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Thread: Tebow under center.

  1. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    Funny I always thought "blind" meant without anything tangible to back it up.

    I believe what's REALLY pissing everyone off IS the evidence and the fact that it's not blind.

    It becomes a lot harder to explain away hard evidence when presented in an argument, so the only thing left to do is attack the person presenting them and trying to discredit him. Which is what's currently taking place right now in here.

    And that's pretty much my cue, that there's nothing left to debate.

    “When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.” - Socrates
    We are not getting rid of the QB position. Case closed. When/if Tebow retrains his muscles to drop back, and throw the ball properly he will have a chance to compete. Even he knows it, which I give him credit for. Until then he is what he is. A gimmick. Albeit a good one. I still think he may be better served to learn to block and run routes, but that's just me. If he works through unlearning everything he knows then I would love to have him start at QB for the Jets, but we are not going to run the single wing, or throw 7 times a game like Denver did. That's just pathetic. BTW Sanchez played his first three years in an inflexible offense tailor made for a completely different type of QB than him. Tebow played in an offense designed specifically to hide his weaknesses. You cannot compare the two. Sanchez deserves a shot with a better suited offense, and we cannot afford to give up on him, and his potential now. He already looks better, and more capable in it, and he's only just begun. He hasn't had his whole line, or his WRs. He only had 6 drop backs, and people are having heart palpitations.
    Last edited by NY's stepchild; 08-14-2012 at 02:34 PM.

  2. #182
    I don’t think anyone thinks Tebow is a better “throwing” QB.

    With that said, it’s not like Mark has played at such a high level that you can’t argue that Tebow’s running, combined with his passing (which although bad is still better than a RB), and his low turnover percentages (and fewer game changing mistakes) could mean he would be a more effective regular season starter vs. Mark.

    The Jets think they can combine 2 flawed guys to make 1 decent guy.

    With that carry on,

    I like hearing this argument, sort of like two guys with ugly wives debating over which one is better looking.

    In the end, does it really matter?

  3. #183
    Quote Originally Posted by NY's stepchild View Post
    We are not getting rid of the QB position. Case closed. When/if Tebow retrains his muscles to drop back, and throw the ball properly he will have a chance to compete. Even he knows it, which I give him credit for. Until then he is what he is. A gimmick. Albeit a good one. I still think he may be better served to learn to block and run routes, but that's just me. If he works through unlearning everything he knows then I would love to have him start at QB for the Jets, but we are not going to run the single wing, or throw 7 times a game like Denver did. That's just pathetic. BTW Sanchez played his first three years in an inflexible offense tailor made for a completely different type of QB than him. Tebow played in an offense designed specifically to hide his weaknesses. You cannot compare the two. Sanchez deserves a shot with a better suited offense, and we cannot afford to give up on him, and his potential now. He already looks better, and more capable in it, and he's only just begun. He hasn't had his whole line, or his WRs. He only had 6 drop backs, and people are having heart palpitations.
    have to disagree with this, and it's not just a question of semantics. There's a huge difference between hiding weaknesses, and capitalizing on strengths. Tebow ran an offense in college that was well suited for him. Some will argue that offense can't work in the NFL. I disagree and believe that you will be seeing more and more of it in the coming years.

    I like Parcell's take on things. Don't tell him what a player can't do. Find out what he does well, and then make use of that.

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demosthenes9 View Post
    have to disagree with this, and it's not just a question of semantics. There's a huge difference between hiding weaknesses, and capitalizing on strengths. Tebow ran an offense in college that was well suited for him. Some will argue that offense can't work in the NFL. I disagree and believe that you will be seeing more and more of it in the coming years.
    Still is semantics. Throwing 10 times a game is still hiding his weaknesses. How many points per game did they score? He still needs to learn to throw the ball properly, and I mean muscle memory so he doesn't revert when he's under pressure. That has nothing to do with what offense he's in. It still doesn't refute my position that Sanchez was not put in an offense that capitalizes on his strengths anyway.

  5. #185
    Quote Originally Posted by NY's stepchild View Post
    Still is semantics. Throwing 10 times a game is still hiding his weaknesses. How many points per game did they score? He still needs to learn to throw the ball properly, and I mean muscle memory so he doesn't revert when he's under pressure. That has nothing to do with what offense he's in. It still doesn't refute my position that Sanchez was not put in an offense that capitalizes on his strengths anyway.
    Gotcha. I thought you were talking about the offense he ran down in Florida as opposed to the crap that Fox and McCoy ran last year.

    I definitely believe in tailoring the offense to fit the QB.

  6. #186
    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    So out of 22 snaps you decide to focus on an interception. Hope you do the same for every other interception that takes place for every quarterback from here to the end of the season.
    Well when you've practically offered up anal to him for the other 21 plays, which by all accounts were average at best, someone has to bring up the worst play.

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by Snell41 View Post
    Well when you've practically offered up anal to him for the other 21 plays, which by all accounts were average at best, someone has to bring up the worst play.
    8.4 yards per carry is average? For a quarterback no less?

    What's great then? And I'm not sure why you are implying I exaggerated anything when all I said was he basically performed well when under center. I didn't say amazing. I didn't say fantastic. I said he did something he didn't do much of last year or his entire career. Apparently saying he threw the ball well, is going to drive some people absolutely insane.

    And I'm sorry, but 8.4 yards per carry is fantastic by the BEST of NFL numbers.

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    8.4 yards per carry is average? For a quarterback no less?

    What's great then? And I'm not sure why you are implying I exaggerated anything when all I said was he basically performed well when under center. I didn't say amazing. I didn't say fantastic. I said he did something he didn't do much of last year or his entire career. Apparently saying he threw the ball well, is going to drive some people absolutely insane.

    And I'm sorry, but 8.4 yards per carry is fantastic by the BEST of NFL numbers.
    There is a big difference between gaining 8.4 yards per carry scrambling on pass plays as opposed to designed runs. On a pass play, the linebackers are well behind the line of scrimmage. So, if the QB can escape the pass rush - something Tebow is very good at - he's got 10 yards of running room before first contact. Obviously, that's not the case on a designed run.

    This is why I hope the plan is not to simply line Tebow up in the wildcat formation and have him run the ball. He's much better scrambling on pass plays or even running a designed QB draw.

  9. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    Apparently saying he threw the ball well, is going to drive some people absolutely insane.
    Your're right, he threw an awsome interception.

    Suck dick, troll.

    Suck dick.

    _

  10. #190
    Quote Originally Posted by Demosthenes9 View Post
    have to disagree with this, and it's not just a question of semantics. There's a huge difference between hiding weaknesses, and capitalizing on strengths. Tebow ran an offense in college that was well suited for him. Some will argue that offense can't work in the NFL. I disagree and believe that you will be seeing more and more of it in the coming years.

    I like Parcell's take on things. Don't tell him what a player can't do. Find out what he does well, and then make use of that.

    Nope, it's always going to be marginal. When you pay a qb 20 million dollars, you don't expose him to the teeth of a defense. You don't want your quarterback to be a primary runner. The risks are too great. People have been saying what you think for the last 30 years and it still hasn't turned that way.

  11. #191
    Quote Originally Posted by JStokes View Post
    Your're right, he threw an awsome interception.

    Suck dick, troll.

    Suck dick.

    _
    You know with 19,700 posts I assume you have been allowed to run wild and blatantly attack any new members with your mudslinging and cursing that have a different point of view than you for a LOOOONG time.

    Your online virtual ego and level of superiority must be so delusionally grand, I really wonder if you know how to act when you first meet someone new in real life or even hold a conversation in the real world. Or do you even have any real friends or outside contact?

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by CleatMarks View Post
    Nope, it's always going to be marginal. When you pay a qb 20 million dollars, you don't expose him to the teeth of a defense. You don't want your quarterback to be a primary runner. The risks are too great. People have been saying what you think for the last 30 years and it still hasn't turned that way.
    30 years ago, you didn't have the rookie wage scale when signing draft picks for one thing. For another, given "pro style" offenses, all teams are out there looking for "elite QBs" and they don't just grow on trees. I mean, there's a reason why people are saying that Luck is the most "NFL ready" QB since Peyton. What's that been ? 14 years ?

    With the prevalance of Spread offenses (including Spread Option) in college, high school and peewee leagues, more and more guys are coming up in those systems. This, in turn, will lead to a wider pool of talent to choose from, and more guys who will be considered "pro material". hence, the cost of the QB goes down.

  13. #193
    Quote Originally Posted by JStokes View Post
    Who said anything about coaching players?

    Coaches coach, GMs get rid of the trash.


    You are definitely NOT a genius.

    You are so dumb, you make dumb people look not dumb*



    *Credit to RV.
    _
    Quote Originally Posted by JStokes View Post
    Hey--TeBallsawk--Tebow was in the PERFECT place to learn from possibly the GREATEST QB at reading defenses in the HISTORY of the league--and John Elway threw him away like a bag of dogsh*t.
    I'm not letting you off the hook, it's to funny watching you stumble over the many dumb things that you are saying. And then follow it up with a ragepost cussing around and wishing people you have never seen before death. It's priceless.

  14. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    You know with 19,700 posts I assume you have been allowed to run wild and blatantly attack any new members with your mudslinging and cursing
    We try to close the door on him, Sir. He just jumps back in through the mailslot.

    Your online virtual ego and level of superiority must be so delusionally grand
    Wow, it's like you know JStokes.


    Do you live in Bergen County? Own a beer stein?

  15. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestCoastOffensive View Post
    We try to close the door on him, Sir. He just jumps back in through the mailslot.



    Wow, it's like you know JStokes.


    Do you live in Bergen County? Own a beer stein?
    C'mon, WCO, I like Stokes and I know his gig, but he did go over the top with the abuse of a newbie. Guys have got to stop drinking and posting. It's dangerous.

  16. #196
    Quote Originally Posted by Demosthenes9 View Post
    30 years ago, you didn't have the rookie wage scale when signing draft picks for one thing. For another, given "pro style" offenses, all teams are out there looking for "elite QBs" and they don't just grow on trees. I mean, there's a reason why people are saying that Luck is the most "NFL ready" QB since Peyton. What's that been ? 14 years ?

    With the prevalance of Spread offenses (including Spread Option) in college, high school and peewee leagues, more and more guys are coming up in those systems. This, in turn, will lead to a wider pool of talent to choose from, and more guys who will be considered "pro material". hence, the cost of the QB goes down.
    Spread offenses and Wildcats are just the latest fad. If you think that's the future, you haven't been around long enough to watch the fads come and go.

    What does Luck being NFL ready mean anyway? You think some kid coming out of college from the spread is going to be more ready because some NFL team might use it? That's nonsense. Luck is NFL ready because of where he was in his development and not what system he was or wasn't from.

    Time will tell but I doubt it's going to go the way you think it will. College ball is a completely different animal. It always has been.

  17. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaBallhawk View Post
    I'm not letting you off the hook, it's to funny watching you stumble over the many dumb things that you are saying. And then follow it up with a ragepost cussing around and wishing people you have never seen before death. It's priceless.
    Talk about dumb, I was talking about TWO seperate people, so I'm not letting YOU off the hook:

    Quote Originally Posted by JStokes View Post

    Hey--TeBallsawk--Tebow was in the PERFECT place to learn from possibly the GREATEST QB at reading defenses in the HISTORY of the league

    That's Peyton Manning.

    Quote Originally Posted by JStokes View Post


    --and John Elway threw him away like a bag of dogsh*t.

    That's John Elway the GM.

    I'll use small words--because you want to mock that Tebow could learn from Sanchez--MY point was that if he was going to learn from anyone--who better than possibly the GOAT--Peytong manning to teach him.

    But the GM--John Elway KNEW he couldn't learn anything form Manning so John Elway the GM threw him out like dogsh*t.

    I never said Elway would be coaching him--that was YOU inability to understand the written word.

    You can't even understand the moronic posts YOU continue to throw out there--don't blame ME because you can't even understand yourself.

    _
    Last edited by JStokes; 08-15-2012 at 10:46 AM.

  18. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    You know with 19,700 posts I assume you have been allowed to run wild and blatantly attack any new members with your mudslinging and cursing that have a different point of view than you for a LOOOONG time.

    Your online virtual ego and level of superiority must be so delusionally grand, I really wonder if you know how to act when you first meet someone new in real life or even hold a conversation in the real world. Or do you even have any real friends or outside contact?
    LOLGFY. I've had plenty of civil discussions with real Jet fans--and even chowds-- with different viewpoints than mine, but when it comes to pure trolls, I treat them with the disdain they deserve. And you don't need to worry about me and my friedns--I am the most personable and cordial person you will never have the pleasure of meeting.

    Quote Originally Posted by WestCoastOffensive View Post
    We try to close the door on him, Sir. He just jumps back in through the mailslot.

    Wow, it's like you know JStokes.

    Do you live in Bergen County? Own a beer stein?

    Quote Originally Posted by long island leprechaun View Post
    C'mon, WCO, I like Stokes and I know his gig, but he did go over the top with the abuse of a newbie. Guys have got to stop drinking and posting. It's dangerous.
    Just want to make sure we're clear here.

    This place is being turned into a diseased wasteland by Chowd trolls.

    This place is being turned into a diseased wasteland by Tebow trolls.

    We now have a hit the daily double with a combo-Chowd/Tebow troll and I'M going over the top? He hates the Jets, hates Sanchez, loves the Pats, loves Tebow.

    With all the vitriol spewed at the true Chowds--never by me--death, cancer, aids, lupus, run over by buses, death by fire, drowned in urine, stuffing blunt/sharp/unlubed objects in every orifice of their bodies, but I went over the top by telling this newest Chowd/Tebow troll to suck dick?

    We're kidding here, right?

    I'm actually getting PMs from the real Tebow trolls cringing about some of the crap this child is posting--and I'm forced to agree with.

    This place is becoming almost unreadable.

    Good job.

    _

  19. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    So out of 22 snaps you decide to focus on an interception. Hope you do the same for every other interception that takes place for every quarterback from here to the end of the season.
    Much like the media covering politics, if you show or say one thing over and over, whether it is partially or fully factual or fictional, people will only see and think fo that because they're are either too lazy or ignorant to learn the full story and/or it is the only thing they know and/or have been taight to think.

    Sidenote: That being said, can someone please make a bunch of animated gif highlight reels of Brady throwing picks, getting sacked, and doing the Brady? And everyone put some of them in their signature? Then that is all we'll think about no matter what he does.

    Granted, Tebow is here to run the wildcat and be a versitile threat alongside Sanchez as the starter (if Tebow is the starter at this point in his career, we're in trouble - not saying he may be good in the future, but not now). You can call it a gimmick, but if it puts Jet points on the board and Jet wins in the win column, I'll take a "gimmick" after doing the same thing over and over for zero points and losses.
    Last edited by ChrisChrusher#40; 08-15-2012 at 12:19 PM.

  20. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by JStokes View Post


    drowned in urine, stuffing blunt/sharp/unlubed objects in every orifice of their bodies

    _

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