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Thread: Day 7 Camp Updates (Fri 8/3)

  1. #181
    Quote Originally Posted by Funaz View Post
    6 is 10x the qb tebow is. If tebow starts a game for the jets the season is over. Sanchez is a born winner and great in the redzone. Tebow's gimmick plays are not worth all his trouble.
    How about you watch some games from last season.



    It's incredible how always 1 troll at the end of the camp updates thread turns it into a "Tebow sucks" thread.
    Last edited by DaBallhawk; 08-04-2012 at 03:42 AM.

  2. #182
    Quote Originally Posted by Jet Nut View Post
    So did Sal P and everyone else covering the team.

    People read what they want to read.

    Add that a QB working on things, working on a new offense and working with new players and scrubs going 8-18 isn't always an indication that he played poorly or had accuracy issues.

    Another thing is that 8-18 doesn't come close to telling you who screwed up. Were receivers dropping passes ? Were the correct routes being run (presuming they were fixed routes) ? Did a receiver make a mistake on the read and run the wrong route based off that read ?

  3. #183
    NFL network is showing the Cincy scrimmage "Tebow's NY debut"
    ESPN packed up and here come NFL network. How needs Hard Knocks we have full coverage anyway just less cussing

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by NY's stepchild View Post
    Sorry, I'm only trying to get everyone's hopes up so they can be dashed when we lose all our games this year. I mean Vlad is being forced into left guard because he can't play. Our #1 RB only averaged 4.2 yards per carry. I haven't read any tweets about Coples. Sanchez doesn't care if he only has 99yard drives, and he has never beaten Pittsburgh in the playoffs. Revis is faking injuries, Cromartie is too busy playing WR, and he's our best receiver. Sporano wears sunglasses. Rex needed a lap band to lose weight. Bart lost too much weight. Maybin put too much on. McKnight eats at McDonalds. Landry says he can cover Gronkowski, but he can't even cover his abs, and Tebow runs topless in the rain. Vegas has us at 22-1 odds to win the SB. We don't have a chance. We didn't win any games last year, and we won't win any this year either.
    Brilliant. And so accurate re the whiners. It really astonishes me sometimes how absolutely depressed and bitter some Jets fans are. No joy in Mudville.

  5. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    Brilliant. And so accurate re the whiners. It really astonishes me sometimes how absolutely depressed and bitter some Jets fans are. No joy in Mudville.
    A lot of it starts with the useless beat writers. So many can't wait to repost the the tweets from the various d-nozzles that are more interested in their creative sarcasm and creating locker-room drama than reporting on the actual play on the field. Then others take that as the only thing happening at camp and get all negative.

    I actually think we'd all do better here if we limited our reposts to Jenny's tweets and left the others, particularly the useless #ESPNfail clowns, out in the cold.

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by nycdan View Post
    A lot of it starts with the useless beat writers. So many can't wait to repost the the tweets from the various d-nozzles that are more interested in their creative sarcasm and creating locker-room drama than reporting on the actual play on the field. Then others take that as the only thing happening at camp and get all negative.

    I actually think we'd all do better here if we limited our reposts to Jenny's tweets and left the others, particularly the useless #ESPNfail clowns, out in the cold.
    True. But they are frankly trumped by some of the posters here. The tone is what gets me more than anything... guys who "just know" a guy is a bust without any data, guys who have built up a hatred for a specific player or FO person and sit like vultures waiting for any misstep or questionmark to attack, guys who spend more time worrying about proving themselves right at all costs, and all done with this snarky, hostile, know it all style. I can honestly take the wild eyed optimists much better than the guys above. Pulling a balloon out of the sky is always easier than pulling dead weight out of hole in the ground.

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    True. But they are frankly trumped by some of the posters here. The tone is what gets me more than anything... guys who "just know" a guy is a bust without any data, guys who have built up a hatred for a specific player or FO person and sit like vultures waiting for any misstep or questionmark to attack, guys who spend more time worrying about proving themselves right at all costs, and all done with this snarky, hostile, know it all style. I can honestly take the wild eyed optimists much better than the guys above. Pulling a balloon out of the sky is always easier than pulling dead weight out of hole in the ground.
    +1

    Its pretty obvious some people on this board want Vlad to fail so they can say "I told you so"

  8. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    True. But they are frankly trumped by some of the posters here. The tone is what gets me more than anything... guys who "just know" a guy is a bust without any data, guys who have built up a hatred for a specific player or FO person and sit like vultures waiting for any misstep or questionmark to attack, guys who spend more time worrying about proving themselves right at all costs, and all done with this snarky, hostile, know it all style. I can honestly take the wild eyed optimists much better than the guys above. Pulling a balloon out of the sky is always easier than pulling dead weight out of hole in the ground.
    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    +1

    Its pretty obvious some people on this board want Vlad to fail so they can say "I told you so"
    Are we talking about Vlad? Because there are two years of "data" (play) to suggest that he sucks. I can only speak for myself, but I do not hate any player. Hating someone you have never met is silly. Hate is a very strong word.

    And if we are talking about Vlad, the only people that would have the "I told you so" would be his supporters. The majority of people have been down on him since day one and his play has supported them. If he turns his play around then his apologists will have the "I told you so". Not his critics.

    And anybody who roots for a player to fail to just so they can win an argument is not a fan. They are an a$$hole.

  9. #189
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    It's always easier to report bad news than good news. No one ever questions bad news.

  10. #190
    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    Are we talking about Vlad? Because there are two years of "data" (play) to suggest that he sucks. I can only speak for myself, but I do not hate any player. Hating someone you have never met is silly. Hate is a very strong word.

    And if we are talking about Vlad, the only people that would have the "I told you so" would be his supporters. The majority of people have been down on him since day one and his play has supported them. If he turns his play around then his apologists will have the "I told you so". Not his critics.

    And anybody who roots for a player to fail to just so they can win an argument is not a fan. They are an a$$hole.
    So we now judge a player after 2 yrs? A player who when he was drafted some draft experts (Gil Brandt, Mayock etc..) acknowledged that he was raw and could take a couple of years to develop..But before people say "he was drafted too high" the majority of these draft experts had Vlad going right where he did (anywhere from a low 1st into the 2nd-3rd round)..Tony Pauline is one of the few that put a 3rd-4th round grade on him..

    Add to that this is his first offseason with his coaches...But people want to write him off...

    Now, he still might never develop but to write him off after 2 yrs is dumb.

    And before people chime in with he was drafted to play OT and failed...The NFL is littered with guys drafted as OT, but don't cut it, are moved to G and succeed..Robert Gallery is one example (#2 overall pick as an OT)..Is he a HOFer? No, but he is a good G...


    Gil Brandt had him as a mid 2nd round pick

    Pick Analysis: The Jets pick up a developmental prospect in Vladimir Ducasse. The Massachusetts star played offensive tackle as a collegian, but could move inside to guard for the Jets. With the team currently loaded along the line, Ducasse will have the opportunity to sit on the sideline and learn the craft before playing a bigger role in a few years.
    http://www.nfl.com/draft/2010/profil...s:tab-analysis

    More post #53
    http://www.jetsinsider.com/forums/sh...e+draft&page=3
    Last edited by C Mart; 08-04-2012 at 10:40 AM.

  11. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    So we know judge a player after 2 yrs? A player who when he was drafted some draft experts (Gil Brandt, Mayock etc..) acknowledged that he was raw and could take a couple of years to develop..But before people say "he was drafted too high" the majority of these draft experts had Vlad going right where he did (anywhere from a low 1st into the 2nd round)..Tony Pauline is one of the few that put a 3rd-4th round grade on him..

    Add to that this is his first offseason with his coaches...But people want to write him off...

    Now, he still might never develop but to write him off after 2 yrs is dumb.

    And before people chime in with he was drafted to play OT and failed...The NFL is littered with guys drafted as OT, but don't cut it, are moved to G and succeed..Robert Gallery is one example (#2 overall pick as an OT)..Is he a HOFer? No, but he is a good G...
    I agree with this. I think he is being judged too harshly. I remember the words "raw" and "project" being thrown around when we drafted him so this is the project process we are seeing. I am not saying he will be good or a bust, but let the "project" run it's course.

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    So we now judge a player after 2 yrs? A player who when he was drafted some draft experts (Gil Brandt, Mayock etc..) acknowledged that he was raw and could take a couple of years to develop..But before people say "he was drafted too high" the majority of these draft experts had Vlad going right where he did (anywhere from a low 1st into the 2nd-3rd round)..Tony Pauline is one of the few that put a 3rd-4th round grade on him..

    Add to that this is his first offseason with his coaches...But people want to write him off...

    Now, he still might never develop but to write him off after 2 yrs is dumb.

    And before people chime in with he was drafted to play OT and failed...The NFL is littered with guys drafted as OT, but don't cut it, are moved to G and succeed..Robert Gallery is one example (#2 overall pick as an OT)..Is he a HOFer? No, but he is a good G...


    Gil Brandt had him as a mid 2nd round pick

    Pick Analysis: The Jets pick up a developmental prospect in Vladimir Ducasse. The Massachusetts star played offensive tackle as a collegian, but could move inside to guard for the Jets. With the team currently loaded along the line, Ducasse will have the opportunity to sit on the sideline and learn the craft before playing a bigger role in a few years.
    http://www.nfl.com/draft/2010/profil...s:tab-analysis

    More post #53
    http://www.jetsinsider.com/forums/sh...e+draft&page=3
    Exactly.

    Saying that Ducasse has no business competing for a starting job is a damn joke.

    Ducasse has also played exclusively at OT since his rookie year, and didn't have an off-season until this year.

    Why do fans have such a hard time understanding that players develop at different rates and speeds? Why is every player given a 1-2 year period before he is written off regardless of circumstance?

    Some fans are just straight dumb.

  13. #193
    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    True. But they are frankly trumped by some of the posters here. The tone is what gets me more than anything... guys who "just know" a guy is a bust without any data, guys who have built up a hatred for a specific player or FO person and sit like vultures waiting for any misstep or question mark to attack, guys who spend more time worrying about proving themselves right at all costs, and all done with this snarky, hostile, know it all style. I can honestly take the wild eyed optimists much better than the guys above. Pulling a balloon out of the sky is always easier than pulling dead weight out of hole in the ground.
    BAM, you nailed certain individuals in this thread and many others.

    It's shameless.

  14. #194
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    All we have to judge him by is his 2 years. And scouts are wrong about guys all the time. At this time, there is simply more evidence to prove that he sucks than that he will turn around. I don't think I ever said we should write him off. I said he should have to earn his way into a competition on more than just OTAs. Rex basically made him a half starter. He is in open competition.

    We took him in the 2nd round and he has done nothing in 2 years. I think it is fair to expect something out of a 2nd round pick. Something, anything. We have gotten nothing thus far. And it is exacerbated by the fact that we had so few picks in those drafts.

    Once again, I never said he should be cut or the curtains have closed on him. Not sure where you guys are getting that idea from. I was clear in my previous posts. You said "to write him off is dumb". I never wrote him off. All I said was that in his two years he has sucked and questioned how he could earn even footing with Slauson based off of OTAs.

    And Ray, stop piggy backing. You are the king of fighting to the death and spinning every little word to try to make yourself right. How dare you.
    Last edited by DDNYjets; 08-04-2012 at 11:24 AM.

  15. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    All we have to judge him by is his 2 years. And scouts are wrong about guys all the time. At this time, there is simply more evidence to prove that he sucks than that he will turn around. I don't think I ever said we should write him off. I said he should have to earn his way into a competition on more than just OTAs. Rex basically made him a half starter. He is in open competition.

    We took him in the 2nd round and he has done nothing in 2 years. I think it is fair to expect something out of a 2nd round pick. Something, anything. We have gotten nothing thus far. And it is exacerbated by the fact that we had so few picks in those drafts.

    Once again, I never said he should be cut or the curtain have closed on him. Not sure where you guys are getting that idea from. I was clear in my previous posts. You said "to write him off is dumb". I never wrote anything off. All I said was that in his two years he has sucked.

    And Ray, stop piggy backing. You are the king of fighting to the death and spinning every little word to try to make yourself right. How dare you.
    Somebody has a guilty conscious

    I also love how you reprimand me for doing the exact things YOU do with other posters...

    There is no such evidence he "sucks," there is evidence that he is a raw player who has been impacted by the lockout last year, and not having the time and work during an off-season to work and develop in a position that he can excel. He's bounced back and forth between OG and OT, and no time to work with coaches hurts bigtime for a player of his background.

    When drafted, he was always considered a player with very high potential, but very minimal experience and a lot of raw ability, he was always a player that was going to need at least a couple of years to make a mark, and in Ducasse's case, that has been severely impacted due to the lockout. The problem is, fans like you don't realize this.

    You are the king of fighting to the death and spinning every little word to try to make yourself right.
    This is completely untrue and yet again, shameless on your part. I have no problem giving credence to other posters on this site, including you when I agree or when a point is something I've been wrong about, I don't have an ego, you do.

    And I'm not piggy backing anybody chump, I was the one that called you out for the same things other posters have in this thread a long time ago.
    Last edited by Ray Ray19; 08-04-2012 at 11:29 AM.

  16. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    All we have to judge him by is his 2 years. And scouts are wrong about guys all the time. At this time, there is simply more evidence to prove that he sucks than that he will turn around. I don't think I ever said we should write him off. I said he should have to earn his way into a competition on more than just OTAs. Rex basically made him a half starter. He is in open competition.

    We took him in the 2nd round and he has done nothing in 2 years. I think it is fair to expect something out of a 2nd round pick. Something, anything. We have gotten nothing thus far. And it is exacerbated by the fact that we had so few picks in those drafts.

    Once again, I never said he should be cut or the curtains have closed on him. Not sure where you guys are getting that idea from. I was clear in my previous posts. You said "to write him off is dumb". I never wrote him off. All I said was that in his two years he has sucked and questioned how he could earn even footing with Slauson based off of OTAs.
    Just a point of reference. Aaron Maybin did 'nothing' in his first two years in the league.

  17. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by C Mart View Post
    New York Jets ‏@nyjets
    #JH WR Stephen Hill chases down a deep ball from Sanchez.
    Nice.

  18. #198
    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    All we have to judge him by is his 2 years. And scouts are wrong about guys all the time. At this time, there is simply more evidence to prove that he sucks than that he will turn around. I don't think I ever said we should write him off. I said he should have to earn his way into a competition on more than just OTAs. Rex basically made him a half starter. He is in open competition.

    We took him in the 2nd round and he has done nothing in 2 years. I think it is fair to expect something out of a 2nd round pick. Something, anything. We have gotten nothing thus far. And it is exacerbated by the fact that we had so few picks in those drafts.

    Once again, I never said he should be cut or the curtains have closed on him. Not sure where you guys are getting that idea from. I was clear in my previous posts. You said "to write him off is dumb". I never wrote him off. All I said was that in his two years he has sucked and questioned how he could earn even footing with Slauson based off of OTAs.

    And Ray, stop piggy backing. You are the king of fighting to the death and spinning every little word to try to make yourself right. How dare you.
    what part of "developmental prospect" didn't you understand? Of course scouts are wrong all the time..But how about we give more that 2 yrs to write a guy off.

    Strengths

    Ducasse has a really nice combination of size, natural power and foot agility for an offensive lineman. Exhibits good initial quickness exploding out of his stance in the running game and getting set in pass protection. Plays with really nice leverage.

    Weaknesses


    Originally from Haiti, Ducasse has a limited football background. Does not possess adequate instincts at this time and can be caught thinking on the move. Must do a better job of finishing his blocks and driving until the whistle. Needs to work on taking better blocking angles.

    http://www.nfl.com/draft/2010/profil...s:tab-analysis


    Draft Projection: Third

    Strengths


    • Three year starter at UMass. 2009 FCS 1st team All American
    • Dominant run blocker. Shows good balance and dominates at the point of attack
    • Uses long arms to lock on to defenders and finish blocks
    • Athletic frame
    • Has the physical tools you look for in a lineman
    • Looks the part - has rare size
    • Good work ethic and very coachable
    • Immigrated to the United States in 2002 from Haiti. When you listen to Ducasse speak you can hear the desire to succeed in his words


    Weaknesses


    • Skills appear to fit best at guard - played left tackle at UMass, but does not have the lack of lateral quickness to play this position at the next level
    • Needs to use his hands better
    • Struggles with speed
    • Talented yet raw. Needs to refine his technique
    • Awareness is an issue. It will take Ducasse time to completely understand blitz pickups as a pass blocker
    • Up and down performance at the Senior Bowl. Displayed potential but also showed he is very much a work in progress.

    http://www.nfldraft101.com/draft/pro...ir_Ducasse.jsp


    + Mayock expects a run on offensive tackles in the first round, with up to four among the first nine picks and six in the opening round overall. His pecking order after Okung and Bulaga, subject to change, consists of Oklahoma’s Trent Williams, USC’s Charles Brown, Massachusetts’ Vladimir Ducasse and Maryland’s Bruce Campbell.

    Mayock suggested the Cowboys could take Ducasse In the first round because of their history of favoring big offensive linemen. At the Senior Bowl, Ducasse measured at 6 feet 5 and 325 pounds. He did not show well in practices but performed well in the game. Mayock compared Ducasse to Duane Brown, who has started in each of his first two seasons with Houston.

    http://cowboysblog.dallasnews.com/20...mike-may.html/
    Last edited by C Mart; 08-04-2012 at 11:50 AM.

  19. #199
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    CMart your point is well taken. But those scouting reports are useless now b.c we have the ultimate scouting report now which is 2 years of him playing against NFL competition.

    Again, I did not write him off. But I think it is fair to say that after 2 years he sucks. Could that change? Of course. But I am not gong to grade him with a curve b.c they said he was a developmental prospect. Maybe some of the blame needs to go to the Jets for taking him and gambling with a 2nd round pick when they had so few picks.

    So what are we to do? Is he on the five year plan like Sanchez or the nine year plan like Hunter?

  20. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Ray19 View Post

    There is no such evidence he "sucks," there is evidence that he is a raw player who has been impacted by the lockout last year, and not having the time and work during an off-season to work and develop in a position that he can excel. He's bounced back and forth between OG and OT, and no time to work with coaches hurts bigtime for a player of his background.

    When drafted, he was always considered a player with very high potential, but very minimal experience and a lot of raw ability, he was always a player that was going to need at least a couple of years to make a mark, and in Ducasse's case, that has been severely impacted due to the lockout. The problem is, fans like you don't realize this.


    Ray the lockout excuse is weak when we had rookie QBs lighting up the league.

    His potential got Callahan fired. Not that I am complaining.

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