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Thread: Hard to listen to early reports about Ingram and C Jones

  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by jpoppy7 View Post
    Ingram is a linebacker, and Jets needed a linebacker more than a defensive lineman.

    If Coples ends up the better player than Jets made the right move. But if Ingram is better, and at a position of greater need at the time, then they made the wrong pick. Time will tell - one preeason game won't.
    no they didn't. the jets needed DLs who could collapse the pocket and generate pressure. besides ed reed and ray lewis, that's what the ravens D had that the jets don't. guys like maybin, demario davis and sapp can fly in if defenses have to also worry about coples, or if they have to double team him.

  2. #82

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by nycuse View Post
    Perhaps on a Seahawks message board. This is a Jets board.
    I was referring to Florio's quote.

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by revischrist View Post
    Um, no. Your point wouldn't have been valid if Ingram had 5 sacks last night. It was 1 preseason game. Perhaps Ingram beat a backup who was subbing for an injuried starter. Perhaps it was a defensive breakdown. Its PRESEASON. Coples doesn't to live up to "early reports" from other players picked near him. You sure your name isn't Cimini?
    My point is that Ingram looked good. Get a clue and stop manufacturing straw man arguments to make yourself look smart. It's the first season of the preseason, Coples is a rookie, etc, yeah, real ingenious and original stuff.

    I'm sure you'll be on the board later tonight raving about some Jet rookie's performance.
    Last edited by Bronxville Jets Fan; 08-10-2012 at 03:45 PM.

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob0729 View Post
    Well, he only played a quarter or so. But you can be a force against the run and not get the tackle. If you clog the lane and force the RB to bounce inside or outside so another player makes a tackle for loss or no game, you played very well against the run.

    He's a DE. How many tackles do DEs get in a game? How many tackles does a DE get in a game that he plays a quarter or a quarter and a half?
    Interesting to hear Pats fans say the same things to defend their guy about the same things they used against Wilkerson.

  6. #86
    Comparing Ingram to Couples does not make much sense. They play 2 different positions. Criticizing Rex for taking a DL over an OLB may have some merit, but consider this... Rex has seen how 4-3 fronts such as the Giants have given the Pats fits. The road to the Superbowl goes through Foxborough, so Rex selects the DL pick to allow for more 4-3 looks and more pressure up the middle. He was probably always going to pick a DE/DT. So even if Ingram does dominate, it is possible that he was never on the Jets radar anyway.

  7. #87
    Couples has something that some of these other Rooks don't, a REALLY GOOD defense around him!
    He doesn't have to start!
    He doesn't have to play every down!
    He only needs to be a piece of the Rex/Pettine/Dunbar puzzle!

    Jets can keep him fresh so he can do some damage in the 4th quarter when players are tiring.
    Rex is gonna squeeze that pocket some more this year & that could be the difference that our secondary needs to make some plays on the ball.
    Our D rotation is really deep & news that Devito has gained more quickness & burst is more great news.
    Mo will be better & Ellis might blossom getting more reps while Pouhas head heals up.
    Rex is actually pretty quiet about this D, that tells me he's like the cat that ate the canary.

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by augustiniak View Post
    no they didn't. the jets needed DLs who could collapse the pocket and generate pressure. besides ed reed and ray lewis, that's what the ravens D had that the jets don't. guys like maybin, demario davis and sapp can fly in if defenses have to also worry about coples, or if they have to double team him.
    The other thing the Ravens D has that the Jets don't is Terrell Suggs, a great edge rusher. That has more to do with the pass rush than the DLs.

    Maybin had a nice half season of picking up sacks when QBs had to hold the ball for 3 seconds or more. We'll see what Davis does, but he's not viewed as primiarily a pass rusher. Let's see Sapp make the team and get on the field before we start expecting him to bring pressure.

  9. #89
    in other news the pats OL looked like crap without Mankins, Vollmer and Waters.

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by GandWFan View Post
    Comparing Ingram to Couples does not make much sense. They play 2 different positions. Criticizing Rex for taking a DL over an OLB may have some merit, but consider this... Rex has seen how 4-3 fronts such as the Giants have given the Pats fits. The road to the Superbowl goes through Foxborough, so Rex selects the DL pick to allow for more 4-3 looks and more pressure up the middle. He was probably always going to pick a DE/DT. So even if Ingram does dominate, it is possible that he was never on the Jets radar anyway.
    I agree. Not only do they not play the same position, they do not even play the same sport.


  11. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by ARodFLKeysJetsFan View Post
    I don't know where you read that.

    Just checked the boxscores on NFL.com

    Ingram had 2 tackles 1 assist, no sacks, no FF's, no FR's, no INT's.

    Jones had 1 tackle 1 assist, no sacks, no FF's, no FR's, no INT's.

    http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/201208...ts&tab=analyze

    I wouldn't exactly classify either debut as lightening in a bottle, just sayin'.....
    He added in the SOJF scoring curve where every other teams players ratings are boosted while Jet players coring curves are dialed back.

    I saw those numbers too, for going up against a scrub, Ingram basically did nothing.

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by SDJETS View Post
    Interesting to hear Pats fans say the same things to defend their guy about the same things they used against Wilkerson.
    I think Wilkerson had a good year last year. I would have never used that as an argument against him. I am not ready to call him a stud like many Jets fans think he is or will be this year, but I think he is a solid player. Wilkerson is the the Jets best pick since the 2007 draft in my eyes granted I don't think that is setting the bar all that high.

  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by DDNYjets View Post
    I agree. Not only do they not play the same position, they do not even play the same sport.

    Playing LB is similar to playing golf, isn't it?

  14. #94
    Here's the thing concerning this topic. Those 2 players (Ingram and Jones) are fair topics because the are both players that Jet fans liked at the 16th position in the draft. The Jets had first choice and picked Coples. They chose freakish athletic talent over possible questionable character issues. We have no idea what SD and NE would have done if they were choosing first. Perhaps the same thing. We don't know and they will never tell.

    We are having this thread because both of those players had good nights in their first showing as an NFL player. We can argue all we want about the stats, or who they played against, or what positions they played. The point is that in this small sample, they both "flashed" the kind of potential that got them selected in the first round. Good for them.

    Now it is our shot to see if our #1 pick can do the same. Can he show that he can push the LOS back like it was reported that Jones did. Can he create hurries like Jones did. Can he get to the QB like Ingram did. In other words can he "flash" the kind of talent that made him the first pick of the 3 players in question.

    Its a very reasonable question, especially given that Coples hasn't exactly been raising people's expectations with his play in camp. In fact he's actually done a good job in lowering the high expectations his HC immediately put on him.

    The fact is regardless of how he plays good or bad really doesn't matter in great scheme of things. We are literally years away from finding out how good any of these players will be in the long term However it would make life a lot easier for all Jet fans who have to interact with Patriots and Charger fans, if Coples showed some of that "impact" play that was seen from Jones and Ingram

  15. #95
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    I don't give much credit to the Ingram QB hit that caused the INT. The Packers' LT played that unbelievably poorly. If you look at Ingram's college highlights he was constantly stuffed when going on on one against better LTs (Cordy Glenn completely ate him up)

    Chandler JOnes looked strangely good. But, he was weak in run protection against a straight block. He has to bulk up in upper body strength or he may be a liability in the run game. (He may also become gassed soon)

    Last year Nate Solder looked impressive in his rookie debut against Miami. Since then he looks pretty mediocre especially in pass protection in space.

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by patman View Post
    Alternating looking like his feet were in quicksand or on roller skates.
    Although that's an extreme representation of what he's capable of playing like, I have said that he is not going to bolster the Pats line and isn't living up to expectations.

    Do you think he's going to start by game 1? I would think Vollmer would.

  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by positive View Post
    I don't give much credit to the Ingram QB hit that caused the INT. The Packers' LT played that unbelievably poorly. If you look at Ingram's college highlights he was constantly stuffed when going on on one against better LTs (Cordy Glenn completely ate him up)

    Chandler JOnes looked strangely good. But, he was weak in run protection against a straight block. He has to bulk up in upper body strength or he may be a liability in the run game. (He may also become gassed soon)

    Last year Nate Solder looked impressive in his rookie debut against Miami. Since then he looks pretty mediocre especially in pass protection in space.
    Ingram looked good on a number of plays, not just that one. Of course, it's premature to overreact, it was one preseason game and he was going against mostly backups.

  18. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by HardKnocks View Post
    Here's the thing concerning this topic. Those 2 players (Ingram and Jones) are fair topics because the are both players that Jet fans liked at the 16th position in the draft. The Jets had first choice and picked Coples. They chose freakish athletic talent over possible questionable character issues. We have no idea what SD and NE would have done if they were choosing first. Perhaps the same thing. We don't know and they will never tell.

    We are having this thread because both of those players had good nights in their first showing as an NFL player. We can argue all we want about the stats, or who they played against, or what positions they played. The point is that in this small sample, they both "flashed" the kind of potential that got them selected in the first round. Good for them.

    Now it is our shot to see if our #1 pick can do the same. Can he show that he can push the LOS back like it was reported that Jones did. Can he create hurries like Jones did. Can he get to the QB like Ingram did. In other words can he "flash" the kind of talent that made him the first pick of the 3 players in question.

    Its a very reasonable question, especially given that Coples hasn't exactly been raising people's expectations with his play in camp. In fact he's actually done a good job in lowering the high expectations his HC immediately put on him.

    The fact is regardless of how he plays good or bad really doesn't matter in great scheme of things. We are literally years away from finding out how good any of these players will be in the long term However it would make life a lot easier for all Jet fans who have to interact with Patriots and Charger fans, if Coples showed some of that "impact" play that was seen from Jones and Ingram
    Great post. You should contribute more often.

  19. #99
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    I believe Jones has bulked up a bit already and will add more as his career progresses. His frame can carry the weight and shouldn't be an issue moving forward.

    It was his first game against a pretty good NFL OT.

    He should only get better as he gets more experience. Yes, he'll have a setback or two but what NFL player hasn't.

    Waiting to see what the ground and pound Jets have at RB and how Coples plays tonite.

    Are there any other areas that bear watching? Oh yeah, Sanchez and Tebow.

  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by jetster View Post
    The Saints practiced against the Pats ALL WEEK!
    Bushrod is a 6 year vet just trying to get through camp & preseason without getting hurt. Jones was pumped up for the Superbowl!
    Also, Bushrod is overrated because last year he had Carl Nicks protecting his azz at guard.
    Bad matchup for Bushrod, shorter arms ect.
    DBrick has the length to get to his chest just as fast, Plus he looks like he can be run on by going right at him & cutting him down like a tree.
    Like Parcells says, "don't put him Canton just yet".
    Bushrod is a very good NFL tackle, he might have just had a bad game, it is early in the pre-season.

    But to say he did not go all out and took a chance on getting his 22million
    qb hit, your nuts. There would be a bounty placed on him.

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