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Thread: Tebow under center.

  1. #41
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    OK. We really need a Tebow sub-forum. It is going to be a brutal season with all these threads.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by JStokes View Post
    Good point, but what YOU don't undertand is that with him staring down his only (read:primary) receiver, everyone on defense knows where the ball is going too and with his elongated delivery everyone on defense will have that extra second or two making it convenient to pick those balls off.

    Sorry, this isn't the SEC, in the NFL, that ugly hitch in his delivery will be a killer over time.

    It's the "on time" part that will prove to be the issue.


    _
    You're def. right about staring down the primary target. That's a BIG no-no.

    I just think that the accuracy is a much bigger problem than the hitch. The two are related, but if he can learn how to be consistent with the hitch, he can get by with good accuracy and better decision making.

    Just because the defenders see him winding up doesn't mean they know exactly where he's throwing it. It's all about mastering the technique he has, which I think is probably easier to do than tearing it all down and rebuilding from the ground up.

    He has to learn to go through his progressions (so does Mark) and get better at looking off defenders. If he can do this, his motion doesn't matter as much.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    Except that Tebow's got one of the best int% in the NFL and last year he only threw 6 interceptions, and I think he went 6 consecutive games without throwing an interception.

    So why even worry about something that isn't a problem?

    And he has never been known to throw a lot of interceptions. In fact that's the "secret" and "heavenly touch" that "magically" makes him a winner and everyone seems to amazed by it. He has one of the best td-to-turnovers in the NFL...

    He chooses to throw the ball away, and have a less than stellar completion % versus throwing a pick. It works. He understands the basics, and doesn't give a crap about yards and completion %.
    So glad you're here to straighten us all out.

    The board was severely lacking.

    Hey, how great was that INT?

    Perfect spiral, amiright?

    _

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by JStokes View Post
    So glad you're here to straighten us all out.

    The board was severely lacking.

    Hey, how great was that INT?

    Perfect spiral, amiright?

    _
    Yah it looked pretty good. I'm just curious, why don't you dissect the form of the 18 interceptions Mark threw last year in the regular season, including the 6 pick sixes?

    It's pretty clear to me if you are picking interceptions as a point of flaw in Tebow's game, then you know little about him.

    88 TD- 16 interceptions in college.
    32 TD's - 16 interceptions in the NFL, including post season.

    Of the active QB's last year only Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady and Sam Bradford have a lower career int% of the QB's that played last year. I know it's hard to accept that, but he's in the top 5 in the NFL in int%. So it's kind of ridiculous to see people ragging on a preseason interception.

    If Tebow has a pick problem so does everyone in the NFL other than Rodgers.
    Last edited by Whichfan; 08-13-2012 at 07:54 PM.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    Except that Tebow's got one of the best int% in the NFL and last year he only threw 6 interceptions, and I think he went 6 consecutive games without throwing an interception.

    So why even worry about something that isn't a problem?

    And he has never been known to throw a lot of interceptions. In fact that's the "secret" and "heavenly touch" that "magically" makes him a winner and everyone seems to amazed by it. He has one of the best td-to-turnovers in the NFL...

    He chooses to throw the ball away, and have a less than stellar completion % versus throwing a pick. It works. He understands the basics, and doesn't give a crap about yards and completion %.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    You're def. right about staring down the primary target. That's a BIG no-no.

    I just think that the accuracy is a much bigger problem than the hitch. The two are related, but if he can learn how to be consistent with the hitch, he can get by with good accuracy and better decision making.

    Just because the defenders see him winding up doesn't mean they know exactly where he's throwing it. It's all about mastering the technique he has, which I think is probably easier to do than tearing it all down and rebuilding from the ground up.

    He has to learn to go through his progressions (so does Mark) and get better at looking off defenders. If he can do this, his motion doesn't matter as much.
    So he only needs to fix staring down his receivers, his accuracy and the hitch in his throwing motion.

    I misunderstood.

    Now I get the clamoring for TEBOW TIME!!

    _

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by freestater View Post


    See the 2.25% in the INT column? I know its hard to accept, since Tebow isn't supposed to be at the top in any type of QB category, but facts are facts.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by JStokes View Post
    So he only needs to fix staring down his receivers, his accuracy and the hitch in his throwing motion.

    I misunderstood.

    Now I get the clamoring for TEBOW TIME!!

    _

    I'm not clamoring for Tebow Time. Some are, I'm not.

    I'm just asking for people to give the guy a chance to improve without the hate. Some have made up their minds that he isn't a QB, never will be. I can't understand that. Sure it's an opinion and everyone is entitled to one, but I feel like there are Jet fans don't want him to succeed.

    By the way, I'm happy Sanchez is the starter. But he too could use plenty of improvement on all of the problems that Tebow has. His accuracy and decision making are very inconsistent as well.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    Yah it looked pretty good. I'm just curious, why don't you dissect the form of the 18 interceptions Mark threw last year in the regular season, including the 6 pick sixes?


    .
    What the F*CK are you talking about Sanchez for?

    This is a TEBOW thread.

    Stay on topic, just like you're staying on his cawk.

    Seriously, go away, we have enough of your type here.

    _

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post


    See the 2.25% in the INT column? I know its hard to accept, since Tebow isn't supposed to be at the top in any type of QB category, but facts are facts.
    Stop looking into the sun; Tebow can pull the ball down and bull for yardage; how are his attempts affected by his numberous scrambles past the LOS?


    Damn right I said numberous; I am numb from this bs

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    Yah it looked pretty good. I'm just curious, why don't you dissect the form of the 18 interceptions Mark threw last year in the regular season, including the 6 pick sixes?

    It's pretty clear to me if you are picking interceptions as a point of flaw in Tebow's game, then you know little about him.

    88 TD- 16 interceptions in college.
    32 TD's - 16 interceptions in the NFL, including post season.

    Of the active QB's last year only Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady and Sam Bradford have a lower career int% of the QB's that played last year. I know it's hard to accept that, but he's in the top 5 in the NFL in int%. So it's kind of ridiculous to see people ragging on a preseason interception.

    If Tebow has a pick problem so does everyone in the NFL other than Rodgers.
    Given that he's thrown only 400 passes to Sanchez's 1500 passes and that he runs as opposed to passes when a play is needed, doesn't throw if his first option is covered, his numbers impress no one.

    Why do those who think Tebow is God refuse to look at how sh1tty he looks playing QB and try and cloud that by cherry picking useless stats.

    And of course why even bring Sanchez into it. If Sanchez sucks and Tebow sucks worse, and he does, how does this help your point?

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jet Nut View Post
    Given that he's thrown only 400 passes to Sanchez's 1500 passes and that he runs as opposed to passes when a play is needed, doesn't throw if his first option is covered, his numbers impress no one.

    Why do those who think Tebow is God refuse to look at how sh1tty he looks playing QB and try and cloud that by cherry picking useless stats.

    And of course why even bring Sanchez into it. If Sanchez sucks and Tebow sucks worse, and he does, how does this help your point?
    That's why there are percentages. Not totals. Total attempts doesn't matter as long as its a large enough number.

    If you're going to use that as an argument then Sanchez has 1500 and Brady has 7900 and few quarterbacks will ever be near each other. Go back and look at Brady's first 1000 and his percentage isn't that far off from his career total.

    And my point was Tebow doesn't have an interception problem. He may have a lot of other issues but that's not one of them considering he's averaging in the top 5% in the NFL.

    It's ridiculous to see so many people pick that play apart because it's the only thing they can really pick apart from his first game.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jet Nut View Post
    he runs as opposed to passes when a play is needed, doesn't throw if his first option is covered, his numbers impress no one.
    BINGO!!

    _

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post

    It's ridiculous to see so many people pick that play apart because it's the only thing they can really pick apart from his first game.
    So Mrs. Lincoln, what did you think of the rest of the play?

    Stop, you really sound dumb.

    _

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestCoastOffensive View Post
    Stop looking into the sun; Tebow can pull the ball down and bull for yardage; how are his attempts affected by his numberous scrambles past the LOS?


    Damn right I said numberous; I am numb from this bs
    The guy ahead of Mark won 2 SB's is that a typo.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    For those of you that are more advanced in your football knowledge, I'm surprised no one is really talking about this. I see some of you talking about how he "looks improved" from last year, but nobody is really even pointing out why. It doesn't really look "better" so much as it is something most are more accustomed to seeing: a quarterback who drops back and then passes from under center versus being in shotgun.

    Against the Bengals Tebow ran 20+ plays from under center, something that has always been a big point of criticism against him, including from former coach John Fox who stated last year Tebow would be screwed in a traditional NFL offense. Friday's offense was vanilla and generic no doubt, but it was a "traditonal" NFL offense.

    For those that may not know the difference I'll try my best to give a brief description. The rest of yous can skip the next 2 paragraphs. In "traditional" NFL offenses the quarterbacks are usually asked to take snaps from "under center", whereas college offenses, and today's more modern NFL offenses, are putting quarterbacks in some sort of "shotgun" position, anywhere from 3-7 steps back(shotgun, pistol, etc).

    The reason "traditional" or "conventional" NFL offenses were considered harder was because it required quarterbacks to perfect their footwork and timing, when "dropping back" 3, 5, or 7 steps then throwing, while at the same time going through their progressions(checking to see which receivers are open). In a college style spread option, the quarterback is already 3-5 steps back, which gives him more time to survey the field, and also has the option of running with the football if he can. Tebow is known for being able to run the spread option, so what we saw friday, was basically a fish out of water but it seemed to me the fish was learning how to swim.

    Personally I feel today, more and more NFL offenses are including shotgun and spread as their base offense so the argument of a "traditional" NFL offense is kind of overrated anyway. Having said that, I thought he looked pretty good even under center, and despite hearing guys like Skip Bayless criticizing the Jets today for not letting him run the spread option, I like the fact they are teaching him how to take snaps from under center and letting him grow as a quarterback during preseason.

    While I do believe that Tebow will have most success running a spread option offense, and that's what he'll most likely run more often in the regular season, I like that the Jets are helping him improve his skill set now when little is on the line. He also had 2 scrambles from under center, but it should be noted, his biggest one, the 14-yarder did come out of the shotgun.

    Shotgun:


    The thought of Tebow alternating between under-center and shotgun, to keep defenses guessing, while still maintaining his ability to be a rushing threat out of both is very exciting. Because while some teams may begin expecting the spread option or "wildcat", which is hard to stop to begin with, a refined Tebow lining up under center and dropping back to pass...will create even more headaches for defenses.

    Under Center:


    In other words, so far I believe all we have seen is the weakest part of what this Jets offense will be and Tebow's game. It really was nothing but practice and training and showcasing the fact that Tebow can drop back and pass.

    Just thought I'd point this out.
    Why don't the Jets run a modern NFL offense?

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whichfan View Post
    So out of 22 snaps you decide to focus on an interception. Hope you do the same for every other interception that takes place for every quarterback from here to the end of the season.
    Again I'm barfing.

    That gif looks like they got some random person off the street and put him in a Jets uniform and asked him to throw a football in a forward direction as hard as he could.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman View Post
    Why don't the Jets run a modern NFL offense?
    Well that really depends on your definition.

    I think they are trying to with introducing things like the Wildcat with Tebow, considering "modern" offenses currently means either a spread option, or high octane spread offense passing offense.

    In fact, with what they are trying to do you could even say they are setting new trends.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by shuler82 View Post
    Tebow looked awful under center. He seemed like he was a full step behind the rest of the offense, and I kept expecting a fumble or a false start penalty.
    I noticed that too. I kept thinking that the center was late and there would be a penalty. I think the backup center has some issues, there were a lot of fumbled snaps in practice. Always hard to tell if it's the center or QBs fault.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by shuler82 View Post
    Tebow looked awful under center. He seemed like he was a full step behind the rest of the offense, and I kept expecting a fumble or a false start penalty.
    I thought exactly the same way. Timing looked awkward and almost off sides on all snaps Tebow took under center. Could this have been deliberate? It looked like a QB sneak without the sneak.....

    Hope it was by design, if not, we have some work to do....

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