costs. A 2011 Department of Health and Human Services study found that the average American patient could only afford to cover 12 percent of their hospital bills, and that failure to gain full reimbursement on such bills accounted for $73 billion in losses for hospitals.

    A lack of access to affordable health care also has real health impacts in the United States. In 1950, the United States ranked number five in the world for female life expectancy; by 2009, it had fallen to number forty-six. A 2010 Commonwealth Fund comparison of population health in seven wealthy nations found the United States in last place. Between 1987 and 2006 the number of American women dying from pregnancy-related causes actually increased from 6.6 per 100,000 live births to 13.3 -- a doubling. In nearly all OECD countries, almost all of which have universal coverage, the reverse trend was seen, as ever-fewer women died year by year.

    Political pundits will now argue the impact of the U.S. Supreme Court decision and the likelihood that Republican opponents to the health reform law will be able to overturn it through legislation. But perhaps it will now be possible for an HIV-infected individual in Mississippi or Alabama to have access, at taxpayers' expense, to the same level of care as the U.S. government supports for comparable individuals in Johannesburg.

    This article originally appeared at CFR.org, an Atlantic partner site.
    http://www.theatlantic.com/internati...ntries/259160/

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Jetdawgg View Post
    American foreign policy had built such programs abroad since the Marshall Plan, so why not at home?
    Because abroad, they can. Free stuff given to poor nations is not generally rejected when the alternative is nothing.

    Because domesticly, thus far, they cannot. We (in the majority at current) have rejected it. "Free" stuff for some of our able-bodied citizens at the expense of other citizens is not usually popular in the U.S. historicly. And unlike poor nation, we already have an alternative that isn't "nothing".

    Pretty strait forward tbqh.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    Because abroad, they can. Free stuff given to poor nations is not generally rejected when the alternative is nothing.

    Because domesticly, thus far, they cannot. We (in the majority at current) have rejected it. "Free" stuff for some of our able-bodied citizens at the expense of other citizens is not usually popular in the U.S. historicly. And unlike poor nation, we already have an alternative that isn't "nothing".

    Pretty strait forward tbqh.
    For a good deal of people in the U.S. the alternative IS nothing. Millions are uninsured for many reasons, a lot of which are beyond their control. We are supposed to be the greatest nation in the world and yet millions of citizens cannot get decent health benefits.

    We are not talking about items of luxury. And the point of the article is to show the continued hypocrisy of our politicians that are against universal-type health care at home, yet rubber stamp it overseas-using our tax money.

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    Quote Originally Posted by intelligentjetsfan View Post
    For a good deal of people in the U.S. the alternative IS nothing. Millions are uninsured for many reasons, a lot of which are beyond their control. We are supposed to be the greatest nation in the world and yet millions of citizens cannot get decent health benefits.

    We are not talking about items of luxury. And the point of the article is to show the continued hypocrisy of our politicians that are against universal-type health care at home, yet rubber stamp it overseas-using our tax money.
    This is something that I've heard a lot recently. I haven't heard with it any identifying of those reasons, just heard about them. As someone legitimately and largely uneducated about the topic, what are some of those reasons?

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    Quote Originally Posted by intelligentjetsfan View Post
    For a good deal of people in the U.S. the alternative IS nothing. Millions are uninsured for many reasons, a lot of which are beyond their control. We are supposed to be the greatest nation in the world and yet millions of citizens cannot get decent health benefits.
    We are not talking about items of luxury. And the point of the article is to show the continued hypocrisy of our politicians that are against universal-type health care at home, yet rubber stamp it overseas-using our tax money.
    This means nothing.

    Funny, I hear that same line a lot. Frequently it comes from the same people that when discussing American foreign policy and war, will tell you what BS patriotsim is. I even recall one here telling us that it doesn't exist.

    The "greatness" of a nation being directly correlated to the access of its citizens to federal health care is not a fact, it is a viewpoint, shared by a minority of people in this country. A majority of us believe there are far better solutions to enabling more people access to the privilege of health care, none of which have to do with lessening choice and increasing power of a leviathan federal government. Liberty is far and away our greatest asset, and has been the definitive factor is setting this nation apart from the rest of the world as being the most powerful, the "greatest".

    Quit the faux outrage over hypocritcal, corrupt politicians when it is YOU that continues to enable and strengthen them.
    Last edited by JetPotato; 07-01-2012 at 12:09 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jasper17 View Post
    This is something that I've heard a lot recently. I haven't heard with it any identifying of those reasons, just heard about them. As someone legitimately and largely uneducated about the topic, what are some of those reasons?
    Sometimes, people have jobs where they don't make enough $$$ to buy insurance.


    The PK Health Care plan would fix all of that. Kill all the fat people. If you're on welfare AND fat...you get killed twice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PlumberKhan View Post
    The PK Health Care plan would fix all of that. Kill all the fat people. If you're on welfare AND fat...you get killed twice.
    Well that's good. I only get killed once then.

    Quote Originally Posted by PlumberKhan View Post
    Sometimes, people have jobs where they don't make enough $$$ to buy insurance.
    Why does this become the problem of the masses?

    I get the short version that there are people that have jobs that don't provide insurance, or don't have jobs therefore not being able to pay for insurance. Government programs like Medicaid/Medicare that provide subsidies to persons who cannot obtain insurance because of physical/emotional/age situations legitimately prohibit these persons makes sense. I get that, help your fellow man, yadda, yadda.

    As far as I know, laziness, stupidity, ignorance, and general a--baggery aren't disabilities. I've had more than enough of the government and interest groups making people afflicted with these syndromes out to be in dire need.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PlumberKhan View Post
    Sometimes, people have jobs where they don't make enough $$$ to buy insurance.


    The PK Health Care plan would fix all of that. Kill all the fat people. If you're on welfare AND fat...you get killed twice.
    ==================================================

    What about the smokers on the PK health plan, do they get a reduced premium or death?

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by PlumberKhan View Post
    Sometimes, people have jobs where they don't make enough $$$ to buy insurance.


    The PK Health Care plan would fix all of that. Kill all the fat people. If you're on welfare AND fat...you get killed twice.
    Obamacare should be awesome, insurance companies will be running it and everything works better when profit is their motivation! Rainbows and ice cream.

  10. #10
    No problem.
    Let's pay ALL of our doctors the same as U.S. Army captains and majors.
    Hospital administrators can be paid as lieutenant colonels.
    Nurses like first lieutenants. And not allow any lawsuits. Doesn't happen in the military.

  11. #11
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    "Socialism = communism"

    "The government always sucks. At everything."

    "The free market will take care of it. If you regulate, you playa hate."

    "Death panels"

    That's why we'll never have universal healthcare.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by intelligentjetsfan View Post
    For a good deal of people in the U.S. the alternative IS nothing.
    That is an outright lie.

    The alternative for the poor is medicaid.

    The alternative to the not poor is getting a job (even one they may not like) and/or choosing to buy insurance before X, Y or Z.

    Millions are uninsured for many reasons, a lot of which are beyond their control.
    Another lie. It is NOT beyond their control. Thats excuse making.

    We are supposed to be the greatest nation in the world and yet millions of citizens cannot get decent health benefits.
    More lies.

    "Cannot", bull****. CHOOSE not is the accurate term.

    It's rather strait forward. I've never been without insurance, from the days I made under $20K thru to today. It was a priority, it got paid for first.

    I have relatives who didn't make that choice, and used their money (often more than the $20K I used to make) on other things and CHOOSE to be insured. Bad decision, as it turns out.

    "cannot" is a partisan bull**** lie. Choose not. To work. To buy insurance when they do work. Or to take advantage of the systems already in place for the poor, even when that can.

    Save your tears for the stupid, if you please.

    And the point of the article is to show the continued hypocrisy of our politicians that are against universal-type health care at home, yet rubber stamp it overseas-using our tax money.
    As shown, it's not hypocricy. There it's accepted because it's free to them. Here is it (thus far) rejected, and they are accountable to us as voters. You'd think this was rocket science or something.
    Last edited by Warfish; 07-01-2012 at 06:00 PM.

  13. #13
    Do you get great service with your insurance? No issues?


    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    That is an outright lie.

    The alternative for the poor is medicaid.

    The alternative to the not poor is getting a job (even one they may not like) and/or choosing to buy insurance before X, Y or Z.



    Another lie. It is NOT beyond their control. Thats excuse making.



    More lies.

    "Cannot", bull****. CHOOSE not is the accurate term.

    It's rather strait forward. I've never been without insurance, from the days I made under $20K thru to today. It was a priority, it got paid for first.

    I have relatives who didn't make that choice, and used their money (often more than the $20K I used to make) on other things and CHOOSE to be insured. Bad decision, as it turns out.

    "cannot" is a partisan bull**** lie. Choose not. To work. To buy insurance when they do work. Or to take advantage of the systems already in place for the poor, even when that can.

    Save your tears for the stupid, if you please.



    As shown, it's not hypocricy. There it's accepted because it's free to them. Here is it (thus far) rejected, and they are accountable to us as voters. You'd think this was rocket science or something.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PlumberKhan View Post
    Sometimes, people have jobs where they don't make enough $$$ to buy insurance.


    The PK Health Care plan would fix all of that. Kill all the fat people. If you're on welfare AND fat...you get killed twice.
    What does the plan do for other high risk patients? Like drinkers and drug userz?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by cr726 View Post
    Do you get great service with your insurance? No issues?
    Brilliant service, matter of fact. No complaints, much use (sadly), not a single denial, problem or issue thus far.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JetPotato View Post
    What does the plan do for other high risk patients? Like drinkers and drug userz?
    Doesn't matter.

    Out-of-breath, disgusting morons who can't see their dicks. Being fat is nasty.

    Why wake up in the AM? Sausage patties?




    IF YOU WANT MY BODY, AND THINK I'M SEXY, LISTEN BREATH REALLY LOUD (cause i'm out of shape):










    Freaking pigs...SOUUUUUU----WIE!!!!!!!!
    Last edited by PlumberKhan; 07-01-2012 at 10:15 PM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Warfish View Post
    Brilliant service, matter of fact. No complaints, much use (sadly), not a single denial, problem or issue thus far.
    That's good to hear. No reply from my PM?

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by cr726 View Post
    That's good to hear. No reply from my PM?
    I don't check them often, but yes, I am jealous obviously.

  19. #19
    If you had the nicest house in your neighborhood and your boiler broke would you then tear down the house and build a new one? The Us healthcare system is the highest quality of care in the world. Why would anyone want to throw it out and start from scratch? Yes the boiler is busted, there are some problems that need to be addressed. Tort reform, portability, competition across state lines and a system in which small businesses could bundle together and purchase insurance at similar rates to large corporations would be a great start. Allowing medicaid money to be used by the states to create free clinics to alleviate the expense of people crowding emergency rooms for basic care would be a solid move as well. This stuff isn't that complicated. Those fixes cost nothing.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by PlumberKhan View Post
    Doesn't matter.

    Out-of-breath, disgusting morons who can't see their dicks. Being fat is nasty.

    Why wake up in the AM? Sausage patties?




    IF YOU WANT MY BODY, AND THINK I'M SEXY, LISTEN BREATH REALLY LOUD (cause i'm out of shape):



    Freaking pigs...SOUUUUUU----WIE!!!!!!!!
    Shops? Pixels? Seen shops before??





    Also, I made sure to delete the pics from the quote. For the good of humanity and all.

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