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Thread: Aside from that one throw Sanchez looked excellent

  1. #101
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    what game did the OP watch? How you classify that as excellent is just mind boggling.

    He was pretty bad.

    I'm done with making excuses for him. I've bought into the "he needs more help" mantra up until now. No more.

    I've seen enough of the head-tuck/walk into the pile move. It's worn out.

    And let's not act like he NEVER has any time. He holds the ball too long and that's the reason for a good percentage of his sacks.

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kentucky Jet View Post
    Actually GREAT players( QBs) elevate the game of their surrounding cast many, many times!
    Ummm which players was Sanchez supposed to "elevate" last year????

    If Tom Brady couldn't "elevate" Ocho and Moss (at times) how in the world was Sanchez supposed to elevate Mason and Plex two guys who started last year who can't even make an NFL squad this year....

    Of course great QBs help other players but the Jets OL, WR corp, and RBs in general are well below average right now. All three areas can't be poor and your QB be effective, he can't....

    But you know this...

    Come on Man!!!

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    what game did the OP watch? How you classify that as excellent is just mind boggling.

    He was pretty bad.

    I'm done with making excuses for him. I've bought into the "he needs more help" mantra up until now. No more.

    I've seen enough of the head-tuck/walk into the pile move. It's worn out.

    And let's not act like he NEVER has any time. He holds the ball too long and that's the reason for a good percentage of his sacks.
    So you bought into the "he needs more help" mantra, (at a time when our starting WR's were Holmes, Edwards, and Cotchery) until the point when the Jets have given him Patrick Turner as a starting WR. NOW is the time when you stopped buying into the "he needs more help" theory. Quite the sensible decision on your part, I must say.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    And let's not act like he NEVER has any time. He holds the ball too long and that's the reason for a good percentage of his sacks.
    Thank You

    Why everyone continues to place the blame solely on the OL for Sanchez's mistakes in beyond me.

    You'd think this team has the worst OL in league history judging by the constant excuses that have been made over the past year.

    Some QB's can face pressure and still hang tough in the pocket (Eli Manning, Jay Cutler, etc) and some totally wilt under it (Sanchez).

    If Sanchez is always going to need a top OL and a great running game just to perform at a halfway decent level, then why the hell are we even wasting our time?
    Last edited by Untouchable; 08-19-2012 at 08:10 PM.

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by unchartedm0nkey View Post
    So you bought into the "he needs more help" mantra, (at a time when our starting WR's were Holmes, Edwards, and Cotchery) until the point when the Jets have given him Patrick Turner as a starting WR. NOW is the time when you stopped buying into the "he needs more help" theory. Quite the sensible decision on your part, I must say.
    Yes because he's not shown an ounce of improvement. He's making the same stupid ass mistakes he's always made. Still throwing pick-6s, still ducking for cover and stumbling into the pile.

    Patrick Turner is crap, and I'm not saying he has a place starting for ANY team... but Patrick Turner didn't under-throw himself.

    How many times did he look for Keller? How many times did he look for Hill? How many times did he check it down for John Freaking Connor when there actually was a clean pocket and time to throw?

    Good QBs overcome. Good QBs make plays in spite of the junk around them. They might not make enough to win all the time, but they make enough to put some points on the board on occasion.

    We all need to see more from Sanchez in this next game.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Martin&theJets View Post
    I guess it's just me but the placement of his ball, his reads and finding the open man were good. He was completing just about every ball. With all of the problems with this team Sanchez isn't even top 3. If you fix Wayne hunter and our injured players you will see the real Sanchez. It's mind boggling that half of our fanbase wants his head. At this point if it came down to it the GM and HC should go before Sanchez.
    Yeah! keep fooling yourself. The whole media, and Profootball analyst including me begs to differ.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Untouchable View Post
    Thank You

    Why everyone continues to place the blame solely on the OL for Sanchez's mistakes in beyond me.

    You'd think this team has the worst OL in league history judging by the constant excuses that have been made over the past year.

    Some QB's can face pressure and still hang tough in the pocket (Eli Manning, Jay Cutler, etc) and some totally wilt under it (Sanchez).

    If Sanchez is always going to need a top OL and a great running game just to perform at a halfway decent level, then why the hell are we even wasting our time?
    The day that Sanchez has HOF caliber players at the skill position as Eli Manning has had for his entire time with the Giants then this makes sense unitil then...

    All I can say to you is Good Grief!!!

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Brown View Post
    The day that Sanchez has HOF caliber players at the skill position as Eli Manning has had for his entire time with the Giants then this makes sense unitil then...

    All I can say to you is Good Grief!!!
    LOL

    Please name me one HOF player that Eli has had on the offensive side of the ball.

    Go ahead, I'll wait.

  9. #109
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    Sanchez has been sacked 5 times in 17 pass attempts.

    Tebow has been sacked 4 times in 22 attempts.


    you can blame the QBs all you want for lack of situational awareness and holding the ball too long, but the pass protection has been a MAJOR issue.

  10. #110
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    People are simultaneously complaining about Sanchez:

    1) Holding the ball too long

    2) Checking down too quickly

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB1089 View Post
    People are simultaneously complaining about Sanchez:

    1) Holding the ball too long

    2) Checking down too quickly
    Because he does both.

    When there is pressure coming, QBs can see it, and should be thinking "I've got to get rid of the ball NOW." When there is no pressure, QBs can see it, and should be thinking "Let's get something big here."

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    Yes because he's not shown an ounce of improvement. He's making the same stupid ass mistakes he's always made. Still throwing pick-6s, still ducking for cover and stumbling into the pile.

    Patrick Turner is crap, and I'm not saying he has a place starting for ANY team... but Patrick Turner didn't under-throw himself.

    How many times did he look for Keller? How many times did he look for Hill? How many times did he check it down for John Freaking Connor when there actually was a clean pocket and time to throw?

    Good QBs overcome. Good QBs make plays in spite of the junk around them. They might not make enough to win all the time, but they make enough to put some points on the board on occasion.

    We all need to see more from Sanchez in this next game.
    And let me guess - you would be one of the same people complaining if he threw 3 INT's instead of 1 by trying to continually force it to guys who created no separation.

    You realize that, in your example above, having a clean pocket to throw doesn't necessarily mean there's anyone to throw to. You're looking solely at Sanchez, its a team game. I'm not defending Sanchez' past, which as we all know has been a mixed bag in a range of looking very good to downright terrible. However, the one big mistake, the INT last night, you have to take into consideration that there was what, 2:16 left in a half where he HAD to continuously check down because guys like Patrick Turner and Stephen Hill weren't creating any separation, and Sahchez was about to come out of the game. I'm not going to hate on the guy for trying to create SOMETHING when he was about to come out of the game, when he got absolutely no assistance all half (how about converting a single yard on either 3rd or 4th and 1?) If he had tried to force more throws (as he's done continuously since 09), he would have piled on more INT's.

    I agree with you on your last point - good QB's make something out of junk. That's the case most of the time, I couldn't agree more. Being objective though, the junk Sanchez has had to work with in the two preseason games were much worse than the average junk that any "good QB" has worked with to create points. If you can give me an example of a quarterback playing well, with his top two receivers being someone of a Patrick Turner-caliber, a second round rookie who played almost exclusively in a gimmick offense in college, and a RT who gave up 4 sacks in one half (including Tuck's that was nullified by penalty), please, prove me wrong. I really doubt an example exists, but I'm inviting the conversation here.
    Last edited by unchartedm0nkey; 08-19-2012 at 09:51 PM.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    Yes because he's not shown an ounce of improvement. .
    Well, he's passing at a 76% completion rate thus far this preseason. That's pretty damn big improvement. Just to, you know, prove you wrong

  14. #114
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    If every pass is a short one then defenses will eventually cheat (as they are) and the pick sixes continue to roll in. Mark Sanchez has some latitude here in terms of deciding which receiver to throw to and he simply seems all too willing to check down to the supposedly "safer" dump off or underneath route....

    Yes the offensive line is not giving him much time but he seems like he is scope locked onto the underneath route even before the ball is snapped.

    Nothing seems to have changed from last year except that every defense in the NFL now has that playbook and tendency down cold. Maybe it was not just Schotty.... doh.... go figure. What a shocker. Until we do something to loosen up the secondary and at least give them something to be concerned about it will only get worse.

    Maybe punter is a greater need for us even than a competent RT.

  15. #115
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    I've actually been pleasantly surprised with sanchez's completions and improvement in the check down part of the game ...it's still a very small sample size but the is a significant improvement from what we saw in that part of his game years 1-3

    Still need to see more, but he def has taken a step in the right direction

    RT on the other hand is a national disaster





    Ljr

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMikeIsHot View Post
    Because he does both.

    When there is pressure coming, QBs can see it, and should be thinking "I've got to get rid of the ball NOW." When there is no pressure, QBs can see it, and should be thinking "Let's get something big here."
    You're not going to get anything big when the other team gets pressure with 4 guys.

    That's why being able to get pressure with 4 is the ultimate luxury: It means that you have 7 guys in coverage while forcing the QB to make a decision under pressure.

    Most of the time when a team sends 4, the QB winds up with all day to throw.


    This isn't a case of Sanchez not recognizing a blitz and being pressure by a free rusher he should have known was coming. It's not a case where the defense sent extra guys and left someone open, and Sanchez simply failed to find the open guy.

    Turner and White wouldn't start for a single team in this league. Yet people are somehow expecting them to get open on a consistent basis and in less than 3 seconds, against a secondary that has them outnumbered.

    If you can't block a 4 man rush, you're ****ed. There's no getting around that.

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Untouchable View Post
    LOL

    Please name me one HOF player that Eli has had on the offensive side of the ball.

    Go ahead, I'll wait.

    Reading is FUNDEMENTAL, I said HOF quality CALIBER player...


    Hmmmm so you can stop waiting Tiki Barber was a much better RB than Curtis Martin (and I am a martin fan) who just went into the HOF but you knew this already, right!!!

    Why don't you go back to saying how Tebow was better than John Elway

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB1089 View Post
    You're not going to get anything big when the other team gets pressure with 4 guys.

    That's why being able to get pressure with 4 is the ultimate luxury: It means that you have 7 guys in coverage while forcing the QB to make a decision under pressure.

    Most of the time when a team sends 4, the QB winds up with all day to throw.


    This isn't a case of Sanchez not recognizing a blitz and being pressure by a free rusher he should have known was coming. It's not a case where the defense sent extra guys and left someone open, and Sanchez simply failed to find the open guy.

    Turner and White wouldn't start for a single team in this league. Yet people are somehow expecting them to get open on a consistent basis and in less than 3 seconds, against a secondary that has them outnumbered.

    If you can't block a 4 man rush, you're ****ed. There's no getting around that.
    No, that NEVER happens

    I see your point. I just think you're making this seem as though every time he holds the ball or gets sacked it's because of the WRs or the OL when in fact there are numerous occasions where it's completely his fault for failing to recognize the pressure or escape the pressure when there is an obvious escape route.

  19. #119
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    other than the only pass thrown by Sanchez the entire pre-season that resulted in a touchdown was the interception he threw in the Giants game I would say things are ok.

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirtstar View Post
    Sanchez has been sacked 5 times in 17 pass attempts.

    Tebow has been sacked 4 times in 22 attempts.


    you can blame the QBs all you want for lack of situational awareness and holding the ball too long, but the pass protection has been a MAJOR issue.
    so there have been 9 sacks allowed in 39 pass attempts. people blame sanchez for holding onto the ball too long, and yet, tebow, who has been brought here to scramble, has been sacked 4 times himself. the o-line couldn't move the giants to get 1 yard on 3rd and 4th down.

    if i'm these qbs, and i'm getting 'sacked' time and again in practice and then i'm getting pummelled in the preseason, my only goal is to not get hurt in these preseason games. i'm not hanging in the pocket to throw a pass downfield and maybe get a completion with my scrub wrs in a game that doesn't count.

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